| Post/Author/DateTime | Post |
|---|---|
| #1SupernalSep 01, 2009 14:15:37 | Since the announcement of a 4th Edition Dark Sun setting, I've become increasingly interested in the lore of Athas, and wouldn't mind giving books a read that were published in the 90's. Novels
|
| #2throkatSep 01, 2009 15:12:24 | I've never read any of the Tribe of One or Chronicles of Athas books, so my knowledge is limited only to the Prism Pentad. The Prism Pentad is probably a decent place to start. The events begin almost immediately after the timeframe of the first boxed set, which also happens to be the timeframe that Dark Sun 4e will be set in. However... There's a lot of hate for the Prism Pentad. It's not because its a poorly written set of books. Indeed, I picked up the re-releases recently and read through them again, and I enjoyed them immensely. The problem with the Prism Pentad, without giving away the plot too much, is that it fundamentally altered Athas in a lot of ways that people didn't like. |
| #3branothebladesSep 01, 2009 16:43:52 | I enjoyed all the Dark Sun novels. The Prism Pentad was a great series and intoduced some very interesting elements to Athas. Like the previous poster said though, while I loved the series I was also disappointed because it fundamentally changed the setting. This would be fine for a stand-alone series of novels but not my choice for how to first represent a setting to the world. |
| #4PennarinSep 01, 2009 16:59:32 | Also, each of the Dark Sun adventures (availlable in PDF on the web, about 2$/each) contained a 10-20 pages short story. Many of those were very enlightening, and the setting IMO thrives better within short stories than novels (which are usually forced to have epic storielines and world-changing events). Check them out |
| #5SupernalSep 01, 2009 17:19:39 | Thanks for the advice. I'm going to purchase The Verdant Passage (Book 1 of Prism Pentad). |
| #6gabSep 02, 2009 9:11:24 | I really liked the Prism Pentad, for the changes it brought to the world, but like others said, many don't like those changes. The three Lynn Abbey books are excellent. They give a very good feel for templars and druids. There's the same main character in all three; it's sort of a trilogy. |
| #7GrummoreSep 02, 2009 19:22:54 | The Prism Pentad is a great serie of novel. Even if it change too much the setting, it's an excellent timeline. As WotC said, it will become a "possible" timeline. I am happy and sad at the same time. I am happy because I liked the grim setting of sorcerer-king ruling cities.
ALTHOUGH, there is a few things I liked about the prism pentad. I liked the new Balic ruled by the 3 Merchant Houses (although I liked Andropinis character). The thing that made me the saddest about the return before the Prism pentad is for Athas.org. I know we owe them a great deal for having keep the setting alive in 3rd ed and they are saying they are happy they setting is alive again...
BUT they created so many things, so many fluff surrounding THAT particular timeline that it's sad that many of these things will or would have to be reworked. Albeit many things will still be very useful dont take me wrong.
The Athasian Chronicle are good, but not all of them. But I think it's the novels that represent the most darksun and athas.
As for Simon Hawke disgusting novel (tribe of one) I suggest you forget about them. If you want to have copy/paste description of monster from the old 2e monster manuals entries, go for it. |
| #8ZardnaarSep 05, 2009 18:55:37 | The best ones are the Lynn Abbey ones. The Prism Pentad are enjoyable to read but ruined the setting IMHO. |
| #9PennarinSep 06, 2009 23:17:34 | RPGNow! no longer seems to carry any Dark Sun PDF products. It's either a move by WotC or the search engine they provide on the site simply can't locate words such as "Athas", despite a known document being named Elves of Athas. I wouldn't go so far as stating all of Simon Hawk's four novels (a trilogy and a standalone) are un-Athasian, for they have lots of interesting and useful tidbits. For example there's the description of a gaming house within Tyr's shady district, who runs it and how, what's served there, what's the clientele like, etc. |
| #10eric_anondsonSep 07, 2009 21:53:06 | To be complete about Dark Sun fiction, the wikipedia list above includes only the novels. Here are the standalone short stories that appeared in the Dark Sun boxed adventures.
