However, some form of Anthropomorph would be interesting, especially if it came in a flavor other than "We Have One Class Feature" shifters.
The primary issue is that the tiger man is facing the wrong way. It's an odd composition.
Yeah thats what confuses me, its standing like its part of the group but the dragon there seems to suggest that he's a monster their fighting.
Tiger is looking at the dragon too.
Yeah its weird, but it could just be that its a fellow adventurer who's annoyed with the party familar...or a weretiger. So now we have two contenders; a tiger man or a crystal humanoid
Tiger is looking at the dragon too.
Yea, i think the tiger's supposed to be figthing the dragon familair/summon.
Yeah its weird, but it could just be that its a fellow adventurer who's annoyed with the party familar...or a weretiger. So now we have two contenders; a tiger man or a crystal humanoid
Really saying that weretigers are in the running as a PHB3 race, because one is being attacked by a familiar in an image from an issue of Dragon that has an article about familiar powers, is kind of a stretch.
Wilden are plants, unless they were completely re-written, but the CB update wasn't that substantial.
CB update stated their appearance and characteristics, and did update a few sentences within that. So I'd say it's definitely not a Wilden. They're still Plant People, thank god.
I'm looking forward to seeing the new picture in the Wilden Debut article.
I really, really think this is either a monster (Were-tiger) being attacked by the party, or else a Razorclaw Shifter.
Tiger is looking at the dragon too.
Yeah its weird, but it could just be that its a fellow adventurer who's annoyed with the party familar...or a weretiger. So now we have two contenders; a tiger man or a crystal humanoid
No we don't. Those are both creatures/monsters. One is an enemy, the other is an enemy or summons. Neither are PC races.
i was thinking it was a weretiger and hoping it was an indication of lycanthrope being PC race options again.
Shifters are the lycanthrope PC race options.
. . . Hey, has anybody considered that they may just be adding new kinds of Shifters? A section of a few additional Shifter types constituting the place of the "fourth race"?
i was thinking it was a weretiger and hoping it was an indication of lycanthrope being PC race options again.
Shifters are the lycanthrope PC race options.
Don't forget druids, especially hybrid druids. Properly refluffed wildshape makes a passable lycanthropic transformation. Sneaky wererat, hybrid rogue|druid. Tough werebere, hybrid fighter|druid or barbarian|druid. It's not quite perfect though, as it only grants an humanoid form and animal form without a hybrid form.
. . . Hey, has anybody considered that they may just be adding new kinds of Shifters? A section of a few additional Shifter types constituting the place of the "fourth race"?
Much as i would love some more shifter variants, if we didn't get them in either PH2 or EPG, I don't expect to see them in PH3. Maybe Dragon article (worked for genasi).
Much as i would love some more shifter variants, if we didn't get them in either PH2 or EPG, I don't expect to see them in PH3.
I don't think that's entirely true. I mean, the PHB2 is where they were introduced, and introducing three of them at once might have been a bit overwhelming when you consider that it would make them just under half of the races in that book. And as for the EPG, that book had three other races to worry about, and any more might have been similarly overwhelming. Plus, putting new Shifters in the EPG may give the odd impression that some Shifters are for Eberron and some aren't? I don't know...
Maybe Dragon article (worked for genasi).
That would be cool...
A Bear Shifter would be awesome... probably +CON/+WIS... I wonder what its power would look like. Maybe a bonus to Fortitude or saves or damage resist?
The first Plane Below excerpt mentions "Eisk Jaats," beings of elemental cold enslaved by frost giants. If you look at the art gallery for that book, there's a picture of some race that seems to match that description. Perhaps they will recieve an NPC writeup in the book to be followed by an appearance in the PH3? It's a stretch, but no more of one than assuming that what seemed pretty clearly to be a were-tiger (right down to the katars) is the fourth race. In all honesty, I don't expect wizards to slyly reveal the final race in some art spot, much less in a dragon magazine it isn't featured in. I don't know that there is a precedent for revealing a race's art before the race itself. If you recall, they kept the 4e genasi art secret until just about the release of the FRPG, even though we knew they'd be in the book for a long time. We even had stats for them long before we knew what they looked like.
And we have minotaurs all through Primal Power, and we aren't getting their official pc write up until PH3
over, Over, OVERREACTION HOOOOOOO!!!!!!!!!!!
i was thinking it was a weretiger and hoping it was an indication of lycanthrope being PC race options again.
Shifters are the lycanthrope PC race options.
Don't forget druids, especially hybrid druids. Properly refluffed wildshape makes a passable lycanthropic transformation. Sneaky wererat, hybrid rogue|druid. Tough werebere, hybrid fighter|druid or barbarian|druid. It's not quite perfect though, as it only grants an humanoid form and animal form without a hybrid form.. . . Hey, has anybody considered that they may just be adding new kinds of Shifters? A section of a few additional Shifter types constituting the place of the "fourth race"?
