Would you like to see something old come back like Dragonlance or would you like to see something totally new? If you want a new setting would you like it to be an "archtypical" 4E setting (not necessarily Nerath) or something with a different feel and hook like Dark Sun or Eberron?
Would you like to see a new setting design contest like the one that gave us Eberron?
Would you like to see a WotC version of one of the great 3E OGL settings like Midnight or Dragonstar?
Would you like to see a setting with a different technology level, whether 17th century pirates, 1920s gangland, WW2, or futuristic? (ah, half orcs with fedoras and dwarves with tommy guns...)
How about a setting where otherwise monstrous races are common as PCs?
Or a setting based around the Feywild and its special interaction with a particular kingdom? This "Silver Kingdom" could be caught in the crossfire of a war between devils (or primordials) and the fey. Or maybe the fey are trying to defend this special place against all the forces of destruction and banality- throw in vampires and necromancers too.
Do you have ideas of your own about what the next setting should be?
Lastly, how much support do you think each setting truly needs? Are a couple books and some adventures enough?
Dragonlane and Greyhawk are to much like FR.
Not if you call that abomination they rolled out with 4th "the Realms," they aren't. But agreed that we have enough support for your staple fantasy world.
A Spelljammer/Placescape setting could be interesting. Same for Ravenloft. But these are setting we already know (and love). Leave them alone for a while and come up with something new.
AFAIK, Spelljammer/Planescape elements are sprinkled in the cosmology, albeit not as a stand-alone campaign "model." Ravenloft more or less is tied into the Shadowfell with the domains of dread, not exactly a setting in its own right. They always felt more like something that makes for a nice crossover rather than the foundation for a world in its own right. A published adventure for these quasi-settings could work out nicely, though. Or a book like The Underdark.
Water World maybe? A land of Theocraties and constant Jihads? Chainmail-bikini-slave-girl world?
"Water World" would be too much like Bizarro Athas (or even just the Blue Age of Athas). I just don't trust Wizards to satisfactorily handle holy wars; I don't want a simple good vs. evil, but I also don't think they'd like to touch anything inspired by real-world holy wars with an eleven-foot pole. Chainmail-bikinis have forever been ruined for me since seeing a woman wear one at the Renaissance Faire. She was probably old when D&D was supplemental rules for Chainmail. To her credit, she was still kind of fit for a woman with gray hair. But still.
I'd like to see a "giant monsters" campaign setting. The world is not inhabited by humanoid monsters like orcs or kobolds (although there's plenty of room for PC-race bandits, zombies, and vicious/mutant animals). However, the thing that makes the world special are Godzilla-like monsters that have to be continually repelled. They might have Cloverfield-like spawn that add to encounters, or maybe their presence reanimates people who die in debris. The campaign setting's adventure could take a cue from Destroy All Monsters, with an invading monster (either from space, another plane, or a discovered-just-for-the-adventure monster) that needs to be defeated with the "help" of other monsters. Some cities might have rituals to bargain with the giant monsters and even have one or two in a guardian-like relationship; others might be fanatically militaristic, determined to beat them back by force. Maybe some mad wizard transforms their son into a kind of titan to fend off the monsters. The monsters wouldn't be defeatable stat-blocks, but rather skill challenges to survive panicking crowds, falling debris, and whatever bizarre effects the monster might have on an area. It would take a lot of work to pull together a campaign setting on that concept, but I think it would be worthwhile.
Normal D&D classes like Paladins and Wizards who wear flak jackets and business suits, and wield handguns and computer touch screens.
The dominant race is obviously human. But other races can be rare or unique. Half-Orcs could be Neanderthals cloned from ancient DNA, who escaped from the lab to survive in the remote wild. Shapechangers could be humans whose body tissue hosts nanobots, that rearrange body tissue - plastic surgery atwill. Warforged could be an artificial intelligence. And so on.
Arcane magic is technomancy, using written symbols to 'program' codes for special effects. Preferring archetypical symbols for more-memorable user-friendly interface. The rituals are intentional to avoid accidentally activating deadly explosions.
Psionic effects like telekinesis could actually be the result of 'utility fog', nanobots in the form of gas, exerting pressure at a molecular level. The brains are upgraded with 'wet ware' technology (basically computers made out of biological substances that can grow in a petrie dish), that hardwire the brain to communicate with the gaseous nanobots, forming a prehensile bodily aura or 'nimbus'.
And so on.
I want this setting to be religiously neutral, where spiritual traditions are strictly flavor and irrelevant to the gaming mechanics of Divine classes.
Well, Gamma World is supposed to be fully compatible with 4E rules. If you don't like the post-apocalyptic aspect of it you can always just take the weapons and other technology; what you describe sounds significantly more futuristic than 21st-century, although I guess you could get plot ideas from Tom Clancy.
Moores Law (then Moores 'Curve' after alternate technologies supercede electronic transistors).
These technological miracles are gonna happen in our century!
But yeah, I like techno-topian urban flavor. I dislike post-apocalyptic rural flavor.
Civilization with its mutually conflicting challenges.
Even a densely populated planet can use the points-of-light setting. Where the points of light are the communities who happen to cohere with your own language and ideological values, and the swaths of darkness are everybody else. Not to mention, many people will be literally isolated within their own virtual reality sites.
The Feywild could be a virtual reality interface for the internet, whose content is creatively updated by artificial intelligence programs, while the Shadowfell is the same, but whose content is the vestigal memory of databank archives. The domains of the Astral Sea are the dreamlike experience of websites that cohere the archetypes and values of the communities of specific spirtual traditions.
