After reading over some DS material I was left with a question: what is a pyreen?
Called the "Peace-Bringers", they are an ageless race, seemingly primarily Druids, trying to restore Athas' environment the best they can. They generally avoid everyone and everything, and rarely are seen in any form than an animal's form.
Curiously enough, Rajaat, the "War-Bringer" and First Sorcerer is a twisted Pyreen.
Although due to some paradoxical liberties, this supplement is sometimes ignored entirely. But Diggles is right, jumbo shrimp.
NOTE: as far as I can recall, this was the first Dark Sun release not to have cover art by Brom.
Although due to some paradoxical liberties, this supplement is sometimes ignored entirely.
I suspect this has something to do with a Dragon being able to pose as an Avangion and get away with it, which was a huge no-no in the 2e era of fixed, warring alignments. After all, that was the purpose of Protection from Evil/Good and Detect Evil/Good spells.
In 4e terms, I'd say either the Changelings (from Eberron, or use the Doppelganger entry in the MM) or Deva would work pretty well for them if you advance them to 30th level elite soloes or something.
Here is another image of them and some text from their 2E entry.
Pyreens are mysterious beings that roam the world of Athas. They are powerful psionicists and very powerful druids. They travel about Athas attempting to set things right, although it looks like a hopeless battle. Few know of their existence, and fewer still have ever met one. They are sworn enemies of defilers, and their actions indicate they are bent on the destruction of the sorcerer-kings.
Pyreens are humanoid, although they are not identifiable as any of the current humanoid or demi-human races--rather, they have characteristics of all of them. They have the broad bodies of dwarves, the pointed ears of the elves, they eyes of a human or giant, and the childlike face of the halflings. Pyreens are almost never seen in their natural form, for with their druidic abilities they can take the form of any animal. Peace-bringers also have forms in each race and generally travel about looking like any of a thousand faceless wanderers on the roads.
Of course, this was 2nd edition, before Druids could do this themselves.
One of the other special things about them was that they could shapeshift into animals.
Of course, this was 2nd edition, before Druids could do this themselves.
Uhm, they got the ability to shapechange into animals at 7th level in 1E and 2E. They have always had the ability.
sounds like a Deva Hybrid Psion/Druid (and the stats match, mmmmh).
At least that's how i'm running it at the moment.
Do you think Oronis (Keltis) is out there to do good, or just acting good so he can become more powerful?
Was he the one who "changed" from a Dragon to an Avagnion?
Do you think Oronis (Keltis) is out there to do good, or just acting good so he can become more powerful?
I actually believe he is the one Champion who got a conscience. My idea was that somehow, inside, he knows deep down that the lizardmen were not killed off, and yet he knows that they are too. He has a conflicting nature about the lizardmen -- instinctively, like I believe all Champions do, he knows if/when he had completed Rajaat's plan for the lizardmen, this instinct keeps making him feel bad because he really didn't succeed (the Mind Lords helped convince him otherwise, however). But his mind, his memories are that the lizardmen are all dead (once again, thanks to the Mind Lords). This conflict produced something in Keltis that no other Champion has had -- a convicting conscience. He is convicted daily by his conscience, and from that he began the slow process to become the first Avangion, purging himself of the evil of his dragonhood, and re-writing the entire process for becoming a Dragon into becoming an Avangion.
I don't necessarily think he is *completely* altruistic, however. I believe he feels very guilty, and extreme remorse for what he had done to the world (as Keltis, he was known by the Mind Lords and other beings that were around during the Cleansing Wars as the "worst of the defilers" -- willing to defile vast tracts of land for his own purposes, without even batting an eye at it) -- so now he is on a path to redeem himself and what he hopes will rid him of this guilt -- restore Athas to what it was in the Green Age. Not for the good of the world, but to ease his own conscience. It is a difficult-to-identify line that separates the two, but I don't believe him to be completely altruistic -- he does have his own motivation and reasons for what he is doing.
I have a related question: As a DM, do you think deva as pyreen PCs could work? Or would you rather keep them in the NPC department?
Shrug. I'd be more inclined to think they are powerful or gifted psionics that have the force of will to NOT die and disappear in the gray. Kinda like Stargate's ascended Ancients.
Perhaps they found ways for their souls to escape the gray and come back to Athas, since they cant get to the astral sea. But leaving the gray or being their saps memories.
I don't necessarily think he is *completely* altruistic, however. I believe he feels very guilty, and extreme remorse for what he had done to the world (as Keltis, he was known by the Mind Lords and other beings that were around during the Cleansing Wars as the "worst of the defilers" -- willing to defile vast tracts of land for his own purposes, without even batting an eye at it) -- so now he is on a path to redeem himself and what he hopes will rid him of this guilt -- restore Athas to what it was in the Green Age. Not for the good of the world, but to ease his own conscience. It is a difficult-to-identify line that separates the two, but I don't believe him to be completely altruistic -- he does have his own motivation and reasons for what he is doing.
