Old posts, OGL and EULA

Post/Author/DateTimePost
#1

Airos

Sep 14, 2009 18:55:29

Since I'm currently unable to contact CustServ due to some odd errors on my end, I'm presenting my question here to the community.


Since 3rd/3.5 is no longer a supported by WotC, there shouldn't be any conflicts regarding homebrew content posted here on the boards. While the "fluff" could still be used in future 4th edition books, an NPC/creature stat block, class, spell or just about any other piece of "crunch" wouldn't be completely portable between the editions.


So, would it be possible for me to take my older posts and attach the OGL to them, (via a link since there are no sblocks currently available for me to insert them into each and every post), giving me the freedom to post the material to the various D&D wiki's and message boards?


While I'm reasonably certain that anything I create from this point forward would be considered "OGL" simply by virtue of stating it as such and providing a clear link to the full license in each post, I'm not sure how it would work for my work that was created prior to the new EULA, and edited again after the new EULA, and didn't claim to be OGL material at any point.


As far as I can tell, not being a lawyer, I retain ownership of my content, but grant WotC a license to do whatever they want with the content. I simply can't cut through enough of the lawyer-speak to tell if the two licenses are mutually exclusive or not.


Long story short, am I'm looking at serious legal trouble by taking anything I post here in the 3.5 boards and re-posting it somewhere else? I have zero intention of ever publishing my work for profit, and only seek to distribute it freely via the OGL.


My biggest concern is that if I do post elsewhere, attaching the OGL to it, and some third party does publish that work, am I setting them up for legal troubles?


Does WotC even care enough about 3.5 and homebrew content anymore to pursue this matter? (Aside from the obvious cases involving illegal file sharing and otherwise hosting non-OGL material)

#2

RUMPLESTIX

Sep 14, 2009 19:32:47

This isn't exactly an answer to your question, but do you have any old CS replies still in your email? Maybe you could send in your question as a reply to one of those with the note that you are currently unable to contact CS.


Just a thought.

#3

wotc_phoenix

Sep 14, 2009 23:42:18

I would strongly encourage you not to rely upon the advice of anyone other than a legal professional for an item of this nature. I would also advise you to consider addressing your question and interest in writing to our legal department who, I am certain, would be more than happy to respond to you and certainly may provide the company's perspective so as to put that aspect of your question well to rest.


You may write to them at the following address:


Wizards of the Coast, LLCAttn: Legal Department1600 Lind AvenueRenton, WA 98055

I would provide you an email address, but there is not a 'default' one for the department and it would be bad form to publicize an individual's email without their permission.


It is my hope this is helpful to you!

#4

lokiare

Sep 15, 2009 0:01:23

According to the ToU, you still retain rights to whatever you post, and because of this you can post it anywhere you want. Now you can't post something that is both 3.5 and 4E because of the GSL, but it can be one or the other.

#5

Airos

Sep 15, 2009 23:14:51


I would strongly encourage you not to rely upon the advice of anyone other than a legal professional for an item of this nature. I would also advise you to consider addressing your question and interest in writing to our legal department who, I am certain, would be more than happy to respond to you and certainly may provide the company's perspective so as to put that aspect of your question well to rest.


You may write to them at the following address:


Wizards of the Coast, LLCAttn: Legal Department1600 Lind AvenueRenton, WA 98055

I would provide you an email address, but there is not a 'default' one for the department and it would be bad form to publicize an individual's email without their permission.


It is my hope this is helpful to you!




Yes, that is helpful, thank you. I'll be sure to send them a letter.



According to the ToU, you still retain rights to whatever you post, and because of this you can post it anywhere you want. Now you can't post something that is both 3.5 and 4E because of the GSL, but it can be one or the other.




I get that aspect of it, but where my confusion comes in is the interaction between the EULA and the OGL. Does one licence "trump" the other, and which one? My concern is that I can't claim something is OGL after the fact that I've granted WotC whatever licence I've granted them in the EULA.


Now, are they going to sue me if I put the stats for a rabbit up on my web site? I doubt it. Are they going to sue some publisher if I post the stats for a rabbit on my web site with a claim that it's OGL, and that publisher takes it and prints it in a book attempting to make a profit with it? There's a fair chance.


I could then be held liable for violation of contract at that point, since I would be the guilty party for publishing, (via the web), material that I didn't have legal license to distribute, and not only be sued by WotC, but by whomever actually printed the material for causing them to get sued, as they would want to recoup their legal fees due to my actions.


All in all, lots of bad things I don't want to occur if I'm not watching every step I take, and make sure I cross all my "i's" and dotting all my "t's". Tongue out

#6

Airos

Sep 16, 2009 2:29:18

Okay, well I just put the letter in the mail. I gave them my e-mail address, so I don't know if they'll reply using that of if they'll reply via snail mail. Here's to waiting several days for their reply! Tongue out

#7

Airos

Oct 01, 2009 23:18:07

Okay, so I got some totally BS response back from WotC's legal team.


Basically, what it comes down to is that the legal team that wrote the TOU and OGL can't actually answer my questions regarding the TOU and OGL, and that if I have further questions about those legal documents to contact a legal professional that's qualified to interpret them.


WTF WotC? If I ask a direct question regarding material, and provide you with a copy of that material to read, why can't you tell me if I'm allowed to apply the OGL to that material? You created the license, you wrote the language in the license, you enforce any violations of that license. The least you could do is tell me what I'm allowed to do under the terms of that license.


It drives me insane that the state of legal affairs in America now means that a legal team can't actually advice you on legal matters until you've broken some law that you didn't know anything about until after the legal team sends you a cease and desist order. If I could just get told "yes, you may" or "no, you may not" up front, I would know what the law was, and be able to avoid a problem.


I get that it's to cover their legal behinds, and to try and avoid a huge lawsuit if/when they give out incorrect legal advice. But I'm using your license, and I can't cover my legal behind while publishing material under that license without knowing what my rights are under that license. I shouldn't have to pay another lawyer to interpret your license, and run the risk of my lawyer giving me incorrect legal advice.


I guess the real answer is not to bother posting anything on these boards aside from advice and information pulled directly from the SRD. All of my other works will be posted on another board that isn't interested in burying everything in a maze of lawyer-speak. At least there I know that if I say it's OGL it'll remain OGL.

#8

calronmoonflower

Oct 02, 2009 1:50:21

WTF WotC?

I believe that it a bureaucratic maneuver called "cover my rear".
#9

Airos

Oct 02, 2009 5:04:53


 I believe that it a bureaucratic maneuver called "cover my rear".




Yes, I get that. Even said as much in may last post.


Thing is, one of my questions was as point blank as "can I take something I posted on the message boards and post it on my own web site". Instead of a simple yes or no, I get a "we can't tell you that". I don't even care if it's OGL or not, just "can I make it available to other people".


If I'm expected to follow the rules, I should be able to ask questions of the rule makers. Are there exceptions? What rights do I retain to my creations? Can another license be applied? I'm expected to contact a third party to explain to me the rules, and what my rights are, when the people who wrote the rules are right there.


I shouldn't have to be versed in copyright law in order to use these message boards. I shouldn't have to keep a lawyer on retainer in order to know what I can and cannot say on my own website. Since WotC was kind enough to include a FAQ on the OGL page, it would serve to reason that there are people on WotC's legal team that are willing to explain a few of the rules regarding that license in plain English.


Why is it too much to ask for a little detail about our rights regarding the TOU?