Filling In Details when Running DDEX - Downloaded from the Wizards Community, all coding removed by Solauren

Post/Author/DateTime	Post
#1 Riley37 Apr 19, 2015 13:31:04	This is a post meant for fellow DMs, running the Expeditions in Adventurer's League. Is this the right place for that? Or is there a specific DMs-running-AL section? I am avoiding spoilers, which gets a bit clunky, but that's necessary, correct? The DDEX adventures are written for "plug and play" simplicity. The authors want the DMs to quickly assimilate enough background to get the players involved and engaged. Therefore, they don't write many sentences about non-essentials. Fair enough. For example, there's an adventure in which the PCs enter a room, in which there are several captives in cages. The adventure text describes how one of those prisoners might influence what happens next, and leaves further details unspecified. That said, as a DMing I want to have fine detail ready in my back pocket. To feel comfortable running that scenario, I need a list of the prisoners: a name, a background (such as "a peasant from a farm outside Phlan" or "an urchin from Podol Plaza"), and how they got into that cage. It's part of my particular personal style. So I wrote that list. Took me a few minutes. No big deal. It added some flavor, since the captives reacted in various ways to what happened when the PCs showed up. If the PCs ask the captives "who are you?", I'm ready with answers. If the PCs only pay attention to enemies and loot, I shrug and carry on. That said, I'm curious what similar fill-ins my fellow AL DMs have created. That person who meets the PCs in a barn outside Phlan: who is she, what's her deal, how did she come to the attention of the (spoilers)? Did you make up details?
#2 Primarchx Apr 20, 2015 6:22:32	I typically give this some consideration when I do my first DDEX read-through but rarely record it. Instead I improv it out based on those impressions when I run. Truth be told, most AL Expeditions modules are so packed with milestones & encounters that they rarely fit their allotted time as written (we've gone to 5.5 hours for Expeditions at my FLGS). This leaves little time for in-depth RP. I find that the more I populate the story with points of 'depth' the more it pulls the players off track and extends the game. If you're running a DDEX and have little time pressure or have a fixed group that can play it in a couple of sessions, then go for it. But if you're in a tourney envirornment with a 4-hour window, keep the party moving using the published material with a minimum of other embellishment if you want to finish in time. Of course this is my opinion, based on my experience with 5e AL thus far.
#3 Pauper Apr 20, 2015 7:29:50	Riley37 wrote:
#4 QwertyAzerty Apr 20, 2015 8:10:22	Liek said previously just try to do some research to see if that NPC got fleshed out in a later module. But random no name prisonner, you should be fine, if he had no name, chance are you won't meet him ever again. If you play AD just be careful with "unintended rewards" you just save the blacksmith from Mulmaster, well your player might expect to have discount on armor and weapon from him and if you sell your fihgter a full plate for 1000gp instead of 1500gp it's a big no-no in Adventure League, especially if your player expect those reward to follow him on different table. Player don't know what is part of the module and what is "added" by the DM, so if you give tell teh fighter that the blacksmith will give him a 33% discount, the fighter will write it on his sheet and the following week if he get with a new DM and tell him he want to buy that full plate with 33% discount, chance are teh new DM will refuse, since it's not AL legal reward. If you look in the archive of the forum, you might find all those thread about Hazirawn, a sentient weapon that the writer forgot to update and to give it the information necessary to play it as a sentient weapon, so now you got people complaining that their DM are jerk making the weapon useless, other really happy for getting a weapon who is more then happy killing dragon cultist, and other who got a non sentient weapon. And then all those people arguing on the legitimate claim player do when bringing there hazirawn on different table. TLDR: what you do a great and super cool, just be carefull with named NPC that will be fleshed out in later modules, and with NPC who offer help to the PC that is not describe in the module itself.
#5 Riley37 Apr 20, 2015 14:50:20	First - I'm mainly interested in the general question of whether AL DMs might want to trade ideas on "here's one way to make this particular Expedition more fun". So, the example I posted is just a defining example, I am also interested in what DMs "filled in" for the other Defiance stories, for Shadows, for Drums, for Iron Route, etc. That said, here's a related general question or issue with AL play. "First, as Primarchx notes, Expeditions adventures often run on a time limit -- you're supposed to be able to complete them in a single session of play. Extended RP with NPCs can be fun, but it can also chew up a lot of game time. Be prepared to skip over a lot of your prep if you find yourself pressed for time." So what does a DM do, when the players at the table are interested in RP with NPCs? Straw man version, what I hope isn't the answer: yank that option out of their hands! Tell players that we're on the clock and I need them to advance to the boss fight so we can complete the story and I can log my DM XP. Moderate version, perhaps: Player: "I turn to the prisoner in the cage. Hey, who are you, why are you in this cage?" DM: The prisoner is an ordinary resident of Phlan; he gives you details, but those details don't matter for this story, so fill them in as you see fit. (Notice that the player has gone to in-character speech, and I've responded with out-of-character summary.) Show He explains that the Black Fists threw him in this cage, without processing a legal arrest, and are apparently feeding prisoners to a monster.
(Reply to #4) Riley37	QwertyAzerty wrote:
(Reply to #6) Pauper	Riley37 wrote:
#8 Tyranthraxus Apr 20, 2015 18:17:53	Im going to be using an example here of how I embelished a EXP scenario Spoilery In a particular scenario the heroes are tasked with visiting some patrons of Mendor's library. One in particular a Dwarf trainer, is interested in the stories of heroes of Past Phlan (which due to extensive experience with Pools of Radiance the gold box game) running Ruins of adventure recently and reading the Ruins of adventure novel, Pools of Radiance I knew a bit about. While the book in question was about the adventure's of Ren O the Blade I made talk of Sharl and Tarl and their adventures re a Flaming Spirit and the Pool of Radiance. I didnt go too deep into information but I was able to use my past setting knowledge to talk up Ren and his Heroics (although at the time Tarl seemed more Heroic). Now It might not have meant much to most of the people at the table, but for me It gave me a chance to practicially use some obscure realmslore knowledge I had (and Ima minnow in that department next to some people).
#9 Riley37 Apr 20, 2015 23:44:24	QwertyAzerty wrote:
#10 QwertyAzerty Apr 21, 2015 7:23:57	Riley37 wrote:
(Reply to #10) Riley37	QwertyAzerty wrote:
#12 Tyranthraxus Apr 21, 2015 18:00:51	I actually fired up the Gold Box Pool of Radiance last night and after fossicking around for my code wheel, Im slogging through the Slums. To be honest, some parts have not aged well, but its still a darnsight better than I thought it would be (or some Indie games are nowadays)
#13 Avross Apr 24, 2015 14:49:37	Riley37 wrote:
(Reply to #13) Riley37	Avross wrote:

