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Familiars!

Post/Author/DateTime Post
#1
Kaldric
Feb 11, 2009 0:29:09 So, we're getting familiars in a few months. Arcane classes, it seems. Confirmed for an April Dragon magazine article, a bunch of familiars will be showing up.

Cue speculation on mechanics, and which will be in. Any wishlists?
#2
shadrs
Feb 11, 2009 7:25:58 For mechanics, I'm hoping Familiars can act as a casting point for spells (i.e. have the familiar as the spell source instead of the caster). Beyond that, no ideas.
#3
Lineov
Feb 11, 2009 7:49:14 it might be an interesting feature (sorry if this was posted i'm not an insider) that 4e arcanists with familiars might have a different range of trained skills, not necessarily more trained skills but a wider variety (if you take X familiar, add Y skill to your class skill list at first level)
#4
Chiba_Monkey
Feb 11, 2009 9:37:28 The preview line says "new" familiars for arcane characters. Does that mean we'll see them in a sourcebook before that?
#5
kairiroses
Feb 11, 2009 9:41:52
The preview line says "new" familiars for arcane characters. Does that mean we'll see them in a sourcebook before that?

yes... it's already been confirmed that familiars will be in Acane Power, which comes out in April if I remember correctly... so the April issue of Dragon will have more familiars supplimenting Arcane Power.
#6
Kaldric
Feb 11, 2009 9:50:02 Excellent... excellent... *strokes white cat thoughtfully*

What are the odds of them just putting out generic "groups" for familiars, like they did with the ranger pets? Seems unlikely to me, because otherwise there wouldn't be a ton of room to have "a bag of holding" full of extra pets in the magazine.

So many familiars are small animals, does it seem likely we'll get stat-blocks for them? Or will they just be marked as a bonus or penalty to something or other? In the past, they've been killable, so that argues for statblocks. The present design philosophy, if I have a good handle on it, generally trends towards not 'punishing' classes for their features, so that argues against statblocks.
#7
oneiros
Feb 11, 2009 16:10:43
So many familiars are small animals, does it seem likely we'll get stat-blocks for them? Or will they just be marked as a bonus or penalty to something or other? In the past, they've been killable, so that argues for statblocks.

They could simply be minions (killable but easily brought back) or have the characteristics/mechanics of a summoned creature (per the summoning keyword preview we saw a few days ago.)

In fact, a familiar might simply be a specific kind of summoned creature, bonded to the character through a ritual.
#8
Chiba_Monkey
Feb 11, 2009 16:39:58 I think that they'll be implements. It was mentioned as a design idea in races and Classes.
#9
skyodin
Feb 11, 2009 16:44:56 Familiars will probably be like the Spirit Companion of the Shaman in the respect that Spirit Companions are immune to Area and Close attacks. So you only have to worry about your familiar dying if someone specifically targets it.
#10
Kaldric
Feb 11, 2009 17:07:15
I think that they'll be implements. It was mentioned as a design idea in races and Classes.

Iiinteresting. Well, implements have steadily increasing plus factors. Think each familiar might be an implement, always in use, that gains strength with the caster's level? Or each type of familiar offers a specific bonus to a certain kind of spell? Or as has been mentioned, they are mobile, can act as the casting point for a spell?
#11
johnthedm7000
Feb 11, 2009 18:55:00 Personally, I'd be happy to see familiars with stat blocks and that can be killed, but that come back after an extended rest with the same sort of death penalty that a character would incur. This prevents characters from using their prized companions as trap-fodder and also allows the familiars to be more than refluffed mage hands.

As for variety, I'd like a variety of generic familiar "templates" that can be modified with features chosen upon gaining the feat that allows you to get a familiar. (I believe one forumite or another has a homebrew familiar system written up that works like this). So you could take an
"Infernal Familiar" which would have a standard stat block and then choose features for it like:

Wings
Utilityesque abilities (like seeing into the future or going invisible)
Skill training
A breath weapon (for those of us who love the dragons!)
Poison

This has the upside of allowing unprecedented customization, but the features would have to be carefully balanced to avoid being over powered.

Another option that I'd enjoy is have familiars with a standard stat block and then have feats that grant one's familiar new capabilities. This however, has the downside of being a little bit of a feat sink and limiting customization slightly compared to the other method.

Then again, I'm sure that if they stated up individual unique familiars that could be good to, so long as they allow for customization with feats and whatnot.

