I have always wanted to try playing D&D and after learning about the adventures league, I thought this would be a good intruduction to the game. None of my friends were really interested in a table top RPG, so I figured this was my best chance at meeting other new D&D players. After a few sessions, I am not really sure adventures league is for me. I am loving the D&D game itself, but grouping with random people is becoming troublesome (this is mainly do to two people that play 'chaotic' characters). I wanted to start playing D&D to meet other people at the table, adventure with our characters, work together and have fun, but it seems that many of the other players are trying to get everything they can for their character while helping as little as possible. Here are some examples:
1. I am trying to sneak past a group of monsters and another player throws an object to alert them because he is 'chaotic'. The DM allows this because he is not attacking me directly and says he is just doing good role playing for his character.
2. The first player to a chest steals the loot for themselves. So while I and other players are fighting one player rushes to a chest to grab the best gear then conceals it. It also seems like at the table the first person to shout out an action is the first person to take that action. The first person to tell the DM they or going to the chest or going to loot a body is the first person to get the loot.
3. A player will talk to a npc and conceal all the information that they can that will benefit them. So if a NPC gives him directions to a location or tells him of a reward for a quest, he will hold the information to himself for advantage.
This was the worst and almost made me leave the table that night:
4. A dragon (evil) told us he wanted a group of humans dead. I was against following a dragons orders to kill a group of people despite the reward from the dragon and so was another player. The playerer that did not want to kill them was poisoned so that he was unconscious and the player that poisoned him killed the group of humans and took the treasure they had for himself. The DM would not allow me to defend the humans because that would be PvP but allowed the other player to get poisoned because it would not damage him.
Is this common for adventures league? I think D&D would be fun with a group of people that wanted to work together but I find myself leaving frustrated after each session. I dont know if there is another store that does adventures league in my area. Is it worth taking the time to look, or will I just run into this again?
It sounds like some of the OP rules aren't being followed. Were these just public games or were they more structured like Encounters/Expeditions?
As an Encounters GM: I can vouch for there being groups that are the opposite of your experience. My players have run the gamut as far as age, editions, and experience go, and the older ones are often helpful to the newer ones with suggestions, opinions, and even build/strategy ideas.
It's important to expect table variation, but I'd recommend trying to find an Encounters group or communicating with any GMs you happen to find about your interest. Encounters is a two hour block designed to integrate newer players and introduce them to the hobby (something something longer explanation).
It's always a crapshoot when you play with strangers, just like any other public game. If you want to play but want to guarantee play with a decent group, I'd recommend recruiting people you know or have noted as reliable at the table, or ask around with players you feel you can trust.
1. Chaotic does not equal stupid or suicidal. It could be argued that the player was attacking you directly by using the equivalent of an area effect summoning of hostile creatures. You would be in the right to file a complaint to the superior of whoever the DM is for allowing such nonsense. If a DM says that's not PVP or disruptive table behavior then the DM is an idiot.
2. The DM was not following the rules therefore the table is open for complaint filing.
3. "You're hiding something from us, aren't you? Spill it!" - Roleplay it, but do it after the party has actually been endangered by the PC's suspicious behavior. Explain (in character) that holding back valuable info will get the party killed (in character). If he refuses then complain to the DM that it's bad roleplaying and disruptive gameplay at the table for DnD to create this kind of social interaction PVP because nobody in their right mind would follow a suspicious guy who keeps such secrets unless there was extreme emergency. Also, you can also say that the party should keep watch on the other guy's PC to make sure he's not doing something that would screw over the party, like hogging a reward or found treasure.
4. Poisoning another player's PC at the table is obvious PvP. WTF was your DM smoking? Complain. Have him removed or find a new DM. He doesn't deserve to head a table.
I would like to add something as well;
Not only is your experience atypical for Adventurers' League but this kind of thing is exactly what the rules for AL are meant to prevent. Unfortunately you will find this kind of behavior from time to time in 'home' games. We're all primates and there's some hardwiring in us to pick on the outsider. That isn't to say that all games will be like this unless there are rules to prevent them, just that it isn't an unheard of event.
Things such as the 'enjoyment of others' rules don't say "unless there's an in character reason" simply because it's easy for someone to come up with an in character reason for almost anything. Of course some reasons will be better than others but saying that the DM should adjudicate whether the reason is valid would be even more problematic since it can easily lead to problems with DM favoritism (which is exactly what you experienced when the DM allowed one player to poison you but wouldn't allow you to defend the humans).
So I am very, very sorry that your first experiences with the game were so bad. The only thing I can tell you is that the problem lies in the people you were playing with and not the game (which isn't to say that they are bad people. We are all flawed individuals).
N.B.: The actions you experienced are not against the D&D rules. You will now and again find home games where these kinds of things occur. They are not, however, things that should be happening in an Adventurers' League game (at least not unless all the players are enjoying the interparty conflict, which can happen).
Sorry for your bad luck.... try finding another AL game you can go to.
(Unless there is a different DM in that same location you can try)
You can try talking to the DM, but I would not get your hopes up too much.
TheBreen wrote:
Angry_Steak wrote:
TheBreen wrote:
No doubt the group is enjoying themselves, but I often end up adjusting things due to circumstance and leave myself wondering if I've crossed a line. It's a learning process, but keeping an eye out for posts like the OP's have helped me learn which avenues and styles to avoid.
