What would an elemental class be? How do you differentiate an elemental class from an arcane class that uses elemental powers (sorcerer, wizard, swordmage chiefly). This is particularly an issue for sorcerers, who seem to be entirely elemental in nature.
I see it being possible that the Dark Sun book replaces divine classes with elemental classes, where an elemental priest is no different from a divine priest except that all radiant damage is instead damage of whatever element they worship. Beyond that, I predict no other "elemental" classes.
I see it being possible that the Dark Sun book replaces divine classes with elemental classes, where an elemental priest is no different from a divine priest except that all radiant damage is instead damage of whatever element they worship. Beyond that, I predict no other "elemental" classes.
We pretty much know this isn't going to happen. Elemental priest is just a theme and not a class in and of itself.
I think the binding elementals would be more unique, especially looking at the chaos sorceror who has the Elemental Chaos's aspects done pretty well.
With binding elementals, you'd be using the power of raw creation to like, make stuff. This would bring back 'incarnum' from before, but with a new look that is less likely to stomp on other power sources toes.
Hmmm, maybe I should have read what Ranadiel said first. But that is generally the idea I have in mind.
That said, looking at the sorry mess of the b-mind and the ardent (who should be the result of hybrids) we'll probably get the WarRock who's a fighter with elemental attacks, and such.
Elementalist: Elemental Striker
Key Abilities: Intelligence, Strength, Dexterity
- A melee blaster that mixes aspects of the Swordmage, Sorcerer, and Monk. The elementalist might gain powers which have different effects depending on what "elemental form" he has taken. For instance, a "wind gust" power might create a cloud of blinding sand when combined with Earth, or turn into a freezing mist that slows enemies when combined with Water.
Some of the classes they had originally planned for Ki, such as the Shugenja or Wu Jen, might end up in the Elemental source. The 3rd edition incarnations of these classes already had power themes that tied in with the elements, so this source might be a good fit for them.
As for an overriding theme, the elemental source's theme might be that of transmutation and mutability. As the Elemental Chaos shifts in random patterns, the elemental classes' powers might change depending on the situation in which they are used.
Binder
"the beings of chaos are power incarnate, that power is mine for the taking"
Role: Controller. Your ability to channel the life-force of elemental beings allows you to use their power to overwhelm and devastate your foes.
Power Source: Elemental. You tap into the elemental power contained within your collection of trapped souls and demon flesh
Key Abilities: V class, Con vs. Cha with Dex
Armor Proficiencies: Cloth, leather, hide
Weapon Proficiencies: Simple melee
Implement: Totems
Builds: Flesh graft Binder and Soul meld Binder
Entropist
“Less is more.”
Role: Striker. Your power to see beyond the veil of the elements to the void beyond has gifted you with dangerous insight; this knowledge can unravel and unmake things into nothing, its truth is bane to all things
Power Source: Elemental. In your search for wisdom and answers, you have found what others are too scared to know; you have found the Elemental Chaos’ answer to all things, the great nothingness, the secrets of the void and its power are yours to keep.
Key Abilities: Int with Str or Wis
Armor Proficiencies: Cloth
Weapon Proficiencies: Simple melee
Implement: Orbs, Rods
Builds: Black Hand Disciple and Void Gaze Disciple
Shaper
"Chaos is all around us, I have learned to bring structure to it; the elements are both my sword and shield."
Role: Defender. You control elemental matter and energy, using your will to shape it and change it, to protect you and your allies and punish your enemies
Power Source: Elemental. You've spent so much time exposed to the ever changing nature of the elemental chaos, you have learned how to bend it to your will.
Key Abilities: Wis with Con or Dex
Armor Proficiencies: Cloth, leather, hide, chain, scale
Weapon Proficiencies: Simple melee, simple ranged
Implement: Staffs, Rods
Builds: Architect Shaper and Prismatic Shaper
As far as meeting "new needs" this is what I see in this thread:
Sha'ir, pet based Controller "say hello to my little friend"
Shaper, Casting defender "get behind me, you clumsy oaf with your plate armor"
Binder, Demon themed answer to the Warlock "oh you made a deal with a Devil? That's one method I guess, personally I prefer to beat a demon into submission"
Is there like a Wiki or something I can read about them? are they originally a setting based class from Al-Quadim or something?
EDIT: oh wait found it... that was easy
EDIT again: Hmmm... This is a Class I could get behind...
The idea is, the Chaosblade channels the power of the elemental chaos through his body by assuming a bunch of different stances. Mechanically, the class would get to choose among a few different At-will stances that would be a part of his class feature. How the Chaosblade punishes enemies who ignore his mark depends on which channeling stance he's in at the moment. Say, if he's in a Stance of Fire, enemies who ignore his mark are seared with flame, while a Chaosblade in a Stance of Wind might slide his enemies and allies to different positions on the map.
