Any word on the Gaming Table? - Downloaded from the Wizards Community, all coding removed by Solauren

Any word on the Gaming Table?

Post/Author/DateTime Post
#1
genericloc
Nov 02, 2008 14:41:19 Sorry,new to the forums so I haven't read every post......but I don't see any mention by anyone of the gaming table and if they will ever release it.

Any info would be greatly appreciated.
#2
kursk
Nov 02, 2008 15:31:15
Any word on the Gaming Table?

Last published launch date data from WotC was June '08.

Obviously they've missed that date and no beta release is in site. WotC refuses to give a new launch date.

Can you say vaporware?
#3
ranadiel
Nov 02, 2008 16:06:00
Last published launch date data from WotC was June '08.

Obviously they've missed that date and no beta release is in site. WotC refuses to give a new launch date.

Can you say vaporware?

I can but that would be misleading since we have seen demos of the game table and lack of demos is one of the symptoms of vaporware.

Anyways, they have said that the game table will be the last of the applications released(partially I imagine because it relies on stuff from two of the other client side applications). They will be going into beta for the Character Builder in a short while. They haven't given any hard dates for the other three products, but have said we should expect them next year. For further info it would probably be best to check the D&Di forums as the D&Di programs and such are the primary focus of them.
#4
doctorhook
Nov 02, 2008 16:49:39
Last published launch date data from WotC was June '08.

Obviously they've missed that date and no beta release is in site. WotC refuses to give a new launch date.

Can you say vaporware?

Yeah, it's a shame it's not available right now, but then, it's also a shame my cat doesn't crap gold nuggets.

IIRC, WotC had to restart the project from scratch this past April, as they were having trouble with their developer or some such thing.

Besides, I'm patient! The Character Builder is my #1 thing ATM, if for no other reason than that it can print Power Cards. *drool* (Seriously, I'm very picky about mine, and not just any internet template will do! I'm hoping the official ones will be up to my standards. :P )
#5
kursk
Nov 02, 2008 17:44:31
I can but that would be misleading since we have seen demos of the game table and lack of demos is one of the symptoms of vaporware.

Sorry, not misleading. Correct.

Definition of: vaporware

Software that is not yet in production, but the announced delivery date has long since passed.
#6
ranadiel
Nov 02, 2008 18:07:31
Sorry, not misleading. Correct.

Definition of: vaporware

Software that is not yet in production, but the announced delivery date has long since passed.

Yes well you are sort of ignoring, or pretending to ignore, the conotation that the word vaporware has of being software that is never released. Really that definition you gave basically puts 3/4 of the video games I own as having been vaporware at some point in time. That sort of puts vaporware as having no real meaning beyond something being delayed.

And then there is also the fact that based off of definition, you could make the argument that either the game table is not vaporware(since by one definition of production it is in production). Alternatively you could make the argument that even once it is released it would still be classified as vaporware using a different definition of production since nothing will be produced after it is released.:P
#7
kursk
Nov 02, 2008 19:41:38
Yes well you are sort of ignoring, or pretending to ignore,

No. Read the definition. It is clear and unambiguous and no other connotations. The gaming table is vaporware, by definition.
#8
ranadiel
Nov 02, 2008 21:12:08
No. Read the definition. It is clear and unambiguous and no other connotations. The gaming table is vaporware, by definition.

Okay going solely by the definition you posted, I suppose that you can make the argument(although I did point out two ambiguous aspects in my previous post). However going solely by definition, your local animal shelter is spreading propaganda. However no one would ever seriously use that term to describe their activities because the word propaganda implies some level of sinister motives even if it isn't present in the definition. Likewise the term vaporware has implications, that the product will never be released, that are unwarranted and disingenuous in regards to the game table.
#9
kursk
Nov 03, 2008 7:38:57
Okay going solely by the definition you posted,

Yes, stick to definitions when you want to figure out what a word means.
#10
kursk
Nov 03, 2008 7:41:09
Except that it is in production.

Umm, no.

S/W when in production is either ready to download or has been put on physical media ready to ship.

Neither is correct. Thus, vaporware.