It is a lot better to experiment and try and find the razors edge that is "the line" than to read the boxed text, roll the dice and call out numbers 
Don't fear going off script, but approach it with caution and some idea as to how to get back on the tracks (by design all AL adventures have at least some tracks).
I have dozens of examples (yes, I tend to improvise). Maybe we should just start a thread where we could describe some of the bigger DME changes we made, our reasoning, the route back etc. I would like it, but this may not be the place as I do fear it would become a very polarizing thing with a lot of "run it as written!!1!" responses.. Maybe something for under the Heralds Guild banner. I will have to suggest it,.
Report that DM to your organizer and if he fails to do anything go up the chain to the LC/RC for your area.
Virtually every negative experience you had at that table was something caused by a violation of the conduct specified in the AL Player's Guide.
Are you sure this was even Adventurer's League? I mean, it can be 5th Edition and not be Adventurer's League. And a homebrew game can advertise for players at a game store, too.
The best way to tell is if you are given the module ID for the game. It'll be something like DDEX1-1 or something. I'm curious to know which module you guys were running. Or was this Hoard of the Dragon Queen or Lost Mines of Phandelver?
If it's one of those there won't be a DDEX number, but the DM should still give you a session number for you to put on your logsheet, to show that your character went through that part of the storyline.
This behavior is not supposed to be typical of AL, but every group of players will be different. As long as the group has fun playing that way, that's how they will play (rules be darned!) and they might find it difficult to change for a random stranger showing up.
Sounds to me like it was Lost Mine of Phandelver, and the DM did a fine job to divert the party away from an otherwise unwinnable fight (a bunch of level 1 and 2 characters who somehow bee-lined straight for the green dragon lair).
The bigger issue seems to be that the players are in a mode where they'd rather troll each other (except for the OP) rather than feel like they have to band together to survive the adventure -- maybe they're a bit too used to online games where you get infinite lives to finish a quest? That's a tougher nut for the DM to crack.
--
Pauper
Pauper wrote:
Thanks for the replies everyone. I appreciate it.
Yes, some of this was durring The Lost Mine story, and some of it was durring Hord of the Dragon Queen. I thought that some of what was going on was against the spirit and rules of adventures league and this confirms it. I think the problem is that is that the DM apprecieates the 'roleplaying' of these disruptive players too much and doesnt realize the lack of teamwork and trust it creates in the group. The players of the chaotic / evil characters are probably not bad guys, they just seem to be playing a solo game rather than working with the group and participating in some social interaction. They even go so far as to pass notes to the DM with questions or actions so the rest of the table does not know what they are up to.
I might give it one more shot and be a little more direct to the players and the DM, saying something like "I really dont want to have to follow your character around to every NPC in the game. It would probably be more fun for everyone at the table if you shared what you and the NPC discussed." or state some adventure league rules about players particapating in combat and spliting the loot evenly. And I am going to have too put my foot down about players intentionally hindering others actions. Telling the DM how to run his table might cause him to single me out, but oh well. I will give it one more chance before talking to the local coordinator and trying to find somewhere else to play.
Despite this experience with some of the players I am really enjoying the game so far. Hopefully I can find a good group to play with that has a similar playstyle in mind!
I would talk to your organizer first and then sit down with him and the DM and have it explained to the DM what is expected of him. If the problem is your organizer, there's little more you can do than finding another store and reporting the conduct to the LC/RC.
Might seem a bit drastic, but I'm of the opinion that those representing the AL brand need to follow the rules or forfeit their support from WotC.
I would definitely try to meet up with the DM before the game starts to have this discussion. Print out the AL Player's Guide and have it with you to refer to in case the DM just doesn't know the AL rules (doubtful, but it's possible.) Also, being confrontational about it is going to put your DMs guard up. So, approach is as a "Hey, I was just thinking about how the game went the other night and I thought you should read this from the ALPG." or something like that.
Outright demanding that they play "your way" is just going to make them single you out as the disruptive one.
Deshiken wrote:
BRJN wrote:
Sounds like you've been playing with someone who enjoys the 'Chaotic Stupid' alignment. For me, that is the one player I cannot stand DM'ing more than any other (probably) is the one who plays Chaotic Neutral like a crazy person, who just does what ever, when ever. Chaotic doesn't mean your crazy, or just do anything at any time. Chaotic means you don't follow the laws or simply don't heed them because you make your own path. I make that clear as a bell to any player I get who just does what ever, without thought, simply because because his character is 'chaotic'.
Chaotic Good - Your a good person but you tend to skirt the laws for your own gain or simply live in a society that allows for a great deal of personal freedom and responsibility for your own actions.
Chaotic Neutral - the big bane, baned at many tables. But it's my personal favorite to play (when I get the rare chance). Your not psychotic, or just do what ever crazy **** your brain spits out without a filter (like a small child). Instead, you follow your own creed. You do what you want, so long as there's a reason to do it. Maybe you do screw over your party for personal gain - your selfish like that - but more often than not you know they help keep you alive so you work with them, grudgingly... even if that paladin is an asshat.
Chaotic Evil - You want to sow chaos for the sake of it? Slash and burn, do anything at any time no matter the consequences or harm to your fellow players. This is the alignment to do it.. not CN.
Xaielao2 wrote: