I'm sure this has already been brought up and dragged into a cave and beat with a big bad stick.
Whats with this Essentials line in the Product Catalogue? Is this all stuff that has already been released and is just being reprinted?
I have already bought every 4th edition book with the exception of The Ebberon books, If this stuff is "Essential" does this mean my 4th Edition books are already obsolete?
Please give me good news. I want to see a PH4, not a "Rules Compendium". I want a DM Guide 3 not a Dungeon Master's Kit. More minis!! Not Die-cut monster tokens!!
I've already forked out TONS of cash in minis and 4th edition books and I will continue to do so as long as I'm not buying the same materials that have already been released.
Is D&D Essentials a new product that supercedes my 4th edition books, or this this just re-released stuff that is already in the books i already own?
Someone please help clear this up for me!
From what I understand the only thing an existing player should need is the tiles, since their point is to have a set that is always in print (to avoid the common complaint that published adventures tend to come out after the tiles it uses are already out of print). The rest of it is aimed at being a new beginners set, so you should only need it if you insist on having everything in print. In any case, it doesn't make anything obsolete.
So this product isn't really "Essential" for someone that has all the tile sets and books already. I know they are releasing a retro looking Red Box set this year, so this D&D essential series goes hand-in-hand with that?
My concern is that I won't buy this stuff and miss out on something super cool that is exclusive to the "Essential" line.
I would be alright if I knew without a doubt that all of the material in the Essential set was stuff that is already in the PH, PH2, PH3, DMG 1 & 2, Monsters Manuals etc.
Rules Compendium will have all the basic rules with errata included.
Rules Compendium and the Heroes of... books are going to be paperbacks, and I believe 6x9.
Haven't heard much specifics about what the book in the Dungeon Master Kit will include.
Is D&D Essentials a new product that supercedes my 4th edition books, or this this just re-released stuff that is already in the books i already own?
Neither (in some cases) if I'm reading it right.
From the description of the Essentials products, the Heroes of Fallen Lands/Forgotten Kingdoms books will contain new builds and other options for the races and classes from the PHB1, like the Power series but grouping the target audience differently. Whether or not there's enough material to build a new character from the information in those books I don't know, but the Amazon cover image seems to suggest that. I'd really like that because they'll be $13 from Amazon, which is a much better price for me to get a book for a new player. For a player with the PHB it might have about the same value as a player's campaign book (with the benefit of being setting-neutral).
The Dungeon Master's Kit looks like an amazing product for the person who's been a player and now wants to try their hand at DMing, and I think it's a shame that something like this wasn't around when 4E launched. The cheaper it is for someone to start the hobby, the more likely they'll stick with it and keep spending, and the kit looks like it will have everything a starting DM would need to really get into the role without being underwhelmingly limited, nor handed more than they can handle/deserve for the money. I don't know what monsters or tiles will be in the kit, though. The screen will probably be updated for errata, but for a well-equipped DM that probably won't warrant a buy on its own.
I actually use the DM booklet from the Starter Set and tables on the Dungeon Master's Screen rather than the DMG1. I did bite on the DMG2, but only after I managed some decent income. I'm not sure what they could put in a DMG3 that would be very appealing, though, and it's not like I'm making that much more money now for me to buy it over minis.
I've never been a fan of additional PHBs. The fact that the 4E rules have grown enough to warrant a printed compendium actually bothers me a little. I'm a PHB1-only kind of guy, though, and when it comes to the rules I don't even keep that around for reference.
The Monster Vault includes "new spins such beloved monsters as..." so it shouldn't just be a big reprinting. It's almost the size of the Monster Manual 2, so including tokens for it is pretty cool, even if it's just cardboard. Minis for even a couple monsters would turn it into a big game box that creates problems for bookstores to shelf, in addition to driving the price way up.
The other products are collections of tiles and dice. I recently ran out of graph paper and only just started buying tiles (because for $10 I could get a single tile set that I can use over and over, instead of another pad that will run out in a year), so a Master Set appeals to me. What few tiles I currently have I wouldn't mind duplicates of.
These are, "essentially," products that already should have been out. I think they'll really help with new blood and longevity for the game.
