So it's been said there will be a 4th ed Darksun. Anything else? I'd love to see a brand new world myself. Wasn't there a setting that won an award way back when Eberron first came out? I don't think anything has been done with that setting yet.
Myself though I'd love to see a 4th ed Planescape, Ravenloft or Kara-Tur quite possibly.
So it's been said there will be a 4th ed Darksun. Anything else? I'd love to see a brand new world myself. Wasn't there a setting that won an award way back when Eberron first came out? I don't think anything has been done with that setting yet.
Myself though I'd love to see a 4th ed Planescape, Ravenloft or Kara-Tur quite possibly.
Ravenloft and Planescape might get some attention eventually, but they won't get their own settings because they are part of core now. Also, subsettings to a campaign setting won't get their own settings most likely. IIRC Kara-Tur is part of the forgotten realms world. I could be wrong since I only know very little about Kara-tur.
As far as we know the current plan is one setting a year for the lifespan of 4ed. Dark Sun will be next summer. After that we currently do not know but there has been lots of speculation on it. And yes WotC does still own the two runner ups from the contest that Eberron won, so those are possibilities that some people consider likely and others think will never happen(personlly I am betting on the high seas world by the guy who makes Order of the Stick which was one of the runner ups).
(personlly I am betting on the high seas world by the guy who makes Order of the Stick which was one of the runner ups).
I know I've got notes on two campaigns with a swashbuckler/high-seas theme to them.
IIRC Kara-Tur is part of the forgotten realms world. I could be wrong since I only know very little about Kara-tur.
Kara-Tur was it's own "setting" back in the days of AD&D when the original OA was published. It was later shoehorned into the FR like several other independent settings were, but IIRC that didn't happen until 2nd ed. I put setting in quotes because it was a single hardback book with classes, spells, monsters, and very little setting material. Not what one would think of when it comes to a setting publication.
IIRC Kara-Tur is part of the forgotten realms world. I could be wrong since I only know very little about Kara-tur.Kara-Tur was it's own "setting" back in the days of AD&D when the original OA was published. It was later shoehorned into the FR like several other independent settings were, but IIRC that didn't happen until 2nd ed. I put setting in quotes because it was a single hardback book with classes, spells, monsters, and very little setting material. Not what one would think of when it comes to a setting publication.
I didn't remember its 1e days, but for 2e I have Kara-tur eastern realms, Kara-tur monstrous compendium, and the trail map. Not sure if theres more Kara-tur material for 2e, probably. But thats all I managed to get. Was never a big fan of Kara-tur, infact, I'v never even used the material beyond a few monsters from the compendium.
Still, I doubt Kara-tur would get its own setting. If another continent of forgotten realms got a setting, it would probably be Abeir (however you spell it) or Lankhmar, but I doubt it. Too many other settings to release for 4e before wotc starts publishing subsettings. (other continents in the same setting)
So there is no word of a possible Planescape 4th ed? I'm not terribly interested in Dark Sun myself.
So there is no word of a possible Planescape 4th ed? I'm not terribly interested in Dark Sun myself.
Planescape has been made part of the core setting, i.e. we will likely NEVER see any specifically branded items. What we are seeing instead are books like Manual of the Planes, Plane Below, and Plane Above. The city of Sigil was in DMG 2 and Manual of the Planes.
Most of the meta-settings, such as Spelljammer, Ravenloft, and Planescape, seem to be sharing this fate. Ravenloft has been popping up in Dragon and Dungeon though.
Well, I think the Dragonlance fans would love to see a 4E treatment. But personally, now that I have Dark Sun. Whatever WoTC want's to do is fine with me.
Well, I think the Dragonlance fans would love to see a 4E treatment. But personally, now that I have Dark Sun. Whatever WoTC want's to do is fine with me.
I know I would, but that certainly shouldn't stop WotC from looking at new settings. Though, to me and practically everyone that did not play 2E (though I did, just not an official setting), Dark Sun is a new setting.
Well, I think the Dragonlance fans would love to see a 4E treatment. But personally, now that I have Dark Sun. Whatever WoTC want's to do is fine with me.
I know I would, but that certainly shouldn't stop WotC from looking at new settings. Though, to me and practically everyone that did not play 2E (though I did, just not an official setting), Dark Sun is a new setting.
Dark Sun has been around since the 90s or so. Its not new but I can see why it would be new to you. See to me? I never played Planescape or Kara Tur or Ravenloft. ALL of those are new to me. I hardly ever played Dragonlance either. My D&D experiences is mostly homebrew worlds with sporadic campaings that always died off before we reached true greatness.
Well, at the very least we know this:
1) Ravenloft - Highly unlikely, at least anytime in the foreseeable future. Domains of Dread are part of the Shadowfell, thus they are considered core. Receiving Dragon write ups. A remote possibility, but not any time soon.
2) Planescape - Is core and will not ever be it's own setting. Will likely see future product(s) that deal with Sigil though, just not as it's own stand alone setting. From Bill Slavicsek in the current design & Dev article: "This was fun to put together, and I can't wait for us to find a product to devote more fully to the City of Doors. Planar adventuring is part of the core D&D experience now and not a separate campaign, and products such as Manual of the Planes, The Plane Below: Secrets of the Elemental Chaos, and The Plane Above: Secrets of the Astral Seaall help expand play beyond the natural world. I'm sure we'll tackle Sigil in a larger manner when the time is right."
3) Dragonlance - Not too long ago when Dark Sun was announced the devs made a comment that some settings were too "generic fantasy" to do a setting for it since they already have the FR and they want to devote their time to doing settings that push the boundaries of a setting. The list included Greyhawk, Dragonlance, and Maztica. So any of those are a slim prospect to see it as the annual setting any time in the foreseeable future. Remote possibility, but may see the light day sometime. I wouldn't expect it for a few years at least.
4) Kara-Tur/OA - nothing to go on here. Once they decide what they want to do with eastern flavored classes, it may be a possibility. Any OA setting would likely be Kara-Tur since that's their original setting. Whether it would specifically be tied to the FR or not would remain to be seen, but woudl be likely since the FR books mention Kara-Tur. So if they want it to be its own setting, they'd need to make an original one.
5) Spelljammer - Is in core. Another highly unlikely candidate.
I would say a new setting or two may be the most likely candidates for the near future. As others have pointed out in other speculation threads, WotC is still sitting on the two runner-up settings from the contest that Eberron won. Since they were looking for something that broke the mold in that contest, they could be good candidates. They could always hold a contest again.
the only settings they published hat i can think of off the top of my head that haven't been mentioned by anything or folded into core is Birthright or Al Quaddim. Although didn't AQ get folded into the FR also?
Personally, it would be interesting to see an official Abeir-based product (even if only a series of articles).
Show us what the rest of the "other world" is like, and how it reacted to the changes brought about by the Spellplague. Show us how Maztica reacted to being dropped into a whole new world.
3) Dragonlance - Not too long ago when Dark Sun was announced the devs made a comment that some settings were too "generic fantasy" to do a setting for it since they already have the FR and they want to devote their time to doing settings that push the boundaries of a setting. The list included Greyhawk, Dragonlance, and Maztica. So any of those are a slim prospect to see it as the annual setting any time in the foreseeable future. Remote possibility, but may see the light day sometime. I wouldn't expect it for a few years at least.
This I disagree with. Yes the designers mentioned that their motives in pursuing Dark Sun for 2010 was to push past the boundries of typical generic fantasy, but they shouldn't try doing that every year. D&D is the most iconic fantasy RPG on the market. Many new players are likely to expect generic fantasy, and WotC needs to occasionally live up to those expectations. Yes the non-setting books are written from such a generic mind set, but they lack a depth to their fluff, making them a bit too generic. After two years of pushing the boundaries, possibly three depending on how extreme one's opinion of post Spellpaglue Faerun is, I think that 2011 would be more than due for something of a more traditional fantasy setting.
3) Dragonlance - Not too long ago when Dark Sun was announced the devs made a comment that some settings were too "generic fantasy" to do a setting for it since they already have the FR and they want to devote their time to doing settings that push the boundaries of a setting. The list included Greyhawk, Dragonlance, and Maztica. So any of those are a slim prospect to see it as the annual setting any time in the foreseeable future. Remote possibility, but may see the light day sometime. I wouldn't expect it for a few years at least.
This I disagree with. Yes the designers mentioned that their motives in pursuing Dark Sun for 2010 was to push past the boundries of typical generic fantasy, but they shouldn't try doing that every year. D&D is the most iconic fantasy RPG on the market. Many new players are likely to expect generic fantasy, and WotC needs to occasionally live up to those expectations. Yes the non-setting books are written from such a generic mind set, but they lack a depth to their fluff, making them a bit too generic. After two years of pushing the boundaries, possibly three depending on how extreme one's opinion of post Spellpaglue Faerun is, I think that 2011 would be more than due for something of a more traditional fantasy setting.
Maybe so but if it's another wanna be Tolkien-esq ripoff fantasy I'm going to puke my guts out.
Maybe so but if it's another wanna be Tolkien-esq ripoff fantasy I'm going to puke my guts out.
Tolkien-esq ripoff fantasy is one of the founding principles of the entire D&D franchise. That's why the only consistent heroic races in all editions are humans, dwarves (mine dwelling warriors no less), elves (forest dwelling mage lords until splitting into two races in 4e), and hobbits (er...um...halfings rather, but only because of copy right law). It's also why the primary antagonists at low levels have always been orcs and various types of goblins.
I'm rooting for dragonlance, which is only "generic fantasy" in the eyes of people who don't know the setting first hand. Mystara would be another fun setting to have for 4e.
Maybe so but if it's another wanna be Tolkien-esq ripoff fantasy I'm going to puke my guts out.
Tolkien-esq ripoff fantasy is one of the founding principles of the entire D&D franchise. That's why the only consistent heroic races in all editions are humans, dwarves (mine dwelling warriors no less), elves (forest dwelling mage lords until splitting into two races in 4e), and hobbits (er...um...halfings rather, but only because of copy right law). It's also why the primary antagonists at low levels have always been orcs and various types of goblins.
And? That doesn't mean it has to be redone a gazillion times. It also used to be most heros were white, or only men. There is no need to stick to Tolkien-esq ripoffs anymore. If you want to appeal to more players you need to not always do Tolkien style fantasy.
I'm rooting for dragonlance, which is only "generic fantasy" in the eyes of people who don't know the setting first hand.
That's all nice and dandy but I asked to be convinced to give the setting a chance by the fans and they didn't give me any strong enough reason for me to invest time in it.There were a few races I was somewhat interested in (shapeshifting elves who turn into seals!) but those were mostly bit players not main races.
