Necromancers - Downloaded from the Wizards Community, all coding removed by Solauren

Post/Author/DateTime	Post
#1 draeth Feb 09, 2009 3:44:49	I have just got back into the swing of things, playing one session so far and finding it vastly different to 3.5, which isn't a bad thing. I have mostly played Necromancers. I like controlling the undead and having them do my bidding, rather then me actually fighting. Nothing better then having your minions guard you while you sleep, send them ahead to set off traps, carry things for you...endless possibilities and fun! It has always been my favorite way to play by far, but now everything is so different I don't know where to begin. I have the PHB and my friends have various other books. So, what is now the class that can control / create / summon etc undead who will hopefully stick around a while and do my bidding for me? All help is much appreciated. I also just noticed that the PHB2 will be released soon, does it have a Necromancer in it? Thanks.
#2 klaustheprince Feb 09, 2009 5:36:11	I also just noticed that the PHB2 will be released soon, does it have a Necromancer in it? No. However, to make a necromancer, you can refluff a shaman or a summoner wizard and live happily ever after. ^_^
#3 draeth Feb 09, 2009 5:47:46	What books are those contained in Klaus? I don't see a Summoner Wizard in my PHB and obviously not a Shaman!
#4 Steely_Dan Feb 09, 2009 5:51:25	I also just noticed that the PHB2 will be released soon, does it have a Necromancer in it? No, but people are speculating it will be in the PHB III: a Shadow Leader or Controller, though I think the Illusionist will be the Shadow Controller.
#5 mouthymerc Feb 09, 2009 6:55:46	What books are those contained in Klaus? I don't see a Summoner Wizard in my PHB and obviously not a Shaman! The shaman will be in the upcoming PHB II (next month) and the summoning wizard will be an alternate build for the wizard in the Arcane Power book (the following month).
#6 malisteen Feb 09, 2009 7:09:11	Some basic 4e design philosophy Classes are divided in two ways. The first is 'class role', which is the way the class is supposed to contribute to combat. The rolls are: Defender (job: soak hit point damage) Leader (job: heal and buff) Striker (job: hit point damage & disruption to single enemies) Controler (job: hit point damage and disruption to groups of enemies) Ideally a party will include characters of each role, although each class also has secondary roles to help cover for party gaps. The second way classes are divided is by 'power source', or the fluff for where the class' power derives from. This is more of a thematic divide. The power Sources for classes in the Player's Handbook are: Martial - perfection of the body through training and focus. Divine - magical power derived from a divine patron Arcane - magical power achieved through knowledge of mystic formula The power sources for classes in the Player's Handbook II are: Primal - power drawn from spirits of the natural world Divine Arcane Power sources to be introduced in future players handbooks include: Psionic - perfection of the mind through training and focus Ki - the channeled energy of one's own soul or spirit Elemental - the fundamental power of the primordials Shadow - A dark power drawn from the realm of the dead Note that it's not just the energy itself being manipulated, but the way it is used that defines a power source. Arcane power, for instance, seems to draw at times on elemental or shadow energies, and the knowledge of arcane formula can be learned by making deals with beings from the astral plane (home of the divine). Undead in 4e have been strongly tied to necrotic energy (the new version of negative energy - though without the latter's metaphysical implications), the Shadowfell (the plane that the souls of mortals pass through on their way out of the universe), and the Shadow energy source. One or more 'necromancer' classes that manipulate the undead are sure to be made availagble once the Shadow power source is unveiled. At the moment, however, there are no necromancer type classes. The closest you have is a ritual for creating an undead helper in 'Open Grave' - which otherwise has basically no PC usable content. It is a monster book for DMs, not a player supplement.
#7 mouthymerc Feb 09, 2009 7:16:59	There are a few new rituals in Open Grave, such as Undead Servitor, which would work towards a necromancer feel.
#8 fenris_lathiin Feb 09, 2009 12:05:01	Mouthymerc said what I was going to say before I could say it. Oh well, it's good advice. Also, to expand a bit on the rituals, several of the rituals in the Player's Handbook can be reflavored to be necromantic in nature. Raise Dead is already somewhat necromantic to begin with, and could have some interesting consequences if you wanted it. Unseen Servant and Tenser's Floating Disc can be reflavored to be ghosts bound to serve you when you need them. The various consulting rituals could be reflavored as spirits the Necromancer has made contracts with to act as spies. The same goes for the various scrying rituals: You're not scrying. Instead, you send a ghost, wraith or other creature and you see through their eyes. Conversely, your eye could leave its socket when using a scrying spell, and your eye flies around, getting info. If the rituals allows you to hear as well, your ear leaves with your eye. Rituals like Phantom Steed, Shadow Walk and Speak With Dead are also somewhat necromantic in nature. Necromancy has ties with the Shadowfell (or the plane of Shadow in previous editions), so that's where Shadow Walk ties in. Phantom Steed has you summoning ghost horses and Speak With Dead should be obvious. Further, several of your spells can be reflavored to be necromantic in nature as well. Ghost Sound and Mage Hand could be reflavored as the necromancer's ghost familiar. Also, Magic Missile could be a blot of entropic force, temporarily aging the target or Thunderwave could be screams from beyond. For power selection, you might want to take things that do psychic, force and cold damage, since those are those forces tie into necromancy more than others. You don't have to though, so I wouldn't worry about it. The Cleric has some summoning powers (although they're not exactly what you're looking for). You could look into multiclassing into Cleric and reflavoring the divine servants as undead warriors. Still, I'm not too familiar on the Cleric's powers, so this might not be the best idea. Next, remember that you add half your level to skill and ability checks. Why? Maybe you have some undead grafts that give you great strength for a moment (which is why you add half your level to your strength check), or you can channel the powers of a wraith to make you seem a bit less substantial (which is why you add half your level to stealth). I think it would be cool to explain the reason why you're so good at climbing and running after X levels is not because you're level 15 and add 7 (plus strength) to your Athletics check, but because you can sprout bony climbing claws out of your back that let you climb well or run faster (but can't be used to attack because they're sort of brittle). Remember, part of being a necromancer is mindset. Look at your powers and abilities and wonder "how would a necromancer do this?" And go with that. If your DM throws a fit, well, than he's a dick.