The Heroes of... books will have new builds for the classes it presents. I believe we've also heard that over half of the monsters in Monster Vault will be new in that they'll be new stat blocks.
Rules Compendium will have all the basic rules with errata included.
Rules Compendium and the Heroes of... books are going to be paperbacks, and I believe 6x9.
Haven't heard much specifics about what the book in the Dungeon Master Kit will include.
The Rules Compendium cover looks like a 6x9 "trade paperback" cover, but the Heroes of covers are in the same aspect as module covers. Although they're also 300+ pages, according to Amazon, which would be pretty wild for the usual size of a source book.
Dungeon Master's Kit "Game Components" section of the description from Amazon:
• 96-page book of rules and advice for Dungeon Masters
• 32-page monster book
• Two 32-page adventures
• 3 sheets of die-cut monster tokens
• 2 double-sided battle maps
• Fold-out Dungeon Master’s screen
until then its nothing more than a money sink.
The Rules Compendium cover looks like a 6x9 "trade paperback" cover, but the Heroes of covers are in the same aspect as module covers. Although they're also 300+ pages, according to Amazon, which would be pretty wild for the usual size of a source book.
Dungeon Master's Kit "Game Components" section of the description from Amazon:
• 96-page book of rules and advice for Dungeon Masters
• 32-page monster book
• Two 32-page adventures
• 3 sheets of die-cut monster tokens
• 2 double-sided battle maps
• Fold-out Dungeon Master’s screen
Huh, you're right. I hadn't noticed that before about the Heroes of... covers. If they are the standard dimensions, I wonder if they'll cut costs by dropping color from the inside.
For the DM Kit, I meant I hadn't heard if they'd be reprinting much of the advice from the first two DMGs or if it would be new advice.
Thanks for all of the replies.
I think I am in the same boat as sfdragon, I'm going to wait until these are released and go to my nearest gaming shop and eyeball them before I buy. I'm not worried about pricing so much, my concern is that these products aren't neccessary for me to buy. I don't want game tokens I already have a ridiculous amount of minis, and although I will be honest, me and my players don't use every book I own, but I would rather stick with the books I own than buy more material that may not get use. I am both a DM and a player (primarily a DM) and I usually scoop up every book out there, but these Essentials products are really making me think twice.
Looking at the DM's kit the only thing that makes this interesting for me is the battle maps, I can always utilize more of those!
The new builds are the only thing that really catch my eye, Can never have enough powers and feats. Sometimes I really just can't find the right power when building a character.
Also one more thing - I really hope that WOTC is not getting away from selling minis and moving towards monster tokens. The latest cancellation of minis sets has got me worried! I was all pumped for the New sets that got cancelled and now have to wait till August for Lords of Madness!? Double you tee eff!!!??? They had better not cancel that set too!!
Simplified format for new gamers.
The simplified class builds, powers, etc. are probably usable in 4e too.
The Essentials game is unchanging. After they publish all the planned material, they wont ever add any more options again. This frozen-in-time-ness will appeal to players who dont like evolving updates, revisions and errata.
The essentials line in addition to being a nice introduction to new players, will serve as a reboot (4.5?) on the races and classes from PHB I & II. We'll most likely see all the races receive the same treatment as those in PHB III, i.e. we'll be able to choose one of the stat bumps. There will be new single primary, dual secondary stat versions of classes like paladin and warlock. These will be completely compatible with the current classes and will appear in the compendium. They will be presented as "alternate class features." Star warlocks will get a new charisma-based at-will. Paladins will get to base their divine challenge off either strength or charisma. Strength clerics will not only be completely ignored, but there will be a few melee options for wisdom-clerics (we already see this happening in dragon).
Even racial ability bonuses may be in flux.
You cant print a revision until all the dust settles completely. Only the test of time, by real gamers using the PH1 in bewilderingly different campaign settings, can prove when the PH1 rules have become refined like gold.
Until then, players can ...
Use the PH1 as-is, while the DM handwaves any conflicts that can potentially emerge.
Use D&DI.
Use the Essentials.