It might not be 'generic fantasy' but it sure looks like it at first glance, and that's not really good marketing if you can't distinguish yourself right off the bat.
Dragonlance also lack unique races that could get a write up and nothing to make a class (or a half-class at least).
So I don't honestly think we'll see it that soon. I'm not saying never but unlikely to be the setting following Dark Sun.
I'd love to see the Iomandra setting Chris Perkins created over on the community group section myself.
I don't know where it would fit in, but Dragonlance did have the Noble class in 3.5
Still don't want to see it. I would prefer it to Greyhawk, but I'd like to see a new campaign first.
Dragonlance also lack unique races that could get a write up and nothing to make a class (or a half-class at least).So I don't honestly think we'll see it that soon. I'm not saying never but unlikely to be the setting following Dark Sun.
To be fair, if what they have said about Dark Sun is to be seen as applying to future settings as well, a setting doesn't need to have full classes unique to the setting to be a viable setting. The devs have said that therer will be what amounts to a new build for some classes, but no new classes. One could assume that the same thing could be said for races as well. We haven't seen variant races yet, but that doesn't mean it can't be done.
This means that the "generics" can get setting info done as well. However I agree that it likely won't be anytime soon.
Man, I just hope that if they do use Dragonlance, they tone down the horribly flat, stereotype personalities of the Little Races. What was funny and amusing while reading the books as a kid has become surprisingly repetitive and insulting now that I've grown up, and my nose starts to curl every time I have to encounter kender, tinker gnomes, gully dwarves and the like.
And? That doesn't mean it has to be redone a gazillion times. It also used to be most heros were white, or only men. There is no need to stick to Tolkien-esq ripoffs anymore. If you want to appeal to more players you need to not always do Tolkien style fantasy.
Yeup, and I agree that it would be a mistake to release nothing but Tolkienesq ripoff settings, but if you really want to appeal to the most players possible you also have to fall back on it every now and again too. Furthermore, it's not as though Tolkien clones is what WotC has been releasing as of late. Eberron and Dark Sun make two distinctly non-Tolkien style settings in a row, and given the destructive effects of the spellplague the new realms could be considered Tolkien gone wrong. For me 2011 will be the perfect time to stop pushing boundaries and give everyone's imagination a chance to relax with a more traditional style setting such Greyhawk, Dragonlance, Mysteria, or even something new but with a classical feel.
Dragonlance also lack unique races that could get a write up and nothing to make a class (or a half-class at least).So I don't honestly think we'll see it that soon. I'm not saying never but unlikely to be the setting following Dark Sun.
To be fair, if what they have said about Dark Sun is to be seen as applying to future settings as well, a setting doesn't need to have full classes unique to the setting to be a viable setting. The devs have said that therer will be what amounts to a new build for some classes, but no new classes. One could assume that the same thing could be said for races as well. We haven't seen variant races yet, but that doesn't mean it can't be done.This means that the "generics" can get setting info done as well. However I agree that it likely won't be anytime soon.
True but if you look at FR the variant dwarf and Elf racesd were done as feat and fluff, so as long as the new variant has the same mechanic it won't get a full write up.
Though I concede the point for no need of a full class, but Dark Sun is certainly more suited to specific build for existing classes than Dragonlance. At best I'd see a spellscar -type half class.
Much of what Dragon9 wrote about Planescape has also been said about Ravenloft. It really is now part of the core concept. They may have horror-heavy adventures or additional undead rulebooks, but it would be unexpected to see Ravenloft as a setting. The Vistani articles are an example of Ravenloft lore being treated as core.
If I were a betting man, I would say Dragonlance could see some love at some point. Spelljammer is being treated as core, and I don't see the other options (such as Birthright) having enough of a fan base to see treatment. A new world is my bet after DS.
But, anything is subject to change. The new race books coming out are already a fair departure from the original ideas being said by designers that all books would be applicable to all gamers. Anyone not intending to pla a Dragonborn has really few reasons to purchase that book. And I can't see most gamers buying every race book. This is a case where DDI is likely the big win for most gamers over buying the splatbook.
It could be that a year from now they look back and decide to flesh out FR, Eberron, and DS with more content. This might shore up fan interest rather than spread it thin.
True but if you look at FR the variant dwarf and Elf racesd were done as feat and fluff, so as long as the new variant has the same mechanic it won't get a full write up.
Most of a race's FULL write up is fluff. So if a setting specific variant is sufficiently different from default then it warrants at least a half page of fluff, per race. Also, the concept of racial variants through feats could be expanded to from a single feat as in FR to something more like the bloodlines that have been presented in Dragon magazine.
Problem is, in a nutshell, that Dragonlance is the embodiment of so much of the stuff DnD left behind on the move to 4th edition.
It's Tanis being held back from confronting Raistlin, because "He's a wizard! You can't fight him!"
It's the world being based, nay, built around the dichotomy of good and evil, pick a side, that's what you are.
It's the spell towers dividing the world into the mages and the mundanes, and the only thing that prevents the former from overwhelming the latter with their limitless power is their need for sleep.
It's the entire metaphysical system telling you what you can do, with black hats, white hats, and wishy washy red hats being mechanically different due to their personalities and ethics.
It's a world of people More Important Than You, where any age is going to be filled with NPCs of huge plot importance, and where the story canon lurks behind the DM's shoulder at every turn.
It's half the iconic party standing in awe of a 1st level spell, wondering how the mage accomplished such an "amazing" feat.
It's a collection of new races defined by their stupidity, their idiotic catastrophes, or their complete disruption of the party.
And most importantly, it's a deep abyss of canon material. Dragonlance has, according to the wiki count, 190 novels. It spans centuries. It's traced the world. If it is reborn for 4th edition, it will either repeat information everyone already knows, or require a reboot the likes of which will set its fans into fits of nerd rage. The different ages do not play alike, and fans of one section of its history will hate if the book centers on another portion of the timeline. Ask three fans about when you would like the novel to take place, and what books should be canon for establishing the setting, and you'll get five opinions about what should be done, what state the gods should be in, and which novels helped or hurt the setting as a whole.
Maybe Dragonlance should come back. But considering the nearly 200 volumes of material it already has, I hope it doesn't return very soon, because with a single setting a year, I would vastly prefer something new be born. 'Lance has plenty of text to work with as it is, it's time for something new.
Personally, I'm rooting for Birthright. Maybe not in 2011, but eventually. It's not Tolkienesque, it's more medieval/renessaince fantasy. And it has several regions specifically geared for the high seas fantasy that some (like me) are wanting. Plus it already has Awnsheigh and Ersheigh as EDs waiting to happen, and Demigod fits better in Birthright than any other setting, since some PCs literally had the blood of a god in their veins.
I'm rooting for dragonlance, which is only "generic fantasy" in the eyes of people who don't know the setting first hand.
I asked to be convinced to give the setting a chance by the fans and they didn't give me any strong enough reason for me to invest time in it.
First, I don't believe in convincing anyone of anything if they are against it, even alittle. I'd rather them make up their own minds as long as they know the facts. But, I'll play along even though I'm tired and ask, what do you consider strong enough reasons to invest time in a setting? How completely different does a setting have to be, to be worth your time? (honest question)
There were a few races I was somewhat interested in (shapeshifting elves who turn into seals!) but those were mostly bit players not main races.
In 3.5 atleast, sea elves were playable races. Although not many DM's feel comfortable with running underwater adventures, which is a shame. The Sea elves are a very cool race, although I'v never played one.
It might not be 'generic fantasy' but it sure looks like it at first glance, and that's not really good marketing if you can't distinguish yourself right off the bat.
Well, if people only judge books by their covers, they will miss out on some of the best stories ever written. Dragonlance has tons of unique aspects to it. But those aspects don't matter if they are not enjoyed.
Dragonlance also lack unique races that could get a write up and nothing to make a class (or a half-class at least).
See, this is where I disagree. Darksun will not be providing new classes, other settings introduce very few races and wotc has already snatched one of dragonlances unique races. The Minotaur, although its not the DL minotaur. The culture is very different. DL also has aghar (gully dwarves), kender and half kender, which are as different from standard D&D halflings as darksun halflings are, only in different ways. Draconians, which is where dragonborn came from (IMO) but still, Draconians are different from Dragonborn in the same way Elves are different from Drow. Tarmaks are an interesting race, Irda, Sea Elves, Centaurs, and Ogres. All playable races in DL and using unique cultures which seperates them from the norm. There are other races normally found only as monsters that could be converted for 4e into playable races, like thanoi for instance. The mad gnomes are also a ton of fun to play, as they invent things that do not blow up in their faces.
As for classes, we have the noble and mariner and master. Prestige classes can be converted and DL has tons and tons of those. Dragonriders and Dragonhighlords and Tinkerers are but a few. The religious classes, holy orders, offers tons of options. The wizards of high sorcery, knights of solamnia and neraka and the legion of steel are more organizations that can provide new builds instead of new classes, while also offering new paragon paths and epic destinies.
So I don't honestly think we'll see it that soon. I'm not saying never but unlikely to be the setting following Dark Sun.
I agree, we will probably not be getting DL in the next few years. I believe we will be getting something new after DS. But DL has a huge fanbase and is a very fun world to play in. So I am sure that it will eventually get its time in the spotlight. Especially since wotc will make money off a 4e DL setting.
Bolded my replies.
Gotta chime in here.
Problem is, in a nutshell, that Dragonlance is the embodiment of so much of the stuff DnD left behind on the move to 4th edition.
It's Tanis being held back from confronting Raistlin, because "He's a wizard! You can't fight him!"
Tanis was never held back for that reason, and when Tanis did say something to raistlin, raistlin would consider it, even if he discarded it. It was sturm that was constantly restrained by the others as raistlin constantly insulted and mocked him. Tanis and Raistlin actually respected each other a lot, even if they didn't like each other some of the time.
It's the world being based, nay, built around the dichotomy of good and evil, pick a side, that's what you are.
This is not true. Almost every single hero in DL has gone through a "self discovery" phase, where they atleast considered the other side of the alignment spectrum. Thats the thing about DL that many people don't know if they havnt been seriously into the setting. DL alignment is not so black and white. The heroes and villains are not cookie cutter characters either. Villains in DL can and often do have honor and show respect and even compassion, while heroes can be corrupt, filled with self doubt, making many mistakes or straight out turning on their allies.
It's the spell towers dividing the world into the mages and the mundanes, and the only thing that prevents the former from overwhelming the latter with their limitless power is their need for sleep.