FTL
#11
Keldir
Nov 03, 2008 7:50:08
Okay going solely by the definition you posted, I suppose that you can make the argument(although I did point out two ambiguous aspects in my previous post). However going solely by definition, your local animal shelter is spreading propaganda. However no one would ever seriously use that term to describe their activities because the word propaganda implies some level of sinister motives even if it isn't present in the definition. Likewise the term vaporware has implications, that the product will never be released, that are unwarranted and disingenuous in regards to the game table.

I have always suspected the animal shelter of sinister intentions, I will be keeping a closer eye on them from now on.
#12
ranadiel
Nov 03, 2008 8:03:07
Umm, no.

S/W when in production is either ready to download or has been put on physical media ready to ship.

Neither is correct. Thus, vaporware.

FTL

Or we could look at the definition of production since you seem to be so caught up in defintions.

pro·duc·tion - [pruh-duhk-shuhn]
–noun
1. the act of producing

pro·duce [v. pruh-doos, -dyoos; n. prod-oos, -yoos, proh-doos, -dyoos] Pronunciation Key - Show IPA Pronunciation verb, -duced, -duc·ing, noun
–verb (used with object)
1. to bring into existence; give rise to; cause: to produce steam.
2. to bring into existence by intellectual or creative ability: to produce a great painting.

So then, production means the act of producing. And producing something basically means to bring into existence. Now then since the game table currently doesn't exist in entirity, and they are curently working on bringing it into existence, then that means they are producing it now(and we have seen evidence of their work). Since they are currently producing the game table, then that means that the game table is in fact in production. Therefore by definition it is not vaporware.
#13
kursk
Nov 03, 2008 8:08:53 "In production" is the verb form.

1. to bring into existence; give rise to; cause: to produce steam.
2. to bring into existence by intellectual or creative ability: to produce a great painting.

As you can see, it hasn't been brought into existence yet.

So, yes, definitions are critical. Thanks for helping further prove my point about it being vaporware.
#14
azaghan
Nov 03, 2008 8:24:26
Umm, no.

S/W when in production is either ready to download or has been put on physical media ready to ship.

Neither is correct. Thus, vaporware.

FTL

Correct. Even if they are working on the s/w now, it is still in development
#15
ranadiel
Nov 03, 2008 8:38:49
"In production" is the verb form.

As you can see, it hasn't been brought into existence yet.

So, yes, definitions are critical. Thanks for helping further prove my point about it being vaporware.

The act of bringing something into existence is not an instantaneous action. Producing something can take many days, wekks, months, or even years. So simply because they have not yet brought it into existence simply means that they have not finished producing it yet, not that they aren't producing it.
#16
kursk
Nov 03, 2008 8:43:25
The act of bringing something into existence is not an instantaneous action. Producing something can take many days, wekks, months, or even years.

Mistake #1. Adding to a definition. "to produce steam." Until there is steam it hasn't satisfied the definition.

Vaporware.
#17
ranadiel
Nov 03, 2008 8:47:09
Mistake #1. Adding to a definition. "to produce steam." Until there is steam it hasn't satisfied the definition.

Vaporware.

That was simply an example of the term in use. Something that dictionaries frequently have after all the definitions of a word.
#18
doctorhook
Nov 03, 2008 16:19:46 Apparently my previous post disappeared.

In short, this short thread is already getting silly. It has devolved to an argument over semantics, with Kursk ridiculously asserting that since the game table is not currently available ("in production"), it never will be.

Perhaps Kursk uses a different definition of the word "production", as what he is currently suggesting seems to be that he expects this software to simply spring into existence instantaneously. Meanwhile, the rest of us understand that the term "production" implies a process of creation, and that processes occasionally take a long time. I can only assume that Kursk is using some jargon definition of "in production" that contrasts with the phrase "in development", perhaps applicable in industry, but not in normal English conversation.

Suffice to say, we're waaayy off topic. To paraphrase, the OP asked, "Is the game table coming out, and if so, when?", to which the official WotC answer is currently, "Yes, it is coming out! We will focus on it following the release of the Character Builder and Character Visualizer tools, both of which the Game Table tool will draw upon directly. Unfortunately, this means it will likely be several months before the Game Table sees release." You can find statements to this effect in the weekly Digital Insider column at Wizards.com/dnd.