Much as i would love some more shifter variants, if we didn't get them in either PH2 or EPG, I don't expect to see them in PH3. Maybe Dragon article (worked for genasi).
You can just have the wild-shaped form be a hybrid form.
You can just have the wild-shaped form be a hybrid form.
Not without sending a royalty check to this guy first.
Sometimes I think the devs at WotC were just playing Diablo 2 when they had to come up with the Shaman, Druid and Warden
I don't know that there is a precedent for revealing a race's art before the race itself. If you recall, they kept the 4e genasi art secret until just about the release of the FRPG, even though we knew they'd be in the book for a long time. We even had stats for them long before we knew what they looked like.
The minotaur was first revealed to be in PH3 when we saw the cover art- officially, they havn't actually announced minotaurs as playable yet. Nevertheless, a minotaur got an art piece in Primal power.
And the Gnoll got an art piece in AV2, wielding epic-level amunition...
You can just have the wild-shaped form be a hybrid form.
Maybe, but a proper hybrid from should still be able to wield weapons. Either way though the druid trick still only has two forms.
I don't think that's entirely true. I mean, the PHB2 is where they were introduced,
Well except counting the Monster Mannual.
over, Over, OVERREACTION HOOOOOOO!!!!!!!!!!!
This post wins.
/thread
over, Over, OVERREACTION HOOOOOOO!!!!!!!!!!!
LMAO!!! Absolutely brilliant!!!
We need an underwater civilisation.
I still say Horseshoecrabfolks.
We need an underwater civilisation.
I agree. We need an underwater race. And no, the Water Genasi does not count, they are 1/5 of a race and not all that cool.
The race shouldn't have penalties for going on normal, terrestrial adventures. And because of balance, it better be a humanoid.
EDIT: Make that a Small or Medium humanoid. No large races. Or larger than large.
Merfolk could actually theoretically be possible if they went with the version of them where they're shape-changers that can turn their fins into legs and don't have racial features that are aquatic-exclusive (other than a swim speed and water-breathing, of course)...
I would like to see that, though aquatic races that shapechange has been done before (see Dragonlance).
The biggest problem that most people seem to see with aquatic races is that aquatic races necessitate aquatic campaigns. This is, of course, not true. Just because a race has increased functionality in the water does not mean the entire campaign must revolve around that.
Until then, I stand by the Gnoll's appearance in AV2.
Also MTG merfolk sometimes have legs
And Aquatic elf has always been a cool race in my mind
Not that these are guesses as to the forth race, I have no idea what that'll be
We already have three and a half elves.
If we really want an aquatic race, we can do better than another elf.
I'm also not sure that Deep Ones would be the way to go because of the whole evil thing, but I actually really like the MTG pic you posted. It reminds me of that thing from Darkstalkers, Rikou. I think that'd make a cool race. Heck, he's even completely functional on land, which is great...
PLEASE, no more elves.
We already have three and a half elves.
If we really want an aquatic race, we can do better than another elf.
Definitely no more elves in PHBs. In setting books, fine. But not in a base core book.
The primary issue is that the tiger man is facing the wrong way. It's an odd composition.
No, I disagree. It's particularly clever, because it seems to depict the party acheiving a flank, or otherwise distracting the were-tiger to get combat advantage. It's a good visual representation of the type of game tactics common to 4E.
PLEASE, no more elves.
We already have three and a half elves.
And we have 5 or 6 humans, with one more on the way. Yet no one ever says, "No more humans!"
PLEASE, no more elves.
We already have three and a half elves.
And we have 5 or 6 humans, with one more on the way. Yet no one ever says, "No more humans!"
No More Humans!
More exotic races like Thri-kreen (sp?) and such would be more interesting.
So you basically have to include aquatic environments, because otherwise they'll never get to use their racial attributes, but if you take the party into the water, then you're probably going to give everybody aque-lungs or something fantastically similar, in which case the character would probably been better off just playing a different race and wear a magic aque-lung as well.
The usage of such racial features are so situational, because it really requires the DM to create situations where the aquatic character has to do something swimming or water breathing on their own to help the party achieve something where they don't need to go into the water, such as swimming through an underwater sewer track to get inside a fountain in a castle garden and unlocking the front gates for the other characters or something similar.
But those are very situational moments. In general, racial powers and features should be stuff that you're able to use pretty much every or every other combat/social encounter. You'd need quite a lot of these sewer systems to make it applicable. Maybe in an Underdark campaign, but again, we're talking an out of the ordinary campaign setting, and all races should be able to be at full functionality in all situations.
Aquatic abilities really should remain with certain utility powers for that reason.
The problem with aquatic races is that while they may be functional in Terrestrial Campaigns, they lack any racial features in that case, because water-breathing and fast swimming stuff takes up the racial features. They pretty much would just become a set of Ability Score and skill modifiers.