The Elemental Chaos can basically be outerspace, tho I assume it remains relatively inaccessable thruout the 21st century. However, cities on the ocean floors, deep in earths crust, or cities floating in vast geodesic spheres in the stratosphere, or aerial supertower cities, could all serve as Elemental environments too.
By the way, Gamma World+Eberron is going to be some craziness that would make the most unknowable Aboleth go "what".
Adjusting to 4E lore:
A setting much closer in time to the dawn war, perhaps in it's direct wake. Where primordials can still be found. Where the world has raw elemental pockets. Where the gods do still intefere in the lives of men.
You know, I can think of a few things I'd like to see that have a remarkably different flavor to them. For one thing, I'd love to see a few "Rest of the Realms" books that would let us see what happened to Zakhara, Kara-Tur, even Maztica if it still exists...all places with dramatically different flavor from your prototypical fantasy setting. Additionally, while a lot of this flavor is built into the Astral Sea, there's not really a Renaissance piracy/exploration setting along the lines of 7th Sea that is workable at the heroic tier. An updated Mystara with an updated Savage Coast might fit the bill.
Just about every place outside of the most "important" Realms locations is the source of someone's frothing nerd rage, but none so much as Kara-Tur. That said, I wouldn't mind seeing it get the same treatment as Underdark as a setting-neutral location to drop into any campaign. Maybe with more player options (I don't remember if it had anything for players). More than an adventure site but less than a complete campaign setting. And on that note, certain cities (or even... individual domains of dread!) might make for good adventure site supplements.
I really think that with the Essentials line coming this year we will see something more traditional fantasy come out next year, but I am probably wrong.
Dragonlance or Greyhawk?
Let the games begin.
I really think that with the Essentials line coming this year we will see something more traditional fantasy come out next year, but I am probably wrong.
Dragonlance or Greyhawk?
Let the games begin.
Well, them, Mystara, PoLand, etc. But the designers have basically thrown Mystara out (a shame really), so really between DL, GH, and PoL. I really think that if they wanted to make a crapload of money, they would release PoL CS as a last book in the Essentials line.
I really think that if they wanted to make a crapload of money, they would release PoL CS as a last book in the Essentials line.
Part of me wonders if PoL will be fleshed out more in the "Heroes of..." books since they're each supposed to be 32 pages longer than the Player's Handbook.
I really think that if they wanted to make a crapload of money, they would release PoL CS as a last book in the Essentials line.
Part of me wonders if PoL will be fleshed out more in the "Heroes of..." books since they're each supposed to be 32 pages longer than the Player's Handbook.
That wouldn't surprise me in the least. one would think a 300-some page book with only four classes and a smattering of races would have a lot of space for fluff.
Of course, the books are much smaller in height and width than the original books so who knows.
Of course, the books are much smaller in height and width than the original books so who knows.
While I'm sure I read that, someone pointed out recently that while the Rules Compendium cover is the right size for 6x9, the "Heroes of..." covers we're seeing are the same size as the standard covers.
I think there's a lot of stuff we'll just have to wait and see on about Essentials.
Of course, the books are much smaller in height and width than the original books so who knows.
While I'm sure I read that, someone pointed out recently that while the Rules Compendium cover is the right size for 6x9, the "Heroes of..." covers we're seeing are the same size as the standard covers.
I think there's a lot of stuff we'll just have to wait and see on about Essentials.
Same proportions; we still don't have measurements. It's entirely possible that the Rules Compendium will be the shape of a normal trade paperback while the Heroes of... use the same trim size as manga some kind of custom trim (manga is smaller than the US trade paperback size). But that would be very strange (and why wouldn't they make the Compendium fit in with them, if that's the case?).
Back on-topic: the more I think about it, a series of adventure sites would be better than a whole new campaign setting. They can release a setting-specific site for each of the settings, and of course something like a domain of dread, and maybe something from Spelljammer/Planescape or even each of the older settings. With the way 4E books are designed there's no more world branding, so it wouldn't give the impression of being "restricted" to a particular product line except for those who already recognize where in what world the site is from. Another great thing about adventure sites is that they're low-price, and even at 32 pages for Hammerfast it's a flavor-packed and inspiring booklet. Vor Rukoth in June will be expanding the Points of Light world's fallen tiefling empire, too. It seems like the most practical course of action, to me, to utilize the adventure site concept to its fullest.
Yes, I do think that there is room for another campaign setting. Personally, I would like to see all of the old 2e campaign settings given the 4e treatment... except for council of wyrms.
Likewise, I think once they get the blockbuster campaigns out of the way (FR, Eberron, DS, DL, and to a lesser extent GH), they should do a campaign settingS book, make it the biggest book they can feasibly make (FRCG or ECG sized) and put info for all of the old settings in it (twenty or thirty pages a piece). Make a PG(190 page) and a CG (320 page). I would bet it would sell due to the amount of variety in it. It would be good for world builders.
But somewhere in the mix a new setting needs to come out. I would put it at 2012(after Dragonlance in 2011, of course), with 2013 being the big setting book.
BTW, why does everyone hate on Council of Wyrms? I have never read the book but it seems to be universally reviled.
If they rehash GH or DL, what would be in the Player's Guide? If they combine it into one like Darksun, what would be the 2nd book? I am not sure if a monster book will be thick enough. Dragonlance might be able to have a monster book of it's own, but most of Greyhawk's monsters are in the MM itself.
