Post/Author/DateTime	Post
#1 Hockeyman274 Feb 19, 2015 15:03:01	I just finished my 2nd week with my new AL group at the local game shop, I have to say that I am having some questions about rules the DM is making.   1.) The party is exploring a cave after confronting a group of hunters. Having a flaw that I'm easily attracted to shiny jewels, I noticed the rings on the lead hunters hand and thus my character began to follow the hunters. The hunter's said they were going into the forest to meet their "contact", intrigued by the contact mention, another PC decided to track the NPCs as well. The DM said we couldn't because the hunters turned around and saw us to which I replied "shouldn't we have to roll for stealth?" The DM looked pissed but said I was right and allowed both of us to roll. We both succeed and immediately after we succeed the DM told us that the hunters turn around and spot us. I asked how and he said he rolled a Nat 20 but he never actually rolled a dice. As a DM I certainly understand when the players do something and the DM doesn't want them to and I accepted the situation and both my companion and I returned to the group. My problem with the situation is later during combat I rolled a Nat 20 and was expecting it to be successful as a Critical Hit, that's when our DM informed me that there is no such thing as a Natural 20 in Adventure League and therefore going against his argument earlier. Another companion rolled a Nat 1 and I expected the worst, to which the DM replied "No such thing as a Critical Fail in Adventure League". I can't find any info in the AL guide as to whether there are Nat 20s and Nat 1s, can someone help justify this cause I found the section in the 5e handbook and he said AL was different.   2.) I know that PvP is frowned upon in AL and I don't have a problem with that but I have a problem that needs clarified. One of our party members wanted to punch her boyfriends character for being a smart Alec and the DM said that she couldn't because it is a "hostile" action which I can accept. My problem comes when the DM's friend, who plays a Druid, shapeshifts into a Giant Spider, wrapped a fellow member of the group in a web and dragged him into a room filled with enemies. The player getting webbed asked if he could fight back and the DM said "No" because fighting the spider would be PvP so he sat there as the spider wrapped him up. I interrupted and said "wouldn't the spider wrapping up a fellow companion, against his will, be a "hostile" PvP action?" To which the DM replied no. I want clarification on how the hell this is legal and why the other PC couldn't fight back and had to deal with it?   3.) In the AL guide it states that the players must work together during times of danger, the exact quote is:   "No Undermining of Other Characters During Adventures. Adventurers are brought together by common cause, and during an adventure, they're expected to work together to overcome challenges. Though certain factions might find others distasteful, individuals will put that aside and become a team when put in dangerous situations. In short, play nice with each other when things get deadly." (ALPG, p.4).   The way it is worded makes me believe something different. It says that PC cannot do PvP just because of different faction beliefs but it never says PvP isn't permitted. The rules state that all characters cannot be Chaotic Evil nor Neutral Evil which are the only 2 alignments that I can see actually murdering their fellow party members for their own purposes. The way the rule is explained, I take it that PvP is permitted but not over faction differences and since all players are "Lawful" their characters could never bring thselves to murder another PC.   My problem is that my character is deadly scared of spiders and has not acually seen our Druid shapeshift into one yet but when he does, I want to be able to roleplay and have my character start hacking at his childhood fear (spiders killed my sister). I wouldn't kill the spider/Druid but I would stop attacking him once he resorted back to his Druid form therefore not killing him. Do you think that's logic is acceptable?   4.) Our Druid will only shapeshift into a Giant Spider and when he takes enough damage to return him to his Druid form he immediately shifts into the spider agin. Problem is that his Druid form never takes any damage, just his spider form, and that the rule book says he can only shapeshift 2 times before he must take a rest to recover his shape shifting points. He shapeshifted a total of 5 times last night and both player and DM argued with me when I showed them the rule in the 5e Players Handbook. Anyone have any input on the situation?   Thank you for all responses
#2 RulesJD Feb 19, 2015 15:36:03	1.  That is bad DMing, but partially right.  Nat 1s/20s do exist in combat and have specific rules as stated in the PHB.  Nat 1s always miss, Nat 20s always hit and cause critical damage.  Saving throws and Ability Checks can still succeed/fail on 1s/20s depending on the relevant modifiers, therefore there is no such thing as a Nat 20 or 1 on something like a Perception check.   2.  The DM was wrong.   3.  Refer to #2.  PVP is not allowed.  Also, if your character is deathly afraid of spiders, I would force the Frightened condition on your character rather than permit you to attack the Druid.   4.  Your DM is a powertripper that likely enjoys the feeling of control given to a DM more than making a well run game.  I'm guessing he's good friends with the Druid.  You can report his behavior to your Local AL coordinator or Regional Coordinator and let them handle any possible greater repercussions.  Unfortunately for you, the best you can do is to deal with it, find a new table somewhere else, or start DMing your own table.
