[Dark sun] Elemental Planes Conduit

Post/Author/DateTimePost
#1

Palladinae

Jul 16, 2008 2:19:27
Hello everybody!
Currently I run 3rd edition Forgotten Realms campaign. In some near future my PC's will face adventure with water elementals. I came upon few ideas but they need an connection and leading NPC, so I thought it would be fun to introduce Elemental Priest from Athas. He will be an linchpin between adventures and will serve as mediator between PC and elementals.

The main idea is: some time ago young half-elf was born on the world of Athas. He grew up and became priest of Water Elemental. With time and adventures, he rose up in ranks and finally transformed into Water elemental (as described in "Earth, Fire..." and "Dragon Kings"). He transferred himself into Elemental Plane of Water and lived there, until was summoned to Toril, where he will meet PC's.

So, here is my question: is it possible? Could he escape from Athas to Elemental plane of Water?
#2

Kamelion

Jul 16, 2008 3:58:39
Short answer: it's up to you.

Not much help, that, I know, but if it works for your game, go for it.

Long answer: DS canon describes the elemental planes in the book Earth, Air, Fire and Water and from those descriptions, it is possible that they are not quite the same elemental planes as feature in other cosmologies. Here are a couple of quotes to illustrate this issue:

"The inner planes that surround the world of Athas are somewhat different than those found in other campaign worlds." (EAFW p76)

"Water's plane is a series of sandy islands, drifting through from the Plane of Earth, and surrounded by muddy tides of murky brine. Most of the spirits live beneath the rippling surface, and one may venture anywhere without fear of drowning. Here, a traveler will see little but water and the pillars of sand that form the islands." (EAFW p76-77)

So from those descriptions, you could say that Athas' elemental planes are not the same as those that connect to Toril, and thus rule that your half-elf water elemental could not make it to Toril.

However...

Although DS canon originally kept Athas isolated from other planes and worlds, some other settings took a different view. Most notably, the Planescape setting incorporated Dark Sun material into its setting. The ruvoka race in the Planescape MCIII originate on Athas and do exactly what your half-elf elemental does - namely, travel from Athas to the elemental planes, and from there to other places in the multiverse. The ruvoka first appeared in the Dark Sun MCII, and are noted as being able to travel the planes with ease, even the astral, which is a virtually unique ability in the DS setting.

There is also a gate from Athas to the Quasielemental plane of Ash mentioned in the Planescape Guide to the Inner Planes (called The Obsidian Gate of Tor Gaylen) so it's clear from this that - from the perspective of Planescape, at least - that it is possible to get from Athas to the standard planes of other settings.

And then, of course, there's the various Athasians floating about Sigil in one supplement or another - they even have their own ghetto in the City of Doors, iirc.

So from material contained in the Planescape setting, you could easily argue that Athas is connected to the larger multiverse, and thus allow your half-elf elemental to go wherever you like. So long as you're consistent, I'd say it doesn't matter which approach you take.
#3

Palladinae

Jul 16, 2008 5:37:42
Thanks alot.

Considering those difficulties you described, I'll stick with "it's up to me" and will give NPC an athasian heritage.
#4

jaanos1

Aug 19, 2008 19:51:48
Thanks alot.

Considering those difficulties you described, I'll stick with "it's up to me" and will give NPC an athasian heritage.

I'd say go for it - it's your world. In my Dark Sun games, the inner planes of Athas are isolated and the outerplanes very hard to get too, so the only way for what your described to happen is for the elemental to be on the prime plane and somehow hop to the outer planes - i have no links from inner to outer in my version of athas.
#5

the_ubbergeek

Aug 19, 2008 20:04:25
Common fanon ruled a similar thing for spelljaming stuff - hard to get, 'closed' sphere...
#6

jaanos1

Aug 19, 2008 20:09:08
Yeah, that's the basic approach i take, and i've done that deliberately as multiple 2e sources make it clear that Athas IS part of the multiverse, just very, very hard to get to (thanks to the grey) and very hard to get OUT of (in once piece!).

That's why it hasn't been overun with crazy outsiders going berko over the thought of a world free from divine protections....
#7

Zardnaar

Aug 20, 2008 0:22:45
It has its own cosmology separate form the Great wheel. However it is possible to get from one cosmology to another by various sources.

The DS elemental planes do not appear to be the Great Wheel cosmology elemental planes.
#8

jaanos1

Aug 20, 2008 0:53:13
Lots of cannon sources indicating that Athas is linked to outerplanes, that gods are known to exist on world beyond Athas etc - so yeah, part of overall multi-verse INMHO

It has its own cosmology separate form the Great wheel. However it is possible to get from one cosmology to another by various sources.

The DS elemental planes do not appear to be the Great Wheel cosmology elemental planes.

#9

Zardnaar

Aug 20, 2008 1:10:13
Lots of cannon sources indicating that Athas is linked to outerplanes, that gods are known to exist on world beyond Athas etc - so yeah, part of overall multi-verse INMHO

Well everything is in the same "multiverse" as such but some worlds like Athas had very different outer planes- Mystrara was another world or Krynn. Other worlds were mentioned in the primary 2nd ed sources but any links would be extremly tenuous with only 1 reliable way to get to another world- Dregoths planar gate.
#10

jaanos1

Aug 20, 2008 1:28:10
Nope, you can use spells but there is a chance to get lost in the grey; see the side bar "you can't get there from here" on page 10 of Preserver and Defilers.

Key quote:

"... the Gray impedes travel." (my emphasis)

Well everything is in the same "multiverse" as such but some worlds like Athas had very different outer planes- Mystrara was another world or Krynn. Other worlds were mentioned in the primary 2nd ed sources but any links would be extremly tenuous with only 1 reliable way to get to another world- Dregoths planar gate.

#11

Zardnaar

Aug 20, 2008 1:43:23
Nope, you can use spells but there is a chance to get lost in the grey; see the side bar "you can't get there from here" on page 10 of Preserver and Defilers.

Key quote:

"... the Gray impedes travel." (my emphasis)

My houserule to get off Athas without Dregoths gate was to go to The Gray and cast a gate spell and make a DC 40 spellcraft check. Success indicates your gate opens somewhere else for 1 round/level. You couldn't use the calling part of the gate spell.

The Elemental planes described in Earth, Arir, Fire, Water are very different to the great wheels elementla planes. Different cosmology but it was possiable to get to other worlds planes through various means. Only a few beings would know this however- clerical advanced beings, Dregoth, visitors to Athas from, another world, and a few rare spellcasters/psions. Even most of the SK's probably didn't have that knowledge.