Two words: Forest Maker. Oronis/Keltis is probably faking it for his own benefit.
Show
The forest maker is Rafernard/Abalach-Re, Sorcerer-Queen of Raam. The illusion is "metamorphosis and aura alteration" and her plot is to grow stuff and lore folks to the grown stuff so she can defile em all in order to jump from a 21st to 25th level dragon.
To clear up any confusion, Oronis/Keltis is not the Forest Maker from TSR2430.
If one Dragon can pull it off, then what's to stop another from doing it?
I have a related question: As a DM, do you think deva as pyreen PCs could work? Or would you rather keep them in the NPC department?
I fully intend to redefine Deva as Pyreen (unless the Dark Sun monster manual has the Pyreen in it...) since otherwise the Deva don't make as much sense on Athas in my opinion.
Deva is probably the closest approximation for the pyreen there is, but the pyreen are mentioned as almost never being present in their natural form because of shapeshifting abilities. Their animal forms are explained with "high level druid," but they have a racial ability to shapeshift into more common races. This bit makes me look at changeling as a possibility.
Pyreen speak a large number of languages, deva works there.
Pyreen have a large knowledge of history and religion, deva works there.
Pyreen are resistant to defiling damage. If defiling damage was defined as necrotic, deva would work here (but it isn't, and the power says "damage cannot be reduced in any way." Course, Pyreen are supposed to hate defilers to the point where it wouldn't make any sense to have them adventuring together anyway.)
Perhaps houseruling so that the Memory of a Thousand Lifetimes is replaced with the Changeling Disguise could work.
If one keeps Memory of a Thousand Lifetimes, the "Thousand Lifetimes" would just be indicative of how long they've lived.
My two bits.
Lalali-Puy of Gulg (Aarakocra Scourge)– a sly and cunning queen that rules over her
territory with mind tricks and manipulation. Her powers even seem to extend to other living
organic systems.
There, by sharing that info, now I am altruistic. MWAHAHA!
That evil laugh... how could somebody be altuistic AND have an evil laugh, it makes no sense. Your evil laugh must not be genuine.
It sounds like it ought to be relegated to a monster, not a PC race.
My two bits.
Check the mint date on those coins, bub. They're from last century. Must be worth a fortune by now.
Really though, this is a classic debate goin on. Pyreen were always one of those, "And why not?" races. Probably giving-the-idea-to so many players due to the playable-races comparison in the description.
"They have the broad bodies of dwarves, the pointed ears of the elves, the eyes of a human or giant, and the childlike face of the halflings."
Why play one race when you can play them all?! Introducing Pyreen!! Now with shape-changing!!! (that was 2E)
Except 4E already has shifters. And with the other races being ported into Athas, notably Dragonborn making the Dray officially PC, the call for appeasement is that much more solicited by the powers-that-be (willfully or not).
On the other hand wing, I'm still waiting for word on the Aarakocra. How bout reskinned Air Genasi? MWAHAHA!
On the other hand wing, I'm still waiting for word on the Aarakocra. How bout reskinned Air Genasi? MWAHAHA!
Genasi exist in Athas, I believe they are called Rukova or something like that, they exist on one of the islands in the silt sea.
Genasi exist in Athas, I believe they are called Rukova or something like that, they exist on one of the islands in the silt sea.
ugh. Sure OK, that's been established ... I'm starting a new thread then.
Avangion are said to model their appearance on that of the pyreen.
Avangions don't look anything like Pyreen.
I suspect this has something to do with a Dragon being able to pose as an Avangion and get away with it, which was a huge no-no in the 2e era of fixed, warring alignments. After all, that was the purpose of Protection from Evil/Good and Detect Evil/Good spells.
It's never been hard to disguise one's alignment, and 2e alignments were not necessarily fixed or "warring". Alignment could certainly have game effects, but it was not a straight jacket.
A Dragon with an artifact that let her duplicate powerful preserver magic (Abalach-Re in Forest Maker) could pull off a pretty good impersonation of an Avangion. Not that a good impersonation was required, as next to no one had any idea what an Avangion was.
Detect evil can be foiled by low level spells, a variety of psionic powers, or any one of many easily obtainable magical items. Abalach-Re is more than powerful enough to conceal her alignment, or present a completely different alignment, indefinitely.
Protection from evil's effects are so minor they can be ignored.
Do you think Oronis (Keltis) is out there to do good, or just acting good so he can become more powerful?
He was a second stage dragon before he completely reversed directions (losing 11 levels in the process) and spent centuries becoming an avangion.
He's not faking it, and he's not doing it for the power. He could have been considerably more powerful if he had stayed on his original path. He gave that up because the cost to the world and his people was too high. Now he seeks to correct his mistakes.
Two words: Forest Maker. Oronis/Keltis is probably faking it for his own benefit.
Toward what end?
The Forest Maker situation was completely different. It was to be Abalach-Re's shortcut to power, and the entire scenario played out in a rather short time.
Keltis/Oronis took a 1,500 year detour for the benefit of those around him.