#3 caecafortuna Feb 19, 2015 16:12:03	First, I like your moniker.  Second, your DM is not managing the game appropriately.  +1 to RulesJD, I would also recommend you talking with the local coordinator, try to play at a different table or try a different store.  Good luck.  Let us know what happens.
#4 Oraibi Feb 20, 2015 1:46:11	Yeah, sounds like a bad table. Sorry that happened to you.
#5 Kalani Feb 20, 2015 8:24:19	The only way the Rangers would have immediately spotted you was if they had direct line of sight to you.   If you were hiding behind a tree or something - stealth vs passive perception would be used to see if they spot you. If they were actively searching it would be stealth vs perception instead.    Turning around and spotting you automatically can happen if all you were doing was following them quietly. Your story lacks details to know which occurred but I suspect the DM was just being pissy at you following the ranger and wanted to trump you.    If you leave your place of hiding you are also spotted automatically if they have line of sight. In combat - this occurs even if you only step partially around the corner (maintaining 3/4 cover) to fire your bow. Outside of combat I would again check to see if you have been spotted in this scenario.
#6 Coredump00 Feb 20, 2015 14:23:22	1)  The way the rules work is you state what you are doing, the DM adjudicates what happens.  This *may or may not* entail some dice rolling.  The DM was completely within his purview to have the rangers spot you if he felt they would have. That said, I think he was just being a control freak....   There is not explicit "no PvP" that I have ever been able to find.  But as you quoted, there is a 'no undermining'.  So the druid should not have been able to web the guy up.   Of course, the rules dont' touch on honest disagreements.... when the evil guy wants to kill the (whatever) and the paladin does not....  When the Warlock wants to keep the evil dragon eggs, but others want to destroy them...
#7 BRJN Feb 20, 2015 15:53:30	re: (4) If a DM is bound and determined to keep his friend at the expense of alienating the other players at the table, that is one way to do it.   As stated above, take these incidents to the AL Organizer for further action.  If you could locate other players at your table(s) who could supply supporting testimony, that would be a benefit, too.  Your "case" will be stronger if several players have a poor experience to describe.  If only one person (you) complains , the problem might be with the complainer (you) instead of with the target of the complaint (that DM).
#8 RCanine Feb 21, 2015 19:44:57	Although I generally think @RulesJD got it right, some things I think he missed:   PCs should only be rolling d20s when the chance of success or failure is possible; it's within the DMs purvue to rule that you cannot find something even though you're looking for it (hopefully for good reason), and hence no dice are required. One of my big pet peeves is when a player announces he is making a skill check and then rolls a die rather than describing his action or intent. Whooping someone upside the head is not PVP, and is a perfectly legitimate RP tactic. Unless, maybe you're a monk trying to land the Slap of 1,000,000 Exploding Suns. In general, there doesn't need to be a rule to allow you to roleplay something. If a character is afraid of spiders, you should feel free to dive behind a bush, squal like a baby, or refuse to go anywhere near it. Be creative, and think of something fun that doesn't involve stabbing it. At the sight of the spider, I squeal like a stuck pig and charge at it, drawing the symbol for burning hands. I yell, "kill it with fire!" but in my haste I trip over my own feet and accidentally target the kobolds instead.
#9 Ravix Feb 22, 2015 13:43:33	Report that DM to your organizer, should your organizer fail to do anything about it report your organizer to the Regional Organizer. I've had bad experiences with an organizer at my location and honestly the best thing you can do is just get others involved, he shouldn't be allowed to create such a dumb experience for the players.  He's perfectly welcome to go DM and non-public non-AL game if he wants to act like that and ignore the rules.