Trying to alter the Dragon King ED to become generic dragon - Downloaded from the Wizards Community, all coding removed by Solauren

Trying to alter the Dragon King ED to become generic dragon

Post/Author/DateTime Post
#1
lizardmage
Sep 09, 2010 13:08:30 Hey,

So I've wanted an ED that allows a player to become a dragon since Dragonborn first showed up. Now thanks to the endless joy that is Dark Sun (and I am serious about that) I have the ED except one flaw. Defiling. In my current Homebrewed world there isn't Arcane Defiling and all I need to do is change the Draconian Defilement power. Unfortunately I can't think of something that is equal to it or any abilities that allow a dragonborn to reroll an attack power.

Thoughts on a power that is somewhat similar, or just in flavor of being a dragon that works as a lvl 21 class power?

Thanks folks.

I have posted this in Homebrew but that was...less then helpful unfortunately so I figure maybe some other DS fans can help me out.
#2
Cyber-Dave
Sep 09, 2010 13:50:51 I posted this on your other thread as well, but this might help you:

Since you want to tie this in to dragons, but divorce it from the Dark Sun dragon fluff, attach it to a class and build that already has a "draconic transformation theme." Specifically, make the requirement for the epic destiny the dragon magic build of the sorcerer class. As for the "draconic defilement" class feature, change it something like this: when casting a sorcerer daily attack power with an extra benefit granted to dragon magic build sorcerers, you may spend a minor action just prior to using the attack power in order to gain either a +2 bonus to attack or a +6 bonus to damage with the attack power. Call the ability something like "draconic sorcery."
#3
rampant
Sep 09, 2010 14:19:34 Well you could try matching the class with an energy type, and then you can gain the bonus with attacks of that type.
#4
lizardmage
Sep 09, 2010 17:17:29 See I really like your idea Cyber, but I do want to make it more avalible for Dragonborn of different classes also. Rampants idea mixed with yours might be best, but that could leave things lacking for non-spellcasters.

Then again all the other benifits granted would probably still be worth it even with one ability you barely use.
#5
charybdis
Sep 09, 2010 19:36:15
Hmmm, I'm torn. As a Dark Sun fanatic, I find it concerning using a DS-flavoured ED outside of the world. DS Dragons are not in any way 'normal' fantasy dragons.

However, as Wizards saw fit to remove any Psionic requirement from the ED (for Avangions also) they're obviously less attached to the flavour than I am, so I better just suck it up :P

So, back to the OP question.

The DS Dragon metamorphosis is definately the best option, but am I understanding that the Arcane class (and Arcane defilement) pre-requisites are the issue (as you want to make this available to Dragonborn of other classes?

For any PC to become a Dragon, regardless of Class you would expect there to be a supernatural component to the transformation (Primal, Psionic, Arcane, Divine etc), possibly even with just an Epic ritual.

Maybe instead of having the Arcane defilement power or be of that class, you need the PC (of any class) to learn a specific Epic Arcane ritual to open up the ED?

OK, so this would cost Martial PC's a feat to learn ritual casting, but this would thematically also give them the magical understanding to undergo such a supernatural event as a dragon metamorphosis.

So, just remove the Arcane Defilement and Arcane class pre-requisites, and add in Ritual Caster feat and a home-brewed (EXPENSIVE) ritual, that includes a GP cost at every level of advancement (perhaps equal to an Equivalent level magic item)

Eg: Draconic Metamorphosis ritual.
Level 20 -
Market price = massive
Ritual Cost = equal to magic item of new PC level
Skill: Arcana (no check)

This ritual allows a Dragonborn PC of any class to undergo the Draconic Transformation ED.

The ritual requires sufficient magic to power the transformation at every level of advancement, where the caster must ingest ritual arcane components for every PC level gained in this ED (eg 225k gp@ L21, 325k gp@L22 etc etc)

I don't have my books with me to check the gp numbers, and I know this is expensive, but to allow any class to become a dragon (and gain access to ye olde rampaging dragon option and excellent dragon breath), I think there needs to be a balance in there somewhere, and money sounsd like a decent start (feel free to change the money balance to L-2 or whatever you think will suit better. I just used the Flat level as a baseline).

You could change the ED to add bonuses to Different attribute points, or instead get a bonus to AC (from thickening hide, etc)

It's definately a homebrew option, but your whole world is Homebrew, so me and my DarkSun purity issues have no place there :P

Hope this helps...
#6
ian.thomson
Sep 09, 2010 21:08:35
Re OP: The Avatar of Io ED from Player's Handbook Races: Dragonborn does a good job of "Imma dragon, rawr!" But, if you wanted to use the Dagon King ED, you could just replace Draconian Defiling with Avatar of Io's Breath Mastery (both 21st level class features).

For the requirements, just replace "arcane defiling" with "an arcane daily power," it's pretty much what it amounts to (if you're arcane, or multiclassed enough to have a daily power, you qualify).