Post/Author/DateTime

Post

Riley37

Apr 19, 2015 13:31:04

This is a post meant for fellow DMs, running the Expeditions in Adventurer's League. Is this the right place for that? Or is there a specific DMs-running-AL section?

I am avoiding spoilers, which gets a bit clunky, but that's necessary, correct?

The DDEX adventures are written for "plug and play" simplicity. The authors want the DMs to quickly assimilate enough background to get the players involved and engaged. Therefore, they don't write many sentences about non-essentials. Fair enough. For example, there's an adventure in which the PCs enter a room, in which there are several captives in cages. The adventure text describes how one of those prisoners might influence what happens next, and leaves further details unspecified.

That said, as a DMing I want to have fine detail ready in my back pocket. To feel comfortable running that scenario, I need a list of the prisoners: a name, a background (such as "a peasant from a farm outside Phlan" or "an urchin from Podol Plaza"), and how they got into that cage. It's part of my particular personal style.

So I wrote that list. Took me a few minutes. No big deal. It added some flavor, since the captives reacted in various ways to what happened when the PCs showed up. If the PCs ask the captives "who are you?", I'm ready with answers. If the PCs only pay attention to enemies and loot, I shrug and carry on.

That said, I'm curious what similar fill-ins my fellow AL DMs have created. That person who meets the PCs in a barn outside Phlan: who is she, what's her deal, how did she come to the attention of the (spoilers)? Did you make up details?

Primarchx

Apr 20, 2015 6:22:32

I typically give this some consideration when I do my first DDEX read-through but rarely record it. Instead I improv it out based on those impressions when I run.

Truth be told, most AL Expeditions modules are so packed with milestones & encounters that they rarely fit their allotted time as written (we've gone to 5.5 hours for Expeditions at my FLGS). This leaves little time for in-depth RP. I find that the more I populate the story with points of 'depth' the more it pulls the players off track and extends the game. If you're running a DDEX and have little time pressure or have a fixed group that can play it in a couple of sessions, then go for it. But if you're in a tourney envirornment with a 4-hour window, keep the party moving using the published material with a minimum of other embellishment if you want to finish in time.

Of course this is my opinion, based on my experience with 5e AL thus far.

