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Archfiends in future supplements

Post/Author/DateTime Post
#1
kamikazegerbil
Mar 25, 2009 15:35:35 Simply put Im' a big fan of Archfiends, be they demon of Devil.

Now so far in 4e WotC have been quite good to us when it come to Archfiends. We got Orcus right off the bat in the MM, no less than 3 Archfiends in Manual of the Planes, Alloces in a recent Dragon article and soon Demogorgon in the MM2.

Thing is... I want more!:D

I've been scouring all the sources I can find for info (hopefully The Plane Below will detail some Demon Princes) but I was wondering if anyone else knew of any info on plans for Archfiends or books likely to contain them.

I'm particularly hoping I won't have to wait long to see some more details on Mephistopheles.
#2
Belorin
Mar 25, 2009 17:37:48 Well, as you said, the Plane Below which is said to cover the Elemental Chaos and the Abyss should give some demony goodness and at least a few more of the princes. Then there should be an Astral Sea book as well with a large section on the Nine Hells.
Plus Dragon magazine must continue it's regular features, the Demonomicon and the Codex of Betrayal. So there is fiendage in your future.

Bel
#3
kamikazegerbil
Mar 25, 2009 19:14:18 Ah, thanks, I'd missed the Demonomicon. That's another big nasty to give me ideas. :evillaugh
#4
pogminky
Mar 27, 2009 15:19:57 Wasn't there another devil other than Alloces in a back issue of Dragon? The spy-guy? And the Minotaur demon and the Gnoll one too....

Lots of goodies in Dragon!
#5
Nykrothane
Apr 03, 2009 7:26:17 Yeah, Beleth the Witch's Viscount, Baphomet the Horned King, Yeenoghu, and Grazzt.

I really hope they do release more on the Archdevils. I also wonder if in an upcoming monster mini set will they be releasing Dispater? He was posted in the Manual of the Planes.

Still holding out for an Aspect of Asmodeus....
#6
doctorhook
Apr 04, 2009 0:36:45 If you like Archfiends, how do you feel about evil gods? Open Grave statted out Vecna, and Draconomicon statted-out Tiamat, (and let me say that she is badass). Additionally, Open Grave also has Kyuss, an "elder evil" who's right about half-way in between being an evil god and an archfiend; plus, he's iconic to D&D.

Also, there're Primordials, who are often as strong, influential, and destructive as archfiends are. There has been one statted out in Dragon Magazine, and another in the Forgotten Realms Campaign Guide.

Finally, what about Fey Lords? They can be nearly as strong as deities too, and at least as unpredictable, so a truly evil one could count as a form of Archfiend too. There's a "Court of Stars" article in Dragon later this month, which will detail a Fey Lord, IIRC.
#7
pogminky
Apr 04, 2009 3:54:36 MM2 will have Demogorgon, and haven't a number of exarchs been detailed all-over? Check the compendium - there's probably loads of BBEGs there....
#8
Marandahir
Apr 04, 2009 22:46:27 Don't forget we got Archdevil Dispater in the Manual of the Planes, in addition to updates to the Demon Princes Graz'zt and Baphomet. Now, I don't think Graz'zt had previously appeared in 4e (besides in a MotP preview), but Baphomet, I believe, appeared early, as did Yeenoghu.

Dispater is an often forgot Archfiend due to his relatively uncelebrated appearance in the MotP, and due to him being one of the weakest of the Nine Dukes. Now, he's stronger than Beleth, I believe, though I'm not sure about Alloces, considering Alloces position as working behind the scenes of the Dukes.

Oh wait, sorry. Nykrothane got to Dispater. But he should be listed up there, far above more fiends like Beleth and that Winter Witch Koliada.

Right. Koliada. As in, a member of the Court of the Stars, even before the first Court article in Dragon. Remember, she was back in Dungeon 162's article "Winter of the Witch." Can't forget significant figures from Dungeon adventures, right?

