Eberron book covers!

Post/Author/DateTimePost
#1

doctorhook

Sep 30, 2008 19:52:44
Posted at ENWorld.org, including Divine Power, Dungeon Delve, Eberron Campaign Setting, Eberron Player's Guide, and E2: Kingdom of Ghouls.

Of particular note, the Eberron Player's Guide:
IMAGE(http://www.wizards.com/global/images/products_dndacc_9780786951000_lgpic.jpg)

If that's not a Warforged (Paladin?) and an Artificer, I'll be a monkey's uncle! Or something. My sister may have other plans.

The others:
IMAGE(http://www.wizards.com/global/images/products_dndacc_9780786949823_lgpic.jpg)IMAGE(http://www.wizards.com/global/images/products_dndacc_239647200_lgpic.jpg)IMAGE(http://www.wizards.com/global/images/products_dndacc_241917400_lgpic.jpg)
IMAGE(http://ecx.images-amazon.com/images/I/51g%2BCfbvf5L._SS500_.jpg)

  • Divine Power has what appears to be a Dragonborn Paladin blasting some vampires (or drow?) with his implement.
  • Eberron Campaign Guide has... I don't know what on the cover. The Lord of Blades, maybe?
  • E2: Kingdom of Ghouls looks like it will involve Doresain, which lends legitimacy to the theory that the adventure path will come full circle from H1: Keep on the Shadowfell (1st-level) to a grand confrontation with Orcus in E3 (30th-level).
  • Dungeon Delve appears to be using the original 4E Player's Handbook art, which is cool, because I liked it.
#2

ranadiel

Sep 30, 2008 20:09:15
Divine Power's cover looks both extremely awesome and extremely stupid at the same time. I really can't figure out what I think about it.....wait have we seen the Arcane Power cover yet?

The others I don't really care for one way or another, especially Dungeon Delve since I saw that on Amazon a few days ago.
#3

askanipsion

Sep 30, 2008 20:10:07
YAY Eberron!!! I really like all of those covers. Lets hope the Psionic handbook comes out right after the Eberron books. I want to play my Kalashtar!! :D
#4

doctorhook

Sep 30, 2008 20:34:56
YAY Eberron!!! I really like all of those covers. Lets hope the Psionic handbook comes out right after the Eberron books. I want to play my Kalashtar!! :D

I have complete confidence that Kalashtar will be in EPG. For the actual Psionics power source, though, you'll probably have to wait until 2010.
#5

askanipsion

Sep 30, 2008 20:38:06
I have complete confidence that Kalashtar will be in EPG.

I sure hope so or I will be VERY disappointed. Keith Baker said he already has a Kalashtar class written but it might not be the same one that will eventually show up.

I even wrote my own Kalashtar up and it seemed very easy to make the race stats.
#6

Tharag_Bocc

Sep 30, 2008 21:03:11
I have complete confidence that Kalashtar will be in EPG. For the actual Psionics power source, though, you'll probably have to wait until 2010.

Kalishtar makes more sense for PHB3 along with, hopefully, the psionic power source.

A full racial entry for Doppelganger (changeling) makes more sense for the Eberron Player's Guide.
#7

princenicy

Sep 30, 2008 21:11:02
Divine Power's cover looks both extremely awesome and extremely stupid at the same time. I really can't figure out what I think about it.....wait have we seen the Arcane Power cover yet?

The others I don't really care for one way or another, especially Dungeon Delve since I saw that on Amazon a few days ago.

Yeah, we have. It's here, surprisingly: Arcane Power
#8

ranadiel

Sep 30, 2008 21:19:27
Yeah, we have. It's here, surprisingly: Arcane Power

Oh thanks, I definatly had never seen that before.
#9

The_Jester

Sep 30, 2008 21:27:59
I think the Dungeon Delve one is filler. But if not it's still a nice piece. You can see why they used it in place of the PHB (prior to the dragonborn revelation and all).

They're all alright but it's hard to judge until you see. The FR CG looked terrible until you saw it in the store.
#10

That_Blasted_Somoflange

Sep 30, 2008 22:59:12
Kalishtar makes more sense for PHB3 along with, hopefully, the psionic power source.

A full racial entry for Doppelganger (changeling) makes more sense for the Eberron Player's Guide.