DL definitely has enough monsters for a Creature Catalog. It had a Bestiary in 3.5 about the same size as the 4e DS Creature Catalog. I really don't know on GH, not my setting of choice.
I don't want to do 'modern' as I prefer to play Eberron to escape this real world actually.
If I want scifi, I'll just crack open my Alternity books again though. It aced the genre and I happen to know 4th won't beat it at it's own game.
I wouldn't mind a setting where there are NO monster races, and you are either Human, Human or Human and all the nasties come from other planes like demons devils, and exotic creatures only found off world and NOT meant to be PC choices.
Emperor: "You don't need 'Asian Classes' to have an Asian Setting."
Exactly.
I prefer classes that are culturally neutral, or at least open-ended.
At the same time, there needs to be certain builds that make it possible to reconstruct certain historically-accurate or mythologically-accurate character concepts.
For example, in the Japanese culture, the Assassin covers the mythological ninja, and the Rogue covers the historical ninja.
Then you get the best of both worlds. You can reconstruct specific cultural settings, while using the classes as the building blocks. And oppositely, you can import a cool concept from another culture into your own setting without any cultural baggage.
For example, you can have a ninja-inspired character concept without needing to refer to Japan. You can call the concept an Urban Warrior or Covert Operative or Robin Hood or whatever.
Of course, Psionic classes work really well in asian settings.
Also, certain races work really well. For example, Changelings are perfect as Kitsune-bito. Just refluff the "base" form from a Pale Glam Rocker to a Fox-girl. I use Dragonborn as standard, but make their forms more sinew as to reflect on Lung Dragons. Tieflings work well as Hannyo (Half-Demons), while Shifters work well as well as Hengeyokai of sorts. I like Halflings at times as Nezumi (ratfolk), and the culture of Eladrin has major similarities with high Chinese and Japanese cultures – their military strength is reminiscent of samurai, while their love and patronage of fine and performing artes is reminiscent of confuscian court China.
Batman, Batgirl, HitGirl, Punisher = Martial
Green Lantern, Witchblade, Nanoha = SuperItem/Magic Item
Iron Man, Dr Octopus = Superscience
Captain America, The Spirit, Daredevil (?) = Chemical
Blade, Darkness, Wonder Woman (?) = Supernatural/Mythic
The Shadow = Psionic
Sheena = Primal
Superman, Supergirl = Alien*
X-Men, Spiderman = Mutant*
* Perhaps both Alien and Mutant could be together in a Genetic power source.
A modern setting would be a nice bone to throw those of us who are D20 Modern fans, especially since we seem to have no real hope of any further support for the D20 Modern line, and a supers setting seems like it would work the best with 4e's mechanics.
If I want scifi, I'll just crack open my Alternity books again though. It aced the genre and I happen to know 4th won't beat it at it's own game.
I have to agree with you, I thought the Alternity books were fabulous, and I particularly liked the StarDrive setting. I must admit I was not totally enamored with the game system, but there is still a lot of crunch in those books I still use. Alternity formed some of the basis for D20 Modern, Future etc., but I was dissapointed they were not completely compatible with 3x. I hope there might be some future releases that cover modern and future role-playing that are totally compatible with 4e for some true mixed-genre gaming.
This.
I know. But I wouldn't put "classes" necessarily as Asian archetypes as much as certain builds work really well in them. For example, Tactical Warlords work really well as the "Strategist" Samurai Lords, and Vengeful Seekers work really well as Miko, especially if they MC in divine classes. Prescient Bards work well as Miko too.
Of course, Psionic classes work really well in asian settings.
Also, certain races work really well. For example, Changelings are perfect as Kitsune-bito. Just refluff the "base" form from a Pale Glam Rocker to a Fox-girl. I use Dragonborn as standard, but make their forms more sinew as to reflect on Lung Dragons. Tieflings work well as Hannyo (Half-Demons), while Shifters work well as well as Hengeyokai of sorts. I like Halflings at times as Nezumi (ratfolk), and the culture of Eladrin has major similarities with high Chinese and Japanese cultures – their military strength is reminiscent of samurai, while their love and patronage of fine and performing artes is reminiscent of confuscian court China.
It feels like your post is trying to disprove the posts already stated, but it seems to just support the idea that an Asian setting would work.
(Re read the posts before yours, they say that an asian setting would prove that asian classes are NOT required)
Scott: "what you describe sounds significantly more futuristic than 21st-century"
Moores Law (then Moores 'Curve' after alternate technologies supercede electronic transistors).
These technological miracles are gonna happen in our century!
But yeah, I like techno-topian urban flavor. I dislike post-apocalyptic rural flavor.
Civilization with its mutually conflicting challenges.
Even a densely populated planet can use the points-of-light setting. Where the points of light are the communities who happen to cohere with your own language and ideological values, and the swaths of darkness are everybody else. Not to mention, many people will be literally isolated within their own virtual reality sites.
The Feywild could be a virtual reality interface for the internet, whose content is creatively updated by artificial intelligence programs, while the Shadowfell is the same, but whose content is the vestigal memory of databank archives. The domains of the Astral Sea are the dreamlike experience of websites that cohere the archetypes and values of the communities of specific spirtual traditions.