Let's look at encounter levels and stat-locations:

Demon Princes - Demonomicon of Iggwilv
Orcus, the Blood Lord - 33 Solo Brute (Leader) - Monster Manual I
Graz'zt, the Dark Prince - 32 Solo Controller - Manual of the Planes
Baphomet, the Prince of Beasts - 28 Solo Brute - Manual of the Planes
Yeenoghu, Demon Prince of Gnolls - 28 Solo Skirmisher - Dragon 364

Archdevils - Codex of Betrayal
Dispater, Father of Strife - 28 Solo Controller (Leader) - Manual of the Planes
Alloces, Butcher of Nessus - 28 Elite Controller (Leader) - Dragon 373
Beleth, the Witches' Viscount - 26 Solo Skirmisher (Leader) - Dragon 365

Archfey - Court of the Stars
Koliada, the Winter Witch - 26 Solo Skirmisher - Dungeon 160

Primordials - Lords of Chaos
Mual-Tar, the Thunder Serpent - 35 Solo Brute - Dragon 370
Blazing Rorn the Fury - 33 Solo Primordial - Forgotten Realms Campaign Guide

Deities - Deities and Demigods
[i]Tiamat, the Dark Lady[i] - 35 Solo Brute - Draconomicon I
Vecna, the Maimed God - 35 Solo Controller (Leader) - Open Grave
Harrowzau, the God Swallower - 31 Solo Brute - Open Grave

Elder Evils - ???
Kyuss, the Bonemaster - 31 Solo Controller - Open Grave

Exarchs and Epic Individuals - Various
Maglubiyet, the Mighty One - 32 Solo Brute - Dragon 372
Dragotha, the Death Dragon - 31 Solo Controller - Draconomicon I
Nefermandias, the Forsaken Pharoah - 31 Solo Artillery (Leader) - Draconomicon I
Tarrasque, Mightiest of the Abominations - 30 Solo Brute - Monster Manual
Ashardalon of the Unborn Souls, Ancient Red Dragon - 30 Solo Brute - Draconomicon I
Dal'Sarnquin, Ancient Red Dragon - 30 Solo Soldier - Dungeon Delve
Szass Tam, Regent of Thay - 30 Elite Artillery (Leader) - Forgotten Realms Campaign Guide
Terpenzi, Guardian of Najara - 30 Solo Controller - Forgotten Realms Campaign Guide
Zebukiel the Gray Worm, Ancient Gray Dragon - 29 Solo Soldier - Draconomicon I
Osterneth, the Bronze Lich - 29 Solo Controller - Open Grave
Runescribed Dracolich, Consort of Tiamat - 29 Solo Controller - Draconomicon I
Harrowzau the Unborn, Atropal - 28 Elite Brute - Open Grave
Fzoul Chembryl, Chosen Tyrant of Bane - 28 Elite Controller (Leader) - Forgotten Realms Campaign Guide
Manshoon, Lord of the Black Cloaks - 28 Elite Controller - Forgotten Realm Campaign Guide
Morthalat, Sorrowsworn Deathlord - 28 Lurker (Leader) - Dungeon 162
Doresain, the Ghoul King - 27 Elite Skirmisher - Monster Manual I
Acerak, the Devourer - 26 Solo Controller - Open Grave
Kas the Betrayer - 26 Solo Soldier - Open Grave
Rime the Steed Auslief, Ancient White Dragon - 26 Solo Brute - Draconomicon I
Quetzallus, Ancient Black Dragon - 26 Solo Lurker - Draconomicon I
Anthraxin the Devourer, Deathmask Dragon - 26 Solo Controller - Draconomicon I
Dragon Guardian, Polychromatic Ancient Black Dragon - 26 Solo Lurker - Draconomicon I
Asterion, the Thief of the Maze - 26 Elite Skirmisher - Dragon 369
Urum-Shar, Ancient Brown Dragon - 25 Solo Lurker - Draconomicon I
Nezrebe, the White Knight - 25 Elite Soldier (Leader) - Dragon 364
Sath'fiss'ith the Skybinder - 25 Elite Controller - Forgotten Realms Campaign Guide
Kurikveaeri, Ancient White Dragon - 24 Solo Brute - Dungeon 162
The Misbegotten - 24 Elite Brute - Dragon 369
Cadrick Dragonsworn - 24 Elite Skirmisher - Dragon 370
Oreiax, Son of Syvexrae - 24 Elite Brute - Open Grave
False Sir Keegan (Sir Derzk) - 24 Elite Soldier (Leader) - Dungeon 162
Madras Kalgore, the Poison Fist - 24 Elite Lurker - Draconomicon I
Machalos, the Sutured Fiend - 24 Soldier - Dragon 373
Cyan Bloodbane - 23 Solo Controller - Draconomicon I
Alzach of the Three Forms - 23 Elite Skirmisher/Soldier - Dragon 365
Elder Arantham of the Ashen Covenant - 23 Elite Controller (Leader) - Dragon 364
Infernus, Elder Red Dragon - 22 Solo Soldier - Draconomicon I
Lucresia Imscari, the Black General - 22 Elite Soldier (Leader) - Dragon 372
Sceptenar Vasabhakti, Death Knight - 22 Elite Soldier (Leader) - Open Grave
Xenro, Blackfire Dracolich - 21 Solo Controller - P3 Assault on Nightwyrm Fortress
Jarlaxle Baenre - 21 Elite Skirmisher - Forgotten Realms Campaign Guide
Mordain the Fleshweaver - 21 Elite Controller - Dragon 372
Magrathar, Larva Mage - 21 Elite Artillery - P3 Assault on Nightwyrm Fortress