Now let's drop this, please?

Post/Author/DateTime	Post
#1 genericloc Nov 02, 2008 14:41:19	Sorry,new to the forums so I haven't read every post......but I don't see any mention by anyone of the gaming table and if they will ever release it. Any info would be greatly appreciated.
#2 kursk Nov 02, 2008 15:31:15	Any word on the Gaming Table? Last published launch date data from WotC was June '08. Obviously they've missed that date and no beta release is in site. WotC refuses to give a new launch date. Can you say vaporware?
#3 ranadiel Nov 02, 2008 16:06:00	Last published launch date data from WotC was June '08. Obviously they've missed that date and no beta release is in site. WotC refuses to give a new launch date. Can you say vaporware? I can but that would be misleading since we have seen demos of the game table and lack of demos is one of the symptoms of vaporware. Anyways, they have said that the game table will be the last of the applications released(partially I imagine because it relies on stuff from two of the other client side applications). They will be going into beta for the Character Builder in a short while. They haven't given any hard dates for the other three products, but have said we should expect them next year. For further info it would probably be best to check the D&Di forums as the D&Di programs and such are the primary focus of them.
#4 doctorhook Nov 02, 2008 16:49:39	Last published launch date data from WotC was June '08. Obviously they've missed that date and no beta release is in site. WotC refuses to give a new launch date. Can you say vaporware? Yeah, it's a shame it's not available right now, but then, it's also a shame my cat doesn't crap gold nuggets. IIRC, WotC had to restart the project from scratch this past April, as they were having trouble with their developer or some such thing. Besides, I'm patient! The Character Builder is my #1 thing ATM, if for no other reason than that it can print Power Cards. drool (Seriously, I'm very picky about mine, and not just any internet template will do! I'm hoping the official ones will be up to my standards. :P )
#5 kursk Nov 02, 2008 17:44:31	I can but that would be misleading since we have seen demos of the game table and lack of demos is one of the symptoms of vaporware. Sorry, not misleading. Correct. Definition of: vaporware Software that is not yet in production, but the announced delivery date has long since passed.
#6 ranadiel Nov 02, 2008 18:07:31	Sorry, not misleading. Correct. Definition of: vaporware Software that is not yet in production, but the announced delivery date has long since passed. Yes well you are sort of ignoring, or pretending to ignore, the conotation that the word vaporware has of being software that is never released. Really that definition you gave basically puts 3/4 of the video games I own as having been vaporware at some point in time. That sort of puts vaporware as having no real meaning beyond something being delayed. And then there is also the fact that based off of definition, you could make the argument that either the game table is not vaporware(since by one definition of production it is in production). Alternatively you could make the argument that even once it is released it would still be classified as vaporware using a different definition of production since nothing will be produced after it is released.:P
#7 kursk Nov 02, 2008 19:41:38	Yes well you are sort of ignoring, or pretending to ignore, No. Read the definition. It is clear and unambiguous and no other connotations. The gaming table is vaporware, by definition.
#8 ranadiel Nov 02, 2008 21:12:08	No. Read the definition. It is clear and unambiguous and no other connotations. The gaming table is vaporware, by definition. Okay going solely by the definition you posted, I suppose that you can make the argument(although I did point out two ambiguous aspects in my previous post). However going solely by definition, your local animal shelter is spreading propaganda. However no one would ever seriously use that term to describe their activities because the word propaganda implies some level of sinister motives even if it isn't present in the definition. Likewise the term vaporware has implications, that the product will never be released, that are unwarranted and disingenuous in regards to the game table.
#9 kursk Nov 03, 2008 7:38:57	Okay going solely by the definition you posted, Yes, stick to definitions when you want to figure out what a word means.
#10 kursk Nov 03, 2008 7:41:09	Except that it is in production. Umm, no. S/W when in production is either ready to download or has been put on physical media ready to ship. Neither is correct. Thus, vaporware. FTL