The Elemental Chaos can basically be outerspace, tho I assume it remains relatively inaccessable thruout the 21st century. However, cities on the ocean floors, deep in earths crust, or cities floating in vast geodesic spheres in the stratosphere, or aerial supertower cities, could all serve as Elemental environments too.
sounds like you you'd enjoy a revamp of the d20 modern rules followed up by a redo of hte Urban Arcan setting...
sounds like you you'd enjoy a revamp of the d20 modern rules followed up by a redo of hte Urban Arcan setting...
Lord knows I'd certainly love to see it. I think however, the fantasy element of Urban Arcana turned off a segement of the Modern audience. Therefore, IMO, a Supers, Anime (or other setting) would be more successful. That being said, I would like to see it compatible with 4e, either entirely or with a minimum of fuss, for thoss of us who like a little fantasy in our modern.
Except I really want it to be D&D, with real D&D classes, like Bard, Wizard, Psion, Druid, Assassin, and so on. Albeit radically refluffed, of course.
Slider: "Sounds like you you'd enjoy a revamp of the d20 modern rules followed up by a redo of hte Urban Arcan setting..."
Except I really want it to be D&D, with real D&D classes, like Bard, Wizard, Psion, Druid, Assassin, and so on. Albeit radically refluffed, of course.
Bards with electric guitars. And the wizard's spellbook? There's an app for that. I'm starting to see it all come together...
Slider: "Sounds like you you'd enjoy a revamp of the d20 modern rules followed up by a redo of hte Urban Arcan setting..."
Except I really want it to be D&D, with real D&D classes, like Bard, Wizard, Psion, Druid, Assassin, and so on. Albeit radically refluffed, of course.
Bards with electric guitars. And the wizard's spellbook? There's an app for that. I'm starting to see it all come together...
The problem with that is that it works as is. You can very easily put a 4e game in a modern setting. All you need to add is guns. Most other technology is just fluff. I recall playing in a 3.5 Ravenloft game where the characters slid back and forth in time (effectively maintaining two lives centuries apart). That campaign made me think a lot about mixing modern fluff with D&D. Ever play a cheerleader bard(v3.5)? I have, and it works well too.
That's why I'd want to see a supers, or other setting. Fluff is easy to homebrew, but most of us don't want to spend what seems like forever playtesting superpowers and other mechanics.
I would like to see a modern setting, perhaps a comic book type setting. I think the 4e power system would work great for supers. Looking at comic books, we can easily see power sources (heroes and villains are listed below).
Batman, Batgirl, HitGirl, Punisher = Martial
Green Lantern, Witchblade, Nanoha = SuperItem/Magic Item
Iron Man, Dr Octopus = Superscience
Captain America, The Spirit, Daredevil (?) = Chemical
Blade, Darkness, Wonder Woman (?) = Supernatural/Mythic
The Shadow = Psionic
Sheena = Primal
Superman, Supergirl = Alien*
X-Men, Spiderman = Mutant*
* Perhaps both Alien and Mutant could be together in a Genetic power source.
A modern setting would be a nice bone to throw those of us who are D20 Modern fans, especially since we seem to have no real hope of any further support for the D20 Modern line, and a supers setting seems like it would work the best with 4e's mechanics.
See the Info for GAMMA WORLD.
It will be compatable with 4E and seems to be just right for SUPER!
I would like to see a modern setting, perhaps a comic book type setting. I think the 4e power system would work great for supers. Looking at comic books, we can easily see power sources (heroes and villains are listed below).
Batman, Batgirl, HitGirl, Punisher = Martial
Green Lantern, Witchblade, Nanoha = SuperItem/Magic Item
Iron Man, Dr Octopus = Superscience
Captain America, The Spirit, Daredevil (?) = Chemical
Blade, Darkness, Wonder Woman (?) = Supernatural/Mythic
The Shadow = Psionic
Sheena = Primal
Superman, Supergirl = Alien*
X-Men, Spiderman = Mutant*
* Perhaps both Alien and Mutant could be together in a Genetic power source.
A modern setting would be a nice bone to throw those of us who are D20 Modern fans, especially since we seem to have no real hope of any further support for the D20 Modern line, and a supers setting seems like it would work the best with 4e's mechanics.
See the Info for GAMMA WORLD.
It will be compatable with 4E and seems to be just right for SUPER!
I'm actually boycotting Gamma World on account of the randomized collectible cards integrated into the game. . . or had you forgotten?
If I can pick up a copy of the rule book second hand (that way I'm not contributing to WotC profits for that product line), I'll definitely have a look at it. That being said, other posters have suggested that GW (if it stays true to the concept of the original) is not meant for actual long-term rp, so I'm not encouraged at its usefulness.
Slider: "Sounds like you you'd enjoy a revamp of the d20 modern rules followed up by a redo of hte Urban Arcan setting..."
Except I really want it to be D&D, with real D&D classes, like Bard, Wizard, Psion, Druid, Assassin, and so on. Albeit radically refluffed, of course.
so you want Ebberon or FR with guns...since the modern world is a bit too wide open to have what i can best discribe as closed classes meaning a wizard is a wizard etc...
www.amazon.com/Gazeteer-Nentir-Vale-4th-...
I wonder if it is the real deal or something fake on Amazon (which happens from time to time).
I know. But I wouldn't put "classes" necessarily as Asian archetypes as much as certain builds work really well in them. For example, Tactical Warlords work really well as the "Strategist" Samurai Lords, and Vengeful Seekers work really well as Miko, especially if they MC in divine classes. Prescient Bards work well as Miko too.
Of course, Psionic classes work really well in asian settings.
