So my group tamed an Id Fiend...

Post/Author/DateTimePost
#1

DontEatRawHagis

Dec 03, 2010 22:10:17
My group just had a good encounter today. I was debating whether or not to have them do the second encounter of Wastewalker(2 kank soldiers and 3 spitters) or give them an Id Fiend to fight.

Spoilers are an explanation of what happened.

Pre-Encounter:
Show

Started off with them running away from the Obsidian storm. However they get cut off, this time its a small silt storm, which won't hurt but will blind them. The storm is just ahead of them but they try to wait for it to past. I said it would take an hour for it to fully past.

The obsidian sandstorm starts to get too close for comfort and after a few knowledge check they figure out that the Obsidian storm is artificial.

Escaping through the silt storm they come to a fork in the road. Left lead to the Id Fiend and right lead to the kanks. They choose left after seeing the tracks, they didn't know what made them but understood that there were more creatures on the right then on the left.
#2

rollawaythestone

Dec 03, 2010 23:23:15
The Id Fiend is quite an intelligent predator. It's not the kind of docile tamable creature a Crodlu is. The moment they go to sleep their dreams will be haunted with nightmares. Their waking life will be plaqued by delusions and hallucinations, and the moment they let down their guard, the Id Fiend will attack and try and eat them.

It can be captured, in the same way that monster hunters might haul strange beasts into the City States for the Arena. But it's not domesticated animal. It's a sadistic intelligent predator. Putting a leash on a tiger doesn't make the tiger not try and eat you.
#3

tentagil

Dec 04, 2010 10:06:53
Yeah, id feinds are not a dumb beast, they are at least as intelligent as most of the lesser humanoids and they can't actually be tamed, at least not based on any of the books.  They will however occasionally work with others if it helps them in some way.  And I could easliy see it acting stupid and letting itself be "tamed" in order to prevent the party from killing it and giving it another chance to escape or kill them.

Not to mention just being near an Id Feind has effects on people, making them edgy and fearful.  Your party would likely start to have paranoid delusions and nightmares jsut from having the thing around.

Of course its your game so you can make them anything you want.
#4

DontEatRawHagis

Dec 04, 2010 11:51:36
Yeah, id feinds are not a dumb beast, they are at least as intelligent as most of the lesser humanoids and they can't actually be tamed, at least not based on any of the books.  They will however occasionally work with others if it helps them in some way.  And I could easliy see it acting stupid and letting itself be "tamed" in order to prevent the party from killing it and giving it another chance to escape or kill them.

Not to mention just being near an Id Feind has effects on people, making them edgy and fearful.  Your party would likely start to have paranoid delusions and nightmares jsut from having the thing around.

Of course its your game so you can make them anything you want.



This is actually helping out a lot.

The way they tamed it was by intimidating it, it was a very very intense for them. I'll definetly have it play dumb. Probably have it buy its time till it can take advantage of the party. Maybe during the Ssuran ambush that happens two missions down the line it might take join with them to try and escape from the players. (I'll keep it at its HP from the end of the last encounter)

#5

zylo_drizzt

Dec 06, 2010 10:46:01
i just wanted to point this out, it takes time to tame any  critter also generally (though aparently not in fantasy) its not quite possible to tame a reptile because the insticts are way too strong however it is possible to get reptiles used to certain behaviors.
#6

Ozmodious

Dec 06, 2010 20:51:53
Might be a little off topic but this is the thread that got me thinking about this. So what kind of skill challenges do people make their players do to tame wild creatures ? When taking a creature for a mount has to be alot differnet than trying to tame an Id Fiend. I mean really.... calming down a trained beast like a crodlu would have to be less time consuming than trying to calm down and antloid or something.
I was just wondering because I am not sure what I would do if my players tried something like this.
#7

terminus_vortexa

Dec 06, 2010 20:55:21
While I own all of the 4th edition books just to show support for DS, I only play 3.5E and thus my perspective is somewhat colored, and may not work in 4e. But couldn't the party just psionically mind%&$* the Id Fiend, either wipe its mind or plant a Mind Seed from a party member maybe? I don't know if those options are available in 4e. Maybe some type of psionic domination? As long as it has its own mental faculties intact, that thing will totally try to kill your party when it gets the chance. 
#8

rollawaythestone

Dec 06, 2010 21:11:36
While I own all of the 4th edition books just to show support for DS, I only play 3.5E and thus my perspective is somewhat colored, and may not work in 4e. But couldn't the party just psionically mind%&$* the Id Fiend, either wipe its mind or plant a Mind Seed from a party member maybe? I don't know if those options are available in 4e. Maybe some type of psionic domination? As long as it has its own mental faculties intact, that thing will totally try to kill your party when it gets the chance. 



