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| #1KalaniJan 20, 2015 10:20:32 | I have noticed that a lot of DMs appear confused as to their expectations, and the powers granted to them as an Adventurer's League DM. While the Adventurer's league Player's Guide does cover this, many people are still understandably confused when it comes to the Rules for Dungeon Masters (ALPG p9) and Tips for Dungeon Masters (ALPG p11-12) sections.
Fortunately, the good folks who run the Adventurer's league have put together a series of FAQs which help clarify some of the confusion. Sadly, the best article which addresses this is very difficult to find unless you use the search function and know what you are looking for.
The following article was originally posted on the dndadventurersleague.org website, but is difficult to find.
I recommend all AL DMs read this article and familiarize yourself with its contents. It will help clarify the expectations placed upon you, and make your job easier.
If at all possible, could I ask that this thread be stickied. |
| #2KalaniJan 25, 2015 15:46:12 |
DMING AND DM EMPOWERMENT
Disclaimer: This article is reposted from the dndadventurersleague.org website. Link to the original source is in the title above. I claim no credit for this article, and have reposted it unedited, in its entiretly for the purpose of reaching the maximum target audience possible. Kalani
DMs Must Follow the Rules as Set Forth in the Player’s Handbook and thePlayer’s Guide and to Generally Run Adventures as Written DMs are expected to follow all of the rules in the Player’s Handbook and Player’s Guidewhen running games. Since the Player’s Guide permits characters to use all of the material in the D&D basic rules and Player’s Handbook, except for rolling ability scores and hit points and imposing certain alignment restrictions, and restricts characters to those rules, DMs cannot impose any additional restrictions or permit characters to use any additional rules. This requirement is consistent with the rules set forth in the Dungeon Masters Guide, which states on page five:
Similarly, DMs are expected generally to run D&D Adventurers League adventures as written. DMs who create their own rules and who depart from the text of adventures significantly destroy the common experience of the game and the portability of characters. In a home game, a DM can freely depart from the rules and the text of an adventure without destroying the experience for their players. However, in organized play, players find it unfair when their characters cannot do what other characters did. They get angry and complain when their DM imposes restrictions that do not limit other characters or when their DM makes them face risks that other characters in the same situation did not face. They also get angry and complain when they hear other DMs gave other players and characters opportunities and wealth that are not generally available to everyone. Therefore, in the D&D Adventurers League, DMs are required to follow the rules and generally to run adventures as they are written. Nonetheless, DMs have a great deal of latitude in how they run games. On page five, the Dungeon Masters Guide states:
Where there are no rules, or where the rules leave something unclear, it is up to the DM to decide how to handle a situation. Page fifteen of the Player’s Guide places responsibility for such decisions on the DM, stating:
For example, a player may want his or her character to swing from a chandelier during a combat, casting a spell as the character does so. The Player’s Handbook does not have a clear rule for that situation. The DM could rule it is not possible, call for a Strength (athletics) check to hang onto the chandelier, call for a Dexterity (acrobatics) check to swing from it, and/or rule that the character has disadvantage on the spell attack (or the foe has advantage on its saving throw) due to the motion of the chandelier during the casting. The current D&D rules intentionally do not cover every situation. When the situation is not covered by a specific rule, or when the rules leave a gray area, whatever the DM says is final. DMs are free to consult their players, other DMs, and the Wizards community forums at community.wizards.com/forums/132291 for guidance on the D&D rules, but are not bound by such guidance. However, where the rules do cover a situation and there is no gray area, the DM cannot vary from them. For example, the Player’s Handbook clearly indicates when players can take feats. Similarly, the Player’s Guide clearly indicates that players cannot roll character ability scores and hit points. DMs running D&D Adventurers League games cannot change or ignore those rules. Although We Play the Same Adventures,
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| #3CyberqatJan 24, 2015 9:51:38 | Good article, but it is still unclear about adressing missing information in an adventure or things that break DMG rules without explicitly saying that this is what they intend to do. Is the GM empowered to fill in for missing item or character statistics, for instance. |
| (Reply to #3)Coredump00 |
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| #5NoonJan 24, 2015 16:26:34 | Well, that's pretty awful and draconic.