Regarding psionic dragon kings: there's a paragon feat, psionic defiling, that gives and lets a character use the arcane defiling power with psionic daily powers, so it is possible for a psionic character to become a dragon king as well.

Post/Author/DateTime	Post
#1 lizardmage Sep 09, 2010 13:08:30	Hey, So I've wanted an ED that allows a player to become a dragon since Dragonborn first showed up. Now thanks to the endless joy that is Dark Sun (and I am serious about that) I have the ED except one flaw. Defiling. In my current Homebrewed world there isn't Arcane Defiling and all I need to do is change the Draconian Defilement power. Unfortunately I can't think of something that is equal to it or any abilities that allow a dragonborn to reroll an attack power. Thoughts on a power that is somewhat similar, or just in flavor of being a dragon that works as a lvl 21 class power? Thanks folks. I have posted this in Homebrew but that was...less then helpful unfortunately so I figure maybe some other DS fans can help me out.
#2 Cyber-Dave Sep 09, 2010 13:50:51	I posted this on your other thread as well, but this might help you: Since you want to tie this in to dragons, but divorce it from the Dark Sun dragon fluff, attach it to a class and build that already has a "draconic transformation theme." Specifically, make the requirement for the epic destiny the dragon magic build of the sorcerer class. As for the "draconic defilement" class feature, change it something like this: when casting a sorcerer daily attack power with an extra benefit granted to dragon magic build sorcerers, you may spend a minor action just prior to using the attack power in order to gain either a +2 bonus to attack or a +6 bonus to damage with the attack power. Call the ability something like "draconic sorcery."
#3 rampant Sep 09, 2010 14:19:34	Well you could try matching the class with an energy type, and then you can gain the bonus with attacks of that type.
#4 lizardmage Sep 09, 2010 17:17:29	See I really like your idea Cyber, but I do want to make it more avalible for Dragonborn of different classes also. Rampants idea mixed with yours might be best, but that could leave things lacking for non-spellcasters. Then again all the other benifits granted would probably still be worth it even with one ability you barely use.
#5 charybdis Sep 09, 2010 19:36:15	Hmmm, I'm torn. As a Dark Sun fanatic, I find it concerning using a DS-flavoured ED outside of the world. DS Dragons are not in any way 'normal' fantasy dragons. However, as Wizards saw fit to remove any Psionic requirement from the ED (for Avangions also) they're obviously less attached to the flavour than I am, so I better just suck it up :P So, back to the OP question. The DS Dragon metamorphosis is definately the best option, but am I understanding that the Arcane class (and Arcane defilement) pre-requisites are the issue (as you want to make this available to Dragonborn of other classes? For any PC to become a Dragon, regardless of Class you would expect there to be a supernatural component to the transformation (Primal, Psionic, Arcane, Divine etc), possibly even with just an Epic ritual. Maybe instead of having the Arcane defilement power or be of that class, you need the PC (of any class) to learn a specific Epic Arcane ritual to open up the ED? OK, so this would cost Martial PC's a feat to learn ritual casting, but this would thematically also give them the magical understanding to undergo such a supernatural event as a dragon metamorphosis. So, just remove the Arcane Defilement and Arcane class pre-requisites, and add in Ritual Caster feat and a home-brewed (EXPENSIVE) ritual, that includes a GP cost at every level of advancement (perhaps equal to an Equivalent level magic item) Eg: Draconic Metamorphosis ritual. Level 20 - Market price = massive Ritual Cost = equal to magic item of new PC level Skill: Arcana (no check) This ritual allows a Dragonborn PC of any class to undergo the Draconic Transformation ED. The ritual requires sufficient magic to power the transformation at every level of advancement, where the caster must ingest ritual arcane components for every PC level gained in this ED (eg 225k gp@ L21, 325k gp@L22 etc etc) I don't have my books with me to check the gp numbers, and I know this is expensive, but to allow any class to become a dragon (and gain access to ye olde rampaging dragon option and excellent dragon breath), I think there needs to be a balance in there somewhere, and money sounsd like a decent start (feel free to change the money balance to L-2 or whatever you think will suit better. I just used the Flat level as a baseline). You could change the ED to add bonuses to Different attribute points, or instead get a bonus to AC (from thickening hide, etc) It's definately a homebrew option, but your whole world is Homebrew, so me and my DarkSun purity issues have no place there :P Hope this helps...
#6 ian.thomson Sep 09, 2010 21:08:35	Re OP: The Avatar of Io ED from Player's Handbook Races: Dragonborn does a good job of "Imma dragon, rawr!" But, if you wanted to use the Dagon King ED, you could just replace Draconian Defiling with Avatar of Io's Breath Mastery (both 21st level class features). For the requirements, just replace "arcane defiling" with "an arcane daily power," it's pretty much what it amounts to (if you're arcane, or multiclassed enough to have a daily power, you qualify). Regarding psionic dragon kings: there's a paragon feat, psionic defiling, that gives and lets a character use the arcane defiling power with psionic daily powers, so it is possible for a psionic character to become a dragon king as well.