Yes they could. The problem is that the Id Fiend is a first level monster. Which means that the party is likely also first level. First level parties don't have access to such psionics.
#9

terminus_vortexa

Dec 07, 2010 5:10:36
Kind of makes me consider dredging up the idea of Psionic Combat from 2e (I believe some early athas.org stuff had Psionic Combat as well). Probably could work much the same for 3.5 and 4e, homebrew rules of course. It would be a great way to handle such situations involving intelligent creatures forced into subservience. But the level 1 factor does still come into play.....
#10

Alphastream

Dec 07, 2010 22:06:16
Yeah, id feinds are not a dumb beast, they are at least as intelligent as most of the lesser humanoids and they can't actually be tamed, at least not based on any of the books.  They will however occasionally work with others if it helps them in some way.  And I could easliy see it acting stupid and letting itself be "tamed" in order to prevent the party from killing it and giving it another chance to escape or kill them.

Not to mention just being near an Id Feind has effects on people, making them edgy and fearful.  Your party would likely start to have paranoid delusions and nightmares jsut from having the thing around.

Of course its your game so you can make them anything you want.



This is actually helping out a lot.

The way they tamed it was by intimidating it, it was a very very intense for them. I'll definetly have it play dumb. Probably have it buy its time till it can take advantage of the party. Maybe during the Ssuran ambush that happens two missions down the line it might take join with them to try and escape from the players. (I'll keep it at its HP from the end of the last encounter)




That's pretty awesome. You could have them have a few "omen" style dreams that seem benign. Or, they could have waking visions. The Id Fiend could become a major plot dispenser. It could plant a seed during the night, which at some point in the day triggers, and before you know it the party is off doing the Id Fiend's bidding.

For a bit of evil, plant a simple beggar that offers them a "stone of fortune", claiming it brings good luck and guidance. Just a simple beggar. The stone does nothing, but they might think it does when they start to have waking visions. Clever players may figure it out, but it should still be fun.

#11

DontEatRawHagis

Dec 08, 2010 11:11:19

That's pretty awesome. You could have them have a few "omen" style dreams that seem benign. Or, they could have waking visions. The Id Fiend could become a major plot dispenser. It could plant a seed during the night, which at some point in the day triggers, and before you know it the party is off doing the Id Fiend's bidding.

For a bit of evil, plant a simple beggar that offers them a "stone of fortune", claiming it brings good luck and guidance. Just a simple beggar. The stone does nothing, but they might think it does when they start to have waking visions. Clever players may figure it out, but it should still be fun.



They have an arcane puzzle box their transporting, I'm thinking of using the idea described below to have one of the players hear voices from it. They already think its evil.

You just gave me a great idea, over the course of the next encounters I'm going to hand some players cards with events written down on them. The idea comes from Paranoia:
Show


  1. A voice can be heard, “Release me from my prison.”

  2. Rummaging through the supplies you see a letter with the Sorcerer-King Kalak’s seal.(an Illusion, if the letter is touched it bursts into fake flames)

  3. A waking vision of your village or tribe being burned to the ground by the Dragon of Tyr came to you. The intensity of it brings you to your knees.

  4. A waking vision of the City-state of Tyr, the streets empty and filled with the stench of death.

#12

BRJN

Dec 23, 2010 20:08:23
How smart is this critter?  It has to heal up before it tackles the group again, but after that it might jump somebody in the night, give them nightmares (no extended rest), backstab them after a tough fight, "be a good boy" as long as they feed it anything they kill.  Think about how a newly-captured slave - such as the PCs - might try to escape and have the id fiend do that to the PCs.

Using this thing in combat ... does any PC have the "Ride a Mount" feat?  If not, make them spend their entire turn to induce the id fiend to use one action - its standard attack, or a move, or (only once per day) a rechargable power.

At some point, a passing caravan ought to mention that {insert city here} Arena is looking for wild beasts for a spectacle next month.  Encourage the PCs to sell off their exotic mount.  The mount might even cooperate ... until/unless it figures out it will never leave the building.

