"Rise and Fall of the Dragon King" question - Downloaded from the Wizards Community, all coding removed by Solauren

"Rise and Fall of the Dragon King" question

Post/Author/DateTime Post
#1
Palladinae
May 13, 2008 7:36:05 Hello everybody!
Fist of all, I'd like to apologize, if I repeated questions, stated previously.

Lastly I re-read "Rise and Fall of the Dragon King" and once again wondered at it's ending. I'd like to know your opinion and explanations. Am I right, thinking Hamanu slept for millenia and awoke in new, green Athas? Has world changed? Or perhaps it all was illusion and deceive?
Best regards
#2
xlorep_darkhelm
May 13, 2008 10:22:56 I actually just completely disregard the whole notion of Hamanu becoming a dragon, etc. It doesn't make sense to me, and I've never cared for that bit... it seems.... pushed, and almost stuck on at the end without really being as solid as the rest of Abbey's works... almost like she was pressured to do it without really wanting that to happen.
#3
rikkiwalker
May 13, 2008 21:28:30 This book was I thought pretty bad; the plot was silly and made little sense and she(Lynn Abbey) seemed to have not done her homework on the history of Athas at all. If she is writing a book from the POV of a sorcerer-king she could at least throw in some interesting perspectives of life on athas for one who was a mover and shaker for thousands of years.
#4
Pennarin
May 13, 2008 23:08:04
Hello everybody!
Fist of all, I'd like to apologize, if I repeated questions, stated previously.

Lastly I re-read "Rise and Fall of the Dragon King" and once again wondered at it's ending. I'd like to know your opinion and explanations. Am I right, thinking Hamanu slept for millenia and awoke in new, green Athas? Has world changed? Or perhaps it all was illusion and deceive?
Best regards

/sight

Hi there! Welcome to our friendly forums, where your questions are answered ;)

Hamanu, in the novel, passes a thousand years in the center of Athas, cocooned into powerful...magic, for lack of a better word, created by the spirit of Athas. It takes that long to undo the changes Rajaat wrought on his Champions when he made them. He's spat out and instantiated into the throne room of then Urik, to discover he's human again, and that the mysterious being he encountered in the Gray long ago, and who tried to ward him off/protect him from Rajaat's wrath, has been impersonnating Hamanu ever since his dissapearance. That being is the spirit of Urik, a kind of spirit of the land that came into existence because of Hamanu's devotion to his city which goes beyond that of other kings and Champions. Hamanu is allowed to gaze out the balcony over at the city, and is amazed and heart-warmed by what he sees, but Abbey does not describe the sight. It's up to you do decide what he sees! A magical tear in the fabric of the world then opens, and he's invented to step in, in the process his essence becoming part of the spirit of Urik (Hamanu effectively dies), which itself is connected to all other spirits because they are all part of the larger spirit of Athas, and in that place/state of being, he meets again Thelami, one of the only two women he ever loved. She had been waiting for him, all along in the embrace of the spirit of Qurait ever since her death.

There you go Quite reminescent of John Sheridan's death in Sleeping In Light, the final episode of Babylon 5, for those in the know...
#5
Zardnaar
May 14, 2008 0:42:19 An easy retcon would be to have it all happen in Hamanus head. I've always thought RaFoaDK was Darksuns swansong as it was one of the last DS products to come out and was set in FY15 which is as far as the timeline had been progresed until Paizo's FY300 setting.
#6
xlorep_darkhelm
May 14, 2008 1:05:47
This book was I thought pretty bad; the plot was silly and made little sense and she(Lynn Abbey) seemed to have not done her homework on the history of Athas at all. If she is writing a book from the POV of a sorcerer-king she could at least throw in some interesting perspectives of life on athas for one who was a mover and shaker for thousands of years.

Actually, Abbey easily was the best of the novel authors for Dark Sun. She captured the essense of Dark Sun more than any of the others, including the co-creator of the setting Troy Denning....
#7
Zardnaar
May 14, 2008 1:34:36
Actually, Abbey easily was the best of the novel authors for Dark Sun. She captured the essense of Dark Sun more than any of the others, including the co-creator of the setting Troy Denning....

Troy Denning at least is improving as an author. His New Jedi Order book was one of the better ones in a reasonably awful series, and his Legacy of the Force books are decent enough but the other 2 authors in that series are better than him.
#8
xlorep_darkhelm
May 14, 2008 8:51:27
Troy Denning at least is improving as an author. His New Jedi Order book was one of the better ones in a reasonably awful series, and his Legacy of the Force books are decent enough but the other 2 authors in that series are better than him.

Oh, he's improving, that's true.
#9
rikkiwalker
May 14, 2008 20:42:02
Actually, Abbey easily was the best of the novel authors for Dark Sun. She captured the essense of Dark Sun more than any of the others, including the co-creator of the setting Troy Denning....

