Dark Sun Themes reverse-engineered

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#1

entropysoda

Jun 22, 2010 13:17:53

All Dark Sun chars. choose 1 theme.  All themes grant 1 encounter power.
If anyone can figure out anything missing or any errors, I will update the list!

Themes:

Veiled Alliance
:
Excise from Sight Standard / Ranged 10 / Encounter
Ability: choose Int, Wis, or Cha
Ability vs. Will ; 1d10 + Ability modifier psychic damage and you or 1 ally becomes invisible to the target until the end of your next turn. Special: You can take a minor action when you use this power to enhance it. If you do, slide the target 1 square on a hit.

Gladiator:

Disrupting Advance Standard / Melee Weapon / Encounter (Gladiator Theme Attack 1)
With an attack followed by a violent shove, your enemy flies backward. As he flails for balance he loses his footing and disrupts that of the allies around him.
Ability: choose Str, Dex, or Con
Ability vs. AC; 2[W] + Ability modifier damage and push the target 2 squares. The target and any of your enemies adjacent to the target at the end of the push are slowed until the end of your next turn.

Noble Adept:

Adept’s Insight Free Action / Close Burst 1 / Encounter (Noble Adept Feature)
With a mental focus, you enhance the undeniability of your actions.
When you or an ally makes an attack roll, saving throw, or skill check, you may add 1 to the roll.  Grants the character 1 power point.
Augment 1: You instead add 1d4 + 1 to the roll.

Wilder:

Wild Surge Standard / Ranged 10 / Encounter
Ability: choose Str, Dex, or Con
Ability vs. Reflex ; 1d8 + Ability modifier psychic damage and your attacks against the target before the end of your next turn can score critical hits on rolls of 18 or higher.

Wasteland Nomad:

Wasteland Fury Standard / Melee Weapon / Encounter
Ability: choose Str, Dex, or Con
Effect:
If you use this power when you’re not adjacent to any of your allies, you can shift 1 square before or after the attack. Ability vs. AC; 1[W] + Ability modifier damage. If you have combat advantage against the target, add 3 to the damage roll.

Elemental Priest:

Elemental Spirit Minor / Ranged 5 / Encounter
Ability: choose Int, Wis, or Cha
You conjure a sand and stone spirit in an unoccupied square within range. The spirit lasts until the end of your next turn. You and allies gain a +1 power bonus to defenses while adjacent to the spirit. As a move action, you can move the spirit 5 squares. As a standard action, you can dismiss the spirit and make a melee attack from the spirit’s square. Ability vs. Reflex; 1d10 + Ability modifier damage, and the target takes a -2 penalty to attack rolls and defenses until the end of your next turn.

Templar:

Templar’s Fist Standard / Close Burst 5 / Encounter (Templar Theme Attack 1)
You command your foe to submit, crushing his spirit and slowing his flight. The same power that compels your foe to despair fills a nearby ally with brutal zeal.
Ability: choose Int, Wis, or Cha
Target 1 creature in burst; Ability vs. Will; 1d8 + Ability modifier psychic damage and the target is slowed until the end of your next turn. Effect: The next ally to hit and damage the target of this power with an attack before the end of your next turn gains a +3 power bonus on all attack rolls until the end of its next turn.








More on Themes:
Character themes are a new element of character identity that sits  alongside race and class. When you choose a theme, you get an encounter  power for that theme, and you have the option of taking additional  powers out of that theme at higher levels by swapping out class powers  for theme powers (with a few limits). Themes can also serve as prereqs  for feats and paragon paths. Think of ‘em as callings, professions, or  even origin stories; to some extent your choice of theme answers the  questions “How did I become a hero?” or “How do I go about being a  hero?”
community.wizards.com/wotc_richbaker/blo...

#2

Band2

Jun 22, 2010 13:21:54
The wastelander's fury is probably based on Strength.  It has the same attack bonus as all of the mul's powers, which are based on strength, and it adds strength to the damage roll.