Or do all three.
tinfoil hat time:
The essentials line in addition to being a nice introduction to new players, will serve as a reboot (4.5?) on the races and classes from PHB I & II. We'll most likely see all the races receive the same treatment as those in PHB III, i.e. we'll be able to choose one of the stat bumps. There will be new single primary, dual secondary stat versions of classes like paladin and warlock. These will be completely compatible with the current classes and will appear in the compendium. They will be presented as "alternate class features." Star warlocks will get a new charisma-based at-will. Paladins will get to base their divine challenge off either strength or charisma. Strength clerics will not only be completely ignored, but there will be a few melee options for wisdom-clerics (we already see this happening in dragon).
I'm not sure why it's "tinfoil hat time" - it doesn't sound much different (even the way you put it) from creating a new product that's a mix of X Power and Player's Handbook Races with a different target audience. By focusing it on new builds/options, it's furthering the life of 4E rather than invalidating anything from a previous book and creating a "new" version (which could potentially be labeled, at least in a derogatory manner, as 4.5).
I wrote a similar comment in another thread, but its more on-topic to the thread here.
Here is the product catalog description for the Player Essentials book, which is part of the Essential product series (note the plural Essentials book and the singular Essential series):
"This essential player product for the 4th Edition Dungeons & Dragons Fantasy Roleplaying Game presents exciting new builds for the most iconic classes: the cleric, the fighter, the ranger, the rogue, and the wizard. Each class comes with a set of new powers, class features, paragon paths, epic destinies, and more that beginning players can use to build the characters they want to play and experienced players can plunder for existing 4th Edition characters."
Namely: "This essential product presents new builds that beginning players can use."
Complex rules and mechanics wont be present.
Importantly, the original descriptions emphasized, the developers will never add new content to the Essential series. It will be a self-contained and self-balancing, gaming system that will never change. Importing D&DI options will likely break this Essential gaming balance.
Admittedly, when parsing the current catalog description, it does say this Essential product is "for" 4th Edition Dungeons & Dragons.
So, it may mean the Essential really is a new kind of PH1 after all? This may represent a change in the goals of the developers, or a clarification of them. At the very least, the devs are making sure to synchronize the Essential content with the rest of D&D 4e, so that newbie players can dive in directly from the finite Essential platform to the infinite D&DI platform.
But its still not the other way around. Essential players still cant import well the D&DI options into the Essential gaming balance. Once players start using the endless content, they must also use the endless errata. Its one-way movement from Essential into D&DI, with the ability of D&DI to use Essential content serving as the gravity that pulls newbies into D&DI.
Where is the evidence to support the claim that the essentials line will provide stat choices for PHB1 races? I havn't seen that in any official release or even in anything hinted. I know there will be new builds for core classes, but I have heard NOTHING about racial changes.
From everything I've read so far, the Essentials line appears to be a simplified version of 4th edition rules with all of the erratta built in. If I'm understanding it correctly, all of the core mechanics remain the same. Several of the developers have come out stating very clearly that this is not 4.5.
If WoTC is following the same business model as TSR in the early 80's (and the near perfect copy of the Redbox makes me think they are), the Essentials line : 4th Edition is like Basic D&D : AD&D
Basically, 80% compatible back and forth with Essential streamlined for the casual/new gamer.
If WoTC is following the same business model as TSR in the early 80's (and the near perfect copy of the Redbox makes me think they are), the Essentials line : 4th Edition is like Basic D&D : AD&D
Basically, 80% compatible back and forth with Essential streamlined for the casual/new gamer.
I thought they said they were avoiding that because it also split the market. I thought they were aiming for 100% compatibility where the only reason you couldn't use one character in another game was because the DM said no.
If WoTC is following the same business model as TSR in the early 80's (and the near perfect copy of the Redbox makes me think they are), the Essentials line : 4th Edition is like Basic D&D : AD&D
Basically, 80% compatible back and forth with Essential streamlined for the casual/new gamer.
I thought they said they were avoiding that because it also split the market. I thought they were aiming for 100% compatibility where the only reason you couldn't use one character in another game was because the DM said no.
It's 100% compatible as far as I'm aware.