This is also not true. The orders of high sorcery are a part of the world and have learned hard lessons in their history. They don't care about overwhelming or controlling, they are only concerned with the preservation, protection and purity of focused magic on krynn and they act as guardians against ambient magic (wild/primal) sorcery, which caused massive devastation back in the days of the scions.
It's the entire metaphysical system telling you what you can do, with black hats, white hats, and wishy washy red hats being mechanically different due to their personalities and ethics.
Actully, the orders represent their gods, and the gods of magic each have different ways of doing things, but share, as do their followers, a common goal. The preservation, protection and purity of focused magic. Schools of magic don't really exist in 4e, so that aspect of the setting probably wouldn't survive a conversion. Then again, each order could offer seperate builds for the base classes, which could offer different things. Also, you have more freedom within the orders than you might think.
It's a world of people More Important Than You, where any age is going to be filled with NPCs of huge plot importance, and where the story canon lurks behind the DM's shoulder at every turn.
The important characters in the world are the characters, not the npc's and any npc that is important, is important because they support the characters. Also, in DL, canon is no more important than it is in any other setting. Anyone can stick to canon in any setting and allow novels to dictate what is or isn't in the game, thats up to the DM and players and is not the failings of the setting, only the people playing it.
It's half the iconic party standing in awe of a 1st level spell, wondering how the mage accomplished such an "amazing" feat.
That is a tool for storytelling and has no bearing in the game. A commoner will be amazed at anything extraordinary, be it a wizards cantrip, a knights sword throwing ability or a clerics ability to heal. But in a game, PC's and most NPC's wouldn't blink at the use of those powers.
It's a collection of new races defined by their stupidity, their idiotic catastrophes, or their complete disruption of the party.
You seem to only focus on the negative and ignore the exceptions. 1, gully dwarves have characteristics no one else has, like superior survival skills, heightened cunning and pretty darn good rogue skills. In 4e, a gully dwarf would not incur any penalties, so they wouldn't be "stupid", mechanically. If a gully dwarf in 4e is stupid, its flavor and nothing else. Also, kender are not all the same, regardless of how authors write them as in novels. Tas is only a single kender. Yes, they all share many characteristics, but how a kender acts is up to the person playing it, not the novels. If players cannot get over a stereotype found in a novel, thats not the settings fault. Believe it or not, but you can play an evil kender who does not suffer from wanderlust, nor does it throw comical taunts at players or absent mindedly pocket anything it notices.
And most importantly, it's a deep abyss of canon material. Dragonlance has, according to the wiki count, 190 novels. It spans centuries. It's traced the world.
The important information to the setting can be included without requiring more than a few pages for a brief timeline. The rest is flavor and can be left out.
If it is reborn for 4th edition, it will either repeat information everyone already knows, or require a reboot the likes of which will set its fans into fits of nerd rage.
It will repeat information like eberron or darksun does. Nothing more, nothing less. It wouldn't require a reboot because you don't have to fit 200 novels worth of "fluff" into a rules book. Include the important info, leave out the rest.
The different ages do not play alike, and fans of one section of its history will hate if the book centers on another portion of the timeline. Ask three fans about when you would like the novel to take place, and what books should be canon for establishing the setting, and you'll get five opinions about what should be done, what state the gods should be in, and which novels helped or hurt the setting as a whole.
As it is with any group of fans from any setting. Also, the different ages are no more required than the different ages in forgotten realms. Progression would be the best thing, as the newest time periods offer the most playable options. You seem to be coming down on dragonlance fans a bit harshly, they are no different from any other fans of another setting. I'v not seen more rational, mature or understanding fans in eberron, darksun or forgotten realms. They're all capable of the same amounts of emotion and responses.
Maybe Dragonlance should come back. But considering the nearly 200 volumes of material it already has, I hope it doesn't return very soon, because with a single setting a year, I would vastly prefer something new be born. 'Lance has plenty of text to work with as it is, it's time for something new.
I agree we need something that truely showcases all of what 4e is capable of. But, DL, with its massive amount of information to support it, will possibly produce a really great 4e setting. There will always be naysayers and people afraid of what might be, but that didn't stop forgotten realms or eberron. Its not stopping darksun and I bet, in time, dragonlance (a very popular and high selling game and novel line) will get its chance.
Bolded my replies.
I played through the Dragonlance series in the 1st edition. I cannot say I enjoyed it much, but on the other hand I thought the overarching plot and theme very heroic and noble.
What is wrong with having a story where good is clearly good and triumphs over evil? Eberron and Dark Sun are designed for the lovers of pulp fantasy, film noir and steam punk. I would like a world designed for lovers of mediaeval epic, Tolkien and Narnia. (The weirdness of the spellscar seems to me to be an attempt to make the Forgotten Realms darker and more aberrant.)
That said, I would probably not run a Dragonlance campaign. I will just keep running variants of the Holy Roman Empire and Europe in my games. (Granbretan, Byzantium, the Crusades and such variations.)
Undrave said:
That's all nice and dandy but I asked to be convinced to give the setting a chance by the fans and they didn't give me any strong enough reason for me to invest time in it.There were a few races I was somewhat interested in (shapeshifting elves who turn into seals!) but those were mostly bit players not main races.
The shapeshifting elves turned into dolphins and sea otters (not seals, though that would be awesome). The dark elf versions turn into sharks and manta rays.
There is the Ursoi (humanoid bear), Thanoi (humanoid walrus), Kyrie (humanoid bird), Slig (medium sized kobolds), Wendle Centaur (medium sized centaur with boney plates on their chest), Shadowfolk (bat...cat... psionic humanoids), Tayling and Taylang (fraternal twins where one looks like an elf, the other looks like a furry ogre), Phaethon (half-elves with fiery wings), ten different types of Draconians all with different abilities (though now they are core, though the core only will have eight), Irda (ogres before they became ugly, very good spellcasters, and they come in several variants as well), yrasda (waterborn ogre spellcasters).
BTW, why does a setting need to have all new main races? Doesn't that just detract from the PHBs?
They need to make a new new campaign setting first.
If there's a Dragonlance setting I clearly won't be getting it, as it doesn't offer much in the way of anything new as a campaign setting. It remains better as just a bunch of novels.
Are there any races with burrowing in DL? Cause if so, that would be freaking AWESOME!
Play a Furry Footed Burrower!
To play devil's advocate, these days a campaign setting gets two books. For DL, the nature of those books could be changed. You could have a player book that includes a bit more on setting and then have the campaign book be more of an adventure book, similar to Against the Giants. I always thought DL played best as a run through the stories, and those adventures could be improved to place the PCs a bit more in the spotlight. Just saying, it could work and be fun.
*Duke says things defending Dragonlance*
These are the best things I've ever seen Duke say. =D
From WotC comments,. I don't think Dragonlanbce will quickly make a 4th ed setting. It looks too much like FR, Greyhawk, etc - too much 'normal fantasy'.
I think Kara-Tur or Al-Qadim have a better chance, or even ''Modern D&D'.
Of course, everything depends on marketing - if there is a demand, it will be made. If otoh the DL novels continue to sell without a setting, then it may not be.
Gomez
I think Kara-Tur or Al-Qadim have a better chance, or even ''Modern D&D'.
IMO the existence of Dark Sun nixes the idea of Al-Quadim for a very long time. I personally think we'll see a generic-fantasy-appearing setting (may not be Dragonlance) before we get another desert-themed setting (which from the little I've read, Al-Quadim definitely fits the desert-theme).
The thing is Hasbro has decided in their infinite wisdom that Wizards will not be selling novels not based on an "active" game line and so Dragonlance novels come to an end this year. As they sell too well to be left in that state for long a Dragonlance setting is inevitable.
I can see them leaving it fallow for a year or three to rework things and create a strong demand. But unlike the other generic settings Dragonlance WILL come sooner or later.
And Dragonlance is unique anyway. It's the setting about WAR. You just need to emphasize it more.
Players buy players book for new mechanical options, even if they like the fluff.
So on a buisness standpoint anything they want to bring out gotta have good 4e compatible mechanics in good enough quantity to entice players. If Dark Sun is not going to have a unique class, it won't surprise me that it going to have ways to modify a class to fit the themes of Dark Sun and its unique style.
Race a very essential part of that mechanical package, even when its just two or three. Races are pretty easy to come up with too.
Dragonlance seems ot have lots of cool race but they also don't seem to be the main characters of the stories that often compared to humans, gnomes, kender and gully dwarves, so its hard to tell which ones would be chosen as iconic races.
I can understand wanting to tap that Dragonlance fan market but it seems to be something troublesome to convert so I think WotC will prioritize something they KNOW they can turn into a 3 book release.
On the other hand the idea of making Dragonlance a sort of Revenge of the Giant type big book sounds interesting. Adventuring in Dragonlance honestly seems more fun than creating Dragonlance characters :p
And Dragonlance is unique anyway. It's the setting about WAR. You just need to emphasize it more.
Birthright is also the setting about WAR. 
Pshaw, Birthright is the setting of POLITICAL ONE-UPMANSHIP!
Dragonlance seems ot have lots of cool race but they also don't seem to be the main characters of the stories that often compared to humans, gnomes, kender and gully dwarves, so its hard to tell which ones would be chosen as iconic races.
Well, going off the older novels, humans, elves, halfelves, halflings (kender) and hill dwarves were the most commonly read about heroes. Gnomes and gully dwarves have been uncommon and sea elves have been rare. Draconians are very common as bad guys, but only a few novels have them as "heroic".
The cultures are the most iconic (IMO), but beyond the standard D&D races, Kender, Minotaurs, Ogres and Draconians are iconic dragonlance races. Irda are DL unique, but not quite as well known as kender or draconians. What races wotc will include in 4e DL is hard to say. Everything can be done with feats, to change up existing core races, but sea elves and irda could get their own write ups. Then again, if wotc wanted to, they could again just use feats for sea elves. But Irda are not elves or eladrin, so they'd probably be one of the races, if included at all.
I can understand wanting to tap that Dragonlance fan market but it seems to be something troublesome to convert so I think WotC will prioritize something they KNOW they can turn into a 3 book release.
As a DL fan, I know a bit about the novel fluff and I say it wouldn't be any harder converting DL to 4e than it was for forgotten realms or darksun. You can sum up 200+ novels worth of fluff in the timeline, which could take as many pages as the timelines in the current campaign settings. For example, you don't have to go into detail about anything, just list a summed up version with a date. Like the minotaur invasion of silvanesti or the rise of the solamnia empire. No need for detail. Just include the important points and leave out the rest. Just like we see in the FR timeline and fluff. DL can be a 3 book release, easily.