#11 Keldir Nov 03, 2008 7:50:08	Okay going solely by the definition you posted, I suppose that you can make the argument(although I did point out two ambiguous aspects in my previous post). However going solely by definition, your local animal shelter is spreading propaganda. However no one would ever seriously use that term to describe their activities because the word propaganda implies some level of sinister motives even if it isn't present in the definition. Likewise the term vaporware has implications, that the product will never be released, that are unwarranted and disingenuous in regards to the game table. I have always suspected the animal shelter of sinister intentions, I will be keeping a closer eye on them from now on.
#12 ranadiel Nov 03, 2008 8:03:07	Umm, no. S/W when in production is either ready to download or has been put on physical media ready to ship. Neither is correct. Thus, vaporware. FTL Or we could look at the definition of production since you seem to be so caught up in defintions. pro·duc·tion - [pruh-duhk-shuhn] –noun 1. the act of producing pro·duce [v. pruh-doos, -dyoos; n. prod-oos, -yoos, proh-doos, -dyoos] Pronunciation Key - Show IPA Pronunciation verb, -duced, -duc·ing, noun –verb (used with object) 1. to bring into existence; give rise to; cause: to produce steam. 2. to bring into existence by intellectual or creative ability: to produce a great painting. So then, production means the act of producing. And producing something basically means to bring into existence. Now then since the game table currently doesn't exist in entirity, and they are curently working on bringing it into existence, then that means they are producing it now(and we have seen evidence of their work). Since they are currently producing the game table, then that means that the game table is in fact in production. Therefore by definition it is not vaporware.
#13 kursk Nov 03, 2008 8:08:53	"In production" is the verb form. 1. to bring into existence; give rise to; cause: to produce steam. 2. to bring into existence by intellectual or creative ability: to produce a great painting. As you can see, it hasn't been brought into existence yet. So, yes, definitions are critical. Thanks for helping further prove my point about it being vaporware.
#14 azaghan Nov 03, 2008 8:24:26	Umm, no. S/W when in production is either ready to download or has been put on physical media ready to ship. Neither is correct. Thus, vaporware. FTL Correct. Even if they are working on the s/w now, it is still in development
#15 ranadiel Nov 03, 2008 8:38:49	"In production" is the verb form. As you can see, it hasn't been brought into existence yet. So, yes, definitions are critical. Thanks for helping further prove my point about it being vaporware. The act of bringing something into existence is not an instantaneous action. Producing something can take many days, wekks, months, or even years. So simply because they have not yet brought it into existence simply means that they have not finished producing it yet, not that they aren't producing it.
#16 kursk Nov 03, 2008 8:43:25	The act of bringing something into existence is not an instantaneous action. Producing something can take many days, wekks, months, or even years. Mistake #1. Adding to a definition. "to produce steam." Until there is steam it hasn't satisfied the definition. Vaporware.
#17 ranadiel Nov 03, 2008 8:47:09	Mistake #1. Adding to a definition. "to produce steam." Until there is steam it hasn't satisfied the definition. Vaporware. That was simply an example of the term in use. Something that dictionaries frequently have after all the definitions of a word.
#18 doctorhook Nov 03, 2008 16:19:46	Apparently my previous post disappeared. In short, this short thread is already getting silly. It has devolved to an argument over semantics, with Kursk ridiculously asserting that since the game table is not currently available ("in production"), it never will be. Perhaps Kursk uses a different definition of the word "production", as what he is currently suggesting seems to be that he expects this software to simply spring into existence instantaneously. Meanwhile, the rest of us understand that the term "production" implies a process of creation, and that processes occasionally take a long time. I can only assume that Kursk is using some jargon definition of "in production" that contrasts with the phrase "in development", perhaps applicable in industry, but not in normal English conversation. Suffice to say, we're waaayy off topic. To paraphrase, the OP asked, "Is the game table coming out, and if so, when?", to which the official WotC answer is currently, "Yes, it is coming out! We will focus on it following the release of the Character Builder and Character Visualizer tools, both of which the Game Table tool will draw upon directly. Unfortunately, this means it will likely be several months before the Game Table sees release." You can find statements to this effect in the weekly Digital Insider column at Wizards.com/dnd. Now let's drop this, please?