Also, certain races work really well. For example, Changelings are perfect as Kitsune-bito. Just refluff the "base" form from a Pale Glam Rocker to a Fox-girl. I use Dragonborn as standard, but make their forms more sinew as to reflect on Lung Dragons. Tieflings work well as Hannyo (Half-Demons), while Shifters work well as well as Hengeyokai of sorts. I like Halflings at times as Nezumi (ratfolk), and the culture of Eladrin has major similarities with high Chinese and Japanese cultures – their military strength is reminiscent of samurai, while their love and patronage of fine and performing artes is reminiscent of confuscian court China.
It feels like your post is trying to disprove the posts already stated, but it seems to just support the idea that an Asian setting would work.
(Re read the posts before yours, they say that an asian setting would prove that asian classes are NOT required)
I was agreeing with the posts already stated. I was clarifying that the classes are not so much fitting to the "Oriental" archetypes as much as specific builds of them.
I want an Oriental Setting. I don't want Kara-Tur, however. But if it happens, I don't want an "Oriental Class" for it. It can be made easily enough with core material.
I'm hoping Gamma World is a test run for a Modern variant of the rules, myself. Not that I'm not looking forward to Gamma World itself, but I'd really love to see a full D&D Modern/Urban Arcana game...
Agreed.
I know. But I wouldn't put "classes" necessarily as Asian archetypes as much as certain builds work really well in them. For example, Tactical Warlords work really well as the "Strategist" Samurai Lords, and Vengeful Seekers work really well as Miko, especially if they MC in divine classes. Prescient Bards work well as Miko too.
Of course, Psionic classes work really well in asian settings.
Also, certain races work really well. For example, Changelings are perfect as Kitsune-bito. Just refluff the "base" form from a Pale Glam Rocker to a Fox-girl. I use Dragonborn as standard, but make their forms more sinew as to reflect on Lung Dragons. Tieflings work well as Hannyo (Half-Demons), while Shifters work well as well as Hengeyokai of sorts. I like Halflings at times as Nezumi (ratfolk), and the culture of Eladrin has major similarities with high Chinese and Japanese cultures – their military strength is reminiscent of samurai, while their love and patronage of fine and performing artes is reminiscent of confuscian court China.
It feels like your post is trying to disprove the posts already stated, but it seems to just support the idea that an Asian setting would work.
(Re read the posts before yours, they say that an asian setting would prove that asian classes are NOT required)
I was agreeing with the posts already stated. I was clarifying that the classes are not so much fitting to the "Oriental" archetypes as much as specific builds of them.
I want an Oriental Setting. I don't want Kara-Tur, however. But if it happens, I don't want an "Oriental Class" for it. It can be made easily enough with core material.
I'd want a new class, regardless if it's asian or not. Especially if it's inclement to not have in the setting. More or less, I'd like a new class to go with the new setting.
I'm hoping Gamma World is a test run for a Modern variant of the rules
I as well. I am definetely ready to experience some other genres using the 4e system.
In terms of is there room for another setting - most definately. I'd really love to see Spelljammer re-produced as a 4e setting.
I'm hoping Gamma World is a test run for a Modern variant of the rules
I as well. I am definetely ready to experience some other genres using the 4e system.
Only if it doesn't include that collectible card crap that Gamma World is pushing. I do not want the effectiveness of my character tied to my level of real-world disposable income.
I'm hoping Gamma World is a test run for a Modern variant of the rules
I as well. I am definetely ready to experience some other genres using the 4e system.
Only if it doesn't include that collectible card crap that Gamma World is pushing. I do not want the effectiveness of my character tied to my level of real-world disposable income.
Agreed. I am an original d20 Modern vet. I love d20 Modern. If they release a 4e Modern with the collectible card game crap attached I will boycott it the same way I am boycotting Gamma World.
The cards for Gamma World are for RANDOM mutations from what has been released. The only need to collect them would be if you want to have every mutation available to choose from.
From what has been officially released in the past, the cards have a rarity system just like magic cards. This implies that the better powers will be on rarer card. And this means you'll have to spend more money on cards to get the good powers. This ties one's real-world disposable income to their character's abilities. I, and others, consider this completely unnacceptable in an RPG. Cyber-Dave and I have both stated that we will boycot any product line that includes collectible cards in randomized booster packs.
As long as such cards are not part of a modern or sci-fi 4e setting, I will gladly pick it up.
The cards for Gamma World are for RANDOM mutations from what has been released. The only need to collect them would be if you want to have every mutation available to choose from.
From what has been officially released in the past, the cards have a rarity system just like magic cards. This implies that the better powers will be on rarer card. And this means you'll have to spend more money on cards to get the good powers. This ties one's real-world disposable income to their character's abilities. I, and others, consider this completely unnacceptable in an RPG. Cyber-Dave and I have both stated that we will boycot any product line that includes collectible cards in randomized booster packs.
As long as such cards are not part of a modern or sci-fi 4e setting, I will gladly pick it up.
Boycott away. Your loss.
I can handle the mutation cards for Gamma World, but I would be very dissapointed if this was a model that might be a component in any future release of 4e modern or future.
Did I also hear there were going to be tech cards for GW as well?
On a side note, I sure hope any potential 4e modern or future releases are completely compatible with 4e fantasy (DnD) to allow the potential for multi-genre gaming.
Boycott away. Your loss.
I won't be losing a thing, but thanks for your permission.
community.wizards.com/go/thread/view/758...