You want to leave the GM in question any latitude to give extra reward, WOTC? Like you could even list a range in the module? "From zero, up to 200 gold, at your discrepancy" or whatever amount of gold.
Otherwise the AL is just a control freak GM, controlling many other GM's and through them, players.
I'll just start my own AL, with hookers and blackjack... |
| (Reply to #4)TheBreen |
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| #7Coredump00Jan 24, 2015 18:08:49 | If you give the sword a purpose, you are changing the magic item. If you assign the sword stats, you are changing the magic item. If you assign the sword a personality, you are changing the magic item.
There is no rule that every item in every adventure has to follow what is described in the DMG. One of the Expedition adventures gave out a cloak that was different than the DMG description. The AL admins issued an errata on that, but until then the cloak did what the cloak said, the table DM has no authority to change the cloak to match the DMG description.
Now, DMs are allowed to create personalities, so I would expect a DM to give the sword a personality for *their* table. But they cannot assign a permanent personality.
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| #8Raddu76Jan 24, 2015 18:34:37 | I asked Jeremy Crawford about Hazirawn's stats on Twitter. I'll let you know if he replies. |
| (Reply to #8)Coredump00 |
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| #10Enevhar_AldarionJan 25, 2015 0:50:18 |
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| #11CyberqatJan 25, 2015 10:53:31 | Whethre its reaosnable or not... its dead wrong.
This is the response from my regional coordinator. Not only does it say the DM should make up stats for Hazirawn, it in general reinforces the DM as final arbiter and decision maker when it comes to rules. As 30 year RPG gaming veteran, this makes sense to me as anything else just opens the game up to counter-productive rules lawyering on the parts of the players.
============================================================================================================= DMDave: HotDQ was written before the rules on sentient magic items was completed. As you have noted, there are no stats for Charisma. The AL has not directly addressed this issue, but they have issued the more general answer for what to do about ambiguities in the rules, found here:http://dndadventurersleague.org/sage/index.php.... |
| #12CyberqatJan 25, 2015 11:30:20 | This ofcourse DOES bring up the question of how do you handle somethign like Hazirawn if it coems into your game under a significantly differnt GM ruling, like it has no stats and thus cannot fight for control. (A) Leave it behind at my table (B) I'll roll secret temporary stats that apply while you are playing it in my game. |
| #13Coredump00Jan 25, 2015 14:33:22 | I would be careful when swinging the "Dead Wrong" assertion.
Its great your Regional Coordinator gave you an answer, and even better that it is one you like. But what makes you think he has the knowledge or authority to make such decisions?
He is one of 7 volunteers in the US that has agreed to help promote and organize AL games. In the list of responsibilities provided on the website, it does *not* include making rule or policy decisions for all of the AL. Did he contact the other RC? Did he contact the people *running* AL? Did he contact WotC? Or is this just his personal opinion....??
Further, two of the AL admins are regular posters here, and yet somehow they don't 'know' what your RC apparenlty takes as fact. In this *very thread* Robert Alducci could have said the same thing (*IF* that were actually the AL stance), but he didn't . He specifically said he would bounce the issue up to WotC.
So now... why should be believe that your RC is a more authoritive source than one of the AL admins. (Not to mention Skerrit not chiming in... and he is the *head* admin)
Keep in mind, the DM will *have* to adjudicate some things so the item works at *his table*. But that is not the same as assigning stats etc to the sword. Any permanent designation is changing the magic item. |
| #14Coredump00Jan 25, 2015 14:51:44 | Um.... I don't know who DMDave is... but he apparently lives in the North East, and the NE RC is named Cindy Moore, so I somehow doubt he is your Regional Coordinator.
He may be a local coordinator.... or for your store... or something.... |
| #15NoonJan 25, 2015 15:24:16 |
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| #16RCanineJan 26, 2015 8:58:30 |
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| #17NoonJan 26, 2015 21:50:59 |
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| #18RCanineJan 26, 2015 23:59:46 |
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| #19KalaniJan 27, 2015 6:33:44 | As far as reducing awards go, here is the official stance on the matter.
