What About Non-D&D PDFs/ - Downloaded from the Wizards Community, all coding removed by Solauren

What About Non-D&D PDFs/

Post/Author/DateTime Post
#1
mythusmage
Apr 07, 2009 21:47:09 The discussion has, so far, dealt with PDFs of D&D products. Of those editions where PDFs were, until very recently, available. But, D&D is not the only RPG Wizards owns the rights to. What about those? Have D20 Modern and Dangerous Journeys been pulled? Or is it just the flagship game?
#2
MattDroz
Apr 07, 2009 23:16:06
The discussion has, so far, dealt with PDFs of D&D products. Of those editions where PDFs were, until very recently, available. But, D&D is not the only RPG Wizards owns the rights to. What about those? Have D20 Modern and Dangerous Journeys been pulled? Or is it just the flagship game?

Looking at DriveThruRPG, there are NO products from WotC available anymore. This includes d20 Modern.
#3
Seeker95
Apr 08, 2009 6:55:16 I suspect this will have a larger legal ramification issue in play, which means that this is a WotC thing, not a D&D thing. Whatever guidance legal has offered regarding the D&D PDFs is likely to apply to all WotC products, in preparation for the legal action we see being taken against 8 individuals (?) in the recent press announcement.
#4
JohnLynch
Apr 08, 2009 7:29:50
I suspect this will have a larger legal ramification issue in play, which means that this is a WotC thing, not a D&D thing. Whatever guidance legal has offered regarding the D&D PDFs is likely to apply to all WotC products, in preparation for the legal action we see being taken against 8 individuals (?) in the recent press announcement.

Because withholding a legal way for people to obtain their products from everyone is definitely worth a lawsuit involving 8 people.
#5
Seeker95
Apr 08, 2009 10:29:08 It is.

Once a matter becomes a legal response, reason and intuition go out the window. Law, precedence, and technicalities are the tools of the trade. If WotC is concerned about illegal sharing of official PDF products, it cannot apply a case-by-case response, from a "we are now in court" element.

The argument goes like this:
Plaintiff: The defendant is illegally distributing our PDF product. In an effort to curtail this practice, we are suspending the distribution of the D&D PDFs until we can come up with a viable solution.
Defendant: There are many PDFs distributed illegally. Is your complaint based on the illegal distribution of your PDF products? Or is it merely the illegal distribution of your popular products?
Plaintiff: We are concerned with the illegal distribution of our products as a matter of principle, regardless of the specific item.
Defendant: Then why are you willing to keep your low-sale PDF items on the market?

Although it should have no bearing on the case, the lawyers will make it appear to. Looking the other way on low-revenue items while crying foul on high-revenue items creates a business-rather-than-legal foundation. That is a dangerous leg to stand on in court.
#6
sirpatricshieldstrik
Apr 08, 2009 10:36:32 I would like to know who out there thought that this was NOT a possibility? Every form of digital media has been pirated and now that they have found 8 perpetrators so far, they put the kabosh on the PDF format. Either the fine folks at WOTC are not the sharpest pencils or I don't know what.
#7
rhialto
Apr 08, 2009 11:28:27 I'm curious at the number of people who have downloaded that pdf in response to legal sales being pulled, simply to find out what all the fuss is about.
#8
Seeker95
Apr 08, 2009 14:48:27
now that they have found 8 perpetrators so far,

My guess is they found (or were alerted to) a PDF that could *only* have come from RPGNow or Drive-Thru, and perhaps even indicates it was loaded before the PDF sales were authorized. I suspect among the 8 will be an online store operator or employee.
#9
lord_karsus
Apr 08, 2009 18:18:42
Every form of digital media has been pirated and now that they have found 8 perpetrators so far, they put the kabosh on the PDF format.

-In this day and age, internet piracy/copyright infringement is a lot like the J-Walking. Do you arrest the old woman who crossed the street after looking both ways to see if it was clear with the sign saying Don't Walk (ie, the little girls who download A theoretical song), or the maniac who is running in and out of traffic causing accidents (ie, the people who are primarily copying and distributing the material on a large scale)? Hence why there's a small number of being being brought to court.
#10
sirpatricshieldstrik
Apr 09, 2009 5:55:59
My guess is they found (or were alerted to) a PDF that could *only* have come from RPGNow or Drive-Thru, and perhaps even indicates it was loaded before the PDF sales were authorized. I suspect among the 8 will be an online store operator or employee.