On the other hand the idea of making Dragonlance a sort of Revenge of the Giant type big book sounds interesting. Adventuring in Dragonlance honestly seems more fun than creating Dragonlance characters :p
Not sure I follow you on the "creating dragonlance characters" aspect. If you mean, setting specific characters, like you find in ANY setting, then I don't see a problem. If you mean characters found in the novels, you can still do that if you want to, although I'v never played a novel character in an adventure. I'v played the war of the lance and no one played the characters from the novels. You don't have to, never had to unless you wanted to, like any other setting. Thats like people only playing the heroes of the hall in FR.
As for making a super adventure for DL. I'd be happy with that, if that was the adventure book and didn't take away from the PG or CG.
Bolded my replies. I'd also like to see a 4e mystara, which is a very interesting setting.
Draconians won't be a 4e Dragonlance Race. They're set to be evil monsters, corrupted Metallic dragons fused with humanoids or something, created from evil magic. That's not condusive to a Player race at ALL.
If a Dragonlance book comes out, I'd like to know what race would qualify, and Sea Elves don't do it for me - they've already said no more x Elves. Centaurs neither - too build, too non-humanoid, too many difficulties of balance.
Kender maybe, if they can differentiate them enough. Gully Dwarves I don't see as being an actual race, just a feat set like the Moon Elf and Sun Elf feats.
Maybe the race could be the half ogre
Metallic draconians have always been villains, no big change there, even in DL, using one required you to either change its alignment or play a bad guy. But there are still playable draconians that DL can offer, by way of the chromatic draconians. lightning, vapor, venom, frost, flame. Which are good aligned.
But Draconians already share too much thematical space with Dragonborn for two player races. I would assume if a 4e Dragonlance was made, Player Draconians would just be eaten by Dragonborn, and Draconians would exist solely as monsters as described in the Draconomicon 2.
But Draconians already share too much thematical space with Dragonborn for two player races. I would assume if a 4e Dragonlance was made, Player Draconians would just be eaten by Dragonborn, and Draconians would exist solely as monsters as described in the Draconomicon 2.
In my conversion materials for DL 4e, I will be making a subset of feats that allow a Dragonborn player to give their character abilities that are similar to the Draconian. Dragonborn themselves would be the second generation and further of Draconians.
As for the races, I wouldn't be opposed to Sea Elves, since this would be three years from the last elven race, and Dragonlance doesn't have Drow. Goblinoids would be something cool to see, as would the centaur (perhaps the smaller Wendle Centaur variant). Half-ogres are way too easily written off as the Goliath or Half-Orc.
Except Dragonlance would have Drow. One of the core 4e themes is that all races and classes are transmutable and fit in every setting.
So even though Dragonborn and Tieflings weren't in Eberron in the past, they found a place in 4e. Same goes for Drow in Dragonlance. They'd be retconned in with the 4e version of the setting.
I REALLY don't see room for Sea Elves. If you want to play an aquatic race, play Watersoul or Causticsoul Genasi, or else we need a new aquatic race as we expand options. But new x Elves aren't the way to do that. That would be recreating the wheel, which isn't a good idea.
Well so far there's been the Realms and Eberron reintroduced for 4e. Dark Sun sees the light of day again next year and word has it that Dragonlance will be making an appearence as well. But I agree with some of the older posts in that D&D is in need of something new. I myself, as with probably quite a few other gamers, have been designing my own setting for 4e. It's something new and different with a bit of a twist of familiarirty that makes it challenging not only for the PC's, but for the DM as well. However, I think that if WotC put something new out, it would be a huge hit and might even get some of those people who're 'anti-4e' to get into it just to see what the new setting was all about. Who knows what'll happen, Wizards has said time & time again that big plans are being made - I guess we'll just have to wait.
But Draconians already share too much thematical space with Dragonborn for two player races. I would assume if a 4e Dragonlance was made, Player Draconians would just be eaten by Dragonborn, and Draconians would exist solely as monsters as described in the Draconomicon 2.
Even if they aren't mugged by Dragonborn, WotC would almost certainly wait for Dragonlance to release them IMO. It may be in a PHB the same year (e.g. Shifters), but I doubt it will be in PHB3.
word has it that Dragonlance will be making an appearence as well.
What word? Because after the "Dragonlance for 2010" people convinced me it actually might have been true, I'm ignoring randoms from the board from now on.
Dark Sun sees the light of day again next year and rumor has it that Dragonlance will be making an appearence as well.
Fixed that for ya.
Dark Sun sees the light of day again next year and rumor has it that Dragonlance will be making an appearence as well.
Fixed that for ya.
Even calling it a rumor is pretty strong. Beyond the Draconians appearing in the Draconomicon 2 (perhaps a DL dragon in the Hall of Fame similar to Draconomicon 1), plus pseudo-Krynnish Minotaurs in PHB3, there won't be anything from Dragonlance until 2011 at the absolute earliest. If something substantial showed up in 2010, it would surprise the hell out of me.
On the subject of Sea Elves appearing in the DLPG, it would be three years minimum after the last elven race, I doubt WotC would see too much of a problem with that, especially since the Drow isn't present on Krynn. And on the subject of shoe-horning Drow and Orcs into the DL setting, DL has done just fine for the past quarter century without them, why change that now. I would be just as upset about WotC shoveling stuff that does not belong into the DL setting as others would be about shoveling stuff that does not belong into Dark Sun or otherwise. Now, if they made an article in Dragon about how to fit Drow into the setting in the same way they made articles about how to fit Genasi into Eberron and Warforged into Forgotten Realms, I would be okay with that. But they don't belong in the hardbound.
Not sure I follow you on the "creating dragonlance characters" aspect. If you mean, setting specific characters, like you find in ANY setting, then I don't see a problem. If you mean characters found in the novels, you can still do that if you want to, although I'v never played a novel character in an adventure. I'v played the war of the lance and no one played the characters from the novels. You don't have to, never had to unless you wanted to, like any other setting. Thats like people only playing the heroes of the hall in FR.
As for making a super adventure for DL. I'd be happy with that, if that was the adventure book and didn't take away from the PG or CG..
I just meant that I think Dragonlance would make for a much better Campaign Setting Guide than a Player's Guide book. The potential mechanical options just don't seem very exciting.
Not sure I follow you on the "creating dragonlance characters" aspect. If you mean, setting specific characters, like you find in ANY setting, then I don't see a problem. If you mean characters found in the novels, you can still do that if you want to, although I'v never played a novel character in an adventure. I'v played the war of the lance and no one played the characters from the novels. You don't have to, never had to unless you wanted to, like any other setting. Thats like people only playing the heroes of the hall in FR.
As for making a super adventure for DL. I'd be happy with that, if that was the adventure book and didn't take away from the PG or CG..
I just meant that I think Dragonlance would make for a much better Campaign Setting Guide than a Player's Guide book. The potential mechanical options just don't seem very exciting.
At this point in time, I agree. Of course, just like the Drow in the FRPG, we could see a race that is pretty much universal to all campaigns appear in the DLPG. The Dark Sun PG is already showing us that a new class isn't a guarantee, so not seeing a class isn't going to be that unusual. There are a lot of organizations in DL that could be given pseudo-classes of some sort (I am making the Wizard of High Sorcery a "weapon talent" class, in so far that it is four feats with power swaps). Wizards hasn't failed us yet with showing us that they can come up with new stuff.
Genasi are mentioned in the actual Eberron material. They're just rare, and weren't traditionally in the setting, so they got a small mention instead of a major race mention (they're in the other races section).
There was an article about putting them in Eberron or Warforged in the Realms, but that was to get one more involved and a focus in the setting.
Drow don't need to take centre stage, but they need to be able to have a place in the setting if they're desired. Mutability of player options is a core theme and concept of 4e.
Maran: Drow don't need to take centre stage, but they need to be able to have a place in the setting if they're desired.
This.
All official campaign settings need to provide sensical flavor for every official player character race. Depending on setting flavor, each race may be dominant or obscure.
Of course, rules should make it clear, a player can refluff an individual character any which way, but it means that character may be unusual in the setting, which itself has storyline implications within the wider setting.
Dark Sun sees the light of day again next year and rumor has it that Dragonlance will be making an appearence as well.
Fixed that for ya.
DRAGON9 - I'm quite capable of speaking for myself thank you, please - for future reference, don't correct my statements unless their uncalled for. My choice of words "word has it" holds the same meaning as "rumor has it", I write what I mean to say, not what you'de like to read instead. You might not like what anybody has to say or how they write, but at least respect their ideas, knowledge, and statements. This is a forum, therefore it doesn't give anybody the right to tell someone else that they fixed something that the author meant to express in the first place. I'm not posting this to be some sort of troll, I just want you to realize I don't appreciate you rewording me like you did, I thought it to be quite rude and uncalled for.
DRAGON9 - I'm quite capable of speaking for myself thank you, please - for future reference, don't correct my statements unless their uncalled for. My choice of words "word has it" holds the same meaning as "rumor has it", I write what I mean to say, not what you'de like to read instead. You might not like what anybody has to say or how they write, but at least respect their ideas, knowledge, and statements. This is a forum, therefore it doesn't give anybody the right to tell someone else that they fixed something that the author meant to express in the first place. I'm not posting this to be some sort of troll, I just want you to realize I don't appreciate you rewording me like you did, I thought it to be quite rude and uncalled for.
I would strongly disagree that "word has it" and "rumor has it" mean the same thing. Word has it implies there is some amount of officialness to it. Rumor has it implies no officialness, and honestly I think Dragon9 was being generous by using that(personally I would have corrected it to "the exact same people saying that Dragonlance was the 2010 setting are now making unfounded claims that it will be the 2011 setting.")
All of that aside, "fixed that for you" is a method of disagreement in forums that is perfectly valid(although perhaps a little lazy). I think you are over reacting, as it is a common method(perhaps more so on forums besides this one) of showing disagreement over the internet.
meh. People do that all the time on forums, especially here.
I don't think DRAGON9 meant to upset you, just clarify that it's not something grounded, but just a rumour. Word makes it sound more definite. I can see where you're going with the word "word" now that you explain yourself, but it really did sound like you were more sure about it, and it's not a good idea to be sure about anything until we have some conclusive evidence, or any large and good evidence to begin with, which I don't think we have.
EDIT: Ninja'd by Renadiel; I should make sure I've read to the last page before I comment, shouldn't I? This new forum didn't make it clear to me I wasn't on the last page.
Yeah. Despite rumors to the contrary, D&D and the internet are not serious business, dude. You need to learn to roll with the idioms.