Post/Author/DateTime

Post

draeth

Feb 09, 2009 3:44:49

I have just got back into the swing of things, playing one session so far and finding it vastly different to 3.5, which isn't a bad thing.

I have mostly played Necromancers. I like controlling the undead and having them do my bidding, rather then me actually fighting. Nothing better then having your minions guard you while you sleep, send them ahead to set off traps, carry things for you...endless possibilities and fun! It has always been my favorite way to play by far, but now everything is so different I don't know where to begin. I have the PHB and my friends have various other books.

So, what is now the class that can control / create / summon etc undead who will hopefully stick around a while and do my bidding for me? All help is much appreciated.

I also just noticed that the PHB2 will be released soon, does it have a Necromancer in it?

Thanks.

klaustheprince

Feb 09, 2009 5:36:11

I also just noticed that the PHB2 will be released soon, does it have a Necromancer in it?

No. However, to make a necromancer, you can refluff a shaman or a summoner wizard and live happily ever after. ^_^

draeth

Feb 09, 2009 5:47:46

What books are those contained in Klaus? I don't see a Summoner Wizard in my PHB and obviously not a Shaman!

Steely_Dan

Feb 09, 2009 5:51:25

I also just noticed that the PHB2 will be released soon, does it have a Necromancer in it?

No, but people are speculating it will be in the PHB III: a Shadow Leader or Controller, though I think the Illusionist will be the Shadow Controller.

mouthymerc

Feb 09, 2009 6:55:46

What books are those contained in Klaus? I don't see a Summoner Wizard in my PHB and obviously not a Shaman!

The shaman will be in the upcoming PHB II (next month) and the summoning wizard will be an alternate build for the wizard in the Arcane Power book (the following month).

malisteen

Feb 09, 2009 7:09:11

Some basic 4e design philosophy

Classes are divided in two ways. The first is 'class role', which is the way the class is supposed to contribute to combat. The rolls are:

Defender (job: soak hit point damage)
Leader (job: heal and buff)
Striker (job: hit point damage & disruption to single enemies)
Controler (job: hit point damage and disruption to groups of enemies)

Ideally a party will include characters of each role, although each class also has secondary roles to help cover for party gaps.