That would mean that the attack bonus for the alhulak is +3.
#3

xlorep_darkhelm

Jun 22, 2010 14:59:44
I would hope that there are different options for the Elemental Priest theme... at least one per element, y'know?
#4

Duke5150

Jun 22, 2010 18:56:00
I would hope that there are different options for the Elemental Priest theme... at least one per element, y'know?



Agreed.
#5

tjs

Jun 22, 2010 19:10:50
The wastelander's fury is probably based on Strength.  It has the same attack bonus as all of the mul's powers, which are based on strength, and it adds strength to the damage roll.

That would mean that the attack bonus for the alhulak is +3.



I really, really, really, hope that the themes are not tied to single abilities scores.

If they're going to do that then they might as well have just made new class builds instead.

I will be very unhappy if I can't play my psionic beastmaster ranger with the wilder theme.

I want versatility.
#6

beej_silver

Jun 22, 2010 23:51:12
The theme attack powers are, if I were to guess, tied to either physical (Choose Str, Con, Dex) or mental (Choose Int, Wis, Cha) abilities respectively.

Case in point, the Templar Warlock of Nibenay used charisma for her Templar's Fist, while the Warlord Templar used intelligence (even though his str was definitely higher). Using Wisdom for Templar's Fist doesn't seem to farfetched either, but I wouldn't be surprised if that doesn't turn out to be the case.

Also, it seems that the Noble Adept theme grants the character 1 power point. One pregen had 1 power point (he was a fighter), while the other, psionic adept has 3.
#7

FlashbackJon

Jun 23, 2010 9:50:32
The theme attack powers are, if I were to guess, tied to either physical (Choose Str, Con, Dex) or mental (Choose Int, Wis, Cha) abilities respectively.


Definitely, almost all non-class powers thusfar have been this way.  I'm guessing they will act just like Spellscarred in that fashion.

#8

entropysoda

Jun 25, 2010 17:43:19
Wish they'd release more themes...but I made one of my own: "Martial Artist" using the monk "Stone Fist flurry of blows" class feature as an encounter power.
#9

Valien

Jul 04, 2010 16:45:59
The Wilder theme does not grant 1 power point but the Noble Adept theme does? That seems strange to me.

Plus, the Gladiator theme uses whatever ability modifier you have in it's attack roll. Previewed by this month's Ampersand. I can only guess the other ones do as well.
#10

lizardmage

Jul 04, 2010 18:20:21

So I suppose the broader question that I will ask is this...Will themes be carried over to standard D&D?


I easily see DDI support for future themes, wouldn't mind seeing them move out of DS if they come up with good ones, such as taking straight Wizards and then applying schools of magic based themes. Just a thought.

#11

openpalm

Jul 04, 2010 19:51:03
Thanks for the post entropysoda. I've really gotta say that I like the Disrupting Advance (Good damage, pretty good control) and Adept's Insight(essentially take a feat, gain memory of a thousand lifetimes as an encounter power.) Excise from Sight is also pretty useful if you want your defender's mark to set off, but I'm not sure if I would spend a feat on it.

Also, if the Essentials preview has taught us anything is that most of these powers will scale based upon tier. Disrupting Advance will go to 3W at Paragon, 4W at epic. I really like this trend, since it means that the feat for taking these powers is never fully wasted. I have no idea how Adept's Insight will scale though, but it's not really necessary anyways.
#12

efutch

Jul 04, 2010 20:42:19
The theme preview for the Gladiator had all the powers listed as "primary ability" for attack and damage. It's nice now that a wizard can be a gladiator theme and use int and a dagger! lol. I really like things lsited as "primary ability" gives the themes so much more versatility and character cusomization.
#13

tjs

Jul 04, 2010 22:50:04
Disrupting Advance will go to 3W at Paragon, 4W at epic. I really like this trend, since it means that the feat for taking these powers is never fully wasted. I have no idea how Adept's Insight will scale though, but it's not really necessary anyways.


What feat?