The only thing that I think makes this not likely is that the Kalashtar have more background with the world, and one of the major villainous organizations, the Dreaming Dark/Reirda. Doppelgangers, tend to not be noticed as a race. In fact, with the previous doppelganger, they may be getting a psychic overhaul, being able to read thoughts to better imitate an individual. Didn't the 3.5 doppelganger do this?

Doppelgangers also can fit into ANY game world, because, they might be there already!
#11

Alter_Boy

Sep 30, 2008 23:19:29
What's with all the use of red?
#12

renchard

Oct 01, 2008 6:41:20
What's with all the use of red?

It's the book cover equivalent to a power tie.
#13

Tharag_Bocc

Oct 01, 2008 6:53:51
The only thing that I think makes this not likely is that the Kalashtar have more background with the world, and one of the major villainous organizations, the Dreaming Dark/Reirda. Doppelgangers, tend to not be noticed as a race. In fact, with the previous doppelganger, they may be getting a psychic overhaul, being able to read thoughts to better imitate an individual. Didn't the 3.5 doppelganger do this?

Doppelgangers also can fit into ANY game world, because, they might be there already!

While it is true that Kalishtar have strong thematics in Eberron, they also have even stronger ties, IMHO, with the concept of psionics. Kalishtar without psionics feel would like only half of a race me. Also the Dreaming Dark while a presence the world over is still primarily located outside the central focus of the main continent of Eberron. Kalishtar, can be mentioned as a supporting race, much the way Half-Orcs and Devas are in the current Forgotten Realms books, and then when the race is fully detailed they can have a more integrated write up for Eberron through on-line content

Changeling, while often invisible from a mundane perspective, is still quite intrinsic to a world full of as much intrigue. They are everywhere, most just trying to avoid attracting attention but other actively using their powers as con-artists or infiltrators.

As for the changeling being a race that can fit into any world, that's the entire design approach for all 4th edition races. Everything printed in any official book is now meant to be part of the core D&D experience. Also shifters are an Eberron staple with strong connections to the setting, its not stopping them from appearing in PHB2 alongside the very logical primal power source.
#14

That_Blasted_Somoflange

Oct 01, 2008 11:57:56
While it is true that Kalishtar have strong thematics in Eberron, they also have even stronger ties, IMHO, with the concept of psionics. Kalishtar without psionics feel would like only half of a race me. Also the Dreaming Dark while a presence the world over is still primarily located outside the central focus of the main continent of Eberron. Kalishtar, can be mentioned as a supporting race, much the way Half-Orcs and Devas are in the current Forgotten Realms books, and then when the race is fully detailed they can have a more integrated write up for Eberron through on-line content

But you CAN have psionics without having it as a power source, take fore example the illithid, githyanki and githzerai these races all have a psionic bent to them, but they are in the monster manual. Kalashtar while having a psionic bent to them as well, also have a highly religious one - Il-Yannah, the path of light. It is, as I see it, more important to what Kalashtar are than psionics.

Kalashtar have a place in the world, while yes Shifters, and Doppelgangers have a place as well, the latter two can be adapted fluff intact to almost any setting, Admittedly, Dark Sun would be harder to house shifters, but not impossible. Shifters can represent the anime beast-men, playable were creatures that many settings may wish to have. Doppelgangers can be added in at any time with the caveat that they have always been there, you just didn't know. Those two races have more generic flavour than the Kalshtar. The Kalashtar flavour is bent around the Quori, a rebellion on Dal-Quor and the seeding/hiding of the rebels amongst the humans, hiding from the Empire of Rierda and the Dreaming dark. This is integral to what it is meant to be a Kalashtar, and while you can adapt them to other worlds, you have to possibly eliminate a great deal of the fluff that makes kalashtar what they are, and that is I would think, a greater disservice to them and Eberron as a whole, than not putting in Doppelgangers.
Changeling, while often invisible from a mundane perspective, is still quite intrinsic to a world full of as much intrigue. They are everywhere, most just trying to avoid attracting attention but other actively using their powers as con-artists or infiltrators.

I do agree, but they don't have a major empire that is trying to hunt down and fearful of them because they have the ability to bring about a change to an entire Plane of existence. They are full of intrigue, but a mundane intrigue - at least in regards to Eberron. I don't mean mundane in a bad way mind you, only in that there are no groups of doppelgangers known to be trying to change the world.