As far as I know, there hasn't been a fantasy Wild West yet. Now to just decide if Wild Sands or Shifting Sands is the better setting name. The former invokes Wild West more directly to me, but the second mimics the alliteration and better describes the location. Hmm.... decisions, decisions.
Shifting Sands sounds more Middle-Eastern/Arabic to me.
This is certainly true for me as well. Images that conjure the old west for me are trains, old west guns (revolvers, double-barrell shotguns, and the winchester rifle), prospectors, that kinda stuff.
Forgotten Realms is the "golden age" of fantasy really, those of Tolkien, and his ilk where the nature was pure, magic was abundant, and people pretty much adhered to the class/caste system. Social mobility is something that only heroes do, and the normal man is pretty much stuck where he is born.
Eberron is around the Industrial Magic stage, akin to the Industrial Revolution, but... it lacks the true modernity, of what make our "modern" times "modern". It completely lacks the near ubiquity of technology or magic in our everyday lives. I mean, I can't count less than 10 electronic items that I personally own, and I'm not particularly wealthy or anything. I can count 4 to 5 electronic items that I can bring with me anywhere and use.
A true modern campaign would have this permeation of technology as mundane and normal, so that even the standard "peasant" could have a cell phone, at the very least, and an easy way to create, manipulate, spread, and conceal information. Our modernity, currently is defined by the speed and ease of how information is created, spread, manipulated, and concealed.
I'd like a true modern compaign, even if it's with Arcana or whatever, but the true feel would be that information is a driving force in the setting, and the fact that anyone and everyone has access to "magic" items that even in both FR and Eberron are still considered expensive trinkets.
At this point, magic really has to be magic; a cellphone is at least 5 times better than a sending stone, after all, my cell phone can talk to anyone in the world, can be used as a light, and is able to access the internet, which if you think about it, is like an eldritch network of information that lives and breathes and has it's moods. It (my cell phone) can store notes, take pictures, and even maybe... play music; and all of those abilities in a single item in terms of game and even setting; make it wonderous and grand. Seriously though, it's nothing more than trinket to the people of our time.
So in a modern setting, magic has to do the impossible. And quite frankly, there's enough Urban Fantasy, Young Adult books, and Mystical City fiction that this niche is getting large and needs to be filled. Books like City of Bone, The Olympians, Rachel Morgan Series... even Twilight... are settings which are called to be played; but have no good ground rules so far in an official sense.
I really want there to be a modern setting, but who knows, I mean they abruptly killed off the last one.
7th Sea is set in a 1600s sort of pirate/swashbuckling theme, but pretty low magic compared to D&D.
Legend of the Five Rings is set in a Japan/China type setting.
Al-Qadim was an "Arabic" setting, which I did enjoy, however briefly.
So what truly hasn't been done, in terms of psuedo-historical settings?
Ever seen a movie called Cast a Deadly Spell? Who would be interested in a setting with elements of standard D&D along with 1920s era gangland? Half-orc mafia, dwarves with tommy guns, that sort of thing.
Shifting Sands sounds more Middle-Eastern/Arabic to me.
This is certainly true for me as well. Images that conjure the old west for me are trains, old west guns (revolvers, double-barrell shotguns, and the winchester rifle), prospectors, that kinda stuff.
Well, Shifting Sands/Wild Sands does have Wild West weaponry. Sure, I've refluffed crossbows to serve as guns, but since no one will be wielding crossbows, there's no need to create new mechanics. And prospectors were a HUGE part of what I described. So I'm lacking trains. But in their place I've got a train of boats on rivers of quicksand - effectively serving as rails. I don't see how this is reading as Arabic/Middle Eastern. Please enlighten me. But bring it to my thread - let's not derail this discussion.
The cards for Gamma World are for RANDOM mutations from what has been released. The only need to collect them would be if you want to have every mutation available to choose from.
From what has been officially released in the past, the cards have a rarity system just like magic cards. This implies that the better powers will be on rarer card. And this means you'll have to spend more money on cards to get the good powers. This ties one's real-world disposable income to their character's abilities. I, and others, consider this completely unnacceptable in an RPG. Cyber-Dave and I have both stated that we will boycot any product line that includes collectible cards in randomized booster packs.
As long as such cards are not part of a modern or sci-fi 4e setting, I will gladly pick it up.
Boycott away. Your loss.
It is not a loss at all. In fact, considering how much money we will save by not engaging in a collectible card game model of consumption, and how much of that money we will be able to spend on buying RPG books (which have a ton more content per the same dollar value), I would say that it will be our gain...
Silly rabbits...
Even if better mutations were on rarer cards, thus bigger money gets a better advantage from physical card purchases, the CB would still probably have everything digitally available anyway?
Not sure how Gamma 'collectable cards' would work with the Character Builder.
Even if better mutations were on rarer cards, thus bigger money gets a better advantage from physical card purchases, the CB would still probably have everything digitally available anyway?
Doubtful. If they were to work it into the CB, you would probably need to enter a special code on the card to apply the power. It's the only way that makes sense, as far as tying rpg powers to lame ass collectible cards goes.
Strahd will be happy to remove that crease from his castle
I am personally hoping that they make Ravenloft into a full campaign setting. Yes, yes I know they folded it into the shadowfell. Well, they can just unfold it and make it a campaign setting now
Strahd will be happy to remove that crease from his castle
Although the only 4e representations of Ravenloft may be through Dungeon/Dragon articles and the board game, I still have some hope that it might be introduced as a full campaign setting. Perhaps if the board game sells well? A gothic setting like Ravenloft certainly fulfills a different niche than PoL, Eberron, Forgotten Realms and Dark Sun.