Post/Author/DateTime	Post
#1 Kaldric Feb 11, 2009 0:29:09	So, we're getting familiars in a few months. Arcane classes, it seems. Confirmed for an April Dragon magazine article, a bunch of familiars will be showing up. Cue speculation on mechanics, and which will be in. Any wishlists?
#2 shadrs Feb 11, 2009 7:25:58	For mechanics, I'm hoping Familiars can act as a casting point for spells (i.e. have the familiar as the spell source instead of the caster). Beyond that, no ideas.
#3 Lineov Feb 11, 2009 7:49:14	it might be an interesting feature (sorry if this was posted i'm not an insider) that 4e arcanists with familiars might have a different range of trained skills, not necessarily more trained skills but a wider variety (if you take X familiar, add Y skill to your class skill list at first level)
#4 Chiba_Monkey Feb 11, 2009 9:37:28	The preview line says "new" familiars for arcane characters. Does that mean we'll see them in a sourcebook before that?
#5 kairiroses Feb 11, 2009 9:41:52	The preview line says "new" familiars for arcane characters. Does that mean we'll see them in a sourcebook before that? yes... it's already been confirmed that familiars will be in Acane Power, which comes out in April if I remember correctly... so the April issue of Dragon will have more familiars supplimenting Arcane Power.
#6 Kaldric Feb 11, 2009 9:50:02	Excellent... excellent... strokes white cat thoughtfully What are the odds of them just putting out generic "groups" for familiars, like they did with the ranger pets? Seems unlikely to me, because otherwise there wouldn't be a ton of room to have "a bag of holding" full of extra pets in the magazine. So many familiars are small animals, does it seem likely we'll get stat-blocks for them? Or will they just be marked as a bonus or penalty to something or other? In the past, they've been killable, so that argues for statblocks. The present design philosophy, if I have a good handle on it, generally trends towards not 'punishing' classes for their features, so that argues against statblocks.
#7 oneiros Feb 11, 2009 16:10:43	So many familiars are small animals, does it seem likely we'll get stat-blocks for them? Or will they just be marked as a bonus or penalty to something or other? In the past, they've been killable, so that argues for statblocks. They could simply be minions (killable but easily brought back) or have the characteristics/mechanics of a summoned creature (per the summoning keyword preview we saw a few days ago.) In fact, a familiar might simply be a specific kind of summoned creature, bonded to the character through a ritual.
#8 Chiba_Monkey Feb 11, 2009 16:39:58	I think that they'll be implements. It was mentioned as a design idea in races and Classes.
#9 skyodin Feb 11, 2009 16:44:56	Familiars will probably be like the Spirit Companion of the Shaman in the respect that Spirit Companions are immune to Area and Close attacks. So you only have to worry about your familiar dying if someone specifically targets it.
#10 Kaldric Feb 11, 2009 17:07:15	I think that they'll be implements. It was mentioned as a design idea in races and Classes. Iiinteresting. Well, implements have steadily increasing plus factors. Think each familiar might be an implement, always in use, that gains strength with the caster's level? Or each type of familiar offers a specific bonus to a certain kind of spell? Or as has been mentioned, they are mobile, can act as the casting point for a spell?
#11 johnthedm7000 Feb 11, 2009 18:55:00	Personally, I'd be happy to see familiars with stat blocks and that can be killed, but that come back after an extended rest with the same sort of death penalty that a character would incur. This prevents characters from using their prized companions as trap-fodder and also allows the familiars to be more than refluffed mage hands. As for variety, I'd like a variety of generic familiar "templates" that can be modified with features chosen upon gaining the feat that allows you to get a familiar. (I believe one forumite or another has a homebrew familiar system written up that works like this). So you could take an "Infernal Familiar" which would have a standard stat block and then choose features for it like: Wings Utilityesque abilities (like seeing into the future or going invisible) Skill training A breath weapon (for those of us who love the dragons!) Poison This has the upside of allowing unprecedented customization, but the features would have to be carefully balanced to avoid being over powered. Another option that I'd enjoy is have familiars with a standard stat block and then have feats that grant one's familiar new capabilities. This however, has the downside of being a little bit of a feat sink and limiting customization slightly compared to the other method. Then again, I'm sure that if they stated up individual unique familiars that could be good to, so long as they allow for customization with feats and whatnot.