PHBII added primal characters and notably the Shifter race which then led into Eberron (perhaps not as directly as psionics would lead into Dark Sun). Does anyone else anticipate something like this happening or am I just crazy for hoping? Has there been any more talk about if or when a 4E DS setting is going to be released?
phooey!
At least DS, Planescape and Spelljammer are a bit different.
I think Dragonlance could be interesting if they could manage to go back to a War of the Lance setup without heavy reliance on the old modules or novels. Pretty much anyone even slightly interested in Dragonlance has either played the modules or read the novels or both. The trick would be to capture the feeling of the original Dragonlance but make it playable in a new way. Gamers for the most part don't like running other people's characters or even taking the parts of Iconic story characters. Gamers want their own characters. If they could make Dragonlance interesting where people could enjoy their own characters and not be locked into another cycle of cataclysms then it would be great.
That said I would probably vote for Dark Sun if I had a vote!
Never has character race been handled so well in the rules and the variety of races present on Dark Sun just beg for a 4E version.Good Gaming.
Oh well.. i just converted my own Dark Sun.. feel free to check it out, the link is in my sig. (it is posted on Enworld).
Our editorial staff now is comprised of Nina Hess, Senior Editor for the Mirrorstone imprint, who is our resident expert in the field of fiction for young readers; and the editors Susan Morris, the Forgotten Realms line editor; Fleetwood Robbins, who we lured away from Del Rey to work on Magic: the Gathering and Dark Sun; and Erin Evans, who's primary responsibility now is Eberron, but who also works on some Forgotten Realms titles, and will be working on some new stuff we've cooking up for 2011.
What my reading has allowed me to say on the subject: Dark Sun is looking more and more likely for eventual republication. Yes the rumor mill is still in favor for Dragonlance, but I'm much more confident that a lot of the percieved problems with Dark Sun aren't really that hard to gloss over.
Arcane Magic? Arcane player characters will be preservers, with the possibility of spell source/pact for Sorcerers or Warlocks, and there will definitely be a defiler template for arcane monsters.
Divine Magic? Expect some primordials to be created to act as gods. I still need to read more to see if it fits the theme of Dark Sun, but it at least fits the theme of them wanting you to be able to loot the Dark Sun book for your non-darksun campaigns.
So yeah... at worst we'll have a problem with the astral plane in general. But still have reading to do so I'll let more educated people on the subject says their piece.
According to today's spotlight interview, WotC has an editor for Dark Sun novels. Take that as whatever evidence you will.
According to all the evidences past and present, there is 99.99% chance the 2010 setting will be Dark Sun ! I'm confident. I Know a huge numbers of "old" players that wait for this setting to rejoin tables. That's GOOD !
Go DARK SUN Go!
? ;)
I'm kinda conflicted though. On one hand it'll be nice to see legitimate support for the setting (nothing against Athas.org, those guys do [did?] an excellent job for 3E-ers wanting to play DS :D ), on the other hand I'll have to fork out a bunch of money (that I really don't have) for the campaing setting and core 4E rules (if there is such a thing in 4E
).Either way, Dark Sun kicks a$$!!!!!
According to today's spotlight interview, WotC has an editor for Dark Sun novels. Take that as whatever evidence you will.
Speaking of DS novels, I did recently notice the re-release of the Prism Pentad series on Amazon shortly before finding my old 2nd Ed. stuff in the loft, and it made me question whether or not a new edition was on the horizon. After finding my old DS hoard again, I quickly jumped over to these forums and read a lot of speculation threads. Some people are saying Dragonlance (although not on the Nexus forums) will be next on the cards, but I really don't see that myself as new announcements show DL comic lines being dropped, and the final Lost Chronicles book being released that seems to have a final note feeling about it with many DL fans who have read it. Plus, the DL line has just gone on and on with tons of releases that have just made a big convoluted mess of the setting and it's history. The core of the setting has been lost for quite a while and it only seems to have been found with the last Lost Chronicles release, although I haven't read it myself yet.
As much as I love DL, I really don't think it's a viable option for a new revision right now. I think a certain amount of time and distance has to be put between the last novels rolling off the line and some form of revision and re-packaging in the future. With DS it seems quite the opposite.
