4th Ed Half Giant - Downloaded from the Wizards Community, all coding removed by Solauren

4th Ed Half Giant

Post/Author/DateTime Post
#1
Zardnaar
Jul 25, 2009 20:14:51 It seems you couldn't create a balenced large 4th ed Half Giant for a PC race. What would you prefer?

1. Downsize the Half Giant to medium.
2. Leave the Half Giant at large size but have them as NPCs.
#2
outlaw68
Jul 25, 2009 20:30:09 I have downsized to medium..

Well, i actually use the Goliath and give them an option on swapping their racial power for one that (I think) feels more half-Gianty.
#3
Cyber-Dave
Jul 26, 2009 7:47:50 I wouldn't bat an eyelash if they downsized them to medium.

Alternatively, they could do something more dark sun specific. Its been a long time since I played dark sun, but I vaguely remember that all characters had a wild talent. Perhaps in Dark Sun all races but the half-giant might get an extra at-will power, and a number of bonus power points (based on their level) with which to augment said at-will power. Half-Giants would instead get to be size large.

But yea, between the choice of half-giants as NPCs only, and half giants as a medium sized race, I choose half-giants as a medium sized race (and some "I am really large" flavor).
#4
Silverblade_The_Enchanter
Jul 27, 2009 2:50:27 Much rather they kept them Large there must be ways ot balance that!
#5
flip
Jul 31, 2009 11:17:57 I'd generally prefer not retconning the size of the half giant -- sort of obvious when you look at DS3 ;)

However, I'm also painfully aware of the problems that ended up causing. D&D isn't really designed for having large characters running around.

To be fair, one of my biggest criticisms of Large characters has been addressed in 4e -- Reach. In ds3, a half giant was all but unapproachable. Anyone getting in range got whacked before getting close enough to the HG to do anything about it. It was pointed out to me on the Arena that in 4e, while large creatures do have reach, it doesn't threaten. There's reach, and there's threatening reach.

There might be other issues with leaving them large, including the absurdity of having a large creature with only a +2 strength adjustment. Of course, I might only be considering that absurd because of previous-edition mental baggage...
#6
Cyber-Dave
Aug 01, 2009 13:52:49 The biggest unbalancing factor of a large sized creature is its ability to wield larger weapons/wield two handed weapons one handed. Giving a half giant reach (but not threatening reach) really isn't that big a deal. But the ability to wield larger damage dice will make the half-giant hands down the best weapon wielding character in the game. This is a problem. Its the same reason why "oversized" will never appear as a PC race ability (according to the devs). Its just too powerful. I really don't know how they could ever implement a large sized creature in a balanced manner as a result. Perhaps if this is the only ability granted, and the half-giant gets no other benefits, it would be ok.
#7
Zardnaar
Aug 01, 2009 18:50:23 Half giant, large, reach, +4 strength thats it. Still probably broken in 4th ed.
#8
Cyber-Dave
Aug 01, 2009 22:09:16 No probably about it. That is broken on an epic scale. It will have the highest strength in the game, the ability to attack things one square further away than anyone else, and will use the most damaging weapons in the game. If that was a PC race, there would be no mechanical reason for anyone to ever play a non-half giant fighter, ranger, or paladin.
#9
Zardnaar
Aug 02, 2009 3:02:18 Yeah I figured as much.Personally I think I'll just NPC the race and use ogre stats for them or something.

Post/Author/DateTime	Post
#1 Zardnaar Jul 25, 2009 20:14:51	It seems you couldn't create a balenced large 4th ed Half Giant for a PC race. What would you prefer? 1. Downsize the Half Giant to medium. 2. Leave the Half Giant at large size but have them as NPCs.
#2 outlaw68 Jul 25, 2009 20:30:09	I have downsized to medium.. Well, i actually use the Goliath and give them an option on swapping their racial power for one that (I think) feels more half-Gianty.
#3 Cyber-Dave Jul 26, 2009 7:47:50	I wouldn't bat an eyelash if they downsized them to medium. Alternatively, they could do something more dark sun specific. Its been a long time since I played dark sun, but I vaguely remember that all characters had a wild talent. Perhaps in Dark Sun all races but the half-giant might get an extra at-will power, and a number of bonus power points (based on their level) with which to augment said at-will power. Half-Giants would instead get to be size large. But yea, between the choice of half-giants as NPCs only, and half giants as a medium sized race, I choose half-giants as a medium sized race (and some "I am really large" flavor).
#4 Silverblade_The_Enchanter Jul 27, 2009 2:50:27	Much rather they kept them Large there must be ways ot balance that!
#5 flip Jul 31, 2009 11:17:57	I'd generally prefer not retconning the size of the half giant -- sort of obvious when you look at DS3 ;) However, I'm also painfully aware of the problems that ended up causing. D&D isn't really designed for having large characters running around. To be fair, one of my biggest criticisms of Large characters has been addressed in 4e -- Reach. In ds3, a half giant was all but unapproachable. Anyone getting in range got whacked before getting close enough to the HG to do anything about it. It was pointed out to me on the Arena that in 4e, while large creatures do have reach, it doesn't threaten. There's reach, and there's threatening reach. There might be other issues with leaving them large, including the absurdity of having a large creature with only a +2 strength adjustment. Of course, I might only be considering that absurd because of previous-edition mental baggage...
#6 Cyber-Dave Aug 01, 2009 13:52:49	The biggest unbalancing factor of a large sized creature is its ability to wield larger weapons/wield two handed weapons one handed. Giving a half giant reach (but not threatening reach) really isn't that big a deal. But the ability to wield larger damage dice will make the half-giant hands down the best weapon wielding character in the game. This is a problem. Its the same reason why "oversized" will never appear as a PC race ability (according to the devs). Its just too powerful. I really don't know how they could ever implement a large sized creature in a balanced manner as a result. Perhaps if this is the only ability granted, and the half-giant gets no other benefits, it would be ok.
#7 Zardnaar Aug 01, 2009 18:50:23	Half giant, large, reach, +4 strength thats it. Still probably broken in 4th ed.
#8 Cyber-Dave Aug 01, 2009 22:09:16	No probably about it. That is broken on an epic scale. It will have the highest strength in the game, the ability to attack things one square further away than anyone else, and will use the most damaging weapons in the game. If that was a PC race, there would be no mechanical reason for anyone to ever play a non-half giant fighter, ranger, or paladin.
#9 Zardnaar Aug 02, 2009 3:02:18	Yeah I figured as much.Personally I think I'll just NPC the race and use ogre stats for them or something.