The second way classes are divided is by 'power source', or the fluff for where the class' power derives from. This is more of a thematic divide. The power Sources for classes in the Player's Handbook are:

Martial - perfection of the body through training and focus.
Divine - magical power derived from a divine patron
Arcane - magical power achieved through knowledge of mystic formula

The power sources for classes in the Player's Handbook II are:

Primal - power drawn from spirits of the natural world
Divine
Arcane

Power sources to be introduced in future players handbooks include:

Psionic - perfection of the mind through training and focus
Ki - the channeled energy of one's own soul or spirit
Elemental - the fundamental power of the primordials
Shadow - A dark power drawn from the realm of the dead

Note that it's not just the energy itself being manipulated, but the way it is used that defines a power source. Arcane power, for instance, seems to draw at times on elemental or shadow energies, and the knowledge of arcane formula can be learned by making deals with beings from the astral plane (home of the divine).

Undead in 4e have been strongly tied to necrotic energy (the new version of negative energy - though without the latter's metaphysical implications), the Shadowfell (the plane that the souls of mortals pass through on their way out of the universe), and the Shadow energy source. One or more 'necromancer' classes that manipulate the undead are sure to be made availagble once the Shadow power source is unveiled.

At the moment, however, there are no necromancer type classes. The closest you have is a ritual for creating an undead helper in 'Open Grave' - which otherwise has basically no PC usable content. It is a monster book for DMs, not a player supplement.

mouthymerc

Feb 09, 2009 7:16:59

There are a few new rituals in Open Grave, such as Undead Servitor, which would work towards a necromancer feel.

fenris_lathiin

Feb 09, 2009 12:05:01

Mouthymerc said what I was going to say before I could say it. Oh well, it's good advice.

Also, to expand a bit on the rituals, several of the rituals in the Player's Handbook can be reflavored to be necromantic in nature. Raise Dead is already somewhat necromantic to begin with, and could have some interesting consequences if you wanted it. Unseen Servant and Tenser's Floating Disc can be reflavored to be ghosts bound to serve you when you need them. The various consulting rituals could be reflavored as spirits the Necromancer has made contracts with to act as spies. The same goes for the various scrying rituals: You're not scrying. Instead, you send a ghost, wraith or other creature and you see through their eyes. Conversely, your eye could leave its socket when using a scrying spell, and your eye flies around, getting info. If the rituals allows you to hear as well, your ear leaves with your eye.

Rituals like Phantom Steed, Shadow Walk and Speak With Dead are also somewhat necromantic in nature. Necromancy has ties with the Shadowfell (or the plane of Shadow in previous editions), so that's where Shadow Walk ties in. Phantom Steed has you summoning ghost horses and Speak With Dead should be obvious.

Further, several of your spells can be reflavored to be necromantic in nature as well. Ghost Sound and Mage Hand could be reflavored as the necromancer's ghost familiar. Also, Magic Missile could be a blot of entropic force, temporarily aging the target or Thunderwave could be screams from beyond. For power selection, you might want to take things that do psychic, force and cold damage, since those are those forces tie into necromancy more than others. You don't have to though, so I wouldn't worry about it. The Cleric has some summoning powers (although they're not exactly what you're looking for). You could look into multiclassing into Cleric and reflavoring the divine servants as undead warriors. Still, I'm not too familiar on the Cleric's powers, so this might not be the best idea.

Next, remember that you add half your level to skill and ability checks. Why? Maybe you have some undead grafts that give you great strength for a moment (which is why you add half your level to your strength check), or you can channel the powers of a wraith to make you seem a bit less substantial (which is why you add half your level to stealth). I think it would be cool to explain the reason why you're so good at climbing and running after X levels is not because you're level 15 and add 7 (plus strength) to your Athletics check, but because you can sprout bony climbing claws out of your back that let you climb well or run faster (but can't be used to attack because they're sort of brittle).

Remember, part of being a necromancer is mindset. Look at your powers and abilities and wonder "how would a necromancer do this?" And go with that. If your DM throws a fit, well, than he's a dick.