If you say so.......While i stand by my opinion of thinking that one is not that good, I have to admit I like one of her books which was the simbuls gift from forgotten realms, even though the plot of that book makes about as much sense as rise and fall's does, it was at least about one of my favorite characters.
#10
Palladinae
May 21, 2008 15:00:31
An easy retcon would be to have it all happen in Hamanus head. I've always thought RaFoaDK was Darksuns swansong as it was one of the last DS products to come out and was set in FY15 which is as far as the timeline had been progresed until Paizo's FY300 setting.

First of all, thanks for your responses. Actually, I enjoyed "Rise and Fall..." much. It was better than Mr. Denning's cykle although I read it in very horrible polish translation (now, when I'm translator too, I know how terrbile it was).

One thing, that hooked me much is Paizo's FY300 setting. Can you give me an url to it or some informations? I must admit I return to Dark Sun after quite time, as well as to whole D&D, so I lack some knowlege.
Best Regards
#11
Palladinae
May 21, 2008 15:00:47
An easy retcon would be to have it all happen in Hamanus head. I've always thought RaFoaDK was Darksuns swansong as it was one of the last DS products to come out and was set in FY15 which is as far as the timeline had been progresed until Paizo's FY300 setting.

First of all, thanks for your responses. Actually, I enjoyed "Rise and Fall..." much. It was better than Mr. Denning's cycle although I read it in very horrible polish translation (now, when I'm translator too, I know how terrbile it was).

One thing, that hooked me much is Paizo's FY300 setting. Can you give me an url to it or some informations? I must admit I return to Dark Sun after quite time, as well as to whole D&D, so I lack some knowlege.
Best Regards
#12
flip
May 21, 2008 15:40:42
One thing, that hooked me much is Paizo's FY300 setting. Can you give me an url to it or some informations? I must admit I return to Dark Sun after quite time, as well as to whole D&D, so I lack some knowlege.
Best Regards

Unfortunately, no URL. It was published in a dedicated pair of Dragon/Dungeon issues, hrm, about three years ago now, I think.
#13
dzauku
May 24, 2008 16:30:00
Unfortunately, no URL. It was published in a dedicated pair of Dragon/Dungeon issues, hrm, about three years ago now, I think.

can anyone tell me which Dungeon and Dragon magazines these were specifically?
#14
Zardnaar
May 24, 2008 20:15:08
can anyone tell me which Dungeon and Dragon magazines these were specifically?

Dragon 319 and Dungeon 110.
#15
dzauku
May 25, 2008 16:28:12 Thank you Zardnaar.
#16
Zardnaar
May 26, 2008 5:58:56
Thank you Zardnaar.

I've got them. They're from 2004.