Actually it quite often is used in a humorous manner and its use is not meant to be snide or nasty. I guess some people just take everything really seriously. 
Actually it quite often is used in a humorous manner and its use is not meant to be snide or nasty. I guess some people just take everything really seriously.
no foolin'
Yeah. Despite rumors to the contrary, D&D and the internet are not serious business, dude. You need to learn to roll with the idioms.
Nonsense. Both D&D and teh interbutzz are vry vry vry vry SRS business.es.1!!11eleven
Well, for the sake of any further arguements and to clarify my choice of words - the 'word' I got came from an announcement at GenCon earlier this year that DL is a go for 4E with Dark Sun being the first D&D setting for 2010. Other possibilities for future projects are Greyhawk & Mystara, but - we'll just have to wait and see.
Well, for the sake of any further arguements and to clarify my choice of words - the 'word' I got came from an announcement at GenCon earlier this year that DL is a go for 4E with Dark Sun being the first D&D setting for 2010. Other possibilities for future projects are Greyhawk & Mystara, but - we'll just have to wait and see.
Citation needed.
Well, for the sake of any further arguements and to clarify my choice of words - the 'word' I got came from an announcement at GenCon earlier this year that DL is a go for 4E with Dark Sun being the first D&D setting for 2010. Other possibilities for future projects are Greyhawk & Mystara, but - we'll just have to wait and see.
oO I don't know where you got that from but whoever told you got it WAY wrong.
The 'word' at GenCon was the COMPLETE opposite! There was a designer being quoted that settings like "Dragonlance, Greyhawk and Mystara" (specifically mentionned by name) were not different enough and were not considered at the moment. He was explaining that Dark Sun was chosen because it offered a different setting from the usual.
Forgotten Realms is our standard fantasy setting for now.
Well, for the sake of any further arguements and to clarify my choice of words - the 'word' I got came from an announcement at GenCon earlier this year that DL is a go for 4E with Dark Sun being the first D&D setting for 2010. Other possibilities for future projects are Greyhawk & Mystara, but - we'll just have to wait and see.
oO I don't know where you got that from but whoever told you got it WAY wrong.
The 'word' at GenCon was the COMPLETE opposite! There was a designer being quoted that settings like "Dragonlance, Greyhawk and Mystara" (specifically mentionned by name) were not different enough and were not considered at the moment. He was explaining that Dark Sun was chosen because it offered a different setting from the usual.
Forgotten Realms and Eberron is our standard fantasy setting for now.
Not wrong or opposite at all, in fact - your statement, as legitamite as it could be, was probably one of many things overheard at the convention, (ya ever been to gencon?) though it maybe true for whatever reason it was stated by said designer- the announcement was made nonetheless. Believe it or not.
One thing that I've noticed in this thread lately is that the topic of possibilties have been drastically narrowed down to someone being - Way wrong...you need to keep one thing in mind, there's always the possibilty that someone may have a little more information about something than you're unaware of. If ya stop and lisen instead of making snap decisions, ya might learn something. This thread has turned out to be a fvckin' joke - I'm out!
Fixed that for ya.
.... Eberron is not standard fantasy. Not even close to it. It's steam punk magi-tech. FR, DL, Greyhawk, Mystara (my preferred) - those are standard fantasy.
.... Eberron is not standard fantasy. Not even close to it. It's steam punk magi-tech. FR, DL, Greyhawk, Mystara (my preferred) - those are standard fantasy.
Well compared to Dark Sun, Eberron might just qualify as standard, though even as an Eberron fan I would find that to be a stretch.
Eberron could perhaps be considered standard fantasy from the perspective of modern culture as popularized by games such as the Final Fantasy series.
.... Eberron is not standard fantasy. Not even close to it. It's steam punk magi-tech. FR, DL, Greyhawk, Mystara (my preferred) - those are standard fantasy.
Lantanese Gnomes beg to differ
Well, for the sake of any further arguements and to clarify my choice of words - the 'word' I got came from an announcement at GenCon earlier this year that DL is a go for 4E with Dark Sun being the first D&D setting for 2010. Other possibilities for future projects are Greyhawk & Mystara, but - we'll just have to wait and see.
oO I don't know where you got that from but whoever told you got it WAY wrong.
The 'word' at GenCon was the COMPLETE opposite! There was a designer being quoted that settings like "Dragonlance, Greyhawk and Mystara" (specifically mentionned by name) were not different enough and were not considered at the moment. He was explaining that Dark Sun was chosen because it offered a different setting from the usual.
Forgotten Realms is our standard fantasy setting for now.
Perhaps they meant for 2010, who knows. What we do know is that Wizards is fully capable of changing their minds on this issue since the next setting won't be going into development until next year. The more people keep talking about Dragonlance and the more people keep saying they would like it for 4e, the more likely they are to revive it sooner.
Perhaps they meant for 2010, who knows.
That was the impression I got. In the 2010 campaign setting announcement they do indeed mention Dark Sun being non-standard as compared FR, GH, and DL all being more generic, but the reason is specifically part of the why Dark Sun was chosen for 2010, "we felt it was time to show the breadth of what's possible in the game". Never once do they state that being generic is a bad quality, only that they wanted to use 2010 to show "what a broad swathe D&D's kind of fantasy can cover". This is not given as a mission statement for all future settings, but merely as a product goal specifically for 2010.
Is this support for a classic such Greyhawk or Dragonlance in 2011, no, but neither is it any indication that such a classic won't be chosen either. What setting is next is really any ones guess at this point.
Wow someone can't take the pressure or internet discussion...
Perhaps they meant for 2010, who knows.
That was the impression I got. In the 2010 campaign setting announcement they do indeed mention Dark Sun being non-standard as compared FR, GH, and DL all being more generic, but the reason is specifically part of the why Dark Sun was chosen for 2010, "we felt it was time to show the breadth of what's possible in the game". Never once do they state that being generic is a bad quality, only that they wanted to use 2010 to show "what a broad swathe D&D's kind of fantasy can cover". This is not given as a mission statement for all future settings, but merely as a product goal specifically for 2010.Is this support for a classic such Greyhawk or Dragonlance in 2011, no, but neither is it any indication that such a classic won't be chosen either. What setting is next is really any ones guess at this point.
The interview also says
Second, one of the factors we've looked at in planning our settings is the degree to which a setting strays from the standard D&D medieval fantasy feel. Forgotten Realms, Greyhawk, Dragonlance, Mystara -- those are all pretty close to baseline fantasy.
Emphasis mine, note the plural?
Personally I take it to mean they aren't priorities at this point. They'll consider other properties and original new ones before defaulting to the generic ones.
Out of all the 'generics' left I'm pretty sure Dragonlance is at the top of the list though. If we see Dragonlance 4e it'll be before Greyhawk or Mystara for sure.
Wow someone can't take the pressure or internet discussion...
Perhaps they meant for 2010, who knows.
That was the impression I got. In the 2010 campaign setting announcement they do indeed mention Dark Sun being non-standard as compared FR, GH, and DL all being more generic, but the reason is specifically part of the why Dark Sun was chosen for 2010, "we felt it was time to show the breadth of what's possible in the game". Never once do they state that being generic is a bad quality, only that they wanted to use 2010 to show "what a broad swathe D&D's kind of fantasy can cover". This is not given as a mission statement for all future settings, but merely as a product goal specifically for 2010.Is this support for a classic such Greyhawk or Dragonlance in 2011, no, but neither is it any indication that such a classic won't be chosen either. What setting is next is really any ones guess at this point.
Personally I take it to mean they aren't priorities at this point. They'll consider other properties and original new ones before defaulting to the generic ones.
Out of all the 'generics' left I'm pretty sure Dragonlance is at the top of the list. If we see Dragonlance 4e it'll be before Greyhawk or Mystara for sure.
Don't get me wrong, if Dragonlance did not come out in 2011, I would not be surprised. But, like you said, of the classic settings, Dragonlance is probably higher on the list than the others. It still has a pretty active novel line currently, and WotC is not abandoning it fully (next year is pretty much all reprints, but reprints are still better than nothing). Perhaps 2012, who knows.
Dragonlance is probably higher on the list than the others.
Could be, but I wouldn't count Mystara out.
When the Dark Sun announcement was first made one of the things I did was take a trip over to the other worlds section of the forums. While there I noted that the Dark Sun had a substantial higher post count than Dragonlance or Greyhawk, which if that can be taken as any indication of customer interest might have also factored into choosing it for 2010. Granted it was the day after the announcement, so maybe it was only a result of increased trafic due to hype, but the post count was so out of proportion to the other sub-forums that I doubt a meager 24 hours was enough to account for the difference.
Anyway, as some of you might have already guessed, my entire point is that I also took note that the only setting with a similarly high post count was Mystara. Even as of now Mystara has a post count higher than Spelljamer, Greyhawk, and Dragonlance combined.
Dragonlance is probably higher on the list than the others.
Could be, but I wouldn't count Mystara out.Anyway, as some of you might have already guessed, my entire point is that I also took note that the only setting with a similarly high post count was Mystara. Even as of now Mystara has a post count higher than Spelljamer, Greyhawk, and Dragonlance combined.
Dragonlance fans tend to congregate more on the Dragonlance Nexus forums, which has more threads and posts than the entire D&D Worlds sub-forum (which includes FR, Eberron, and every other game world). I am sure Wizards won't ignore that.
Dragonlance fans tend to congregate more on the Dragonlance Nexus forums, which has more threads and posts than the entire D&D Worlds sub-forum (which includes FR, Eberron, and every other game world). I am sure Wizards won't ignore that.
A fair point. My knowledge of dedicated setting communities is admittedly lacking. I rarely venture past WotC for my D&D fix, save the occasional jaunt over to EnWorld (usually only following a link from here). Even around these parts I mostly stick to only a half dozen or so categories.
Still, I was surprised about how popular the Mystara sub-forum is, especially as I had barely even heard of the setting until somewhere in the middle of the Dragonlance vs. Darksun debates.
Perhaps they meant for 2010, who knows. What we do know is that Wizards is fully capable of changing their minds on this issue since the next setting won't be going into development until next year. The more people keep talking about Dragonlance and the more people keep saying they would like it for 4e, the more likely they are to revive it sooner.
Well the next setting might not go into full fledged development until next year(well I think it will be entering development in Decemeber, but what's one month?), but that doesn't mean that they haven't already started moving towards getting the 2011 setting ready. Let's not forget that they have a novel editor for a line that will consist of "new stuff". The novel lines support the 4ed campaign settings(and MtG). Therefore I think that it is safe to assume that this new novel line is for the next campaign setting.