I just assume most power's are going to be "XdY damage, and the target is prone" without the fancy "gain regen 2 till the target makes his saving trow, aftereffect: the target get's -2 to attack any ally adjacent to you (save ends), aftereffect: make a secondary attack...." stuff, and give you some class alternatives bringing the difficulty of play down to a ranger's "quarry -> twin strike". Heck it might even have an alternate, simpler quarry feature.
Where is the evidence to support the claim that the essentials line will provide stat choices for PHB1 races? I havn't seen that in any official release or even in anything hinted. I know there will be new builds for core classes, but I have heard NOTHING about racial changes.
No official word from WotC, but the writing is on the wall. As I recall there was a rumor or maybe it was a leak that Essentials would introduce flex stats fro existing races. Then a couple weeks after the rumor started we found out that PHB3 races had flex stats. Around the same time as that people started noticing that some(all?) new racial powers that were modified by a racial stat(s) were alternatively modified by another stat that the race did not currently have a bonus to. In one specific example we have the writer himself saying that the third stat option was done entirely by WotC after he submitted the work.
I wonder if they do it for the races that will be in the essentials, when will the remainder of the races get flexible stats also and will there be a full erratta on this.
Yes, if there is flexible stats for the old races in Essentials, expect an errata before September. Unless, they want us to have two versions of the same race.
I was bored so I made these product flow diagrams. This is my take on where the Essentials line fits in.
In my opinion anything that pulls in more players and unifies all of the errata and rules updates into one soft-bound book is a good idea.
Magazine Annuals should probably be on there too, though the first Dragon Annual is a bit messed up, since it has in it some article which would be considered Dungeon material now.
Technically, there doesnt need to be any 'errata'. The Essential series could provide new traits, namely the optional racial abilites, and the Character Builder and the Online Compendium could simply include these among the many options from the many books.
But not all people have a DDI subscription and people should not be forced to buy a product just to keep up with a errata for variable stats.If variable stats are coming you will see an errata before the release of the essentials line or right after for all those who currently own a PHB1 and 2.
Yes. Imagine having two tieflings in same party, one is using the errata'd racial power and one is using the old one.
Technically, there doesnt need to be any 'errata'. The Essential series could provide new traits, namely the optional racial abilites, and the Character Builder and the Online Compendium could simply include these among the many options from the many books.
But not all people have a DDI subscription and people should not be forced to buy a product just to keep up with a errata for variable stats.If variable stats are coming you will see an errata before the release of the essentials line or right after for all those who currently own a PHB1 and 2.
If they include it only as an option in Essentials it's not much different from including it as an option in Player's Handbook Races, and would be considered an option in the same vein as extra racial feat choices or a racial paragon path. It wouldn't be errata, then.
I'm not saying that's what I think they'll do, I'm just explaining Haldrik's wild speculation.
4e is 2 years old, D&D is has the most actual PLAY-HOURS than any other RPG in existence. I believe the numbers are like 10 fold (totally arbitrary, but I think there are sales numbers to back that up.) So saying the "the dust hasn't even settled" is pretty much not true. WotC might seem like they throw in revisions arbitrarily, but it's actually backed up by a really large DDI subscription, a few thousand active forum users and even more RPGA members. Plus WotC pretty much has some of the most brilliant designers in the RPG world.
Anyway, 99% of the rule revisions can be ignored, and whatever they include in the $50 worth of new Essentials (Starter, Rules Compendium & DM kit) is not _that_ much of an investment to get "caught-up". While the rest of us, with DDI access have access to Errata and updates as soon as they come out.
No one has to BUY the new rules, no one have to even play them. There are hundreds, if not thousands, of people that are quite content with the OLD EDITIONS, and each edition has hundreds of thousands of hours of material dedicated to them.
GAME ON, old-school. or PAY ON, new school. It's your choice.
I played the game in the early to mid 90s when they had the "New Easy To Master" version out.
The Essential "Red Box" is full-of-win! It looks like the 80s version. While that was before my time, it is a must-have for me for the retro box alone!
The Essential "Monster Manual" is exactly what I have been looking for. I wanted a Monster Manual to reference when I am reading the Drizzt novels, but did not really care for the 4E versions.