Then figures that wandered between tribes, giving advice or telling tales, or figures of exile, or mercenary champions. Bring an extra build in for the bard that focused on the Skaldic nature of the setting... High superstition, high 'warrior's code' and 'honour' ideas, largely Low Fantasy(In as much as magic would be fairly prevalent, but plagues and sorts would still be rampant...)
Fits quite well into the Points of Light ideal too.
Also, *COugh* Vissbruck in signature *Cough*
Though I quite like the 1920s gangland idea, perhaps borrow a few ideas from Baccano to make that work? And Rich Burlew's setting is always a tempting prospect.
Spelljammer, not so much, it seems to have been rolled into the core setting (I think there are rules for Spelljamers in that Astral Sea book, actually... Or it might just be a mention of them in Manual of the Planes somewhere and I'm getting confused.)
I vaguely remember hearing that the 2nd/3rd place settings in the contest that Eberron won were still owned by WotC. (granted, that's been a while) I'd like to see what they might have been. Or anything new for that matter. I was personally a little disappointed with Dark Sun being announced, simply because I was hoping for a surprise. At least it wasn't an FR/Eberron copy.
"Is there room for another campaign setting?" Yes, why wouldn't there be? Plenty of people have no interest in the current 4e material and are waiting for their favorite setting to be release or at least supported.
As for settings I'd enjoy, as I'v already said in other threads (and maybe this one), Dragonlance and Mystara would be great to have in 4e. I'm also 100% in favor of a completely new setting that takes all the points of light (core) fluff and makes it into its own setting. Well organized with its own continental maps, site maps and so on. Although I'm not a fan of a pirate/waterworld setting. Just not my thing.
I'd also buy a futuristic/sci-fi/steampunk version of D&D. A starwars/warhammer 40k type D&D game would be great. I'd make one myself, but the lack of sci-fi D&D artwork keeps me from burning years of effort on that.
If I had to pick two settings, Dragonlance and a fully detailed "core" PoL setting. I also want more DDI support for planescape content.
Making it a collective project helps reduce the burden on any single individual, and more importantly, the project benefits from the interests and expertise of many different kinds of gamers. Many gamers enjoy adding art, others maps, others statistically balanced mechanics, others intreaguing narratives, others diplomacy to coordinate the efforts of competing interests, etc.
It is extremely difficult to get gamers to agree with eachother. But if the collective project enjoys at least a wide base of support, then it will probably do well in the marketplace, and WotC will be able to officially support it. Even if not, it can remain a cult-classic on the website.
My short reply is, Design by Committee is a bad idea and fails far more often than it sees a successful completion of a project. When it comes to a community setting project, created by folks on these forums, I'd have to say it would have an even higher failure rate, since the vast majority on here enjoy snarky debate and circular discussion more than anything productive.
Put simply, I have no faith and I don't think the "community" could do it. If someone wants to create a new setting, they should do a rough draft alone, get the general vision and guidelines done and then and only then, give others the opportunity to work on it and only one person per field. Two people working on the same racial write up, for instance, is a mistake.
If gamers want to create a brand new campaign setting, the wiki-pages are perfect for that. Just add a link to the wiki-page in a thread in this Future forum, or in the Homebrew forum. It deserves to be here in this Future forum too, because it isnt exactly a homebrew, but a proposal by many gamers for the kind of product theyr looking for. Sorta a like a petition, but a petition thats kinda like a universe.
Making it a collective project helps reduce the burden on any single individual, and more importantly, the project benefits from the interests and expertise of many different kinds of gamers. Many gamers enjoy adding art, others maps, others statistically balanced mechanics, others intreaguing narratives, others diplomacy to coordinate the efforts of competing interests, etc.
It is extremely difficult to get gamers to agree with eachother. But if the collective project enjoys at least a wide base of support, then it will probably do well in the marketplace, and WotC will be able to officially support it. Even if not, it can remain a cult-classic on the website.
That's a nice idea if that's all you want to do with it. Once you put it up, I think you lose the IP rights (though I'm not positive). Being a writer with a campaign setting of my own, I'd prefer not to lose the IP rights to the world several of my stories take place in.
Well, this forum just deleted my reply. So, damn. Oh well.
My short reply is, Design by Committee is a bad idea and fails far more often than it sees a successful completion of a project. When it comes to a community setting project, created by folks on these forums, I'd have to say it would have an even higher failure rate, since the vast majority on here enjoy snarky debate and circular discussion more than anything productive.
Put simply, I have no faith and I don't think the "community" could do it. If someone wants to create a new setting, they should do a rough draft alone, get the general vision and guidelines done and then and only then, give others the opportunity to work on it and only one person per field. Two people working on the same racial write up, for instance, is a mistake.
I've seen complete settings and even game-systems being created in less than a week by a certain Hivemind. I know it can be done.
Well, this forum just deleted my reply. So, damn. Oh well.
My short reply is, Design by Committee is a bad idea and fails far more often than it sees a successful completion of a project. When it comes to a community setting project, created by folks on these forums, I'd have to say it would have an even higher failure rate, since the vast majority on here enjoy snarky debate and circular discussion more than anything productive.
Put simply, I have no faith and I don't think the "community" could do it. If someone wants to create a new setting, they should do a rough draft alone, get the general vision and guidelines done and then and only then, give others the opportunity to work on it and only one person per field. Two people working on the same racial write up, for instance, is a mistake.