I honestly think I've returned to the setting at just the right time – almost as if my loft-delving was some kind of strange premonition or gut feeling. The decision to make DS the next revision seems sound to me, both in business terms and fan service, and also in terms of enough time has passed that the material will be fresh and something new and different for players.
I just hope my gut feeling is right. It usually is when it comes to pooping and being sick, so I guess it has a +90% past rate of being correct. :P :embarrass
I just hope my gut feeling is right. It usually is when it comes to pooping and being sick, so I guess it has a +90% past rate of being correct. :P :embarrass
I'll have to fork out a bunch of money (that I really don't have) for the campaing setting and core 4E rules (if there is such a thing in 4E
There are core rules -- same set of 3 books. If playing, you're only likely to need the PHB, PHB2 and PHB3, plus the campaign setting. Yes, that looks bad. Consider PHB3 the psionics handbook, and it's not too far off "tradition"
Plus the reissue of the PP, after it's been out of print for over a decade.
Interestingly, a few months back, I saw a call for line artists from Wizards. http://twitter.com/brucecordell/status/2019543293
And no, I have no more inside information on this than anybody else here.
there are quite a few new races since 2e!!!
but the Complete Humanoids Handbook had a bunch of races...
even the 2e elf book had a section on Athasian elves...
we'll see, and like you said I'll buy anyway!
it would be interesting to see DS versions of Genesi and Warforged
would a watersoul genesi last more than 5 minutes in Tyr? lol!!
at first they didn't have Dray or Araococra either...
it would be interesting to see DS versions of Genesi and Warforged
would a watersoul genesi last more than 5 minutes in Tyr? lol!!
New races in DS are fine but Orcs were specifically wiped out. The only way I owuld let an Orc into DS would be as a tower freak or some plotline involving time travel/temporal stasis.
New races in DS are fine but Orcs were specifically wiped out. The only way I owuld let an Orc into DS would be as a tower freak or some plotline involving time travel/temporal stasis.
See my post here for a way WotC can make Athas an all-inclusive setting.
There are 96 regions covered in the FRCG, and an 11-pg section of deities. If you took every major city-state and city, and put them through ALL of the ages (which wouldn't be the case), you'd still have plenty of room left over. Thus, I am quite certain WotC can include all of the past lore, plus add a significant amount of new lore, using the format they have for the first two campaign guides (i.e. the points of light philosophy).
In other words, any and all races could easily be included, were WotC so inclined to do so.
In other words, any and all races could easily be included, were WotC so inclined to do so.
The Blue and Green ages are part of history, and I never had any interest in playing settings during those time periods. Mostly because the brown age, pre-PP, was the most gruesome, wasted and dangerous campaign setting put together by DnD. Which is what made it fun to play. The other ages are too different - for various reasons.
But you do made an excellent point, the Tyr region is small compared to all the other settings.
The Blue and Green ages are part of history, and I never had any interest in playing settings during those time periods. Mostly because the brown age, pre-PP, was the most gruesome, wasted and dangerous campaign setting put together by DnD. Which is what made it fun to play. The other ages are too different - for various reasons.
But you do made an excellent point, the Tyr region is small compared to all the other settings.
And this is precisely WHY I think it behooves WotC to incorporate the historical ages. :D It makes the setting that much more appealing to a wider audience. Sure, many will want to play in the (preferably more thoroughly covered) Brown Age.
However...by including reasonably robust sections for the previous ages, in the points of light format, you accomplish two primary goals:
1) You give the player base something that they can utilize for a campaign more to their liking, from an alien waterworld, to a high fantasy with psionics setting including all known races and more, to an apocalyptic world-at-war setting of grit and atrocity, to the post-apocalyptic wasteland we know and love; and:
2) You provide a helluva lot of material for DMs to incorporate into the Brown Age, hints of history to drop here and there, bits of lore to enrich the devastated world, ancient horros to reemerge (or to prevent just that from occurring), etc.
Thus, such material is useful to both types of groups: those who wish to play in a different age, and those who simply wish to play in the Brown Age.