The Essential "Rules Compendium" just sounds awesome! It definitely reminds me of the "Rules Cyclopedia" which is from my day and the very manual I used to run my Basic D&D compain in the 90s.
Namely: "This essential product presents new builds that beginning players can use."Complex rules and mechanics wont be present.
You conveniently cut out the second part of that sentence, which is "and experienced players can plunder for existing 4th Edition characters."
You also ignore the fact that the game is still 4e, with the exact same complex rules and mechanics.
Importantly, the original descriptions emphasized, the developers will never add new content to the Essential series. It will be a self-contained and self-balancing, gaming system that will never change. Importing D&DI options will likely break this Essential gaming balance.
This just made up, since it's been stated explicitly that D&D Essentials is just 4e repackaged to help new people get into the game, since $20 gets you everything you need to sit down and start playing, as opposed to 3 $30 core books and accessories.
This may represent a change in the goals of the developers, or a clarification of them.
This is exactly in line with the strategy they stated back during 2008.
Year 1 (2008): Get the game out.
Year 2 (2009): Expand the game for experienced players (PHB 2, X Power books, etc)
Year 3 (2010): Landing strip for new players (D&D Essentials).
But its still not the other way around. Essential players still cant import well the D&DI options into the Essential gaming balance.
This is FALSE. Flat out WRONG. PERIOD. Stop making **** up. It's the same ****ing game.
Anyway, the devs have discussed the Essential for while a now. Originally, they planned for it to strictly focus on newbie players. But to increase the customer base , the devs will also use it to publish content that experienced players will use. The Essential books are a stand alone product, but other players can use material from it.
By the way, note the word 'plunder' in the product description: experienced players can take stuff from it.
I was bored so I made these product flow diagrams. This is my take on where the Essentials line fits in.
In my opinion anything that pulls in more players and unifies all of the errata and rules updates into one soft-bound book is a good idea.
First off:
Matt, very well thought out and it looks to be pretty much dead on.
Secondly, its the same style marketing that Games Workshop pulls off for their table top lines, just the time line is stretched out a bit.
I was managing for them during the 5th ed release of 40k and it basically broke down like this:
July: Hardback book, Collectors edition and Gamers Edition (beautiful book by the way) for the experienced guys
August was something, but I cant remember as exactly what
September: Assault on Blackreach "Starter Kit"
Why I say its similar is that the "starter kit" had a smaller, but unabridged version of the rules that made it still desireable to the experienced guys plus miniatures that were EXCLUSIVE to the set.
Wizards is making a new product but still making stuff exclusive enough that us experienced players (and those nostalgic for the "Red Box") will still want AND buy the essential line
It's actually a good business plan.
Lords of Madness can't get here any sooner! If I have to, I will buy 2 sets and then spend no money on d&d products until the next set comes out. I still have hours of gaming left for my players with Trollhaunt, Demonqueen Enclave, Nightwyrm, modules etc, Fortgotten Realms, Dungeon Delve, Revenge of the Giants and Tomb of Horrors due to be released.
Like I said before I'm gonna have a good long hard look at this essentials line before I budge, but If I see the trend switching from minis to tokens I won't be happy! And neither will my wallet!
Essentials scared me initially, cos I'm buying up the PHB/MM/DMG series as they come out, so not seeing DMGIII in the release schedule had me a bit scared.
Yes, I have a DDI subscription, I find it handy to have a quick(er) reference at my game table than a stack of books.
Its so amazing the volume of material for experienced D&Ders. I'm glad there's going to be stuff for new players compared to the Old Days where it was pretty non existent (I'm glad I paid attention in math class so I could understand THAC0 better then my fellows when we played in school). Look at First Ed and the first run of Second Ed. If you were a new player, you had to have a bunch of friends keen to learn the rules with you, or have an experienced friend to teach you.
For new starters, the tokens & tiles would be a big help. I'll probably consider the Essentials line just to compliment existing collections (which you only gain by being experienced. how many times have we all looked at our Hoard of Stuff and wondered when we ever get to use that Gargantuan dragon...)