Honestly I think Dragonlance's chances are extremely slim. Had there been any indication that Dragonlance was going to be a setting in the next couple of years, I think that the novel line would not be effectively dead in the water as it is right now. I think that 2012 is the soonest that Dragonlance has so much as a slight chance, and even then I don't think the odds are particularly great.
Wasn't Mystara folded into the FR like Kara-Tur was?
Wasn't Mystara folded into the FR like Kara-Tur was?
Nope. Completely seperate settings. Mystara has (IIRC) hollow world, blackmoor, red steel and the known world. (default setting)
Wasn't Mystara folded into the FR like Kara-Tur was?
You are thinking of Maztica.
Lantanese Gnomes beg to differ
Hey dont point that finger at me buddy! Take it up with the Gnomes!
I think he's refering to Lantan going out Atlantis style and no longer existing in FR.
I think he's refering to Lantan going out Atlantis style and no longer existing in FR.
Ugh dont remind me. Thats a big sore spot for me. They really screwed up the 4e Realms and what happend to Eberron? Nothing! They didnt kill off any gods or rearange the land or anything. I think they just got rid of those Gnomes to lower the tech level of the Realms just to make Eberron more unique. But I digress, Im getting off topic here and strating to rant.
Back on topic as far as new realeases go they have a huge catalog of past products to pull from, and I think theres is some definate demand for 4e Mystara, or Dragonlance, or Ravenloft, or what ever. Still I would like to see an all new setting, but they would really need to do something different to make it really stand out from all the other settings, and you'll have people complaining oh i wanted 4e Greyhawk or whatever, so if they do go with an all new setting they will really have to make it top notch.
Personally I would like to see more support for existing settings. I could see additional books for the Forgotten Realms, focusing on Kara Tur, or Abeir. I would totally buy that.
Of the non-FR "generic" settings, I think Dragonlance is the most marketable because of the synergy with a reasonably popular line of novels, and therefore is the most likely to see the earliest release. When they will release another "generic" setting, I can't say, but I bet it will be Dragonlance.
I hope its dragonlance and no other setting deserves it more (maybe Greyhawk), but it would need a new big campaign with new characters and a new epic storyline and not again "war of the lance".
I hope its dragonlance and no other setting deserves it more (maybe Greyhawk), but it would need a new big campaign with new characters and a new epic storyline and not again "war of the lance".
I really don't think the setting needs new characters or an epic storyline. It works well enough in the current timeline (set about seventy years after the War of the Lance).
I hope its dragonlance and no other setting deserves it more (maybe Greyhawk), but it would need a new big campaign with new characters and a new epic storyline and not again "war of the lance".
I really don't think the setting needs new characters or an epic storyline. It works well enough in the current timeline (set about seventy years after the War of the Lance).
I completely agree. I love the age or mortals and really want the progression of the setting to continue. There are so many new and exciting things happening all over krynn that need to be explored.
But, I'm not against new characters in the spotlight and a new overall campaign.
I totally agree on both of you. The whole age of mortals story has to come to a big conclusion, ending in a new rpg campaign.
Maybe I didn't express myself correctly!
I would bet Dragonlance will be the next setting.
Later.... Greyhawk?
While I love Greyhawk, there are two doubts I have about the next setting:
1) I doubt it will be another generic fantasy setting. Which would rule out DL and Greyhawk.
2) IF it does end up being DL, I highly doubt they would do two generic settings in a row.
While I love Greyhawk, there are two doubts I have about the next setting:
1) I doubt it will be another traditional fantasy setting. Which would rule out DL and Greyhawk.
2) IF it does end up being DL, I highly doubt they would do two traditional settings in a row.
Fixed.
After having thought about it for a while, here is my new set of predictions for campaign settings:
2011: New Setting(the pirate world runner up from the contest that gave us Eberron)
2012: Birthright or Al-Qadim
2013: New Setting(other runner up from contest)
2014: Dragonlance(30th anniversery)
Too many possibilities for 2015 for me to try and take a guess for that one right now.
I would bet Dragonlance will be the next setting.
Later.... Greyhawk?
Dragonlance & Greyhawk are original settings put forth into D&D decades ago, worlds in which gamers haven't seen anything new in quite awhile. A reintroduction would allow fans of old and newer gamers with little to no experience of DL & GH, the time to finally delve into these 2 historical settings. But like FR, times change - so they would, of course, be more "up to date". I look forward to them in the near future.
While I love Greyhawk, there are two doubts I have about the next setting:
1) I doubt it will be another traditional fantasy setting. Which would rule out DL and Greyhawk.
2) IF it does end up being DL, I highly doubt they would do two traditional settings in a row.
Fixed.
I must say, I like the fix. "generic" has such a negative tone to it, making it seem like those settings are something bad, not worth playing. Which is just not the case. Traditional is a much better word that fits almost every D&D setting around. Since two of the unique settings have been included or about to be include (eberron & darksun) and three of the unique settings are folded into core (ravenloft, planescape, spelljammer) that leaves very little in the way of unique settings. Al-quadim is truely the only other "unique" setting with a flavor very different from the others. Everything else falls into the traditional catagory. Even when each of those settings offers something unique, its still, knights, dragons, wizards and goblins.
What we need as a new setting is a core setting, joining all the core info into one player sourcebook and one DM sourcebook and delving deeper into it. But I doubt we will get that for a long time.
A "waterworld/pirate" setting and Al-quadim would both be different enough to peak interests, but ignoring traditional settings beyond forgotten realms is to ignore the very spirit of D&D, atleast for many D&D players who loved their traditional settings.
Dragonlance, Greyhawk, Mystara and Birthright all have a fanbase that desires to see their setting in 4e and money saved for the books. Eventually, wotc needs release those settings. It would be a mistake not to. Three of those settings have been ignored for far too long.
Birthright is not a traditional/generic fantasy setting though. It was the first setting where your character was a mjaor mover & shaker from day 1, and where playing a demi-god was the norm.
I want Rich Burlew's setting to be published. WoTC either needs to actually do something with it or give the IP rights to Burlew. Sitting on a property just so that nobody else can use it but you refuse to is the scummiest of business practices.
Birthright is not a traditional/generic fantasy setting though. It was the first setting where your character was a mjaor mover & shaker from day 1, and where playing a demi-god was the norm.
Sure it is. It has unique aspects to it as all traditional fantasy settings do, setting themselves apart from the others. But overall it is just another traditional fantasy setting, and it deserves attention in 4e, just like the rest.
WoTC has developed Living Greyhawk, looks like the P&P setting may not be too far off.
Eh? When and did they announce(or leak) that they were reviving Living Greyhawk? I haven't seen any kind of uproar that I would expect from such an announcement being made. If they haven't made such an announcement then I hardly think that a dead RPGA campaign is going to facto to much into their decision for future settings(especially since it was killed because 4th edition came out).
WoTC has developed Living Greyhawk, looks like the P&P setting may not be too far off.
Eh? When and did they announce(or leak) that they were reviving Living Greyhawk? I haven't seen any kind of uproar that I would expect from such an announcement being made. If they haven't made such an announcement then I hardly think that a dead RPGA campaign is going to facto to much into their decision for future settings(especially since it was killed because 4th edition came out).
They didn't. They don't run Living Greyhawk right now. >_>
"FR, DL, Greyhawk, Mystara (my preferred) - those are standard fantasy."
Hum...
So, lets use the Apocolipse Idea form FR and create a patchwork world of fo the best/worst parts of DL, Mystara (with Red Steel), and Kara-tar. It would then be a twisted world and the interactions between the ismatched parts can be used to create a Mega-campaign. It would have familiar parts one could still play-in, but it would also be a total non-starndard.
Actually, I want them to do the Red Steel Campaign. I think it would work real good with 4E. Swashbuckling mutants!
4e Greyhawk (coming earliest 2010, latest 2012) will restart the setting in circa 576CY.
There will be no timeline advance. Rather, there will be a timeline retrograde.
In the restart, the Flanaess will be reimagined. Everything that has “happened” in published products will “never have happened” unless it is specifically reincorporated in the restarted setting.
The Greyhawk Wars will never have occurred. There will never have been demon armies rampaging all over. However, Iuz will be on the march and the “bad guy of the North.”
The Scarlet Brotherhood will never have been “outed” by going for an empire. It will be a “general” bad guy found everywhere - sneaky, silent, unseen.
The Great Kingdom will be caught in a quasi-civil war with lots of politics, magic and religion. No undead animus rulers. No United Kingdom of Ahlissa. No Great Kingdom of the North. Medegia is not a wasteland. The Iron League and Nyrond stand opposed. Its “old school” 83Greyhawk in this area with the volume turned up to 11.
The Sheldomar Valley (Keoland and smaller states) will be “monster central” as monsters (giants, dragons, drow etc.) attack civilization relentlessly. Think Points of Light dialed all the way up.
The City of Greyhawk will be the “center of it all” where things start or come together. Everything in D&D will fit somewhere in the central region of the Flanaess around Greyhawk to include the Wild Coast (Turrosh-Mak and the Empire of the Pomarj will never have happened). The Circle of Eight will function as a premade “mission control.”
Celene will be moved into the Feywild with the addition of Eladrins. Celene will be sort of like a “fortress” from which fey forces sally forth to fight evil.
The Bandit Kingdoms and the Rift Canyon will be “dungeon-land” where all things dungeony can be readily found. Lots of dragons too. Speaking of which.
Dragonborn will be incorporated. They will be from “off the map” to the south in the Amedio/Hepmonaland.
The Tieflings will be incorporated. They will not be monolithic, as in a nation. Rather, they will have origins in the Horned Society, the Sea of Dust, the Lands of Iuz, the Land of Black Ice etc. Essentially, where there are evil planar influences, there will be Tieflings. More on this below.
The idea is to compartmentalize Greyhawk into the ultimate “classic play” menu of a setting with “zones”:
What to kill monsters? Play in the Sheldomar.
Want heroics and politics with evil wizards and evil high priests oppressing people who must be stopped? Play in the Great Kingdom, Nyrond or the Iron League.
Want to oppose the One Big Evil Guy? Play in the north against Iuz.
Want to go exploring ancient ruins and dugeons, see the BK and the Rift Canyon.
Want everything in one spot? One organizing principle? Play in the City of Greyhawk/Central Flanaess - adventure-in-can-land.
This split will essentially “define” Greyhawk as the Flanaess. Other areas will be marginalized (the Baklunish West as “genie-land” the exception). There will also be some geographical changes to Oerth (but I have no sense of the extent or details at this moment).
The cosmology of Greyhawk will not be the Great Wheel. Given the premise of the restart, Greyhawk’s cosmology will be 4e standard and will have “always been that way.”