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| #20NoonJan 27, 2015 16:17:53 | RCanine, seems to me the fudging is against AL rules, so that's certainly not a supportive example of AL.
And in regards to fights, that's not examples of players changing an outcome. It's clear modules expect you to get through the fight that is between A and B, so you can get to B. Whether they walk through, stealth through, fight through, whatever - it all just ends in going to B, regardless. And this is where your feature may be what I describe as a bug - all the players do is add some colour and quips. That's not playing - it's occasional audience participation.
Kalani,
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| #21KalaniJan 27, 2015 20:35:35 | No I don't think everyone plays it exactly the same - but the idea is to have a common play experience. Therefore certain details are hard coded. Dms can alter Conversations, tactics, etc. but they cannot alter the substance of the adventure such as introducing new monsters, encounters, treasure etc. minor npcs are fine though. |
| #22NoonJan 27, 2015 21:52:13 | For a start I've run AL modules that have hidden treasure - that's going to make the play experience uncommon as one group misses out on a treasure and another finds it.
Instead of a dice determining if you get another 50 GP, it'd be a GM deciding it - yet for some reason (and amazingly given this isn't a hobby about boardgames) you think that's a disruptive influence?
My initial idea is that they could have modules would grant a GM a budget of gold he could hand out if it suits what happens in play.
The budget limit would be harded coded as much.
It'd be silly to say 'because it's not hard coded in modules now, it can never be in any future ones'. That's not the module being hardwired. |
| (Reply to #18)Undrhil |
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| #24RCanineJan 27, 2015 22:09:15 |
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| #25OraibiJan 27, 2015 23:10:13 | Noon, with your comments about literal strangulation and so on, I'm wondering if organized play of the AL style is really what you're looking for. It sounds to me like you want a looser experience that is closer to the traditional style of home games, so maybe AL isn't a good fit for what you desire. Your ideas about starting your own OP program sound interesting, but it's also a lot of work. Do let us know if you get that off the ground, though! |
| #26PauperJan 28, 2015 8:22:23 | My feeling is that we shouldn't be telling thoughtful, articulate DMs that AL isn't a 'good fit' for them; we should be finding ways to encourage such DMs to continue running AL games and even find ways to have them pass on their understanding and knowledge to new DMs. That's how you improve and expand the program in a lasting, durable way.
-- Pauper |
| #27RCanineJan 28, 2015 8:56:32 |
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| (Reply to #18)Pauper |
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| #29SkerritJan 28, 2015 11:42:48 | Sometimes you just have to do whats fun. I recently was testing a possible encounter with a sleep-like effect that you get a save against (no Hp limit like the spell has). The save is quite low, but somehow all five players failed. That should be a TPK; first fight of the mod. Not really fun. Instead, as the players went around saying what they rolled, I lowered the save DC so two characters were awake and we could keep playing (and then made a note to adjust the final version so there was a way to prevent such a save or TPK situation should I decide to use that encounter). |
| #30OraibiJan 28, 2015 12:22:52 | Pauper, when someone's reaction to simple OP rules is that extreme that they're already threatening to leave and start their own program, it's worth noting that AL will not be right for everyone, cannot be right for everyone, and is designed to meet certain goals by the organizers that not everyone will share. It's just one of many ways to play 5e D&D, and it won't be a fit for everyone's preferred play style. |
| (Reply to #30)Pauper |
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| #32NoonJan 28, 2015 16:41:07 |
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| #33RCanineJan 28, 2015 19:45:42 |
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| (Reply to #9)Aribeth |
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| #35UndrhilJan 29, 2015 1:09:02 | Every campaign starts out railroaded. If it didn't, you'd have four or five random PCs drinking ale in a tavern and making lewd gestures at the bar maid and no hint of a reason for them to do anything else.