I'm still undecided on the Essentials line however the red box concept is brilliant marketing in my opinion. As someone who back in 1981 got the original one for my 11th birthday I really think that now im 40 I will probably buy the new one even if it is just for nostaligic purposes lol !
That's exactly the plan
• 96-page book of rules and advice for Dungeon Masters
• 32-page monster book
• Two 32-page adventures
• 3 sheets of die-cut monster tokens
• 2 double-sided battle maps
• Fold-out Dungeon Master’s screen
but looking on the Product list on the WotC site it says it contains:
- 256-page book of rules and advice for Dungeon Masters
- Two 32-page adventures
- 2 sheets of die-cut monster tokens
- 2 double-sided battle maps
- Fold-out Dungeon Master’s screen
wizards.com/dnd/Article.aspx?x=dnd/dramp...
Dungeons & Dragons Essentials
The action takes place mostly in your imagination, but you need a few things to play the Dungeons & Dragons game. These Essential Products form the foundation of the roleplaying game line moving forward, providing a starting point for new players and new material for longtime players. These products debut in September and roll out through October, November, and December.
Bolded section would indicate that the Essentials line is now the standard for future releases.
A) Pick up a sword and fight!
B) Shoot them with magic
C) Skulk into the shadows and assasinate the lot of them
D) Tend to the wounded
E) Hope they go away
If you picked:
A) You're probably a Fighter, Paladin or Warlord
B) You're probably a wizard or Warlock
C) You're probably a Rogue or Assassin
D) You're probably a Cleric, or a princess Warlord
E) GTFO!
wizards.com/dnd/Article.aspx?x=dnd/dramp...
Dungeons & Dragons Essentials
The action takes place mostly in your imagination, but you need a few things to play the Dungeons & Dragons game. These Essential Products form the foundation of the roleplaying game line moving forward, providing a starting point for new players and new material for longtime players. These products debut in September and roll out through October, November, and December.
Bolded section would indicate that the Essentials line is now the standard for future releases.
Considering it is basically the PHB1 rules plus errata and maybe a couple of other changes, it pretty much already is the foundation for every rule book released so far except for a few released before the major PHB1 errata was released.....so not much of a change.
wizards.com/dnd/Article.aspx?x=dnd/dramp...
Dungeons & Dragons Essentials
The action takes place mostly in your imagination, but you need a few things to play the Dungeons & Dragons game. These Essential Products form the foundation of the roleplaying game line moving forward, providing a starting point for new players and new material for longtime players. These products debut in September and roll out through October, November, and December.
Bolded section would indicate that the Essentials line is now the standard for future releases.
www.randomhouse.biz/international/PDFs/w...
I find this a bit interesting.
Read the section for Heroes of Shadow. It is called a Players' Option. Then read the selling points to the side. Players' Option is referred to as the next level of play after Essentials. Really? I thought the Essentials were the gateway drug to the more advanced 4e accessories. You start with the watered down 4e rules, get the hang of it and go for more "advanced" 4e options in the previously published material.
If this is where D&D is heading, fine. I'm not complaining but this does seem a little odd.
The Essentials rules are the same as any other 4e rules, not "watered down."
What? Let's see here...print another collection of rules called the Essentials, yet, it's still the exact same published rules one could find in the ALREADY printed PHB1-3, DMG1-2 and MM1-3.
So, WOTC is taking us for fools then? Hell, I've got PHB 1-3 why am I going to put out for the Essentials? The Essentials will have errata, that's why. In a way it's almost like starting over.
It's a Mulligan, My Bad, Do Over.
And it has been stated that the Essentials are NOT the complete 4e rules. They are the basic concepts. This is to bring in newer gamers and grab some of the grognards that will be interested in the throw back, classic red box design.
"These Essential Products form the foundation of the roleplaying game line moving forward.."
This is the money quote. WOTC is changing there business model. Hey, that's cool. I want them to keep D&D and 4e going, because I will be purchasing the Essentials and using them to bring my young daughters into the game.
WotC has clearly stated this repeatedly.
