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| #1LashanOct 16, 2014 7:50:11 | Are they different than the ones on the Sword Coast? I'm hoping so. I have a dislike of the Sword Coast and prefer to play in the Inner Sea region. I was quite happy to read that there is some organized play in the Moonsea region. I'm looking at the factions, though, and am worried that they will be the same for the Moonsea. That's because too many of them just don't mesh.
HARPERS = Sure, they are good. ORDER OF THE GUANTLET = They might be good. I have never heard of them before. EMERALD ENCLAVE = Specifically set in the Sword Coast area. LORDS ALLIANCE = Specifically set in the Sword Coast area. ZHENTARIUM = Fine.
OK...so maybe it's just 2. I wasn't sure of the Order of the Guantlet as I've not heard of it before.
Still, are there factions that are geared towards the Moonsea area that might work better than those west coast types? I hope so. |
| #2SteveMNDOct 16, 2014 11:04:00 |
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| #3SkerritOct 16, 2014 11:07:13 | Correct, and while some of the Factions grew out of regional specific orders from a hundred plus years ago, they are all continient spanning groups with goals that are far beyond the region where they started. |
| #4LashanOct 16, 2014 11:15:24 | I understand the need to make things fit from an orgainzational sense, but I don't have to like it.
To say that the Lord's Alliance has spread to the Inner Sea after 200 years since it's creation is just moronic. There are specific city states in the Alliance. They are all on the Sword Coast. I just do not see the logic of having them send agents to the Moonsea, of all places. The place is the edge of civilization and really just exports arms, armor, and gems. Most of those don't make it to the Sword Coast. Why would they give a flip about what happens in the Moonsea?
This is the type of thing that turns me off from the whole idea and just running a home brew. |
| #5SkerritOct 16, 2014 11:41:18 | The Lords Alliance has become an orgainzation focused on civilizing the rest of the continent. They believe in enriching themselves and bringing prospertity to the rest, whether they like it or not. Think of them like Imperialist powers in 1890s and early 1900s. They have money and lots of adventurers that they pay to do their work for them with an eye to sending back profitable deals/contracts back home. |
| #6LashanOct 16, 2014 11:48:05 | The problem with that line of thinking is that there are other strong powers closer to the region that would easily block such efforts. Imperial powers were able to move into places of lower technology and power and just colonize them. The problem with the Moonsea area is that there already are power groups with enough firepower to take over any area themselves. Also, the Moonsea is far enough away that any deals that might be haggled are small when compared to the costs of shipping something overland to the Sword Coast. It's just not cost effective to make deals to something as far away as the Moonsea. I don't see the Lord's Alliance as a group of people with unlimited resources and don't see them funding expeditions to areas at extreme distances that wouldn't really give them much of an edge in any regard. |
| #7PauperOct 16, 2014 12:01:07 | If Phlan is the best the Moonsea has to offer currently, then I'm not at all convinced that there are powers there that could resist an outside colonization/imperialistic economic conquest of the area. And as long as there are things the Moonsea can provide that are hard or impossible to get in the Sword Coast otherwise, then there will be trade; the question is who controls it and therefore benefits.
You're welcome to do what you like in your own home game, but I think it's an interesting angle for the OP campaign to take. It certainly helps explain why the Lords' Alliance isn't averse to evil characters, what with slave labor helping to keep down costs and all.
-- Pauper |
| #8LashanOct 16, 2014 12:10:30 | That's just the thing. Phlan isn't the best the Moonsea has to over. Zhentil Keep, Mulmaster, and Hillsfar are much bigger cities in the area. Also, the Zhenterium has a near monopoly on trade throught the Moonsea. The effort to try to break through into such a market would be considerable. Even if it were a worthwhile endevour, places like Comyr or Sembia would be more likely to make a play. Or Hillsfar, even, as they are the closest. Sembia is the biggest bunch of greedy merchants on the face of Faerun and you can bet they would act en force if they saw an oppurtunity.
