My guesses are:
Raven Queen and Corellon may be stated in Manual of the Planes (both of them being strongly linked to the shadowfell and the feywild respectively)
Vecna may appear in the upcoming Open Grave book
Bahamut in Draconomicon II: Metallic Dragons
I could also see tharizdun and Asmodeus stated in MotP
Secondly, well, it's a god. 'rocks fall, everybody dies' is all the stat line they need, if you do make them interactive. "Pelor, I challenge you *splort*" and it's over.
As for Gods to come, I could see Evil Gods getting statted out first they are more likely to need stats. Then Neutral and then perhaps Good.
While I wouldn't like to see the gods actually statted out, I'd appreciate more information about how they interact with each other and what their churches are structured life. I find it quite frustrating how vague the information on them is at the moment. Doesn't give me much roleplaying material to work with.
I consider that a plus, myself. It means that the players (and thus, their characters) are more free to interpret their character's beliefs in different ways. It makes the clerics more individual instead of a bunch of clones.
It also lets the DM do the same, deciding how the churches operate in his world. The DM is free to write his own fluff.
This is a feature, not a bug.
However, 4e did something different. Gods are unkillable unless by DM fiat. (They list several different ideas on what the DM may do if they do want Tiamat acctually killable, but as written, there is no way for players to kill them (in fact, they are not even damagable until the players are epic).)
Well then Salla, you would hate the current Draconomican...it has the stats for Tiamat in it.
However, 4e did something different. Gods are unkillable unless by DM fiat. (They list several different ideas on what the DM may do if they do want Tiamat acctually killable, but as written, there is no way for players to kill them (in fact, they are not even damagable until the players are epic).)
Yeah, the "deity rules" have the gods essentially "banished" to their home planes when bloodied. Options such as attacking Tiamat in Baphomet's realm are suggested as story devices, but there is absolutely no mechanical means of "accidental" killing a god without the DM specifically allowing it.
Vecna may appear in the upcoming Open Grave book
I would love this, I intend on having Vecna tempt one of my players and I dont have a whole lot of info on him to effectivley do that.
Thirding the whole "Vecna in Open Grave" thing.
"Famous Undead" section anyone?
I think if Strahd von Zorovich is gonna be in it, then I would fourth the Vecna.
"Famous Undead" section anyone?
I think if Strahd von Zorovich is gonna be in it, then I would fourth the Vecna.
Actually upon reviewing the Open Grave catalog entry, Vecna isn't just a rumor. He was the first god we had confirmation of an appearance of.....I just sort of missed that because I forgot Vecna was a god.
Mainly because I'm the kind of guy who, as a DM, would try and steer a campaign towards deicide. :D
Actually upon reviewing the Open Grave catalog entry, Vecna isn't just a rumor. He was the first god we had confirmation of an appearance of.....I just sort of missed that because I forgot Vecna was a god.
WHOOT!
I don't think gods should have stats.
And yet, they do :P
Anyway, it's unlikely that any deity will appear in the Manual of the Planes, since it already contains Graz'zt, Baphomet, and one of the Lords of the Nine (which, on the other hand, could be Asmodeus).
I have always like stats for gods, ever since I got hold of my favourite D&D book of all time when I was a smaller fellow: 1st Ed Deities & Demigods.
I like having Gods have stats since it isn't any hair off anyone's chest if they don't want stats.
I view it as a waste of space where we could get better/more useful information
We already have Lords of Madness (aberrations) and Drow of the Underdark (drow, spider, Lolth-touched) as semi-traditional "monster sourcebooks," and I could easily see Lolth being in DotU. I could also imagine a fey creature sourcebook, as well as an elemental creature sourcebook. A Deities and Demigods sourcebook could be used to pertain to Immortal creatures in general, instead of just gods, but also include stats for some of the major gods (like Peylor and Kord).
But honestly though, I only really want to see god-stats for dieties that would be cool to fight (no matter what your alignment is). I can see wanting to fight Bahamut and Moradin (LG), Kord or Correlon (Ul), Zehir or Bane (E), and Tharidun or Lolth (CE). But there are lots of gods that would be just silly to want to fight, like Ioun and Avandra (even if you are evil, you can always use knowledge or luck on your side.)
I guess I can see how some DM's would want stats for some of those gods... But I would be less inclined to use some of the sillier ones.
I view it as a waste of space where we could get better/more useful information
I've to admit, that in 3e, it was a waste of space, indeed, because those stats were hardly usable. The stats were 3.0, first of all, then they were not built with epic rules, and, what bothers me most, that hardly any of those stats had any unique abilities (unique abilites that were really comparable to those of fan-made deity-stats).
We already have Lords of Madness (aberrations) and Drow of the Underdark (drow, spider, Lolth-touched) as semi-traditional "monster sourcebooks," and I could easily see Lolth being in DotU. I could also imagine a fey creature sourcebook, as well as an elemental creature sourcebook. A Deities and Demigods sourcebook could be used to pertain to Immortal creatures in general, instead of just gods, but also include stats for some of the major gods (like Peylor and Kord).
So this is exactly what WotC_Logan said here.
I don't think gods should have stats. Firstly, in 4e, the baseline is that gods are distant and do not directly interfere or appear in matters; thus, they need no stats because they don't have a game-mechanical effect on the world, and you'll never see one.
Actually, if you've read the canon books you'll know that the gods are supposed to be more active in the lives of their followers because -- due to the events of the Godswar they now have to maintain a following or else they'll die. That's not to say that they're going to be walking the Realms accepting challenges for their portfolio or anything, but meeting one isn't out of the question when you are in the epic tier.
Secondly, well, it's a god. 'rocks fall, everybody dies' is all the stat line they need, if you do make them interactive. "Pelor, I challenge you *splort*" and it's over.
Agreed. Fighting the gods is absurd. They'd simply squash you.
That is, if they still have salient divine abilities... but 4E clearly ****ed that up, too.
But there are lots of gods that would be just silly to want to fight, like Ioun and Avandra (even if you are evil, you can always use knowledge or luck on your side.)
Dude, Ioun could be awesome to fight, think Asmodeus Cho.
Dude, Ioun could be awesome to fight, think Asmodeus Cho.
Amadeus Cho. I miss comics
Since no one is complaining about Primordial/Demon Lord stats, why the panties in bunches over stats for gods?
Actually upon reviewing the Open Grave catalog entry, Vecna isn't just a rumor. He was the first god we had confirmation of an appearance of.....I just sort of missed that because I forgot Vecna was a god.
really it said it would stat vecna?
really it said it would stat vecna?
I do keep a very large list of sources for information regarding future releases in this forum. You could always check for yourself, but here it is anyways.
....and statistics for unique undead such as Acerak and Vecna.
Since no one is complaining about Primordial/Demon Lord stats, why the panties in bunches over stats for gods?
As most people still think that single-spheric deities are more powerful than cosmic entities that are present on nearly every world. Well...
As most people still think that single-spheric deities are more powerful than cosmic entities that are present on nearly every world. Well...
Exactly, I even remember something about it taking several gods to take out certain Primordials in the 4th Ed cosmology.
As most people still think that single-spheric deities are more powerful than cosmic entities that are present on nearly every world. Well...
And they keep forgetting that Orcus and Demogorgon have well.....killed a few. But they don't count right?