Oversized racial trait - Downloaded from the Wizards Community, all coding removed by Solauren

Oversized racial trait

Post/Author/DateTime Post
#1
guest1026868146_dup
Mar 16, 2009 16:22:54 It seems to me that they are removing the oversized weapons trait from the races. When they released the dragon magazine article about the Minotaur they removed that ability and know that it is confirmed that the Goliath also does not have the oversized ability it makes me wonder if they are going to remove it entirely. The Bugbear can't be the only race to be able to wield a massive sword or ax, are they?

On a similar note, does this remove the hope of a monkey grip feat?
#2
Mirtek
Mar 16, 2009 16:28:43 I don't know which desiger said it, but after the dragon article on minotaurs one of the designers stated that no player race would ever get the oversized trait.

PS: The MM write ups, while they can be used as such, are not supposed to be player races.
#3
doctorhook
Mar 16, 2009 16:29:02
It seems to me that they are removing the oversized weapons trait from the races. When they released the dragon magazine article about the Minotaur they removed that ability and know that it is confirmed that the Goliath also does not have the oversized ability it makes me wonder if they are going to remove it entirely. The Bugbear can't be the only race to be able to wield a massive sword or ax, are they?

On a similar note, does this remove the hope of a monkey grip feat?

Let's hope so. Oversized weapon capabilities would instantly become a "must-have" for any character who uses powers with the Weapon keyword, and anyone without it would be suboptimal. In effect, it's not an additional option for characters, because it becomes a de facto requirement for your character.
#4
doctorhook
Mar 16, 2009 16:29:37
I don't know which desiger said it, but after the dragon article on minotaurs one of the designers stated that no player race would ever get the oversized trait.

That was Mike Mearls.
#5
Ramien
Mar 16, 2009 16:50:43 That and an 1d12 brutal 2 weapon that gets an oversized upgrade ends up sitting at 2d6 brutal 2, which is nigh-pointless if you apply it to the total of the roll, and definitely overpowered if you apply it to each die. (I houseruled it to brutal 1, applied to each die).
#6
splinters
Mar 16, 2009 16:52:54 Praise be to the end of that trait. As much as I loved the IDEA the mechanics were too good for the games own good.
#7
Crimson_Concerto
Mar 16, 2009 17:37:55
That and an 1d12 brutal 2 weapon that gets an oversized upgrade ends up sitting at 2d6 brutal 2, which is nigh-pointless if you apply it to the total of the roll, and definitely overpowered if you apply it to each die.

Actually, a 1D12 Brutal 2 weapon being upgraded to a 2D6 Brutal 2 weapon is no more overpowered than a 2D6 weapon being upgraded to a 2D8 weapon. 2D6 Brutal 2 and 2D8 actually have the same average damage of 9, the difference being that 2D8 has a higher maximum damage by 4 and a lower minimum damage by 4.

However, my concern with the ability isn't that it's overpowered. It's bad design to grant the ability to a PC race because it pigeon-holes members of the race into playing weapon-using classes or else lose out on a major racial benefit, and this is completely contrary to the 4E PC race design philosophy that every race should be able to function reasonably well as a member of any class.

Post/Author/DateTime	Post
#1 guest1026868146_dup Mar 16, 2009 16:22:54	It seems to me that they are removing the oversized weapons trait from the races. When they released the dragon magazine article about the Minotaur they removed that ability and know that it is confirmed that the Goliath also does not have the oversized ability it makes me wonder if they are going to remove it entirely. The Bugbear can't be the only race to be able to wield a massive sword or ax, are they? On a similar note, does this remove the hope of a monkey grip feat?
#2 Mirtek Mar 16, 2009 16:28:43	I don't know which desiger said it, but after the dragon article on minotaurs one of the designers stated that no player race would ever get the oversized trait. PS: The MM write ups, while they can be used as such, are not supposed to be player races.
#3 doctorhook Mar 16, 2009 16:29:02	It seems to me that they are removing the oversized weapons trait from the races. When they released the dragon magazine article about the Minotaur they removed that ability and know that it is confirmed that the Goliath also does not have the oversized ability it makes me wonder if they are going to remove it entirely. The Bugbear can't be the only race to be able to wield a massive sword or ax, are they? On a similar note, does this remove the hope of a monkey grip feat? Let's hope so. Oversized weapon capabilities would instantly become a "must-have" for any character who uses powers with the Weapon keyword, and anyone without it would be suboptimal. In effect, it's not an additional option for characters, because it becomes a de facto requirement for your character.
#4 doctorhook Mar 16, 2009 16:29:37	I don't know which desiger said it, but after the dragon article on minotaurs one of the designers stated that no player race would ever get the oversized trait. That was Mike Mearls.
#5 Ramien Mar 16, 2009 16:50:43	That and an 1d12 brutal 2 weapon that gets an oversized upgrade ends up sitting at 2d6 brutal 2, which is nigh-pointless if you apply it to the total of the roll, and definitely overpowered if you apply it to each die. (I houseruled it to brutal 1, applied to each die).
#6 splinters Mar 16, 2009 16:52:54	Praise be to the end of that trait. As much as I loved the IDEA the mechanics were too good for the games own good.
#7 Crimson_Concerto Mar 16, 2009 17:37:55	That and an 1d12 brutal 2 weapon that gets an oversized upgrade ends up sitting at 2d6 brutal 2, which is nigh-pointless if you apply it to the total of the roll, and definitely overpowered if you apply it to each die. Actually, a 1D12 Brutal 2 weapon being upgraded to a 2D6 Brutal 2 weapon is no more overpowered than a 2D6 weapon being upgraded to a 2D8 weapon. 2D6 Brutal 2 and 2D8 actually have the same average damage of 9, the difference being that 2D8 has a higher maximum damage by 4 and a lower minimum damage by 4. However, my concern with the ability isn't that it's overpowered. It's bad design to grant the ability to a PC race because it pigeon-holes members of the race into playing weapon-using classes or else lose out on a major racial benefit, and this is completely contrary to the 4E PC race design philosophy that every race should be able to function reasonably well as a member of any class.