You provide a helluva lot of material for DMs to incorporate into the Brown Age, hints of history to drop here and there, bits of lore to enrich the devastated world, ancient horros to reemerge (or to prevent just that from occurring), etc.
Tectuktitlay,
This is a really good thing you just mentioned... it adds ways to have ancient technology re-emerge! or even lost pockets of civilization where maybe a tribe of Orcs went underground and survived well into the brown age!!
Now I really am ready to play... When this Setting comes out... I am scrapping my 2 current RL campaings and forcing DS upon them... they wont mind, they are uber gamers... and would love the challenge Athas presents!!
And no, I have no more inside information on this than anybody else here.
That's really really disappointing. One would hope that after all you guys have done to keep the setting alive for the past decade you'd at least be given some lip service.
If it does turn out that DS is going to be the 2010 setting will that mean anything for the athas.org projects still being worked on, i.e. Secrets of the Dead Lands?
... it would be interesting to see DS versions of Genesi and Warforged
And now I have a reason NOT to by the 4E DS setting.
And now I have a reason NOT to by the 4E DS setting.
You dont have to use those races... I for one am only gonna use the ones that are in my boxed set from the early 90's!
Not really into 4th ed but I hope for DS, Planescape or Spelljammer. Dragonlance can wait.
Bah. Dark Sun is fairly cool, but Dragonlance is still selling it's novels pretty well, and there is a lot of interest. I really hope they hop the story at least a few more decades into the future, and go go go.
That being said, to me, lack of setting books has never seemed to be a reason not to play that setting in a given edition to me. I'm already playing 4e dragonlance, there will just be some free character respecs if the official books change things in a way that players want to make use of.
Bah. Dark Sun is fairly cool, but Dragonlance is still selling it's novels pretty well, and there is a lot of interest. I really hope they hop the story at least a few more decades into the future, and go go go.
If Weiss and Hickman wrote for Dark Sun, those books would telepathically read themselves to you!
In fact they should start to write those... I like the dragonlance books, but compared to the other books(non DnD) they have written... the Death Gate Cycle was an even better line of books.
Not just that, but Weiss is in charge of Dragonlance, so that is out of the hands of WotC... so 2010 could see both Dark Sun and Dragonlance!!
Not just that, but Weiss is in charge of Dragonlance, so that is out of the hands of WotC... so 2010 could see both Dark Sun and Dragonlance!!
Actually Weiss is no longer in charge of Dragonlance, that license expired some time ago and the rights reverted back to WOTC. MWP had to put out their last 3rd ed book in a hurry to get it done before it did expire.
Here is a blog with a few comments from the seminar.
http://4espoilers.blogspot.com/2009/08/d-extravaganza.html
http://www.wizards.com/default.asp?x=dnd/drfe/20090814
Enjoy, DS fans! :D
GO DARKSUN!
-And please, enough with the Darksun vs Dragonlance garbage. As a fan of both, I KNOW both rock.;)
1. Back to the 2e boxed set with the PP as one "possible way things turn out".
2. Trying not to shoehorn 4e concepts into DS. "Dark Sun is something very different, and we felt it was time to show the breadth of what’s possible in the game, just what a broad swathe D&D’s kind of fantasy can cover"
3. Character classes are going to have "an all new set of options". May be rules for defilers and preservers? Gladiators? Templar? Wild talents?
4. Focus on psionics
5. Belgoi are baAAaaack!
Bill Slavicsek did the 2nd Edition box, and though it changed the look and feel a bot from previous sourcebooks, it had a lot of good, solid ideas. I just hope they can explore the rest of the Tablelands - those things mentioned in the Wanderer's Journal but never flushed out.
Joël
And they come right out and say "no gods". Woo.
Back to the original timeline!
"We are going to try very hard not to shoehorn 4e conceits into Dark Sun"
Thats everything I need to rest easy. Looks like the setting is in good hands.
Chapter 5 deals with a new reward system that can replace or augment the magic item system. Kind of screams Dark Sun. So while I remained prepared for disappointment, I was 75% certain from that point on.