This makes the most sense, nuff said, good post.

Post/Author/DateTime	Post
#1 mythusmage Apr 07, 2009 21:47:09	The discussion has, so far, dealt with PDFs of D&D products. Of those editions where PDFs were, until very recently, available. But, D&D is not the only RPG Wizards owns the rights to. What about those? Have D20 Modern and Dangerous Journeys been pulled? Or is it just the flagship game?
#2 MattDroz Apr 07, 2009 23:16:06	The discussion has, so far, dealt with PDFs of D&D products. Of those editions where PDFs were, until very recently, available. But, D&D is not the only RPG Wizards owns the rights to. What about those? Have D20 Modern and Dangerous Journeys been pulled? Or is it just the flagship game? Looking at DriveThruRPG, there are NO products from WotC available anymore. This includes d20 Modern.
#3 Seeker95 Apr 08, 2009 6:55:16	I suspect this will have a larger legal ramification issue in play, which means that this is a WotC thing, not a D&D thing. Whatever guidance legal has offered regarding the D&D PDFs is likely to apply to all WotC products, in preparation for the legal action we see being taken against 8 individuals (?) in the recent press announcement.
#4 JohnLynch Apr 08, 2009 7:29:50	I suspect this will have a larger legal ramification issue in play, which means that this is a WotC thing, not a D&D thing. Whatever guidance legal has offered regarding the D&D PDFs is likely to apply to all WotC products, in preparation for the legal action we see being taken against 8 individuals (?) in the recent press announcement. Because withholding a legal way for people to obtain their products from everyone is definitely worth a lawsuit involving 8 people.
#5 Seeker95 Apr 08, 2009 10:29:08	It is. Once a matter becomes a legal response, reason and intuition go out the window. Law, precedence, and technicalities are the tools of the trade. If WotC is concerned about illegal sharing of official PDF products, it cannot apply a case-by-case response, from a "we are now in court" element. The argument goes like this: Plaintiff: The defendant is illegally distributing our PDF product. In an effort to curtail this practice, we are suspending the distribution of the D&D PDFs until we can come up with a viable solution. Defendant: There are many PDFs distributed illegally. Is your complaint based on the illegal distribution of your PDF products? Or is it merely the illegal distribution of your popular products? Plaintiff: We are concerned with the illegal distribution of our products as a matter of principle, regardless of the specific item. Defendant: Then why are you willing to keep your low-sale PDF items on the market? Although it should have no bearing on the case, the lawyers will make it appear to. Looking the other way on low-revenue items while crying foul on high-revenue items creates a business-rather-than-legal foundation. That is a dangerous leg to stand on in court.
#6 sirpatricshieldstrik Apr 08, 2009 10:36:32	I would like to know who out there thought that this was NOT a possibility? Every form of digital media has been pirated and now that they have found 8 perpetrators so far, they put the kabosh on the PDF format. Either the fine folks at WOTC are not the sharpest pencils or I don't know what.
#7 rhialto Apr 08, 2009 11:28:27	I'm curious at the number of people who have downloaded that pdf in response to legal sales being pulled, simply to find out what all the fuss is about.
#8 Seeker95 Apr 08, 2009 14:48:27	now that they have found 8 perpetrators so far, My guess is they found (or were alerted to) a PDF that could only have come from RPGNow or Drive-Thru, and perhaps even indicates it was loaded before the PDF sales were authorized. I suspect among the 8 will be an online store operator or employee.
#9 lord_karsus Apr 08, 2009 18:18:42	Every form of digital media has been pirated and now that they have found 8 perpetrators so far, they put the kabosh on the PDF format. -In this day and age, internet piracy/copyright infringement is a lot like the J-Walking. Do you arrest the old woman who crossed the street after looking both ways to see if it was clear with the sign saying Don't Walk (ie, the little girls who download A theoretical song), or the maniac who is running in and out of traffic causing accidents (ie, the people who are primarily copying and distributing the material on a large scale)? Hence why there's a small number of being being brought to court.
#10 sirpatricshieldstrik Apr 09, 2009 5:55:59	My guess is they found (or were alerted to) a PDF that could only have come from RPGNow or Drive-Thru, and perhaps even indicates it was loaded before the PDF sales were authorized. I suspect among the 8 will be an online store operator or employee. This makes the most sense, nuff said, good post.