That's the extent of truly stated "Great Powers," as far as I can tell. If I missed any, by all means post, and I'll update the list. Maybe I'll continue updating it with new ones as they come out, should this thread live long enough at least to see the first Court of the Stars article later this month. Note that I listed Baphomet with the Manual of the Planes because he wasn't actually stated in his Demonomicon of Iggwilv article. Gives some hope for a possible future statting of Bane (who also wasn't statted in his Deities and Demigods article).

Post/Author/DateTime	Post
#1 kamikazegerbil Mar 25, 2009 15:35:35	Simply put Im' a big fan of Archfiends, be they demon of Devil. Now so far in 4e WotC have been quite good to us when it come to Archfiends. We got Orcus right off the bat in the MM, no less than 3 Archfiends in Manual of the Planes, Alloces in a recent Dragon article and soon Demogorgon in the MM2. Thing is... I want more!:D I've been scouring all the sources I can find for info (hopefully The Plane Below will detail some Demon Princes) but I was wondering if anyone else knew of any info on plans for Archfiends or books likely to contain them. I'm particularly hoping I won't have to wait long to see some more details on Mephistopheles.
#2 Belorin Mar 25, 2009 17:37:48	Well, as you said, the Plane Below which is said to cover the Elemental Chaos and the Abyss should give some demony goodness and at least a few more of the princes. Then there should be an Astral Sea book as well with a large section on the Nine Hells. Plus Dragon magazine must continue it's regular features, the Demonomicon and the Codex of Betrayal. So there is fiendage in your future. Bel
#3 kamikazegerbil Mar 25, 2009 19:14:18	Ah, thanks, I'd missed the Demonomicon. That's another big nasty to give me ideas. :evillaugh
#4 pogminky Mar 27, 2009 15:19:57	Wasn't there another devil other than Alloces in a back issue of Dragon? The spy-guy? And the Minotaur demon and the Gnoll one too.... Lots of goodies in Dragon!
#5 Nykrothane Apr 03, 2009 7:26:17	Yeah, Beleth the Witch's Viscount, Baphomet the Horned King, Yeenoghu, and Grazzt. I really hope they do release more on the Archdevils. I also wonder if in an upcoming monster mini set will they be releasing Dispater? He was posted in the Manual of the Planes. Still holding out for an Aspect of Asmodeus....
#6 doctorhook Apr 04, 2009 0:36:45	If you like Archfiends, how do you feel about evil gods? Open Grave statted out Vecna, and Draconomicon statted-out Tiamat, (and let me say that she is badass). Additionally, Open Grave also has Kyuss, an "elder evil" who's right about half-way in between being an evil god and an archfiend; plus, he's iconic to D&D. Also, there're Primordials, who are often as strong, influential, and destructive as archfiends are. There has been one statted out in Dragon Magazine, and another in the Forgotten Realms Campaign Guide. Finally, what about Fey Lords? They can be nearly as strong as deities too, and at least as unpredictable, so a truly evil one could count as a form of Archfiend too. There's a "Court of Stars" article in Dragon later this month, which will detail a Fey Lord, IIRC.