Your other comment about the Moonsea having things that are hard or impossible to find elsewhere is also a good point. This is because there isn't anything in the Moonsea that is hard to get somewhere else. Metals, metal goods, and minerals are available a lot closer to the Lord's Alliance cities than all the way over in the Moonsea. The cost to transport alone would make something incredibly expensive and not worth while. That's why it makes no sense.
Also, the Emerald Enclave.....why are they there? They are a localized group that was formed on the Sword Coast to guard specific areas there. OK...let's say they do want to enlarge the franchise and head to all sorts of places around the world. Why bother with a cemetary in Phlan? Out of all the places in the world that could use some attention from the kind tree huggers and they go to a semi-ruined city of Phlan? The old elven woods of Cormanthyr right nearby seems like a better target. I understand that the AL people are just trying to make things fit, but it's just not logical. |
| #9SkerritOct 16, 2014 13:00:32 | A lot of your assumptions sound like you are thinking a pre-spellplague, pre-sundering world. Zhentil Keep no long has a monopoly of trade for example, given that they were almost wiped out in the spellplague with the destruction of the city and the citadel of the raven by the Netherese. With the return of Bane, the Zhents are trying for a comeback, but they needs allies (like the Lords Alliance) to make that happen.
As for the Emerald Enclave, their interest in the area likely focuses on the Quivering Forest and the attempts by the Guilds of Phlan to clear cut it. The huge amount of pollution (magical and otherwise) in the Stonjanow River is also a concern. Sure, as a favor to the church of Kelemvor, they helped purify the land of the graveyard, but its not their focus. It never hurts to have the favor of the only cleric (Doomguide Yovir) in the area who is high enough level to cast raise dead.
Please note that all five factions (while they do not agree one everything and sometimes work against each orther) have officially declared a truce and joined forces against the main threat (which by know every knows if the Cult of the Dragon). So some opperatives are in this are because the cult is here. Their faction sent them to work with other faction's agents in order to stop the cult. There are some more specific blatent reasons that come up through play, but I don't want to post the whole plot on a forum.
Also, these changes to the world are not solely the doing of the DnDAL Admins (of which I am one), but rather are made in consultationwith WOTC and how they are moving the story of the entire Realms.
Greg Marks DnDAL Associate Resource Manager |
| (Reply to #4)Mind_Flayer_Monk |
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| #11SkerritOct 16, 2014 18:54:06 |
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| (Reply to #10)SteveMND |
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| #13TyranthraxusOct 16, 2014 22:25:43 | Please, you dont end up in charge of something if you dont care about what you are doing. All 6 Admins have easily proven they DO care so far.
I dont mind the factions at all, although I find the connection of the Emerald Enclave slightly nebulous. THe Factions are certainly far more interesting in Expeditions than Encounters as they should be. |
| #14Evil_MouseOct 17, 2014 0:58:36 |
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| (Reply to #12)Mind_Flayer_Monk |
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| #16SkerritOct 17, 2014 6:15:12 | I have posted 5 of the 16 posts in this thread (31.25% of posts). That is the most of anyone. How is that infrequent? I think you are trying to make a point that doesn't exist.
Greg Marks DnDAL, Associate Resource Manager |
| #17LashanOct 17, 2014 6:51:10 |
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| (Reply to #17)SteveMND |
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| #19LashanOct 17, 2014 7:58:39 | Oh, I see. I thought the Time of Troubles was a terrible idea and generally ignored it. Cyric was a putz and Bhaal and Myrkul were way cooler.
It's things like that that make me not want to play in FR anymore. I think FR has an emmersive flavor to it, but there are things that just rub me wrong. Why not unified pantheons? I swear, it's like Battling God Bots. No sense of the pantheon as a reflection of the culture. That and the predominance of city-states tends to make things a little simplified at times, which is unfortunate as there is so much that makes great sense in the game world. I feel like they got the trade routes, ethnic migrations, etc great.