I was kind of thinking that they would be a new warlock build that gets a free sup'ed up familiar instead of a pact boon.
Sunday a buddy and I were talking about possibilities for elemental
One was the obvious idea of each role being defined by just one element
earth - defendr
fire - striker
water - leader
air - controller
we were thinking that they should either be allowed to freely multiclass within elemental or have feats to add a bit from one of the other flavoures.
Now the elemental chaos it's self is all over the place and shifting but under this idea PC would focus on one to keep himself mentaly stable.
I think it would be cool if there was a wide enough stat spread between the roles that nearly any race could be good at one class
earth str - con - wis
fire int - dex - cha
water con - dex - wis
air - int - wis - cha
just some random musings not any strong opinions
Looks more like a shadowcaster to me...
And we already have a binder (Vestiges Warlock).
So we'd have...
Wu Jen - Controler?
Shugenja - Leader?
Elemental Cleric - Defender?
??? - Striker?
Looks more like a shadowcaster to me...
Yeah, maybe not the best picture; I was going for something a little less necrotic looking.
And we already have a binder (Vestiges Warlock).
The Warlock doesn't really "bind" anything, they're the one who're binded (by contract). And this new Binder wouldn't deal with vestiges at all, so they're really nothing alike.
Ideally I'd like to see:-
A monk-y defender who binds elementals to his own flesh, with a host of implement based melee attacks with the damage type/s being defined by the elemental they bound that morning.
A Heavy armour wearing striker who binds elementals to his weapons and armour, perhaps with his encounters/dailies getting riders from the at-will he's used last, with each at-will being him drawing upon a different elemental he's bound.
I'd also like to see a mechanic making Int a useful ability whilst wearing heavy armour.
A leader who bind elementals to his allies, with dailies that grant the targets temporary powers. A decent example would be a power that binds a fire elemental to your target allowing him to deal a little extra fire damage, with the option to end the power to do a burst of flame.
Shugenja maybe?
Main stats would be Int and Cha
Would be able to create a fire whip as a class feature.
Fire based....
Wu-jen
and the one that appeared in the complete Divine, that I can never remember how to spell.
Shadow:
Ninja
Shadowdancer
yeah lets not start up with the Assassin killed them and took their stuff.
nobody here knows that for sure despite everybody's Dispatored opinion on it.
Pyrokineticist.
Main stats would be Int and Cha
Would be able to create a fire whip as a class feature.
Fire based....
That's ridiculously limited.
That's ridiculously limited.
Not to mention that it also should be a Psion PP, just like in 3.5e.
I kinda like the Idea of them not having any real powers other than owning a Genie, but I don't know if that would really work; Would you just be standing there the whole time during combat, but then again there would be so many classes at this point, who cares if one of them is not about being a bad***.
I like the Sha'ir, but I'm not sure how I would bring it into 4E; They would be no longer Arcane so they wouldn't really be mages anymore, you would need someway of explaining how they got a Genie servant and you would need to make sure it's not too 'Pact'y
I kinda like the Idea of them not having any real powers other than owning a Genie, but I don't know if that would really work; Would you just be standing there the whole time during combat, but then again there would be so many classes at this point, who cares if one of them is not about being a bad***.
Well, we've already got the Shaman whose perfectly capable of being built so that the Shaman himself never actually does anything other than summon his spirit and tell it what to do.
They could easily make a class that uses similar mechanics but is of a different role (and powersource or whatnot).
Sunday a buddy and I were talking about possibilities for elemental One was the obvious idea of each role being defined by just one element
earth - defendr
fire - striker
water - leader
air - controller
we were thinking that they should either be allowed to freely multiclass within elemental or have feats to add a bit from one of the other flavoures. Now the elemental chaos it's self is all over the place and shifting but under this idea PC would focus on one to keep himself mentaly stable. I think it would be cool if there was a wide enough stat spread between the roles that nearly any race could be good at one class earth str - con - wis fire int - dex - cha water con - dex - wis air - int - wis - cha just some random musings not any strong opinions
This is actaully a pretty cool idea, and it would separate the elemental power source from others in a very interesting way. Perhaps along with the ability to take unlimited multiclass feats within the power source, the classes would get one free multiclass feat at level 1 or something.
I like it alot.
S
earth - defendr
fire - striker
water - leader
air - controller
This is actaully a pretty cool idea
...obvious but effective and interesting
I noticed the 4 elemental domains of previous editions were not transformed into the new edition and printed in Divine Power, IMHO could be a small point for this perspective
these has nothing to do with arcane / divine, as wu-jen and many other ideas who can probably find place in other power sources and are not very deep 'elemental' linked
these classes should have bonuses to use related energy attacks, but obviously many other options, like "Fire-Striker" with many good attacks dealing Fire damage, but not only fire ones
they should share strong common mechanics, to be setted apart from other power sources
Well, we've already got the Shaman whose perfectly capable of being built so that the Shaman himself never actually does anything other than summon his spirit and tell it what to do.