As for the changeling being a race that can fit into any world, that's the entire design approach for all 4th edition races. Everything printed in any official book is now meant to be part of the core D&D experience. Also shifters are an Eberron staple with strong connections to the setting, its not stopping them from appearing in PHB2 alongside the very logical primal power source.

As I stated earlier, shifters, while having an important niche in Eberron, aren't tied to a particular enemy, such as the Kalashtar and the Quori. To fully add Kalashtar to a world, without out eliminating what makes them different form the other psionic races such as the Elan, you must add the Quori to a setting. With out the Quori fluff, Kalashtar aren't as interesting, but that is my opinion. Back to shifters, can represent a greater number of things than just descended were-creatures.

Also, why is there such a definitive view that there will only be two races in the Eberron players guide? Why can't there be Warforged, kalashtar and doppelgangers? The first two were created for the setting, the last was adapted from the races that is already in every setting. Originally the changeling was just going to be a playable doppelganger (3.5e version) they were down graded in 3.5, and in 4e, they have been melded back into one in the line of what was originally intended by the Hellcow.
#15

Tharag_Bocc

Oct 01, 2008 17:12:20
But you CAN have psionics without having it as a power source, take fore example the illithid, githyanki and githzerai these races all have a psionic bent to them, but they are in the monster manual. Kalashtar while having a psionic bent to them as well, also have a highly religious one - Il-Yannah, the path of light. It is, as I see it, more important to what Kalashtar are than psionics.

Illithids are monsters and as such have all the psionics they need built into their stat blocks. I can't talk much about the Giths, I've never real delved into either of those races.

Kalashtar have a place in the world, while yes Shifters, and Doppelgangers have a place as well, the latter two can be adapted fluff intact to almost any setting, Admittedly, Dark Sun would be harder to house shifters, but not impossible. Shifters can represent the anime beast-men, playable were creatures that many settings may wish to have. Doppelgangers can be added in at any time with the caveat that they have always been there, you just didn't know. Those two races have more generic flavour than the Kalshtar. The Kalashtar flavour is bent around the Quori, a rebellion on Dal-Quor and the seeding/hiding of the rebels amongst the humans, hiding from the Empire of Rierda and the Dreaming dark. This is integral to what it is meant to be a Kalashtar, and while you can adapt them to other worlds, you have to possibly eliminate a great deal of the fluff that makes kalashtar what they are, and that is I would think, a greater disservice to them and Eberron as a whole, than not putting in Doppelgangers.

I can tell from your very passionate about Kalashtar, and for your sake hope they are in the Eberron Players Guide. That being said I still can't agree with you. In the same way you feel that Kalashtar can't be divorced from the Quori and the Dreaming Dark, I feel that Kalashtar cannot be divorced from psionics.

Also, I'm not trying to express any dislike for the Kalashtar. In fact my desire to see them pushed off until PHB3 is predominantly so they can be designed along side the new psionic power source. Kalashtar for me are one of if not the definitive psionic races and I wouldn't want to see them done any disservices by being designed too hastily.

I do agree, but they don't have a major empire that is trying to hunt down and fearful of them because they have the ability to bring about a change to an entire Plane of existence. They are full of intrigue, but a mundane intrigue - at least in regards to Eberron. I don't mean mundane in a bad way mind you, only in that there are no groups of doppelgangers known to be trying to change the world.

Again, I just don't feel that Kalashtar are as essential to the Eberron experience as you do. Maybe that's just the Eberron I have played, but for me (especially when I fist started playing Eberron) Warforged, Shifters, and Changelings were all intrinsic and unique aspects of the setting. Kalashtar, on the other hand, were just humans with a twist. In fact, part of the reason I feel that Kalashtar can wait till PHB3 is that humans are a perfectly good stand in in a pinch.

Also between the Emerald Claw/Blood of Vol, Cults of the Dragon Below, the Lord of Blades, Lords of Dust, plus the machinations of the five nations and dragonmarked houses that there are more than enough obvious, immediate, and close at hand threats to let the Dreaming Dark sit on the sidelines across the ocean in Riedra. Not that they have to non represented, like an Illithid an Inspired would be a monster and have everything they need in their stat block.