I've seen nothing to indicate that themes will cost a feat.
#14

beej_silver

Jul 05, 2010 9:23:38
Hmm, I believe the Gladiator preview also mentions that DS characters can decide to not choose a theme if they don't want to, making them as optional as backgrounds. Smile 
#15

jrwoodchuck

Jul 05, 2010 13:29:00

So I suppose the broader question that I will ask is this...Will themes be carried over to standard D&D?



I recall hearing Rich Baker saying no they wouldn't.  At least not in the near future on an official basis, however anything is popular if the idea is well received by the playing community.
#16

xlorep_darkhelm

Jul 06, 2010 10:22:43
I easily see DDI support for future themes, wouldn't mind seeing them move out of DS if they come up with good ones, such as taking straight Wizards and then applying schools of magic based themes. Just a thought.



I believe the idea about themes is that they aren't specifically tied to one class (or even a small handful of classes), but are rather available for every class.
#17

valsivis

Jul 09, 2010 13:39:32
I am still reading up on 4th edition...but this idea of Themes sounds alot like the version of multclassing in 4th edition.

From my initial review in comparison, i found multiclassing in 3.0-3.5 broken, and in 4th edition underwhelming...is this soft of a fix for this?  Or this more intended to address the unique flavor of Darksun withouth contradicting base 4th edition rules?
#18

xlorep_darkhelm

Jul 09, 2010 13:45:51
I am still reading up on 4th edition...but this idea of Themes sounds alot like the version of multclassing in 4th edition.

From my initial review in comparison, i found multiclassing in 3.0-3.5 broken, and in 4th edition underwhelming...is this soft of a fix for this?  Or this more intended to address the unique flavor of Darksun withouth contradicting base 4th edition rules?



Not really multi-classing. Multi-classing in 4e is done in two basic approaches: Multi-class feats, or Hybrid classes (PHB3).

Themes are, from what I've been told, more like the old 2E kits, in a lot of ways, but where they aren't specific to a given class, but rather a generalized one that anyone could potentially do. They add a bit of flavor to the setting and the characters within, and so far, are Dark Sun specific. 
#19

FlashbackJon

Jul 09, 2010 14:21:57
From my initial review in comparison, i found multiclassing in 3.0-3.5 broken, and in 4th edition underwhelming...


4th edition multiclassing isn't the sort of class kitbashing that occured in previous editions (for that you want a Hybrid), but multiclass feats are some of the most powerful individual feats in the game.

My characters are typically too feat-starved to spend any for a power swap, but I almost always end up with a multiclass feat.

#20

valsivis

Jul 09, 2010 14:26:04
Thanks for the clarification on mutliclassing and themes (when "kit from 2nd Ed" was said...it made more sense).  I have only done some initial reading.  If I ever get an opprotunity to actually play, I am sure I will get a better feel for the mechanics.
#21

FlashbackJon

Jul 19, 2010 9:48:50
Bump for updates:

As per new info, all Theme powers use your highest ability score for attack and damage.  You get the first power for free, the others are selected in place of your class powers, and have limited scaling (they get better when selected at a higher tier).
#22

bsb150

Jul 19, 2010 12:02:08
Any thoughts on Athasian Minstrel?  (Entertainers, spies, and assassins)
#23

Duskweaver

Jul 19, 2010 14:36:32
Any thoughts on Athasian Minstrel?  (Entertainers, spies, and assassins)


Other than that it's what used to be called a bard in DS? Seems like a good idea to give it a name that won't get it confused with the actual class, although I'm not crazy about the name they actually picked ('minstrel' sounds too strongly mediaeval-Europe to me*). Not sure what more there is to say at this stage...

* - I'd have gone with 'ashik'. It just sounds like an Athasian word to me. Or possibly 'djali', which means both 'bard' and 'blood', which seems appropriate for a bardic assassin.
#24

FlashbackJon

Jul 19, 2010 16:54:30
I actually like the name simply because it's so diametrically opposed to their actual function.  Speaks to the dichotomy.