#7 pogminky Apr 04, 2009 3:54:36	MM2 will have Demogorgon, and haven't a number of exarchs been detailed all-over? Check the compendium - there's probably loads of BBEGs there....
#8 Marandahir Apr 04, 2009 22:46:27	Don't forget we got Archdevil Dispater in the Manual of the Planes, in addition to updates to the Demon Princes Graz'zt and Baphomet. Now, I don't think Graz'zt had previously appeared in 4e (besides in a MotP preview), but Baphomet, I believe, appeared early, as did Yeenoghu. Dispater is an often forgot Archfiend due to his relatively uncelebrated appearance in the MotP, and due to him being one of the weakest of the Nine Dukes. Now, he's stronger than Beleth, I believe, though I'm not sure about Alloces, considering Alloces position as working behind the scenes of the Dukes. Oh wait, sorry. Nykrothane got to Dispater. But he should be listed up there, far above more fiends like Beleth and that Winter Witch Koliada. Right. Koliada. As in, a member of the Court of the Stars, even before the first Court article in Dragon. Remember, she was back in Dungeon 162's article "Winter of the Witch." Can't forget significant figures from Dungeon adventures, right? Let's look at encounter levels and stat-locations: Demon Princes - Demonomicon of Iggwilv Orcus, the Blood Lord - 33 Solo Brute (Leader) - Monster Manual I Graz'zt, the Dark Prince - 32 Solo Controller - Manual of the Planes Baphomet, the Prince of Beasts - 28 Solo Brute - Manual of the Planes Yeenoghu, Demon Prince of Gnolls - 28 Solo Skirmisher - Dragon 364 Archdevils - Codex of Betrayal Dispater, Father of Strife - 28 Solo Controller (Leader) - Manual of the Planes Alloces, Butcher of Nessus - 28 Elite Controller (Leader) - Dragon 373 Beleth, the Witches' Viscount - 26 Solo Skirmisher (Leader) - Dragon 365 Archfey - Court of the Stars Koliada, the Winter Witch - 26 Solo Skirmisher - Dungeon 160 Primordials - Lords of Chaos Mual-Tar, the Thunder Serpent - 35 Solo Brute - Dragon 370 Blazing Rorn the Fury - 33 Solo Primordial - Forgotten Realms Campaign Guide Deities - Deities and Demigods [i]Tiamat, the Dark Lady[i] - 35 Solo Brute - Draconomicon I Vecna, the Maimed God - 35 Solo Controller (Leader) - Open Grave Harrowzau, the God Swallower - 31 Solo Brute - Open Grave Elder Evils - ??? Kyuss, the Bonemaster - 31 Solo Controller - Open Grave Exarchs and Epic Individuals - Various Maglubiyet, the Mighty One - 32 Solo Brute - Dragon 372 Dragotha, the Death Dragon - 31 Solo Controller - Draconomicon I Nefermandias, the Forsaken Pharoah - 31 Solo Artillery (Leader) - Draconomicon I Tarrasque, Mightiest of the Abominations - 30 Solo Brute - Monster Manual Ashardalon of the Unborn Souls, Ancient Red Dragon - 30 Solo Brute - Draconomicon I Dal'Sarnquin, Ancient Red Dragon - 30 Solo Soldier - Dungeon Delve Szass Tam, Regent of Thay - 30 Elite Artillery (Leader) - Forgotten Realms Campaign Guide