The beginning of HotDQ has the characters going into the town because they have to. Sure, they could be a cowardly sort and go the other way, but that's not how a campaign works. |
| #36NoonJan 29, 2015 1:28:07 |
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| #37OraibiJan 29, 2015 2:43:04 | I'm thinking it's hard to fit in lack of railroading in organized play, let alone characters "searching for their sister, planning their revenge, wanting to build a church" and so on. Because let's face it, AL characters built with such goals are never going to accomplish them. (Furthermore, there's really no way to mandate good motivations in OP.)
Mind you, I don't disagree with your statements if we were talking about a home game. But there is an inherent amount of railroading and vague motivations that comes along with organized play. I don't think it can actually be completely avoided, but I also think it is a feature and not a bug. (In other words, the qualities inherent in OP are supposed to be there, and it's not something that's unintentional and undesirable.) |
| #38OraibiJan 29, 2015 2:49:30 | PS: Skerrit's example was from his playtesting of an encounter that may or may not make it into an AL adventure. I don't think it's at all unusual that playtests would consist of different styles of judging than actual AL sessions. I don't think it's justifiable to accuse Skerrit of hypocrisy because of this situation. |
| #39SkerritJan 29, 2015 6:32:37 | I'll also point out that I was refering to fudging as a judge to avoid a TPK 20 minutes into game due to the table some how hitting astronomical odds bad roll, not saying I think giving out monty hall levels of treasure and destroying a shared campaign economy is fun so I want to do it. It's that kind of logic that is why we can't have nice things. |
| #40RCanineJan 29, 2015 8:42:15 |
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| #41AribethJan 29, 2015 21:54:13 |
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| #42OraibiJan 30, 2015 3:30:57 | ... wait, what does DME mean? |
| #43KalaniJan 30, 2015 7:29:39 |
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| (Reply to #41)Pauper |
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| (Reply to #43)Pauper |
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| (Reply to #23)Cyberqat |
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| #47AribethJan 30, 2015 19:49:40 |
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| (Reply to #42)Aribeth |
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| #49RCanineJan 30, 2015 22:58:41 |
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| #50AribethJan 31, 2015 17:03:20 |
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| (Reply to #50)TheBreen |
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| (Reply to #51)Aribeth |
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| #53RCanineJan 31, 2015 19:04:56 |
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| (Reply to #53)Aribeth |
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| #55OraibiJan 31, 2015 23:31:42 | In my view, DM empowerment is the kind of great power that comes with great responsibility.
So just because a DM is able to do certain things, that doesn't always mean they SHOULD do them. I favor a conservative approach to DM authority which seeks to err on the side of caution. |
| #56RCanineFeb 01, 2015 4:20:47 |
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| #57KalaniFeb 01, 2015 8:59:48 | When it comes to monsters, we are encouraged to add/remove monsters of the same type - that's it.
If however, an encounter is going south due to an overestimation of party strength, we can always halve the HPs of the remaining monsters, or reduce their AB and AC by a few points in order to make the combat less challenging. This should only be done however in a situation where it doesn't make sense for the creature(s) to flee and/or take prisoners, and for non-important battles only. Who wants to die to a horde of goblins just because the DM made an error when setting up the encounter and put a few too many critters on the table. |
| (Reply to #56)Aribeth |
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| (Reply to #47)Pauper |
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| (Reply to #34)Coredump00 |
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| (Reply to #60)Pauper |
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| (Reply to #61)TheBreen |
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| #63Mind_Flayer_MonkFeb 02, 2015 15:33:35 |
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| #64TyranthraxusFeb 02, 2015 19:16:28 | That post confuses the heck outta me Mind_Flayer_Monk.
I run the adventure as written. I dont see this as me doing a diservice to the players at all, but doing what the Scenario and AL in general asks me to do. |
| (Reply to #64)Mind_Flayer_Monk |
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| (Reply to #60)Aribeth |
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| #67lestroissauvagesFeb 02, 2015 21:10:23 | Having read through this thread, and seeing as how no one's taken the bait,I feel obliged to say this.