The new cosmology will also be the restarted Greyhawk’s “McGuffin” or new animating force. The restart described above is intended to “keep Greyhawk as Greyhawk.” On top of that will be “the hook” that can neatly summarize the setting - why do you play here?
Tharizdun will be name to conjure with - The Fight Against the Dark God! But in the process, Tharizdun will function almost as a convenient means to introduce numerous other planar elements, in the sense that PCs must traverse the planes and deal with planar incursions into Greyhawk as a necessary part of - The Fight Against the Dark God! Its almost Greyhawk meets Planescape. Sort of. Maybe better to say Planescape (but not 2e Planescape in any pure sense, rather The PLANES) within a Greyhawk context or frame. The idea is that the planar aspect will not be so pronounced (more subtle) as to overpower the Greyhawk elements; the Greyhawk elements are to remain the focus but with a very strong planar theme. However, individual designs are unpredictable, naturally.
So saying, the above is only what I have been able to suss out post-Con Season (and I’m not infallable by any means) and is waaaaay in advance of the range of release dates. Stuff could change. However, I feel comfortable posting the foregoing nonetheless.
POSTED THIS BEFORE, BUT I'M POSTING IT AGAIN FOR THOSE WHO MIGHT NOT HAVE CAUGHT IT:
The images are from a fan site not a WotC site. Hardly seems like any evidence. Got a link for the source of rest of the claims?
DS won't be the only setting released this year, and it certainly won't be the last, gauranteed.
Actually, Dark Sun is the only setting coming out this year. Guaranteed.
Greyhawk, along with Dragonlance, was announced at last years GenCon for future releases without an actual release date, and my previous post below clearly states (coming earliest 2010, latest 2012.)
When did this occur? WotC certainly never made any statements about Dragonlance coming out before 2012, and they didn't make any statements regarding Greyhawk at all.
Face it, you are using a piece of fanwork as the basis of your argument with absolutely nothing else to back it up. Also, the Coming earliest 2010, latest 2012 is the biggest load of bologna I have ever seen. That is a three year margin, which is pretty wide.
DS won't be the only setting released this year, and it certainly won't be the last, gauranteed.
Actually, Dark Sun is the only setting coming out this year. Guaranteed.
You are sadly mistaken, but you keep believing that.
Greyhawk, along with Dragonlance, was announced at last years GenCon for future releases without an actual release date, and my previous post below clearly states (coming earliest 2010, latest 2012.)
When did this occur? WotC certainly never made any statements about Dragonlance coming out before 2012, and they didn't make any statements regarding Greyhawk at all.
I thought I made that clear? Last year at GenCon... which was August in Indianapolis.
Face it, you are using a piece of fanwork as the basis of your argument with absolutely nothing else to back it up. Also, the Coming earliest 2010, latest 2012 is the biggest load of bologna I have ever seen. That is a three year margin, which is pretty wide.
Arguement? Is that how you see it? I was simply answering some questions. I'm not asking anyone to believe any of it, I'm just saying that something's right around the corner, something we're quite familiar with. Sorry to make you so mad Blaze, I didn't realize that Greyhawk or Dragonlance was such a sore topic with you, best to keep myself quite then and let things unfold for themselves instead. But a bit of advise - before you start trashing ppl and making up your own assumptions about them or where they get their information, keep in mind one thing - there's always someone who knows something you don't.
so saying that it's just a fansite is really just grasping at straws without really knowing.
You're the only one grasping at straws. The rest of us are grasping facts.
Greyhawk, along with Dragonlance, was announced at last years GenCon for future releases without an actual release date,
No, they weren't. That is a fact.
DS won't be the only setting released this year, and it certainly won't be the last, gauranteed. WoTC isn't gonna let every single idea outta the hat right away... that's called business...just because it's not on their boards or someone can't find it, doesn't mean it doesn't exist. Gamers are on a "need to know basis" - if it's not announced yet, ya don't need to know. Corporations pull that kinda stuff on ppl all the time, it's what keeps the general public interested. This thread is an example of just that. As far as fanbased sites, that's an area that's really hard to pin point - there are those who put them up just for kicks, and then there are sites put up by staff members for business purposes such as feedback and ideas - again, it's business, they're not obligated to state who they are or what company they work for - so saying that it's just a fansite is really just grasping at straws without really knowing. Greyhawk, along with Dragonlance, was announced at last years GenCon for future releases without an actual release date, and my previous post below clearly states (coming earliest 2010, latest 2012.) which basically means - we won't find out 'till it's time to know. Nonetheless - it's going to happen, now whether or not any of us agree if it's a good idea is another thing all together. I personally look forward to seeing what they got up their sleeves. People have their opinions, but when it hits the stores - some of those who don't believe any of it right now are gonna say something entirely different, it's inevitable.
I don't know what you're talking about. They specifically said only one setting will be rolled out a year; thus, Dark Sun is the ONLY setting being released this year by WotC.
That said, I don't have any recollection of them saying that they'd make Dragonlance and Greyhawk at the latest by 2012 at a GenCon, and I would assume that people would be talking about that a lot more and it would be in the general knowledge base here, since people from the boards actually do go to GenCon (surprise!) …
Also, we're being biased and attacking you for wild, baseless theories? When correcting people in a civilised manner is suddenly an attack…
You are sadly mistaken, but you keep believing that.
Prove it. Believe me, I would like to see Dragonlance before 2012, but that isn't in the cards right now.
I thought I made that clear? Last year at GenCon... which was August in Indianapolis.
Who made this statement? I thought you "made that clear"?
Arguement? Is that how you see it? I was simply answering some questions. I'm not asking anyone to believe any of it, I'm just saying that something's right around the corner, something we're quite familiar with. Sorry to make you so mad Blaze, I didn't realize that Greyhawk or Dragonlance was such a sore topic with you, best to keep myself quite then and let things unfold for themselves instead. But a bit of advise - before you start trashing ppl and making up your own assumptions about them or where they get their information, keep in mind one thing - there's always someone who knows something you don't.
I really have no burning desire to see Greyhawk ever again (played it for a while), but once again, I have made my desire to see Dragonlance soon abundantly clear throughout these forums (there might be a way to look my posting history up). Not only that, I am pretty involved in discussions of all things Dragonlance (both here and on other forums), the fact that Dragonlance is coming out soon isn't exactly something that would get by me very easily. It's almost as if people on the Dragonlance forums would be abuzz with speculation on what we would see.
By the way, who is trashing anyone? If anything, your posts are getting closer to that more than anyone.
I'm outta here!
Proof? Alright then...Last year, WotC released The Village of Hommlet (Andy Collins). It is not available for purchase, but instead is sent as a reward to anyone signing up for the RPGA. It updates Gygax' Village of Hommlet to 4E. So far it is the only published official 4E material for the World of Greyhawk setting to date, although - the RPGA adventure Return to the Moathouse is also based on the original Village of Hommlet. GH was originally planned out for it's release after FR & Eberron was established - but for some reason in 2008, that idea was scratched - and so now we see Dark Sun's release instead. It's just a matter of time.
I'm outta here!
You have to remember, a lot of Greyhawk ideas have been ported to the generic setting. Greyhawk deities, locations, legends, dungeons; they've been stolen for the PoL. Village of Hommlet being released in RPGA before an actual setting is actually evidence AGAINST Greyhawk, since it means it's wrapped into the core, generic setting.
You keep claiming evidence, but give none. It's now come down to this. I didn't want to pull this statement, because I thought you could be a little more reasonable.
Links or it didn't happen.
Proof? Alright then...Last year, WotC released The Village of Hommlet (Andy Collins). It is not available for purchase, but instead is sent as a reward to anyone signing up for the RPGA. It updates Gygax' Village of Hommlet to 4E. So far it is the only published official 4E material for the World of Greyhawk setting to date, although - the RPGA adventure Return to the Moathouse is also based on the original Village of Hommlet. GH was originally planned out for it's release after FR & Eberron was established - but for some reason in 2008, that idea was scratched - and so now we see Dark Sun's release instead. It's just a matter of time.
I'm outta here!
You have to remember, a lot of Greyhawk ideas have been ported to the generic setting. Greyhawk deities, locations, legends, dungeons; they've been stolen for the PoL. Village of Hommlet being released in RPGA before an actual setting is actually evidence AGAINST Greyhawk, since it means it's wrapped into the core, generic setting.
You keep claiming evidence, but give none. It's now come down to this. I didn't want to pull this statement, because I thought you could be a little more reasonable.
Links or it didn't happen.
Reasonable? You mean see things your way. You want the information - don't mess around and juggle sites pretending you know what your looking for, go right to the source...assuming you know ppl that is. Otherwise, get off my back! Think about it for a moment - What in the world do I have to gain by lying, and if i was - do you care? Or are you only in these threads to jerk ppls chains around 'cause you ain't got anything better to do with your time but whine about their posts? Apparently if you don't know, then it doesn't exist right? And if someone doesn't provide a link for you, then it's all made up - correct? Well, "SURPRISE!" doesn't work that way, chief. If what I've stated doesn't appease you - too bad, I ain't gotta feed you links and evidence to get an approval - just be patient and you'll find out soon enough. In the meantime, it's all out there - just do the work. You may wanna start by contacting the RPGA found here on this website to get your facts straight.
Proof? Alright then...Last year, WotC released The Village of Hommlet (Andy Collins). It is not available for purchase, but instead is sent as a reward to anyone signing up for the RPGA. It updates Gygax' Village of Hommlet to 4E. So far it is the only published official 4E material for the World of Greyhawk setting to date, although - the RPGA adventure Return to the Moathouse is also based on the original Village of Hommlet. GH was originally planned out for it's release after FR & Eberron was established - but for some reason in 2008, that idea was scratched - and so now we see Dark Sun's release instead. It's just a matter of time.
I'm outta here!
You have to remember, a lot of Greyhawk ideas have been ported to the generic setting. Greyhawk deities, locations, legends, dungeons; they've been stolen for the PoL. Village of Hommlet being released in RPGA before an actual setting is actually evidence AGAINST Greyhawk, since it means it's wrapped into the core, generic setting.
You keep claiming evidence, but give none. It's now come down to this. I didn't want to pull this statement, because I thought you could be a little more reasonable.
Links or it didn't happen.
