PHB2 Excerpt Feats - Downloaded from the Wizards Community, all coding removed by Solauren

PHB2 Excerpt Feats

Post/Author/DateTime Post
#1
Keenath
Mar 09, 2009 9:16:38 This article was pretty interesting to me. Normally feat lists are dull as dust to me, but this one had some cool stuff.

In particular, this one:
Melee Training - Change ability used for melee basic weapon attacks

That's awesome. Hey, look, Charisma-paladins can actually hit with their OAs now... Though I do hope the full text specifically notes that you can't change the ability score for powers that can be treated as a basic attack, but only a literal Basic Attack. You can't make Shield Bash use wisdom, and you can't make Probing Attack use dexterity (assuming you can get them from a multiclass, for example).

Distant Advantage Gain combat advantage with ranged and area attacks against flanked enemies

Crossbow rogues no longer need to invest heavily in stealth if they don't want to...

Goliath Greatweapon Prowess - Gain proficiency, +2 damage with two-handed melee weapons

This one makes me go "huh?" It seems a little too strong to me -- gaining proficiency with all two handed melee weapons includes all the double weapons, greatspear, mordenkrad, execution axe... EVERYTHING. That's a wide array of superior weapons to choose from. I kinda get dwarves being able to gain proficiency with all the superior axes and hammers, and the eladrin spear thing, this just seems like it doesn't have the same racial background to it. The other racial weapon feats give you a nice advantage for going with the stereotype -- but "uses a two handed weapon" doesn't seem like much of a stereotype to me.

Maybe I'm being overly critical there, it just struck me as weird.

Implement Expertise - +1 to attack rolls with chosen implement

I'd go so far as to say it's going to be a nearly required feat for laser-clerics, wizards, warlocks... anyone who uses implements as a primary. Weapon Expertise may or may not be as good; this seems like a really strong choice particularly for those who are trying to work without a weapon proficiency bonus.

I rather hope we can get an official clarification that "weapon" abilities only apply when using a weapon as a weapon, and "implement" only applies when using an implement as an implement -- if you have an implement that is also a weapon (like a staff or dagger), you can't get Weapon benefits when using it to cast spells, and you can't get Implement benefits when using it to make weapon attacks... Because otherwise it's looking like weapon-implements are getting more and more powerful relative to implements that aren't weapons...
#2
darotwyn_dup
Mar 09, 2009 11:37:11 That's a good analysis, I agree on most points.

Goliath Greatweapon Prowess seems broken, but really, who is going to use more than one two handed superior weapon? All this is really is giving them a bonus to two handed weapons and the weapon proficiency feat in one package. Sure it also gives them a chance to use any two handed weapon they find adventuring, but usually with a good DM this isn't that big of deal either.

Also, I do believe that Implement Expertise and Weapon Expertise do not stack as they're from the same (feat) source. Therefore making it less of a concern.

Melee Training was greatly needed, I remember missing Weapon Finesse for a Rogue I was working on but this just blows that out of the water. Distance Advantage was also needed and is perfect for any ranged based attacker. It also makes tons of sense from a realistic standpoint.
#3
Lechteron
Mar 09, 2009 11:38:03 Goliath Greatweapon Prowess seems to be their way of replacing Oversized for a race that should have it otherwise.
#4
greatfrito
Mar 09, 2009 11:43:58 The Greatweapon Prowess feat looks like it'll be along the lines of the Dwarven and Eladrin proficiency feats - a bit better, if you're going to use two-handers anyways, but (assuming that +2 will be a feat bonus) pretty much along the lines of the other "racial weapon training" feats. Actually, it looks like a fairly elegant solution for removing Oversized (though I would have gone for an actual racial bonus, perhaps - oh well, I guess that just means my Half-Giants will be more unique from Goliaths).
#5
darotwyn_dup
Mar 09, 2009 11:47:34
Goliath Greatweapon Prowess seems to be their way of replacing Oversized for a race that should have it otherwise.

I'm hoping for their racial paragon path to take care of that, or maybe a return of the Monkey Grip feat. I think it would be alright in Paragon or Epic compared to Heroic tier. Of course, this is wishful thinking.
#6
_Mithreinmaethor_
Mar 09, 2009 11:49:07
Goliath Greatweapon Prowess - Gain proficiency, +2 damage with two-handed melee weapons

This one makes me go "huh?" It seems a little too strong to me -- gaining proficiency with all two handed melee weapons includes all the double weapons, greatspear, mordenkrad, execution axe... EVERYTHING. That's a wide array of superior weapons to choose from. I kinda get dwarves being able to gain proficiency with all the superior axes and hammers, and the eladrin spear thing, this just seems like it doesn't have the same racial background to it. The other racial weapon feats give you a nice advantage for going with the stereotype -- but "uses a two handed weapon" doesn't seem like much of a stereotype to me.

Double weapons are not 2 handed weapons, they are double weapons. The only double weapons that are 2 handed are the Quarterstaff and Spiked chain if you take the appropriate multiclass feats.
#7
big_pete
Mar 09, 2009 22:39:29 I like these ones

Combat Medic (Trained in Heal)
Stabilize the dying as minor action, +2 to Heal checks

This can really help a supporting character keep those front line fighters on their feet.

Timely Respite
Second wind or total defense grants saving throw

Lets you get rid of that nasty effect earlier (perhaps gives a 2nd chance at ebnd of round too); helps get you back into the fight alot quicker. - Very useful, but probably overlooked alot.