Thus completes the published Dark Sun fiction . . . :D |
| #11rainbringerSep 08, 2009 7:00:53 | There were also three short stories published in Dragon Magazine: Water & Ashes, by Allen Varney - Dragon 185 Ashes to Ashes, by Lisa Smedman - Dragon 197 Hunt's End, by Rudy Thauberger - Dragon 220 (A Little Knowledge was also published in Dragon 173. ) |
| #12PennarinSep 10, 2009 3:40:15 | Equinox, by William M. Connors, was a great development on the mythology of the spirits of the land. In that story people mess around with one, generating unpredicatble effects. |
| #13raptor112Sep 10, 2009 21:19:45 |
Why do yo hate the tribe of one series? other then the cut and paste descriptions? I thought they were an interesting and entertaining series. Then again I don't understand the dislike for the second box set alot of people have |
| #14greyormSep 11, 2009 8:30:36 | Why do yo hate the tribe of one series? other then the cut and paste descriptions? I thought they were an interesting and entertaining series. Then again I don't understand the dislike for the second box set alot of people have I suspect, like many of us, because: besides being one of the most poorly written, it was also one of the most poorly researched series of DS stories. For example, with the latter, the cutnpaste descriptions were often inaccurate (used for the wrong creatures, or simply not true according to canon...and I know there were issues with communication, but when you clearly have that specific material right there in front of you and you still get it wrong?), the classes the protagonist supposedly belonged to were portrayed exceptionally poorly and completely out-of-sync with D&D-based fiction. Some, but not all, of which could have been forgiven if, and not that there weren't some cool moments and ideas in the books...but I'll avoid critiquing the writing, because listing the flaws with both the grammar and plot (oy, the PLOT!)--really basic "Creative Writing 101"-type no-nos an editor should have caught (which makes me suspect it didn't see an editor)--will just raise my blood pressure unnecessarily. |
| #15PennarinSep 14, 2009 14:14:25 | The Tribe of One' protagonist - Sorak - was a freakin' god, a big issue: souped-up fighting skills, super-powered psionics, effortlessly gifted with a mighty magic sword, able to survive anywhere and anything. A fun, unchallenged and unchallengeable character, just like the power-fantasists in all of us crave for /sarcasm megatherion made this parodic 3e prestige class that gives you Sorak's powers: Living Legend "Woe and angst is me, for I am petty and weak, not to mention confused with my many personalities, infinite powers, and not to forget undecided in my sexual orientation." - Sorak, the Crown of the Elves Sorak was a fine example of the "Living Legend" syndrome. Receiving all the training in the world in the arts of druidry, melee combat, psionic arts and ranger survival, he always felt he was alone and misunderstood. The reason for this, rather disturbed state of mind was the fact he had multiple personalities, each more powerful than the other. No matter they all lived in almost perfect unison, worked as one wherever their life was in danger (or when they simply wanted some fun by cheating at the casino table) Sorak was deeply insecure and always felt impotent. As he grew popular by doing some rather drastic and famous deeds, he became more and more unhappy with his state of mind. Once he finally managed to get rid of the other personalities, through a very complicated and epic quest, not to mention after three books of complaining and whining, he felt so alone and bitter I almost threw the book to trash. Almost. This prestige class is a lot different than your usual prestige classes, simply because of it's very strict requirements. However, once met, it provides a potential player a vast number of advantages. Hit Die: Flip a coin. Use of psionic powers to determine (or influence) the outcome is not prohibited. If it's heads use d12, otherwise use d20. Requirements To qualify to become a Living Legend, a character must fulfill all the following criteria. Region: Somewhere in the Ringing Mountains. Alignment: Any. Special: Must have been trained almost from birth in a very strict and completely non-described monastic sanctuary although there are no monks on Athas. Special: Must be a non-playable, fictitious or otherwise non-stated race. Dwelf is a good example. Special: Must have a very important figure for grandfather, without knowing it. Fabricated or also fictitious (from beyond the tablelands) Sorcerer-Kings are allowed. Special: Character must be a virgin, ie, never had sex with anyone. Special: Must have all base stats equal or higher than 17. Special: Must be vegetarian, no matter that'd be suicide on Athas. Special: Must have fragmented personality. At character creation roll d%, divide by 3, and use that number as your "known" personalities. Half are male, other half are female. Others are dormant. Special: The Living Legend to be must whine constantly about him being underpowered. Failure to do so at any possible opportunity makes him an Ex-Living Legend. Having sex with any PC or NPC also results in losing the prestige class. Note there are no BAB of Feat requirements. They are not necessary. Class Skills: The Living Legend has all skills as class skills, due to vast chance that some of dormant personalities has that knowledge. Skill Points at Each Level: 10 + Int modifier. Class features Weapon and Armor Proficiencies: Living legends are proficient with all armor and all weapons, including exotic ones. They gain that knowledge from their dormant personalities. Artifact Weapon: At first level the Living Legend unexplainably finds an artifact weapon under his pillow. The weapon is +15 weapon, and the Living Legend can distribute those enhancements as he wishes. Fame (Ex): At