Pauper

Apr 20, 2015 7:29:50

Riley37 wrote:

QwertyAzerty

Apr 20, 2015 8:10:22

Liek said previously just try to do some research to see if that NPC got fleshed out in a later module. But random no name prisonner, you should be fine, if he had no name, chance are you won't meet him ever again.

If you play AD just be careful with "unintended rewards" you just save the blacksmith from Mulmaster, well your player might expect to have discount on armor and weapon from him and if you sell your fihgter a full plate for 1000gp instead of 1500gp it's a big no-no in Adventure League, especially if your player expect those reward to follow him on different table. Player don't know what is part of the module and what is "added" by the DM, so if you give tell teh fighter that the blacksmith will give him a 33% discount, the fighter will write it on his sheet and the following week if he get with a new DM and tell him he want to buy that full plate with 33% discount, chance are teh new DM will refuse, since it's not AL legal reward.

If you look in the archive of the forum, you might find all those thread about Hazirawn, a sentient weapon that the writer forgot to update and to give it the information necessary to play it as a sentient weapon, so now you got people complaining that their DM are jerk making the weapon useless, other really happy for getting a weapon who is more then happy killing dragon cultist, and other who got a non sentient weapon. And then all those people arguing on the legitimate claim player do when bringing there hazirawn on different table.

TLDR: what you do a great and super cool, just be carefull with named NPC that will be fleshed out in later modules, and with NPC who offer help to the PC that is not describe in the module itself.

Riley37

Apr 20, 2015 14:50:20

First - I'm mainly interested in the general question of whether AL DMs might want to trade ideas on "here's one way to make this particular Expedition more fun".

So, the example I posted is just a defining example, I am also interested in what DMs "filled in" for the other Defiance stories, for Shadows, for Drums, for Iron Route, etc.

That said, here's a related general question or issue with AL play. "First, as Primarchx notes, Expeditions adventures often run on a time limit -- you're supposed to be able to complete them in a single session of play. Extended RP with NPCs can be fun, but it can also chew up a lot of game time. Be prepared to skip over a lot of your prep if you find yourself pressed for time."
So what does a DM do, when the players at the table are interested in RP with NPCs?

Straw man version, what I hope isn't the answer: yank that option out of their hands! Tell players that we're on the clock and I need them to advance to the boss fight so we can complete the story and I can log my DM XP.

Moderate version, perhaps:
Player: "I turn to the prisoner in the cage. Hey, who are you, why are you in this cage?"
DM: The prisoner is an ordinary resident of Phlan; he gives you details, but those details don't matter for this story, so fill them in as you see fit.
(Notice that the player has gone to in-character speech, and I've responded with out-of-character summary.)

Show

He explains that the Black Fists threw him in this cage, without processing a legal arrest, and are apparently feeding prisoners to a monster.

(Reply to #4)

Riley37

QwertyAzerty wrote:

(Reply to #6)

Pauper

Riley37 wrote:

Tyranthraxus

Apr 20, 2015 18:17:53

Im going to be using an example here of how I embelished a EXP scenario

Spoilery

In a particular scenario the heroes are tasked with visiting some patrons of Mendor's library. One in particular a Dwarf trainer, is interested in the stories of heroes of Past Phlan (which due to extensive experience with Pools of Radiance the gold box game) running Ruins of adventure recently and reading the Ruins of adventure novel, Pools of Radiance I knew a bit about. While the book in question was about the adventure's of Ren O the Blade I made talk of Sharl and Tarl and their adventures re a Flaming Spirit and the Pool of Radiance. I didnt go too deep into information but I was able to use my past setting knowledge to talk up Ren and his Heroics (although at the time Tarl seemed more Heroic).

Now It might not have meant much to most of the people at the table, but for me It gave me a chance to practicially use some obscure realmslore knowledge I had (and Ima minnow in that department next to some people).

Riley37

Apr 20, 2015 23:44:24

QwertyAzerty wrote:

#10

QwertyAzerty

Apr 21, 2015 7:23:57

Riley37 wrote:

(Reply to #10)

Riley37

QwertyAzerty wrote:

#12

Tyranthraxus

Apr 21, 2015 18:00:51

I actually fired up the Gold Box Pool of Radiance last night and after fossicking around for my code wheel, Im slogging through the Slums.

To be honest, some parts have not aged well, but its still a darnsight better than I thought it would be (or some Indie games are nowadays)

#13

Avross

Apr 24, 2015 14:49:37

Riley37 wrote:

(Reply to #13)

Riley37

Avross wrote: