However, I think it would be really cool if WotC published a book that had a whole bunch of cool character ideas, backgrounds, and concepts, and other interesting role-playing bits. For example, they could have a chapter on Warlocks, where they talk about the nature of different warlock pacts, the sorts of creatures they might deal with, and the price that they might pay for their power.
I think it would be a good read for getting some fresh ideas for character concepts. I would like if it was full of fluff, and VERY rules-light. Perhaps there would only be a little chapter on additional background benefits.
I just think it would be cool to see what sorts of ideas the designers at WotC have floating around in their heads. It's always nice to have a new perspective on things to get some fresh ideas.
Do you guys think we'll ever see something like this? Would you buy it? Would it be worth it for WotC to publish?
You can't think of everything all the time and a little help never hurts.
Here's an example from the Complete Book of Wizards, the section concerning Conjurors;
Because of the great power they wield, most conjurers are utterly convinced that their specialty is superior to all others. Illusion and divination are trivial, alteration and invocation are inconsequential, abjuration and enchantment are too weak, and necromancy is too repulsive. Though tending toward smugness and arrogance, conjurers are also confident, courageous, and bright.
Conjurers tend to rely on summoned creatures to perform difficult tasks for them; hence, many conjurers grow flabby as the years pass. Many consider conjurers to be downright lazy.
Conjurers recognize the importance of keeping evil in check, and most are of good alignment. Evil conjurers flourish, however, particularly those who maintain contact with evil entities summoned from other planes of existence.
Conjurers speak their minds freely and have little patience for the opinions of those they consider to be inferior; it takes a leader of proven worth and unyielding strength to earn the respect of a conjurer. In an adventuring party, conjurers tend to prefer action to discussion, and attacking to negotiating. Conjurers relish every opportunity for combat in order to demonstrate their power.
Since conjurers have little interest in associating with common people, they prefer to live in isolated areas of the countryside. Most consider children a nuisance, so even the few conjurers who marry typically remain childless by choice.
Aside from magical research, conjurers shun all activities that would normally constitute a career or occupation. When funds are low, conjurers can always summon creatures to fetch treasure for them.
I always found things like this useful not only for my NPC's, but for other players as examples of how their character might act.
Things like this would be good for such a book of roleplaying.
Bel
I'll start off by saying that I'm not one of those people that complains that 4e has no "roleplaying rules" like in 3.5e, because I think it's stupid to create rules that govern how your character acts.
However, I think it would be really cool if WotC published a book that had a whole bunch of cool character ideas, backgrounds, and concepts, and other interesting role-playing bits. For example, they could have a chapter on Warlocks, where they talk about the nature of different warlock pacts, the sorts of creatures they might deal with, and the price that they might pay for their power.
I think it would be a good read for getting some fresh ideas for character concepts. I would like if it was full of fluff, and VERY rules-light. Perhaps there would only be a little chapter on additional background benefits.
I just think it would be cool to see what sorts of ideas the designers at WotC have floating around in their heads. It's always nice to have a new perspective on things to get some fresh ideas.
Do you guys think we'll ever see something like this? Would you buy it? Would it be worth it for WotC to publish?
It would not be worth publishing and I would not purchase it, nor would most people.
However, if they included methods and guidelines for adapting the crunch to fit the fluff, I would be all over the book. For example, say the Wizard chapter has a dozen themes for roleplaying different kinds of wizards; each theme should also include an example power that shows how that character's personality can be expressed in combat as well.
The problem I see most often with roleplaying isn't a lack of creative ideas. Rather, it's the severe disconnection between how the character behaves in and out of combat.
However, I think it would be really cool if WotC published a book that had a whole bunch of cool character ideas, backgrounds, and concepts, and other interesting role-playing bits.
They do: Novels.
It would not be worth publishing and I would not purchase it, nor would most people.
Take a poll or something??? I would buy it. I would like to see what type of stuff they could come up with and I agree, you can't think of every little thing yourself. They do have a few good books out there called PC Pearls, NPC Essentials, and GM Gems. They just aren't that popular because they are books for various different games, not just dnd.
They do: Novels.
This +1
I think that adventures that do not focus so much on combat would be better than a book on roleplaying. If your adventure is to go from A to B where on the way are an enless supply of hostile creatures, a book on roleplaying isn't going to be that helpful. However, an adventure where you have to interact with NPC's without attacking them will lead to more role playing.
I think I remember Stephen hinting that some or all of his Save My Game columns may appear at some point in an upcoming release; that'd be a good start.
I think it would be really cool if WotC published a book that had a whole bunch of cool character ideas, backgrounds, and concepts, and other interesting role-playing bits.
[. . .]
Do you guys think we'll ever see something like this? Would you buy it? Would it be worth it for WotC to publish?
This is one reason why I really enjoy Dragon. As with any D&D book, there is crunch but there's also lots of story.
Everything from the 'Character Concepts' articles to series like 'Codex of Betrayal', 'Court of Stars', 'Demonimicon of Iggwilv', 'Lords of Chaos', which describe devils, fey, demons, and primordials respectively; the sorts of beings the PCs might interact with on some level (i.e. roleplaying).
'Dieties & Demigods' helps flesh out gods that the PCs might worship (such as 'Bane' and this month's 'Bahamut' article). Some of the 'Ecology' articles have explored the lifestyles of dragonborn, devas, genasi; solid ideas for roleplaying I think.
There's also articles devoted to settings like Forgotten Realms and Eberron. What must it be like to live in those sorts of worlds? Inspiration for roleplaying.
With Dragon, I have all the roleplaying support (for lack of a better word ;)) I could ever ask for in D&D. To answer your question: Yeah, I'd buy such a book but in a sense, I already am.
It's a good idea, but I think it works better as Dragon articles rather than a book.
I wouldn't have thought so.
"Hey guys, we've come up with some stuff particularly aimed at helping new players and less creative players roleplay, tell stories, and craft plot arcs. We think it's so wonderful that we're offering it exclusively via a service mainly subscribed to by our most dedicated and experienced players."
I mean, I don't have the DDI take-up figures but I'd suspect that, much like the forums, there's a disproportionately large number of grognards, older players, and die-hard fans in the subscriber base. The place a roleplaying-focused supplement is really needed is out with the newer players who don't know what a mind flayer actually is because the only Monster Manual they've ever read is the fluff-free 4E version.
Which I suppose is a good argument for putting it in a "core" book like the DMG2 rather than a more optional splat book.
Take a poll or something??? I would buy it. I would like to see what type of stuff they could come up with and I agree, you can't think of every little thing yourself. They do have a few good books out there called PC Pearls, NPC Essentials, and GM Gems. They just aren't that popular because they are books for various different games, not just dnd.
Firstly, using three question marks doesn't make your question three times the question.
Second off, we already know they won't sell well. Why? How many people buy the campaign setting guides relative to the other books they produce? Not the "Player's Guide to X", but the other one?
I keep hoping that we're going to get a Dungeon Master's Guide that has some actual tips on Dungeon Mastering in it, rather than just endless formulae for generating level-appropriate adventures. I can't help but compare the 4E DMG to any base book White Wolf has released ever and find it lacking.
I think I remember Stephen hinting that some or all of his Save My Game columns may appear at some point in an upcoming release; that'd be a good start.
I thought the first part of the DMG was brilliant in it's gaming philosophy and help with dealing with players and running a game, but I do agree with you for the most part. The DMG has the beginning DMs covered, now let's get some stuff for the intermediate and advanced DMs to play with out there.
I wouldn't have thought so.
I doubt such a book would sell well enough to be worthwhile to produce it. People are much more likely to buy a book with crunch in it, not info on RPing. I could be wrong on that.
Everything the OP mentioned in his post would be great as a Dragon article (in-depth info on the various pacts, character concepts, etc). As a matter of fact, the character concepts one has been done a couple times in Dragon already.
Firstly, using three question marks doesn't make your question three times the question.
Second off, we already know they won't sell well. Why? How many people buy the campaign setting guides relative to the other books they produce? Not the "Player's Guide to X", but the other one?
While I agree with you, I rather think your first statement was a tad hostile or unnecessarily mean.
I think such role playing points or tips are best left as little boxes in the various books or as articles on Dragon or Dungeon. (Edit: As Greg has said I think stuff like this would also be good in a DMG.)
I kind of wish they would allow a cheap subscription for Dragon and Dungeon without the full DDI package. Or maybe they should have different DDI packages, the more expensive the more features, etc. etc.
Second off, we already know they won't sell well. Why? How many people buy the campaign setting guides relative to the other books they produce? Not the "Player's Guide to X", but the other one?
Not entirely accurate. In using a relative measure this statement requires that what we know is not the rather stark and negative "won't sell well" but the somewhat more hopeful "won't sell as well". Considering the anecdotal evidence (which is pretty much all we have) based on, for example, PHB sell-outs and multiple print runs, the latter statement provides the possibility that a fluff book may turn a profit albeit one that is not so great as the crunchy books.
Your posts seem to rule this possibility out entirely and on that basis defines the book as "not worth publishing". I would and am questioning the absolute nature of this pronouncement, even in the face of your confrontational tone.
I have been cursed on many boards but I'll keep saying that D&D is one of the worst settings for roleplay.
"But rules has nothing to do with roleplay!"
Yeah, sure... that's why there's so much hack'n'slash on Wod... ;)
So, a roleplaying add won't add much, I think...
I don't think D&D roleplaying has salvation on these 4E (*disclaimer: I love 4E*) days.
I have been cursed on many boards but I'll keep saying that D&D is one of the worst settings for roleplay.
"But rules has nothing to do with roleplay!"
Yeah, sure... that's why there's so much hack'n'slash on Wod... ;)
So, a roleplaying add won't add much, I think...
It's more about atmosphere and rules. WoD has a very non-action based atmosphere.
Also, I'd like to see some rules for non-standard battle formats, like army battles and ship battles. Although this is getting away from the idea behind this post...
Firstly, using three question marks doesn't make your question three times the question.
Second off, we already know they won't sell well. Why? How many people buy the campaign setting guides relative to the other books they produce? Not the "Player's Guide to X", but the other one?
Take a poll or something?????????????????????????????????????????????????????????????????????????????????????????????????????????????????????????????????????
Definitely. Crunch is good and all. But a book dedicated to fluff, plot threads, adventure ideas and character hooks is ideal. Some DM's just need inspiration sometimes.
Definately!
And not just DMs, but too, a good set of Die-Roll tables for Character Background, this would be good for both NPC and PCs...
What I would like to see are adventures that are not just an endless series of room which the PC must get past to get to the big boss at the end. I find that most published adventures consists of the PC's being told where to go and then go on a killing spree to get there. I would like to see an adventure that focuses more on NPC's, events and plot points. There should not be more than 2 or 3 battles in between each plot point and you shouldn't expect that 90% of anything you run into would be openly or obviously hostile to the party.
I think that adventures that do not focus so much on combat would be better than a book on roleplaying. If your adventure is to go from A to B where on the way are an enless supply of hostile creatures, a book on roleplaying isn't going to be that helpful. However, an adventure where you have to interact with NPC's without attacking them will lead to more role playing.
P2: Demon Queen's Enclave fits this wonderfully.
I'm really looking forward to running it.
And not just DMs, but too, a good set of Die-Roll tables for Character Background
Yeah because what I really want to be playing is Traveller!
Yeah because what I really want to be playing is Traveller!
I might be interested in it, IF it included tables that resulted in death actually.
They do have backgrounds in the PH2 (and character examples in every PH), and tho' I'd be interested in seeing more expansive background tables, they wouldn't save one from the need to make creative effort. Inspiration for those are as different as the books, movies, and other games people experience, many having little to do with the world portrayed in D&D's illustrations and assumed by the rule-writers. If you're looking for an idea mine, forumers have started bibliographies with blurbs about what they found interesting about each entry.
Replays on the web of peoples' play sessions, something Mike Mearls and other posters have done before on the forums, would be an interesting source of ideas as well.