No ... you either get the Essentials because you don't already have the other books (again, they're the same core rules), or because you want the new builds and feats and PPs and EDs that will be in the Essentials books because they are offering new material instead of reprinting the exact same builds and such from the other books.
WotC has clearly stated this repeatedly.
wizards.com/dnd/Article.aspx?x=dnd/drfe/...
Mutt I'm not trying to be a ahole but this article says something else. Rules have been tweaked, errata added and they changed dailies for the newbs. They broke classes down in a new way as well. It's not going to change the entire game but it will have some interesting effects.
I'm with a lot of you guys THIS IS NOT 4.5. However, it ain't the 4e released in 2008 either.
This is a good thing. The designers have found a way to streamline the game and add just a smidgen to it. I'm really looking forward to this.
However, it ain't the 4e released in 2008 either.
And neither was PHB2 or PHB3.
However, it ain't the 4e released in 2008 either.
And neither was PHB2 or PHB3.
Touche!
What I am curious to know in terms of the utility of the Essentials line for existing players is whether this new power progression can be picked up at any point by a character or whether it is really only designed for characters that are newly developed. While its clear my ranger won't become obsolete, if he has progressed to a certain level using the existing power progression, can he then switch and take advantage of the new power progression in the Essentials line?
Very well said. This is exactly the issue that gives me some doubts about the essentials line. I believe that the developers are trying to expand the game while maintaining a sense of continuity between the past and future products, and have great confidence in their ability to do so. But it seems, to me, that they are not communicating that very well.
I will admit that maybe I am reading more into things then are really there. I don't believe that it is D&D 4.5. But I am a little skeptical about the compatibility of the two product lines. If they truly are compatible then it will be awesome. I look forward to seeing the previews to the Essentials line.
IWhat I am curious to know in terms of the utility of the Essentials line for existing players is whether this new power progression can be picked up at any point by a character or whether it is really only designed for characters that are newly developed. While its clear my ranger won't become obsolete, if he has progressed to a certain level using the existing power progression, can he then switch and take advantage of the new power progression in the Essentials line?
I think as much as you can go from a beastmaster ranger to a bow ranger or a star pact warlock to an infernal pact one
you must go trhough a lot of retconning
probably there will be some power you can use as they are
They changed the name on the can to Tab, then everybody loved it, in part because they didn't realize it was part of the evil Coca-Cola corporation.
Coca-Cola lost part of their own sales to a "competitor", which was ultimately themselves. It's called cannabalizing your market.
Diet-Coke was re-released, this time to compete with the popularity of Tab, for those loyal to the Coca-Cola brand.
Here, 4e has had criticisms, 4eE comes out, maybe addresses those criticisms, maybe not.
TSR published Basic D&D concurrently with AD&D. They both operated on many of the exact same mechanics, used many of the exact same charts, terminology, etc.
One was simplified, basic, one was more involved, advanced.
Did anyone predict the end of AD&D when the red box came out? Nope.
Did the red box spell the end of AD&D? Nope.
Did both lines continue to be published simultaneously? Yup.
Were AD&D and Basic rules, modules, source books interchangable? Nope.
Will 4e and 4eE rules, modules, source books, tiles, and miniatures be interchangable? Looks like.
Will WotC gain a new revenue stream from 4eE? They seem to think so, and I'm inclined to agree at this point.
Is WotC canniballizing it's own market? I think so. Just like Heroscape canniballizes their miniature market.
Is this wise? Hell if I know.
Do the folks who make these decisions at WotC have more education and experience in running a multi-million dollar business than me or you? Yup.
Is 4eE going to be an enjoyable, quality product? In my opinion, yes, that's why I buy their material. If your opinion is no, you have no excuse for having purchased the 4e material you have, and no need to whine about the 4eE material you're not required to pay for.
Do they deserve the benefit of the doubt? Based on the fact that I've purchased their 4e material and enjoy it, yup. If you purchased their 4e material and haven't enjoyed it, don't give them the benefit of the doubt, don't give them your money, don't bother complaining.
Darn good thing some of you folks aren't D&D characters. You seem to have an overwhelming fear of the unknown that would leave you quavering in the tavern rather than striking out to adventure.