You know what? Forget the blackjack. And forget the AL!
(It really has been an interesting thread) |
| (Reply to #59)Aribeth |
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| (Reply to #68)Undrhil |
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| (Reply to #69)TheBreen |
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| #71RCanineFeb 03, 2015 0:23:56 |
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| (Reply to #61)Coredump00 |
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| (Reply to #66)Coredump00 |
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| (Reply to #73)TheBreen |
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| #75KalaniFeb 03, 2015 9:53:27 |
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| (Reply to #71)Aribeth |
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| (Reply to #69)Aribeth |
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| (Reply to #68)Pauper |
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| #79RCanineFeb 04, 2015 8:29:14 |
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| (Reply to #77)Undrhil |
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| (Reply to #80)Aribeth |
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| (Reply to #79)Aribeth |
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| (Reply to #82)Undrhil |
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| #84Mind_Flayer_MonkFeb 04, 2015 22:00:30 |
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| (Reply to #83)Pauper |
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| #86sigfileFeb 05, 2015 15:12:10 | ...is a perfect example of a three-round adventure, even if having to break the adventure up twice during the encounter is a bit of a pain.
Wait, whattaya mean there's more to the mod after Encounter One? |
| #87Enevhar_AldarionFeb 05, 2015 21:50:53 |
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| #88PauperFeb 06, 2015 13:32:09 | Good article on dndadventurersleague.org today about just this very topic, which includes a number of ways to 'tweak' an adventure (including a published AL adventure) using DM empowerment to make it more fun:
- Use your players' written background elements to add personal interest to the story.
For instance, rather than three nameless half-orcs in the ambush, have one of them be a member of the gang that's hunting the rogue. You can even include a note that implies the half-orc was tipped to the rogue's location by one of the story villains -- that adds a personal touch to the adventure.
- Embellish the written description of areas to tell the kind of story you want to tell.
The example given changes a mundane warehouse into a spooky potential crime scene. Nicely done.
- Personalize!
Prefer that the half-orc use handaxes rather than scimitars? Go for it -- so long as the in-game stats stay the same.
- Side quests are your friend.
Have a party that's less motivated by greed than by doing good deeds? Then have a few of the NPCs they interact with describe items that are already placed in the villains' treasure horde, so that the players aren't selling the items for gold, but receiving a well-deserved reward for returning the items!
it's a good article, and a great starting answer to the question, "What am I allowed to do under DME?"
http://dndadventurersleague.org/2015/02/breaking-the-confines-of-the-page-how-you-can-make-a-premade-game-world-your-own/
-- Pauper |
| #89KalaniFeb 06, 2015 14:28:07 | I found that sections of that article directly contradicted previous articles, and the official AL FAQs In particular the following:
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| (Reply to #89)Pauper |
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| #91KalaniFeb 06, 2015 14:59:16 | Fair enough, although you can see how it might be misinterpreted by those who do not read the rules/guidelines as closely as you or I. This is especially true given how ambiguously worded the "Tips for the Dungeon Master" section of the ALPG is - especially for those DMs who have not read the DM empowerment article or the AL FAQ (which I assume a large number of more casual DMs are oblivious of).
In light of the above, this article may appear supportive of allowing DMs to add/increase/modify treasure awards. Given how treasure-anaemic HOTDQ is, I could see many DMs rightfully desire to increase the treasure awards in order to keep their players happy (I know I wish I could). |
| #92imaginaryfriend.invFeb 10, 2015 18:15:42 | Ah the DME debate. The more things change... the more things stay the same..
I am glad the debate is there because it is never something to be taken lightly as it can seriously mess with peoples fun, as is evident by some responses. I do however feel obliged to add that to my knowledge few, if any, of the LFR epics (or specials or BI's) including 4-2 were written with the expectation that they would or should be run as written (i.e. following the letter). It was certainly possible, but generally not considered the optimal experience. Just FYI, I am sure its unlikely to change anyones mind |
| #93RCanineFeb 10, 2015 20:45:43 |
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| (Reply to #93)Pauper |
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