Post/Author/DateTime	Post
#1 Palladinae May 13, 2008 7:36:05	Hello everybody! Fist of all, I'd like to apologize, if I repeated questions, stated previously. Lastly I re-read "Rise and Fall of the Dragon King" and once again wondered at it's ending. I'd like to know your opinion and explanations. Am I right, thinking Hamanu slept for millenia and awoke in new, green Athas? Has world changed? Or perhaps it all was illusion and deceive? Best regards
#2 xlorep_darkhelm May 13, 2008 10:22:56	I actually just completely disregard the whole notion of Hamanu becoming a dragon, etc. It doesn't make sense to me, and I've never cared for that bit... it seems.... pushed, and almost stuck on at the end without really being as solid as the rest of Abbey's works... almost like she was pressured to do it without really wanting that to happen.
#3 rikkiwalker May 13, 2008 21:28:30	This book was I thought pretty bad; the plot was silly and made little sense and she(Lynn Abbey) seemed to have not done her homework on the history of Athas at all. If she is writing a book from the POV of a sorcerer-king she could at least throw in some interesting perspectives of life on athas for one who was a mover and shaker for thousands of years.
#4 Pennarin May 13, 2008 23:08:04	Hello everybody! Fist of all, I'd like to apologize, if I repeated questions, stated previously. Lastly I re-read "Rise and Fall of the Dragon King" and once again wondered at it's ending. I'd like to know your opinion and explanations. Am I right, thinking Hamanu slept for millenia and awoke in new, green Athas? Has world changed? Or perhaps it all was illusion and deceive? Best regards /sight Hi there! Welcome to our friendly forums, where your questions are answered ;) Hamanu, in the novel, passes a thousand years in the center of Athas, cocooned into powerful...magic, for lack of a better word, created by the spirit of Athas. It takes that long to undo the changes Rajaat wrought on his Champions when he made them. He's spat out and instantiated into the throne room of then Urik, to discover he's human again, and that the mysterious being he encountered in the Gray long ago, and who tried to ward him off/protect him from Rajaat's wrath, has been impersonnating Hamanu ever since his dissapearance. That being is the spirit of Urik, a kind of spirit of the land that came into existence because of Hamanu's devotion to his city which goes beyond that of other kings and Champions. Hamanu is allowed to gaze out the balcony over at the city, and is amazed and heart-warmed by what he sees, but Abbey does not describe the sight. It's up to you do decide what he sees! A magical tear in the fabric of the world then opens, and he's invented to step in, in the process his essence becoming part of the spirit of Urik (Hamanu effectively dies), which itself is connected to all other spirits because they are all part of the larger spirit of Athas, and in that place/state of being, he meets again Thelami, one of the only two women he ever loved. She had been waiting for him, all along in the embrace of the spirit of Qurait ever since her death. There you go Quite reminescent of John Sheridan's death in Sleeping In Light, the final episode of Babylon 5, for those in the know...
#5 Zardnaar May 14, 2008 0:42:19	An easy retcon would be to have it all happen in Hamanus head. I've always thought RaFoaDK was Darksuns swansong as it was one of the last DS products to come out and was set in FY15 which is as far as the timeline had been progresed until Paizo's FY300 setting.
#6 xlorep_darkhelm May 14, 2008 1:05:47	This book was I thought pretty bad; the plot was silly and made little sense and she(Lynn Abbey) seemed to have not done her homework on the history of Athas at all. If she is writing a book from the POV of a sorcerer-king she could at least throw in some interesting perspectives of life on athas for one who was a mover and shaker for thousands of years. Actually, Abbey easily was the best of the novel authors for Dark Sun. She captured the essense of Dark Sun more than any of the others, including the co-creator of the setting Troy Denning....
#7 Zardnaar May 14, 2008 1:34:36	Actually, Abbey easily was the best of the novel authors for Dark Sun. She captured the essense of Dark Sun more than any of the others, including the co-creator of the setting Troy Denning.... Troy Denning at least is improving as an author. His New Jedi Order book was one of the better ones in a reasonably awful series, and his Legacy of the Force books are decent enough but the other 2 authors in that series are better than him.
#8 xlorep_darkhelm May 14, 2008 8:51:27	Troy Denning at least is improving as an author. His New Jedi Order book was one of the better ones in a reasonably awful series, and his Legacy of the Force books are decent enough but the other 2 authors in that series are better than him. Oh, he's improving, that's true.
#9 rikkiwalker May 14, 2008 20:42:02	Actually, Abbey easily was the best of the novel authors for Dark Sun. She captured the essense of Dark Sun more than any of the others, including the co-creator of the setting Troy Denning.... If you say so.......While i stand by my opinion of thinking that one is not that good, I have to admit I like one of her books which was the simbuls gift from forgotten realms, even though the plot of that book makes about as much sense as rise and fall's does, it was at least about one of my favorite characters.
#10 Palladinae May 21, 2008 15:00:31	An easy retcon would be to have it all happen in Hamanus head. I've always thought RaFoaDK was Darksuns swansong as it was one of the last DS products to come out and was set in FY15 which is as far as the timeline had been progresed until Paizo's FY300 setting. First of all, thanks for your responses. Actually, I enjoyed "Rise and Fall..." much. It was better than Mr. Denning's cykle although I read it in very horrible polish translation (now, when I'm translator too, I know how terrbile it was). One thing, that hooked me much is Paizo's FY300 setting. Can you give me an url to it or some informations? I must admit I return to Dark Sun after quite time, as well as to whole D&D, so I lack some knowlege. Best Regards
#11 Palladinae May 21, 2008 15:00:47	An easy retcon would be to have it all happen in Hamanus head. I've always thought RaFoaDK was Darksuns swansong as it was one of the last DS products to come out and was set in FY15 which is as far as the timeline had been progresed until Paizo's FY300 setting. First of all, thanks for your responses. Actually, I enjoyed "Rise and Fall..." much. It was better than Mr. Denning's cycle although I read it in very horrible polish translation (now, when I'm translator too, I know how terrbile it was). One thing, that hooked me much is Paizo's FY300 setting. Can you give me an url to it or some informations? I must admit I return to Dark Sun after quite time, as well as to whole D&D, so I lack some knowlege. Best Regards
#12 flip May 21, 2008 15:40:42	One thing, that hooked me much is Paizo's FY300 setting. Can you give me an url to it or some informations? I must admit I return to Dark Sun after quite time, as well as to whole D&D, so I lack some knowlege. Best Regards Unfortunately, no URL. It was published in a dedicated pair of Dragon/Dungeon issues, hrm, about three years ago now, I think.
#13 dzauku May 24, 2008 16:30:00	Unfortunately, no URL. It was published in a dedicated pair of Dragon/Dungeon issues, hrm, about three years ago now, I think. can anyone tell me which Dungeon and Dragon magazines these were specifically?
#14 Zardnaar May 24, 2008 20:15:08	can anyone tell me which Dungeon and Dragon magazines these were specifically? Dragon 319 and Dungeon 110.
#15 dzauku May 25, 2008 16:28:12	Thank you Zardnaar.
#16 Zardnaar May 26, 2008 5:58:56	Thank you Zardnaar. I've got them. They're from 2004.