Terpenzi, Guardian of Najara - 30 Solo Controller - Forgotten Realms Campaign Guide Zebukiel the Gray Worm, Ancient Gray Dragon - 29 Solo Soldier - Draconomicon I Osterneth, the Bronze Lich - 29 Solo Controller - Open Grave Runescribed Dracolich, Consort of Tiamat - 29 Solo Controller - Draconomicon I Harrowzau the Unborn, Atropal - 28 Elite Brute - Open Grave Fzoul Chembryl, Chosen Tyrant of Bane - 28 Elite Controller (Leader) - Forgotten Realms Campaign Guide Manshoon, Lord of the Black Cloaks - 28 Elite Controller - Forgotten Realm Campaign Guide Morthalat, Sorrowsworn Deathlord - 28 Lurker (Leader) - Dungeon 162 Doresain, the Ghoul King - 27 Elite Skirmisher - Monster Manual I Acerak, the Devourer - 26 Solo Controller - Open Grave Kas the Betrayer - 26 Solo Soldier - Open Grave Rime the Steed Auslief, Ancient White Dragon - 26 Solo Brute - Draconomicon I Quetzallus, Ancient Black Dragon - 26 Solo Lurker - Draconomicon I Anthraxin the Devourer, Deathmask Dragon - 26 Solo Controller - Draconomicon I Dragon Guardian, Polychromatic Ancient Black Dragon - 26 Solo Lurker - Draconomicon I Asterion, the Thief of the Maze - 26 Elite Skirmisher - Dragon 369 Urum-Shar, Ancient Brown Dragon - 25 Solo Lurker - Draconomicon I Nezrebe, the White Knight - 25 Elite Soldier (Leader) - Dragon 364 Sath'fiss'ith the Skybinder - 25 Elite Controller - Forgotten Realms Campaign Guide Kurikveaeri, Ancient White Dragon - 24 Solo Brute - Dungeon 162 The Misbegotten - 24 Elite Brute - Dragon 369 Cadrick Dragonsworn - 24 Elite Skirmisher - Dragon 370 Oreiax, Son of Syvexrae - 24 Elite Brute - Open Grave False Sir Keegan (Sir Derzk) - 24 Elite Soldier (Leader) - Dungeon 162 Madras Kalgore, the Poison Fist - 24 Elite Lurker - Draconomicon I Machalos, the Sutured Fiend - 24 Soldier - Dragon 373 Cyan Bloodbane - 23 Solo Controller - Draconomicon I Alzach of the Three Forms - 23 Elite Skirmisher/Soldier - Dragon 365 Elder Arantham of the Ashen Covenant - 23 Elite Controller (Leader) - Dragon 364 Infernus, Elder Red Dragon - 22 Solo Soldier - Draconomicon I Lucresia Imscari, the Black General - 22 Elite Soldier (Leader) - Dragon 372 Sceptenar Vasabhakti, Death Knight - 22 Elite Soldier (Leader) - Open Grave Xenro, Blackfire Dracolich - 21 Solo Controller - P3 Assault on Nightwyrm Fortress Jarlaxle Baenre - 21 Elite Skirmisher - Forgotten Realms Campaign Guide Mordain the Fleshweaver - 21 Elite Controller - Dragon 372 Magrathar, Larva Mage - 21 Elite Artillery - P3 Assault on Nightwyrm Fortress That's the extent of truly stated "Great Powers," as far as I can tell. If I missed any, by all means post, and I'll update the list. Maybe I'll continue updating it with new ones as they come out, should this thread live long enough at least to see the first Court of the Stars article later this month. Note that I listed Baphomet with the Manual of the Planes because he wasn't actually stated in his Demonomicon of Iggwilv article. Gives some hope for a possible future statting of Bane (who also wasn't statted in his Deities and Demigods article).