Reasonable? You mean see things your way. You want the information - don't mess around and juggle sites pretending you know what your looking for, go right to the source...assuming you know ppl that is. Otherwise, get off my back! Think about it for a moment - What in the world do I have to gain by lying, and if i was - do you care? Or are you only in these threads to jerk ppls chains around 'cause you ain't got anything better to do with your time but whine about their posts? Apparently if you don't know, then it doesn't exist right? And if someone doesn't provide a link for you, then it's all made up - correct? Well, "SURPRISE!" doesn't work that way, chief. If what I've stated doesn't appease you - too bad, I ain't gotta feed you links and evidence to get an approval - just be patient and you'll find out soon enough. In the meantime, it's all out there - just do the work. You may wanna start by contacting the RPGA found here on this website to get your facts straight.
Woah, woah woah. This is what I meant by being unreasonable. You're freaking out on me. If it exists, I'd like to know where you found out, considering NOBODY ELSE SEEMS TO KNOW THAT THEY'RE COMING OUT.
That said, I'd rather not run on a wild goose chase, and if you have the "facts," you could start by giving us the source of your facts, with direct links, rather than flipping out, and telling us to look it up ourselves.
It's not that I couldn't find it if it did really exist, it's just I don't feel like sending an hour down the tube when I could be writing a chapter of my novel for a class tomorrow.
EDIT: I found the site you posted from in your blog. There's no indication anywhere else that it's going to happen. No mention at GenCon, which means whoever told them / told you was lying. I don't know what you're talking about. Please explain more if you're going to drop a bomb like this on us, rather than hitting and running.
Think about it for a moment - What in the world do I have to gain by lying,
Oh, I don't know - getting a reaction out of people like what's already happening, because you enjoy it?
Or are you only in these threads to jerk ppls chains around 'cause you ain't got anything better to do with your time but whine about their posts?
That actually sounds more like you at this point.
Apparently if you don't know, then it doesn't exist right? And if someone doesn't provide a link for you, then it's all made up - correct?
Actually providing a link to a source is meant as a niceity so that you don't waste other peiople's time as they try to find the source. Incidently in this case, the original source of that list you posted earlier is dead. The forums that it was posted in are completely gone, so I can only go off of pieces of informtation that other people salvaged before the forums collapse(it should be noted that these posts were made in 2008).
I did not attend Gencon. However, I have friends who did. So, up front, my "information" is second hand. That said, the information is derived from seminars and conversations had with individuals who ostensibly are in positions to know or hear things and my own reading of the resulting tea leaves. Like a weather forecast, there is an inevitable "bust" factor. If you asked me to put a percentage on my level of confidence I'd say:
70% chance there is a GH 4e as of today; and
75% chance it will look pretty much as described.
More info should be forthcoming at the DDX and next Con Season.
This is second hand information from someone who admits to having basically made some of it up. His prediction also included announcing it last/giving details during the 2009 con season, which did not happen.
do we have an idea about when they'll start giving "hints" for the next Setting?
Probably the same time they did last year, April.
Probably the same time they did last year, April.
Assuming they give hints at all this time. Personally I am expecting a new setting this time, so giving out hints wouldn't really serve as much of a point.
Probably the same time they did last year, April.
Assuming they give hints at all this time. Personally I am expecting a new setting this time, so giving out hints wouldn't really serve as much of a point.
Unless, of course, they want to create hype and speculation to get people interested in something new.
They have to create a market share, after all, and the best way to do that is to have a lot of people eagerly awaiting the new product.
Probably the same time they did last year, April.
Assuming they give hints at all this time. Personally I am expecting a new setting this time, so giving out hints wouldn't really serve as much of a point.
Unless, of course, they want to create hype and speculation to get people interested in something new.
They have to create a market share, after all, and the best way to do that is to have a lot of people eagerly awaiting the new product.
That is kinda what I was thinking. If they don't hype the new setting even before we know what it is, it will fall flat.
I am just saying that we will probably hear stuff about it being a never-seen-before setting.
If it were two books, it would have all of the player information a smaller 160 page book (with roughly forty pages going to each setting) and all of the DM information in a 280 page book (again with roughly seventy pages to each CS).
I was thinking today. What if Wizards released a book (maybe two) every year that updated four campaign settings to 4e. If it were one book, it could be a 280 page hardcover with roughly seventy pages devoted to each campaign setting. It would contain racial, regional, and monster information for each CS. Call it Campaign Classics or something. It would contain settings that are unlikely to get updated any time soon. Perhaps it could also contain a side campaign(Kara-Tur, Al-Qadim, Taladas, etc) in each release, perhaps even a new setting each release too.
If it were two books, it would have all of the player information a smaller 160 page book (with roughly forty pages going to each setting) and all of the DM information in a 280 page book (again with roughly seventy pages to each CS).
I think that would be very risky froma marketing perspective. If I were interested in only one of the two or four settings in the books, I might feel like I was paying twice as much as I should, and then I wouldn't buy it.
I think that's one of the reasons WotC is putting out individual racial books, rather than a "Races of X" series like in Third Edition.
I was thinking today. What if Wizards released a book (maybe two) every year that updated four campaign settings to 4e. If it were one book, it could be a 280 page hardcover with roughly seventy pages devoted to each campaign setting. It would contain racial, regional, and monster information for each CS. Call it Campaign Classics or something. It would contain settings that are unlikely to get updated any time soon. Perhaps it could also contain a side campaign(Kara-Tur, Al-Qadim, Taladas, etc) in each release, perhaps even a new setting each release too.
If it were two books, it would have all of the player information a smaller 160 page book (with roughly forty pages going to each setting) and all of the DM information in a 280 page book (again with roughly seventy pages to each CS).
I think that would be very risky froma marketing perspective. If I were interested in only one of the two or four settings in the books, I might feel like I was paying twice as much as I should, and then I wouldn't buy it.
I think that's one of the reasons WotC is putting out individual racial books, rather than a "Races of X" series like in Third Edition.
That is a pretty good point. Perhaps Dragon and Dungeon articles instead, like a Races of Mystara, Classes of Mystara, etc in Dragon, and Regions of Mystara in Dungeon.
Although, like many other people, I did not buy the Eberron or Forgotten Realms 4e stuff with any intent to play in either setting, I did it for stuff to pilfer from them (mostly the races and classes). If the rules info for the Campaign Classics book was good (and varied), I am sure it would sell. If it consisted of settings that were pretty varied in each volume, it would move. Also, the side campaigns would draw people from existing worlds to buy the book, since it would be added support for the world they play in. Even something like three settings in 160 page book would be an okay model, since it would increase the likelihood of there being something the DM would find useful in there (perhaps one classic stand-alone, a classic side-campaign, and a new campaign world).
It was just a thought.
This is a D&D 4e conversion playtest document for Races of Ansalon, a D&D 3.5 sourcebook published by Margaret Weis Productions. The document has been posted here for playtesting purposes and, should you decide to use this in your D&D 4e game, we would very much like any feedback and questions you may have on the Dragonlance Nexus Forums.
Click here to download (127 KB)
[D&D 4e] Races of Ansalon Conversion Document
This is a D&D 4e conversion playtest document for Races of Ansalon, a D&D 3.5 sourcebook published by Margaret Weis Productions. The document has been posted here for playtesting purposes and, should you decide to use this in your D&D 4e game, we would very much like any feedback and questions you may have on the Dragonlance Nexus Forums.Click here to download (127 KB)
What about it, Cam Banks made that document almost two years ago. Not a sign of anything.
[D&D 4e] Races of Ansalon Conversion Document
This is a D&D 4e conversion playtest document for Races of Ansalon, a D&D 3.5 sourcebook published by Margaret Weis Productions. The document has been posted here for playtesting purposes and, should you decide to use this in your D&D 4e game, we would very much like any feedback and questions you may have on the Dragonlance Nexus Forums.Click here to download (127 KB)
.... Not a sign of anything.
Not suppose to a sign, it's only reposted for those who're interested in doin' somethin' different with their campaigns, - afterall, this is a "settings" thread.
[D&D 4e] Races of Ansalon Conversion Document
This is a D&D 4e conversion playtest document for Races of Ansalon, a D&D 3.5 sourcebook published by Margaret Weis Productions. The document has been posted here for playtesting purposes and, should you decide to use this in your D&D 4e game, we would very much like any feedback and questions you may have on the Dragonlance Nexus Forums.Click here to download (127 KB)
.... Not a sign of anything.
Not suppose to a sign, it's only reposted for those who're interested in doin' somethin' different with their campaigns, - afterall, this is a "settings" thread.
It's a NEW Settings thread. Not a "old settings revamped to 4e by a third party" thread.
[D&D 4e] Races of Ansalon Conversion Document
This is a D&D 4e conversion playtest document for Races of Ansalon, a D&D 3.5 sourcebook published by Margaret Weis Productions. The document has been posted here for playtesting purposes and, should you decide to use this in your D&D 4e game, we would very much like any feedback and questions you may have on the Dragonlance Nexus Forums.Click here to download (127 KB)
.... Not a sign of anything.
Not suppose to a sign, it's only reposted for those who're interested in doin' somethin' different with their campaigns, - afterall, this is a "settings" thread.
It's a NEW Settings thread. Not a "old settings revamped to 4e by a third party" thread.
don't ya ever stop crying?
Uncalled for... I think so.
Once again, I am a DL fan, I saw that particular piece of fandom the day it came out, talked about it with the person who wrote it, and all that. I would like to see more from Cam, but he has other endeavors that he is involved with.
Back on topic, I really want to see an arctic based campaign (complete with tiles).
On topic, I'd like to see support for running Swashbuckling campaigns, as well as Oriental and Arabic types. That Tundra one you mentioned Silver_blaze sounds great too.
I don't think we need new classes for these, since the 4e classes work marvellously in all settings; it's just I want fluff that deals with that sort of setting and running a game with that.
It would probably only be a DM book, though I guess Player feats and PPaths and Backgrounds and a couple EDests might be appropriate.
I'm not crying…
On topic, I'd like to see support for running Swashbuckling campaigns, as well as Oriental and Arabic types. That Tundra one you mentioned Silver_blaze sounds great too.
I don't think we need new classes for these, since the 4e classes work marvellously in all settings; it's just I want fluff that deals with that sort of setting and running a game with that.
It would probably only be a DM book, though I guess Player feats and PPaths and Backgrounds and a couple EDests might be appropriate.
Red Steel... Woo-hoo! ...need mutant rules.
Then we can have Gamma World again!
Hum...
Caught between "Woow! Cool!" and "I wonder how long until Caverns of Chaos" comes out.
Then we can have Gamma World again!
www.amazon.com/Gamma-World-Roleplaying-G...
Then we can have Gamma World again!
www.amazon.com/Gamma-World-Roleplaying-G...
KKKooooollll!!!
Then we can use these mutations for a Red Steel background!!! Woow!