They could easily make a class that uses similar mechanics but is of a different role (and powersource or whatnot).
Well then that settles it, I'm going to work on a concept for class thats just some guy who owns a genie
That's ridiculously limited.
Not to mention that it also should be a Psion PP, just like in 3.5e.
Limited to four powers and no class features. Why?
This class can be expanded on, not just be a transfer of the 3.5 PrC.
That's ridiculously limited.
Not to mention that it also should be a Psion PP, just like in 3.5e.
Limited to four powers and no class features. Why?
This class can be expanded on, not just be a transfer of the 3.5 PrC.
Well, if it were made into a Paragon Path, it would be three powers and three class features.
And really, the Pyrokineticist is a very straightforward concept. The only way to really expand upon it is to make it not a pyrokineticist.
Limited to four powers and no class features. Why?
This class can be expanded on, not just be a transfer of the 3.5 PrC.
Oh gee, I dunno, maybe because they aren't worth a full class? Are pyromancers a full class? No. Are cryomancers a full class? No. How about electromancers? No again, closest they get is the Storm Sorcerer build. And that's all the Pyrokineticist is worth - a single build. And frankly, I don't believe they need that. A Paragon Path is more than sufficient.
And I say that as a fan of Pyrokineticists. They do not and will not ever need a full class treatment under 4e.
Sha'ir
“Destroy those wretched orcs! Your master demands it!”
Role: Controller. The power of a Genie is nearly unlimited, it can devastate and overwhelm your foes, churn and sunder both land and sky; that power is at your command, so be careful what you wish for
Power Source: Elemental. Although a Genie possess great Elemental power, it is helpless against the mystic strictures and laws that dictate their existence. You have somehow used these rules to gain ownership of a Genie; whether by using guile, influence or perhaps from stumbling into it by shear luck.
Key Abilities: Cha with Int or Con
Armor Proficiencies: Cloth
Weapon Proficiencies: Simple melee
Implement: Orbs, Daggers, Seals
Builds: Efreet's Bargain and Djinn's Bargain
EDIT: I'm keeping the Totemist a controller; even though it makes them very similar to Sha'ir, I don't think it's too much more similar than two classes of the same source and role can be, and because the Sha'ir is pet based and the Totemist is melee/close based, they will play very different from each other.
My concept so far:
Show
Totemist
"The beings of chaos are power incarnated, and I have learned to incarnate the beings of Chaos"
"The beings of chaos are power incarnated, and I have learned to incarnate the beings of Chaos"
Role: Controller. Your arsenal of mystical augmentations allows you to employ the ravaging tactics and the bewildering power of some of the most feared Elemental creatures known to mortals.
Power Source: Elemental. You tap into the elemental power contained within your collection of trapped souls and demon flesh; you might wield a gorgon's breath as a warrior would wield his weapon.
Key Abilities: Con with Str or Dex
Armor Proficiencies: Cloth, leather, hide
Weapon Proficiencies: Simple melee
Implement: Totems, Seals
Builds: Flesh graft Totemist and Soul meld Totemist
Not sure I understand this "Hunter" concept; it sounds like they just have a roundabout way doing what the Barbarian, Druid and Warden do, because they don't need skins, they just channel the beast's spirit directly.
Which is why I thought it might actually be better suited as a paragon path or "sub-build" with feats and powers. Yes, it is quite similar, but without the transformative fluff. So it might even be doable by just reflavoring.
And where does that leave us? The totemist being better suited as an elemental class. Which I suppose fits this topic perfectly.
The only problem really is that a line in the runepriest's description implies heavily that there will be more rune classes, not necessarily divine classes, but overall I think the rune (or other theme) state idea will be the province of rune classes.
Summary (read:what I couldn't post coherently) of my very short post:
Each class should have the full range of elements
They should at creation gain affinity in 1 or 2 elements. Each class has different effects attached to the affinity.
Powers are affected by the affinities that you have.
TFL
I think that the Elemental classes should be able to select an 'affinity'
That's what I have in mind for the Sha'ir, they would have an affinity based on what type of genie they own.
I don't know if that's something all Elemental classes should do, it makes them all a little to much the same thing. At the very least it forces all Elemental classes to use the 4/8 elements shtick. My concepts for the Entropist and Totemist don't even really use that much elemental type attacks, In fact I don't see the Entropist having any kind of elemental energy attacks.