Post/Author/DateTime	Post
#1 Keenath Mar 09, 2009 9:16:38	This article was pretty interesting to me. Normally feat lists are dull as dust to me, but this one had some cool stuff. In particular, this one: Melee Training - Change ability used for melee basic weapon attacks That's awesome. Hey, look, Charisma-paladins can actually hit with their OAs now... Though I do hope the full text specifically notes that you can't change the ability score for powers that can be treated as a basic attack, but only a literal Basic Attack. You can't make Shield Bash use wisdom, and you can't make Probing Attack use dexterity (assuming you can get them from a multiclass, for example). Distant Advantage Gain combat advantage with ranged and area attacks against flanked enemies Crossbow rogues no longer need to invest heavily in stealth if they don't want to... Goliath Greatweapon Prowess - Gain proficiency, +2 damage with two-handed melee weapons This one makes me go "huh?" It seems a little too strong to me -- gaining proficiency with all two handed melee weapons includes all the double weapons, greatspear, mordenkrad, execution axe... EVERYTHING. That's a wide array of superior weapons to choose from. I kinda get dwarves being able to gain proficiency with all the superior axes and hammers, and the eladrin spear thing, this just seems like it doesn't have the same racial background to it. The other racial weapon feats give you a nice advantage for going with the stereotype -- but "uses a two handed weapon" doesn't seem like much of a stereotype to me. Maybe I'm being overly critical there, it just struck me as weird. Implement Expertise - +1 to attack rolls with chosen implement I'd go so far as to say it's going to be a nearly required feat for laser-clerics, wizards, warlocks... anyone who uses implements as a primary. Weapon Expertise may or may not be as good; this seems like a really strong choice particularly for those who are trying to work without a weapon proficiency bonus. I rather hope we can get an official clarification that "weapon" abilities only apply when using a weapon as a weapon, and "implement" only applies when using an implement as an implement -- if you have an implement that is also a weapon (like a staff or dagger), you can't get Weapon benefits when using it to cast spells, and you can't get Implement benefits when using it to make weapon attacks... Because otherwise it's looking like weapon-implements are getting more and more powerful relative to implements that aren't weapons...
#2 darotwyn_dup Mar 09, 2009 11:37:11	That's a good analysis, I agree on most points. Goliath Greatweapon Prowess seems broken, but really, who is going to use more than one two handed superior weapon? All this is really is giving them a bonus to two handed weapons and the weapon proficiency feat in one package. Sure it also gives them a chance to use any two handed weapon they find adventuring, but usually with a good DM this isn't that big of deal either. Also, I do believe that Implement Expertise and Weapon Expertise do not stack as they're from the same (feat) source. Therefore making it less of a concern. Melee Training was greatly needed, I remember missing Weapon Finesse for a Rogue I was working on but this just blows that out of the water. Distance Advantage was also needed and is perfect for any ranged based attacker. It also makes tons of sense from a realistic standpoint.
#3 Lechteron Mar 09, 2009 11:38:03	Goliath Greatweapon Prowess seems to be their way of replacing Oversized for a race that should have it otherwise.
#4 greatfrito Mar 09, 2009 11:43:58	The Greatweapon Prowess feat looks like it'll be along the lines of the Dwarven and Eladrin proficiency feats - a bit better, if you're going to use two-handers anyways, but (assuming that +2 will be a feat bonus) pretty much along the lines of the other "racial weapon training" feats. Actually, it looks like a fairly elegant solution for removing Oversized (though I would have gone for an actual racial bonus, perhaps - oh well, I guess that just means my Half-Giants will be more unique from Goliaths).
#5 darotwyn_dup Mar 09, 2009 11:47:34	Goliath Greatweapon Prowess seems to be their way of replacing Oversized for a race that should have it otherwise. I'm hoping for their racial paragon path to take care of that, or maybe a return of the Monkey Grip feat. I think it would be alright in Paragon or Epic compared to Heroic tier. Of course, this is wishful thinking.
#6 _Mithreinmaethor_ Mar 09, 2009 11:49:07	Goliath Greatweapon Prowess - Gain proficiency, +2 damage with two-handed melee weapons This one makes me go "huh?" It seems a little too strong to me -- gaining proficiency with all two handed melee weapons *includes all the double weapons*, greatspear, mordenkrad, execution axe... EVERYTHING. That's a wide array of superior weapons to choose from. I kinda get dwarves being able to gain proficiency with all the superior axes and hammers, and the eladrin spear thing, this just seems like it doesn't have the same racial background to it. The other racial weapon feats give you a nice advantage for going with the stereotype -- but "uses a two handed weapon" doesn't seem like much of a stereotype to me. Double weapons are not 2 handed weapons, they are double weapons. The only double weapons that are 2 handed are the Quarterstaff and Spiked chain if you take the appropriate multiclass feats.
#7 big_pete Mar 09, 2009 22:39:29	I like these ones Combat Medic (Trained in Heal) Stabilize the dying as minor action, +2 to Heal checks This can really help a supporting character keep those front line fighters on their feet. Timely Respite Second wind or total defense grants saving throw Lets you get rid of that nasty effect earlier (perhaps gives a 2nd chance at ebnd of round too); helps get you back into the fight alot quicker. - Very useful, but probably overlooked alot.