Nightmares
- thieves have stolen all the food/water; when the PCs check the id fiend shows them the illusion of empty saddlebags.
- slavers are preparing a dawn ambush just over the next hill (get the party to split up; then attack whoever is with the id fiend)
- monsters are tracking the group from a distance (get the party to attack anything they meet; escape in the chaos)
- sandstorm coming (push the party in a particular direction)
- you are already captured and are being tortured for information you don't have (get the party to explain what they are up to)
- the oasis you are seeking has been swallowed by the desert
- "Rosencrans and Guildenstern are Dead" - the PCs are being manipulated by somebody who doesn't want them to survive
- locals think the PCs have been suborned by the id fiend and attack them/it on sight
- you are tresspassing on halfling lands and they are preparing to GET you
#13

salla

Dec 23, 2010 20:12:41
How smart is this critter? 



According to the Compendium, Int 13, Wis 16.
#14

DontEatRawHagis

Dec 23, 2010 20:33:30
How smart is this critter?  It has to heal up before it tackles the group again, but after that it might jump somebody in the night, give them nightmares (no extended rest), backstab them after a tough fight, "be a good boy" as long as they feed it anything they kill.  Think about how a newly-captured slave - such as the PCs - might try to escape and have the id fiend do that to the PCs.

Using this thing in combat ... does any PC have the "Ride a Mount" feat?  If not, make them spend their entire turn to induce the id fiend to use one action - its standard attack, or a move, or (only once per day) a rechargable power.



So far the id fiend has been a great foil to them. Its been cutting off their only exits and the like.

Right now they are sleeping in a cave with it. I might have them wake up to find a shared dream experience. Their employer Pak'les, a thri-kreen working for the veiled alliance, was last seen fighting off an entire group of Silt Runners to the death. Passed few times they have seen evidence that he is a Defiler or evil(all created by the Id Fiend). They think they will have to fight him later on, might have an encounter with him later on. The Id Fiend will mess with their insight rolls to show he's lying about being good starting a fight.


#15

BRJN

Dec 24, 2010 13:19:10
How smart is this critter? 


According to the Compendium, Int 13, Wis 16.


Hmph, it's got more INT than my DS character.  But I've got better WIS so eventually Narvik should get a notion that something's wrong.
I still think we should, um, introduce him to the arena master.
#16

ChimericPhase

Dec 29, 2010 1:18:00
I just wanted to post to say: this thread inspired me when I first read it a few weeks ago.
In a game shortly after reading this thread, I decided to pit my players against an id fiend's nightmare as part of a skill challenge.

My plan was...

The group was already trekking through the alluvial wastes looking for a caravan leader driven off course by bandits. They had hired a guide, who gave them an estimation of 3 days to their destination. The group had also recently experienced a vision of the Dragon of Tyr that had really shook them and they were still wary about it.

The plan was to describe several more days of travel, during which things that each character feared would appear or occur. The templar was a secret agent for another city would find their sister arriving to take her head back for treason for example. 7 players in my group so I had a lot of stuff. 

I plotted out a skill challenge for the group to realise they were trapped in a nightmare. Ultimate success meant they realised on their own they were in a nightmare and will themselves awake - at which time the angry id fiend and a handful of minions would attack but the party would be at no penalty and neither side had surprise. Failure meant they succumbed to fear and helplessness as the Dragon of Tyr would appear and kill them all with defiling magic but their combined terror of the Dragon of Tyr would jolt them awake and find the id fiend attacking them. The id fiend & minions would have a surprise round and everyone in the party granting CA, save ends as they were disoriented until they gathered their wits about them.

As it was, half the party didn't show up for that session, but I ran it for the present players, with the excuse that the other characters didn't wake up from the nightmare at all, only the present characters woke. I dropped the minions and had them fight the id fiend alone. Cleverly, the characters decided to not kill the id fiend but instead intimidated it into surrendering and then - inspired by this thread - I allowed the characters to negotiate a deal with the id fiend. On some successful knowledge checks I warned them that id fiends are treacherous beasts but could be dealt with.

In the following session, the party ended up making an agreement with the id fiend for it to distract the bandit guards while the rest of the party rescued the caravan leader.
#17

Feetz

Dec 29, 2010 8:58:19
I decided to pit my players against an id fiend's nightmare as part of a skill challenge.



I love this idea and I think I'll be trying a variation of it when I get my campaign up and running.


#18

ChimericPhase

Dec 29, 2010 11:25:08
I decided to pit my players against an id fiend's nightmare as part of a skill challenge.



I love this idea and I think I'll be trying a variation of it when I get my campaign up and running.




Hey Feetz, I tried to send you a message but it said I couldn't send it to you because your messages are set to friends-only!