Just as a counter-point I can look at Keoland in Greyhawk. Formed by Suel refugees that built itself up. It was once an empire that ruled the whole Sheldomar Valley, but has been reduced to the main kingdom with some satellite nations that are generally allies to external threats. It just makes more sense. I just wish it had the flavor for the people and culture and every day man that FR has. |
| #20PauperOct 17, 2014 7:58:30 | Hey, it wasn't just WotC -- TSR had the Time of Troubles to transition from classic to Advanced D&D, and that seemed to go over well.
I'm kind of wondering if the OP isn't just trolling us at this point.
-- Pauper |
| #21LashanOct 17, 2014 8:00:23 |
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| (Reply to #19)SteveMND |
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| #23PauperOct 17, 2014 8:32:45 | As long as we're sharing our wish-lists, I've been waiting for Living Blackmoor since the mid-90s. |
| #24LashanOct 17, 2014 8:51:50 |
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| (Reply to #16)Mind_Flayer_Monk |
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| (Reply to #25)Lashan | I think those things should be more directed at WOTC, though, as opposed to the voluntolds. I'm not sure how much control they have in when things got rolling or what they can do. |
| #27SteveMNDOct 17, 2014 11:33:37 |
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| #28SkerritOct 17, 2014 13:14:04 |
1. That's not entirely true (as there were numerous posts on these boards and others as well as the comics, the WOTC site, the various game products), but it does make a good point that it took alittle longer than we would have liked. Truthfully it had zero to do with posts to these forums and a lot more to do with the fact the Admins are volunteers with actual jobs who do this as much as they can (and often at their own expense so you can have cool things). I hope you don't believe there is no involvement in the story from the adventures standpoint, especially the Expeditions and Epic adventures, which are targeted towards that sort of player. There is a wealth of story there.
2. All forms of marketing are not our (the Admins) product. We are not WOTC employees. We are volunteers. You are complaining to/about the wrong person there, but as to WOTC, I think they did actually post quite a big in news stories, to blogs, and other places. You might argue that it could be better organized, but I don't believe its absent. The DnDAL PG does consoladate some the links on page 21.
3. The Factions are clearly a part of adventures (such as the getting of assignments from your Faction contacts), and a HUGE part of the Epic. We do not control Encounters, so they are used much less frequently there. Starting with the tier 5-10 adventures you will also start to see the special missions. The factions also had the faction folders (which the demand for exceeded the printing, but it was there with lots of great stuff). The DnDAL PG also has four pages talking about the Factions (page 16-19)
4. They are in all the Expeditions and Epic adventures and there is four pages of detail in the player's guide. You say "You were told by the players..." suggesting to me you haven't seen these resources and likely are arguing out of frustration in not knowing about something (and believing there is no way to find out). Never fear, there's lots of ways.
5. Umm... there are five uses on page 187 of the Player's Handbook and another specific to wizards on page 114. In addition there is a Faction specific activity for each faction that has not yet been released. WOTC made the call that they didn't want to roll out all of the higher tiers of the Factions for reasons I can't speak to. So that's seven different uses.
As to pulling teeth Monk, I think you disagree more with a WOTC marketing strategy than anything else. In the age social media, its clear that you need people to keep talking about your product. The way you do that is to constantly put out small bits of information punctutated by big product releases. That's how they do it. "Want to know about this? Here's an blog. Next we'll tell you even more..." Don't worry, its all coming. It's not that the people giving it to you don't care. |
| #29UthracOct 24, 2014 5:47:24 |
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| (Reply to #29)Mind_Flayer_Monk |
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| #31PauperOct 24, 2014 13:46:02 | I honestly feel like AL is more interested in capturing new players than trying to lure away players from other OP campaigns.
If that really is the focus, then heavy plot/mechanic-related material may actually be counter-productive to the goal of the campaign.
-- Pauper |
| #32TyranthraxusOct 26, 2014 21:30:06 | Tbh, Im glad AL is trying to recruit new players rather than lure players away from other OP. We need new blood. Not the brigade who state' Well back in my early gaming days... X was just so much better' |