Post/Author/DateTime	Post
#1 silverwulf Nov 25, 2009 8:03:56	So we're getting ready to run a 2E Dark Sun Campaign that runs through some of the modules in preparation for the 4E Dark Sun next year. Psionics are obviously a huge part of Dark Sun, so I wanted to get some insight from others on how to handle Psionic combat, because it's been a LONG time and I can't remember how we handled things in the past. We'll be running the optional rules presented in the revised box set and SKills and Powers Book, which present you with MAC and MTHAC0's. To make sure we have a firm grasp on how the system works, here's some bits for discussion... When someone attacks another psionically, they're attacking a closed mind in an attempt to drain their PSP's to "0," then open their mind to further psionic attack. While this is happening, does the person being attacked have the option to attack physically, or must he stay within his mind and see the combat through to completion? For example... Bob the Psionicist is in combat with his group. He launches a Psionic attack against one of the attacking Fighters in another party. As he starts to combat the mind of the Fighter, must the Fighter stay within his mind and fight off Bob, or while his mind is being attacked, can he come over to Bob and hack him with his sword every round while Bob is assaulting him mentally? I've always been a little sketchy on whether the person being attacked could still physically move and do other actions until he'd forced someone out of his mind. I think back to Troy Dennings novels, and though it's been a while since I've read them, I don't recall anyone ever physically attacking while they were being attacked with the Way. They always seemed to fight that battle in their mind before they were able to do other things. But again, it's been a while, so I wanted to get some feedback from everyone.
#2 ritorix Nov 25, 2009 12:00:00	No they can continue doing whatever if defending.  And at least in the revised rules, it only takes one 'hit' to open a nonpsionic mind.  Then you got another free attack when it opens.  For psionic minds, you have to reduce the psp pool to 0.  Psionic defenses are free actions at the beginning of a combat round.  Psionic attacks required concentration and can be disrupted. So a psionicist uses say Ego Whip, hits and opens the fighter's mind (no PSPs to burn through), then gets a free follow-up attack for opening a mind this round.  Another Ego Whip will daze if it hits.
#3 silverwulf Nov 25, 2009 20:19:09	Thanks! How would that apply in Dark Sun though? Since everyone is assumed to be a Wild Talent, that means everyone would have a pool of PSP's and have some degree of psionic talent. Are Wild Talents considered non-psionic minds for the purposes of psionic attack? For example, if Bob the Psionicist is attacking Random Fighter X, it's assumed Random Fighter X is a Wild Talent because most are on Athas. If he has some random Wild Talent and a pool of 30 PSP's (for example), would you still treat him as a non-psionic mind and open it after one hit, or would you make a Psionicist have to drain his 30 PSP's before his mind is considered open?
#4 Raddu76 Nov 25, 2009 22:32:21	Thanks! How would that apply in Dark Sun though? Since everyone is assumed to be a Wild Talent, that means everyone would have a pool of PSP's and have some degree of psionic talent. Are Wild Talents considered non-psionic minds for the purposes of psionic attack? For example, if Bob the Psionicist is attacking Random Fighter X, it's assumed Random Fighter X is a Wild Talent because most are on Athas. If he has some random Wild Talent and a pool of 30 PSP's (for example), would you still treat him as a non-psionic mind and open it after one hit, or would you make a Psionicist have to drain his 30 PSP's before his mind is considered open? Not everyone on Athas is a Wild Talent, all PC's are wild talents and I believe the criteria for NPC's to be a wild talent was that they had to meet the class ability requirments for a Psionicist.  If they did they were a wild talent.  However; in my game I jsut gave people wild talents if it made sense for the story.
#5 ritorix Nov 26, 2009 3:21:54	If he has some random Wild Talent and a pool of 30 PSP's (for example), would you still treat him as a non-psionic mind and open it after one hit, or would you make a Psionicist have to drain his 30 PSP's before his mind is considered open? Anything with PSPs had to have their pool empty before being open.
#6 silverwulf Nov 26, 2009 16:31:51	Thanks! It would seem rather easy for PC's to take out a Psionicist then at first glance. If all PC's are Wild Talents per Dark Sun rules and a Psionicist would have to drain their PSP's before attacking them, it would seem highly unlikely that a Psionicist would be able to drain all of a PC's PSP's and open his mind before the guy was hacking on him and disrupting him, forcing him into melee where a Warrior would hack him into pieces.
#7 redxdelivers Nov 30, 2009 5:33:37	i may be wrong about this because it did change but psionic combat was only fought between psionicists. the defender needed to actually have a psionic defense otherwise it was considered open and you could just blast it for 80% of its hit points or whatever.
#8 silverwulf Nov 30, 2009 8:23:45	i may be wrong about this because it did change but psionic combat was only fought between psionicists. the defender needed to actually have a psionic defense otherwise it was considered open and you could just blast it for 80% of its hit points or whatever.  That's what I've been uncertain about. I just don't see how a Psionicist could possibly hope to take out a Warrior type if all PC's are Wild Talents and Wild Talents had to have their PSP's drained before a mind is considered open? Let's say Bob the Psionicist stumbles upon PC John the Fighter. Since John is a player character, he's an automatic Wild Talent per the rules. We'll assume he has 35 PSP's. Even letting Bob get the jump on him and attack first, let's say he Ego Whips John and drains 12 PSP's from him. Now it's John's turn to attack, pulls out his two-handed sword and proceeds to hack Bob to bits. He can now engage in melee with John - which would be nearly pointless - or almost just as pointless stand there and try to drain another 23 PSP's from John while John wails on him, probably killing him before he even gets close to opening his mind.  Unless he rolled a natural 18-20 to crit and immediately opened a closed mind per the revised rules, it seems there is almost no way a Psionicist would stand a chance against a (PC) Warrior. Is there something I'm missing here?
#9 redxdelivers Dec 01, 2009 5:05:58	i may be wrong about this because it did change but psionic combat was only fought between psionicists. the defender needed to actually have a psionic defense otherwise it was considered open and you could just blast it for 80% of its hit points or whatever.  That's what I've been uncertain about. I just don't see how a Psionicist could possibly hope to take out a Warrior type if all PC's are Wild Talents and Wild Talents had to have their PSP's drained before a mind is considered open? Let's say Bob the Psionicist stumbles upon PC John the Fighter. Since John is a player character, he's an automatic Wild Talent per the rules. We'll assume he has 35 PSP's. Even letting Bob get the jump on him and attack first, let's say he Ego Whips John and drains 12 PSP's from him. Now it's John's turn to attack, pulls out his two-handed sword and proceeds to hack Bob to bits. He can now engage in melee with John - which would be nearly pointless - or almost just as pointless stand there and try to drain another 23 PSP's from John while John wails on him, probably killing him before he even gets close to opening his mind.  Unless he rolled a natural 18-20 to crit and immediately opened a closed mind per the revised rules, it seems there is almost no way a Psionicist would stand a chance against a (PC) Warrior. Is there something I'm missing here? im not really sure its been years but id suggest ecoplamsic form and then probably desintegrate. the psionicist has no speed factor so hes going to win initiative most of the time. and ectomplasmic form means if you want to do damage you pretty much have to do it psychically. psychic combat to me was always meant for between psions hence all the special emphasis on attack modes and defense modes. and teh visualisations from teh veiled alliance book was aweome