second level, after the Living Legend has done something worthwhile to level up, his name becomes famous. Living Legend receives +10 bonus on all charisma based skills. The bonus doubles when dealing with other famous characters, of at least 15HD. At 5th and 9th level the bonus increases to +20 and +30, respectively. Kreen mental set (Su): At 2nd lvl the Living Legend discovers some more animalistic personalities within him which enable him to: - Stay awake as long as desired - Communicate with all living beings which have intelligence 1 or lower (ie bugs), and make them do his willing. No will save is allowed, the animals must obey. This ability requires a full round of concentration, and is ussable at will. Mystic surge (Su): At 3th level the Living legend gains the Mystic Surge ability. This ability destroys all enemies in a 200 ft. radius, no matter of their HD. This ability requires one full round of concentration and is usable once per day. The enemies must be intent on attacking the Living Legend, so for example if a Sorcerer-King isn't actively attacking, he can't be targeted. Unexplainable Insight (Ex): The Living Legend is capable of perceiving the antagonist's master-plan in any DM's plot. Add +30 on any checks made towards this goal, such as sense motive, or survival checks made to track the antagonist. Unlock personalities: At 4rd and 8th level the Living legend unlocks some but never all of the dormant personalities. The living legend gains +5 of all skill checks, gains 2 weapon focuses, 11 psionic powers extre, 50 extra power points, and finally doubles all spellcasting abilities. If he could cast 4 druid spells (not including bonus ones from high attributes) of 1st level, at 3rd level he can cast 8, and at 8th level he can cast 16 first level spells, plus the bonus ones. The same goes for all other spell levels. Power-up: After reaching 6th level, the Living Legend realizes he has approached the half of the way to whatever cause he pursues and miraculously receives a power-up. Roll 2d4 for each ability and add that number to the respectable ability score. Locate Wealth (Su): At 7th level, one time per day the Living Legend can locate enormous wealth in ancient ruins, or other places where the wealth could be stashed. He needs to be in the general geographical area to locate it though. Woe and Angst: After reaching the ultimate goal to stop whining at 10th level, the Living Legend loses all his secondary personalities, thus losing all the class skills, weapon and armor proficiencies and other attributes he wouldn't normally have (from his other classes). He retains the Power-Up though. Further, his artifact weapon is broken, treat it now as a +10 dagger (also rearrange attributes as preferred). He also loses the Mystic surge ability, all the Unlock personality bonuses and the Locate wealth ability. But the Living Legend never despairs (actually he does all the time, but the player does not), so in losing all these stats, the Living Legend gains d6 levels of any class he wishes, together with the appropriate experience points. Furthermore, having an important figure as a grandfather, he has free access to any wealth / magical or psionic knowledge/ favors / raw power his grandfather might have, at player's wish. Treat this effect as 15 repeated castings of a Wish spell. Ex-Living Legends A Living Legend who failed to whine about his impotence, weaknesses and/or state of mind loses all the (Ex) and (Su) abilities he had. He cannot advance any more in his class until he starts whining again, and must do so for 5 real-time hours. Ie, the player must spend most or all of the playing session doing nothing else than whining how problematic multiple personalities are and how he cannot have sex with whom he pleases. After 5 hours, at DM's discretion, the Living Legend has or has not made his attonement. A Living Legend who had sex with a PC or NPC must seek someone capable of casting a Wish spell and ask for the deed to be negated. Any other form of time-travel or reality-bending that will result in having the deed cleared will be effective. |
| #16phoenix_mSep 14, 2009 16:47:40 | Gee someone's not bitter about that character |
| #17greyormSep 14, 2009 22:18:57 | Bitter? Naw! Just horrified at an overbearing Mary Sue! (Plus Mythos creature levels of SAN loss: "Randolph Carter fled the library and stumbled down the rain-slicked streets, his eyes bulging with the near-horror of that..thing, that unspeakable thing! He had nearly come face-to-face with it there amid the musty stacks. But in the infernal blackness of the abandoned alleyway he now traversed towards the questionable safety of his residence, a shadow darker than the night loomed up before him, and rising out from that eldritch gloom like hungry wraiths freed from yawning graves of forgotten aeons was...THE TRIBE OF ONE!") |
| #18schizoidraySep 15, 2009 12:42:41 | Have you ever read a Forgotten Realms novel? So many wish-fulfillment fantasy Mary Sue's to choose from: Elminster, Blackstaff, everyone's favorite dual-wielding angst-ridden drow... there are too many to choose from. It tends to be a staple of fantasy fiction. (of course, Sadira of Tyr kinda fits the bill as well, though it takes her a while to get there) |
| #19greyormSep 15, 2009 13:01:55 | Don't confuse "Mary Sue" with "powerful character" or think such a thing is a staple of fantasy fiction. There is a difference between a powerful (super)hero and a ridiculous caricature of a (super)hero. I can't comment on Sorak as a supermensch as I don't recall myself -- I'll leave that for Penn (which is who the joke was for) -- my beef with that series is the writing. |
| #20schizoidraySep 15, 2009 13:14:08 | Oh I agree with the Tribe series shoddy writing, but just can't stand characters like Elminster who are ridiculously powerful just because. Wish fulfilment as pure as it gets. |