A small part of me hopes they don't completely do away with the Life-Shaped items. They weren't a bad idea considering all the strange lifeforms on Athas... they were just taken way too far based on what I've read.
Organic arm mounted jack blades: yes please.
Flying mounts: forest dwellers attacking from exotic flying beasts don't break the setting too much.
Living suits of full plate: break out the napalm, it needs to die.
Oh well. We'll have to wait and see what they come up with.
On second thoughts thas a very nice looking cover and very DS.
On EBay you can find the first boxed set at times
(Ignroe the secodn boxed set)
Meanwhile, 2010 will see me happily exploring a brutally gritty desert world, and that's pretty awesome too.
So, I couldn't be more excited.
theres a plethora of detailed web sites out there with DS material!! if you take the time to look!
so, how long till the official threads open up for DS??
Thta's great news but what does it mean for Athas.org?
They appear to be excited, I haven't looked into their forums yet... but
Wizards of the Coast has announced that they will publish a 4th edition Dark Sun campaign setting.
To all athas.org current and former members and fans that have supported Dark Sun over the years - Good work! We did it, we kept Dark Sun alive, we grew its fanbase. Finally Dark Sun is resurrected!
I <3 Dark Sun! WOO!
All the "oh woes is usses!" junk on some dragonlance boards is silly, though. They complain they get passed over for a year, where dark sun has been left to hang since 1996 (14 years!).
Of course there's athas.org, but still.
Anyway, huzzah! I'd celebrate somehow, but it's almost 3am and I should sleep.
I'm ecstatic. Dragonlance got me into d20 and 3.5 and it looks like Dark Sun will do it for 4E.
All the "oh woes is usses!" junk on some dragonlance boards is silly, though. They complain they get passed over for a year, where dark sun has been left to hang since 1996 (14 years!).
Of course there's athas.org, but still.
Anyway, huzzah! I'd celebrate somehow, but it's almost 3am and I should sleep.
Aww. Dammit. I read this thread first this morning, and now I'm apprehensive about reading the DL forums...
Why can't all of us DnD folks be happy for eachother when our setting get's it's loves?
Aww. Dammit. I read this thread first this morning, and now I'm apprehensive about reading the DL forums...
Why can't all of us DnD folks be happy for eachother when our setting gets its loves?
Just a few bad apples is all. Probably younger folks who got into Dragonlance during the recent 3.5 heyday. 3.5 was REALLY good for Dragonlance, what with the war of souls stuff and the simply AWESOME rpg books put out by m. weis productions. Acting like it's the end of the world that DL didn't get picked for 2010, posting crap like "RIP Dragonlance, 1984-2009."
DS needs love now and there were a few hints over the last year or so DS was going to be redone reasonably soon.
DL has also had a reasonably recent print run and probably isn't all that hard to adapt to 4th ed.
DS needs love now and there were a few hints over the last year or so DS was going to be redone reasonably soon.
Well, yeah. DL has very recent releases, and it's really not that hard to convert to 4th edition, all told. DS needs some dev attention, as it's a very different setting.
While DL is different in many ways than FR, it is a lower magic, smaller god count DnD setting, in the end. DS is a completely different feel in many, many ways.
I definately understand why they would put DS before DL. I'm just hoping DL gets the 2011 slot.
I just went there (its been a long time since last visited the site) and it is down. There is a "athas.org expired on 08/10/2008 and is pending renewal or deletion. " notice on the page.
A pity.
So many questions running through my head... I do hope they are not going to go too crazy on races, after all most of them are supposed to have been erradicated... bye-bye half-orc, shifters, eladrin, etc... What about elemental clerics vs invoke/sorcerer ?
Igotta dust off my Dark Sun 2ed stuff (literally) which must be in my parents' attic (a few thousand miles away)
Best setting ever
GO DARK SUN GO
athas.org seems to be dead.
I just went there (its been a long time since last visited the site) and it is down. There is a "athas.org expired on 08/10/2008 and is pending renewal or deletion. " notice on the page.
A pity.
We're not dead. Just let the domain expire. Bad filtering and such. Getting it resolved.