As I stated earlier, shifters, while having an important niche in Eberron, aren't tied to a particular enemy, such as the Kalashtar and the Quori. To fully add Kalashtar to a world, without out eliminating what makes them different form the other psionic races such as the Elan, you must add the Quori to a setting. With out the Quori fluff, Kalashtar aren't as interesting, but that is my opinion. Back to shifters, can represent a greater number of things than just descended were-creatures.

Personally I hope that Kalashtar supplant the Elan as the human like psionic race. D&D, especially 4th edition, doesn't really need immortal PC races. In fact I wouldn't mind seeing Kalashtar steel the elans fluff for the generic settings.

Also, why is there such a definitive view that there will only be two races in the Eberron players guide? Why can't there be Warforged, kalashtar and doppelgangers? The first two were created for the setting, the last was adapted from the races that is already in every setting. Originally the changeling was just going to be a playable doppelganger (3.5e version) they were down graded in 3.5, and in 4e, they have been melded back into one in the line of what was originally intended by the Hellcow.

Actually I guess there isn't much say that will be the case. Taking the Forgotten Realms Player's Guide as an example is all their is to go on. I certainly wouldn't complain if we get three races in the Eberron version. That being said if it comes down to a choice between including the Kalashtar or the Changeling, Id choose the changeling every time. For me Warforged, Shifter, and Changeling are more essential to Eberron because they all originate in Khorvaire, while Kalishtar are foreign immigrants. While the conflict between the Dreaming Dark and the Path of Light is a significant one, the bulk of it is just to far removed from the central setting of the campaign to matter.
#16

doctorhook

Oct 02, 2008 0:47:57
I personally don't buy the idea that since Kalashtar are a psionic race, they NEED the Psionic power source. The fact is, the Kalashtar racial power and racial features will be "psionic-" or "psychic-" themed regardless of what class (and thus what power source) a Kalashtar character pursues. Since there is no formal relationship between race and power source, there's no reason that Kalashtar need access to Psionic power sources to be perfectly playable, legitimate characters.

Doppelgangers might appear in the EPG, but I personally think them just as likely to appear in a future Player's Handbook. Doppelgangers are, frankly, too common a fantasy race NOT to appear in a core supplement, while Kalashtar are basically unique to Eberron. (They first appeared there, they are a fairly original concept, they are intricately tied to the setting, and they haven't been popular enough to be broadly ported to other settings so far.)

I don't know anything about the Elan race, other than that they are human-like and psionic. Whether this suggests that 4E's "anti-redundancy" sensibilities will see the two races reconcepted into one for 4E, I have no idea, but I can see the idea potentially having merit.
#17

Tharag_Bocc

Oct 02, 2008 3:43:21
I personally don't buy the idea that since Kalashtar are a psionic race, they NEED the Psionic power source. The fact is, the Kalashtar racial power and racial features will be "psionic-" or "psychic-" themed regardless of what class (and thus what power source) a Kalashtar character pursues. Since there is no formal relationship between race and power source, there's no reason that Kalashtar need access to Psionic power sources to be perfectly playable, legitimate characters.

Sorry, I never meant to suggest that Kalashtar couldn't be printed without the psionic power source. My line of thinks was supposed to be more along the line of feeling incomplete without it. BAD EXAMPLE: To me it would be like printing warforged if there was no martial power source.

Also if PHB2 is any example it seems as though WotC is trying to have races that flavorfully match the power sources. Shifters, Half-Orcs, and Goliaths (and to an extent the new gnome) all seem like natural fits with the primal power source. So by logical extension I would expect them to include psionic flavored races along side the corresponding power source.

Doppelgangers might appear in the EPG, but I personally think them just as likely to appear in a future Player's Handbook. Doppelgangers are, frankly, too common a fantasy race NOT to appear in a core supplement, while Kalashtar are basically unique to Eberron. (They first appeared there, they are a fairly original concept, they are intricately tied to the setting, and they haven't been popular enough to be broadly ported to other settings so far.)

And evil elves and a race forged from the primal elements aren't generic fantasy tropes. Every thing is core now.

Also as I've said before Humans are perfectly viable stand in for Kalashtar until the get an official write up. The same cannot be said for Doppelgangers. And while Kalashtar are an Eberron original they are less central to the primary portion of the setting then Warforged, Shifters, and Changelings.