I've seen complete settings and even game-systems being created in less than a week by a certain Hivemind. I know it can be done.
Of course it "can" be done, but the chances are very slim, and it's usually more trouble than it's worth.
Well, as a collective project no individual would really have the exclusive IP rights anyway.
If I understand correctly, posting here in these forums grants WotC permission to use the material, but I think the creators still retain the right to use it themselves independently.
Finally, whether gamers share the IP rights with others by engaging in a collective project, or wait for WotC to make it for them, either way they dont really have exclusive IP rights anyway.
"Being a writer with a campaign setting of my own, I'd prefer not to lose the IP rights to the world several of my stories take place in."
I understand your desire as an author to retain your IP rights.
Unfortunately, by not letting other players playtest your gaming concepts - before you make your financial investments to publish them - you take a greater risk. Moreover, you dont benefit from the collective sensibilities of the D&D community, nor can you meet the specific needs of as many gamers as possible. The success of the project becomes more of a gamble.
For an independent designer who targets the D&D community, to choose whether to share content or not in the forums, is a painful dilemma.
For myself, I am seriously considering investing my time and effort in a 21st-century D&D campaign setting, whose genre is 'modern magic', 'urban fantasy', 'magical realism', maybe even 'paranormal romance'. I would make more money if I kept the project secret. But I would rather have as many players as possible enjoy it by contributing their own desires to it. So, the game itself will end up better by discussing it here. At least, more people will be able to enjoy it better. So I already 'leaked' the idea, and it seems to be gaining a lot popular support. Its taking on a life of its own - as all good collective projects do.
Interestingly, the popular mood seems to prefer actual magic, like the magical realism of The Dresden Files, Charmed, Buffy, Venture Brothers, and so on. As opposed to strict technomancy, where realistically plausible hi-tech becomes indistinguishable from magical effects.
I prefer strict technomancy. The idea, reallife technology can become even better than our wildest dreams, truly fascinates me. But if magical realism appeals to more gamers, thats fine with me. I would enjoy that kind of campaign setting too.
You copywrite your material before you make it public. Otherwise, you will get ripped off. One reason no one has ever, nor will ever, see anything I work on outside of material owned by other companies, like wotc. I have no problem posting work ups for D&D stuff connected to PoL, or another published setting. Then again, I save my "real" work for D&D submissions.
You only use people you know, as playtesters. Not strangers online, unless you wanna get real legal about the process. It's simply not worth it, to me at least. Although, minor work is perfectly fine to make public, to simply get your name out there.
That is a formula for ... Wait! What! Didnt see that coming!
WotC too only uses 'people they know' as playtesters. (Even then WotC has a reputation for ignoring their playtesters.) But this policy of nepotistic playtesting causes much errata later on.
Of course, in an evolving open-system game, there will always be errata. Just like a living body has an immune system. But silly mistakes or design problems because of narrow opinions disrupts the enjoyment of the game.
I dont blame you or other authors for wanting to profit from your good ideas. I just want to point out, sometimes the effort to profit personally from an idea actually compromises the idea, making it less good than it could be.
Legally, anything you write, you own. Whether you formally claim copyright or not.
If anything, these forums actually protect your intellectual property by providing circumstantial (but not airtight) evidence for when and how you expressed your concepts.
Cyber Dave, by the way, your Land of Nod campaign setting looks awesome. The four empires remind me of the four compass points of a mandala. Lilith (angry choleric?) represents leftside, and Terra (melancholy?) is below. Gaia (easy-going phlegmatic?) is rightside, and Eden (self-transcending sanguine?) above. Very archetypical.
Understanding that the company doesn't have any open-calls out for new material; I am still intent on actually completing the project. So, I now turn to my fellow members of the Wizards Community in hope that someone here can help me find something along the lines of what I am looking for.
Thanks in advance
Edit: Reading it over again, it appears he's re-stating something from the Dungeon Master's Guide. So maybe it is Wizards' own world-building assumptions.
Me, I think there's room for a new campaign setting. Heck, I'm rooting for it. First off, there hasn't yet been a 4e D20 modern. We need that. Though it'd be so different as to not so much be a new setting as a whole new ruleset that could be compatable with standard 4e if a DM did want Urban Arcana. I'm also in favor of a new setting contest, like what gave us Eberron. I've been working on a new idea myself:
community.wizards.com/go/thread/view/758...
As far as I know, there hasn't been a fantasy Wild West yet. Now to just decide if Wild Sands or Shifting Sands is the better setting name. The former invokes Wild West more directly to me, but the second mimics the alliteration and better describes the location. Hmm.... decisions, decisions.
its called "dead lands" its pretty much american southwest with magic and undead. Not made by wizards but capatable with 3.0 (had to do some more tweaking for 3.5). never played but found the books.
Underground?
Cloud City.
I'm intrigued, however, to read about the way they introduce all published player races in the setting. Previously, the selection was limited since many races had been wiped out. Of course, as a DM, I will be able to adjust this if I want to, especially since I already know my players would understand. But I see hardly see some races in dark sun ... gnomes for example were wiped out by the Champions of Rajaat during their Cleansing War. We already know that the races will be modified somehow to match the setting's atmosphere; can't wait to see that.
As for the mechanics, we have some information about breaking rules and defiling magic...as with everything else, each DM will study these and see if they suit their setting. There are pros and cons of course as with everything. Let's hope for the best.
It's just too awesome!