I'm not sure that I agree with this. The Aquatic keyword and breathing underwater shouldn't take up very much room in the race at all, as it's not that mechanically significant, and I guess you could make the case that a swim speed woud take up some more significant room, but then that would still leave plenty of room for another feature or two and a racial power, especially if the swim speed is lower, like 5, maybe even their land speed.
I agree that it's difficult and maybe still a bit swingy, but it's not completely out of the question if done properly.
And we have 5 or 6 humans, with one more on the way. Yet no one ever says, "No more humans!"
The problem with this rationale is that every race in the game is 'human'. Elves are humans with pointy ears, dwarves are stocky humans, halfings are short humans, genasi are elemental humans, dragonborn are humans with dragon heads, etc... The races of DnD are derived from our anthrocentric world view and thus are pretty much special variations of human being. Putting a whole ton of elves in the game is annoying to some folks because it basically says that this one special niche variation of human is more special than all the other nich variations, for no meaningful reason.
The problem with this rationale is that every race in the game is 'human'. Elves are humans with pointy ears, dwarves are stocky humans, halfings are short humans, genasi are elemental humans, dragonborn are humans with dragon heads, etc... The races of DnD are derived from our anthrocentric world view and thus are pretty much special variations of human being. Putting a whole ton of elves in the game is annoying to some folks because it basically says that this one special niche variation of human is more special than all the other nich variations, for no meaningful reason.
^^^ The Truth ^^^
I see water-breathing and swim take up about the same amount as elf longbow proficency and wild step (respectivly). That leaves room for a good racial, or a racial and another small bonus feature.
Water Soul Genasi didn't get the swim, and their Power was aquatic related. They got Water Breathing and a racial bonus to saving throws ability. Any aquatic race is going to have to compare itself to Water Soul. Caustic Soul was very similar, only with an Acid bent to it.
A race that gets Water Breathing and Swim speed wouldn't have room for another racial feature besides a power, or else would have to sacrifice their power like the Dwarf does for more racial features.
And it's more than likely the power would want to be aquatic-based as well, to go with the theme, unless you can think of a better power that would fit the race.
The problem with this rationale is that every race in the game is 'human'. Elves are humans with pointy ears, dwarves are stocky humans, halfings are short humans, genasi are elemental humans, dragonborn are humans with dragon heads, etc... The races of DnD are derived from our anthrocentric world view and thus are pretty much special variations of human being. Putting a whole ton of elves in the game is annoying to some folks because it basically says that this one special niche variation of human is more special than all the other nich variations, for no meaningful reason.
^^^ The Truth ^^^
Well, hopefully the Thri-Kreen will satisfy the need for more savage humanoids once Dark Sun is released this summer.
PLEASE, no more elves.
We already have three and a half elves.
If we really want an aquatic race, we can do better than another elf.
Sea-Elves, might not be true elves. They might be a completely unrelated race of aquatic fey that only are called elves by naive mortals.
Water Soul Genasi didn't get the swim, and their Power was aquatic related.
Huh? Swift-Current isn't aquatic-related at all. It arguably doesn't even actually work underwater, unless you're down on the lake bed or sea floor.
A race that gets Water Breathing and Swim speed wouldn't have room for another racial feature besides a power, or else would have to sacrifice their power like the Dwarf does for more racial features.
Well, the Dwarf doesn't actually sacrifice its racial power. It's just that one of its racial features, Dwarven Resilience, is its racial power, and it's not bad racial power at all.
That said, the Water Soul Genasi (and Genasi in genral, come to think of it) are on the rather lacking side as far as races go in terms of racial features. I think that giving a race the Aquatic keyword (comes with water breathing) and a slow swim speed of 5 would leave plenty of room for another mid-power racial feature and a racial power.
And it's more than likely the power would want to be aquatic-based as well, to go with the theme, unless you can think of a better power that would fit the race.
Why should it be assumed that "we live under water" is the only interesting thing that a race should be able to bring to the table. Indeed, if that's the only interesting thing about a race, then it's not a very good race.
I actually think that this sort of conversation is a bit ironic, because I'm usually the one getting (falsely) accused of being rigid and unwilling to experiment as far as racial design goes.
Water Soul Genasi didn't get the swim, and their Power was aquatic related.
Huh? Swift-Current isn't aquatic-related at all. It arguably doesn't even actually work underwater, unless you're down on the lake bed or sea floor.A race that gets Water Breathing and Swim speed wouldn't have room for another racial feature besides a power, or else would have to sacrifice their power like the Dwarf does for more racial features.
Well, the Dwarf doesn't actually sacrifice its racial power. It's just that one of its racial features, Dwarven Resilience, is its racial power, and it's not bad racial power at all.
That said, the Water Soul Genasi (and Genasi in genral, come to think of it) are on the rather lacking side as far as races go in terms of racial features. I think that giving a race the Aquatic keyword (comes with water breathing) and a slow swim speed of 5 would leave plenty of room for another mid-power racial feature and a racial power.And it's more than likely the power would want to be aquatic-based as well, to go with the theme, unless you can think of a better power that would fit the race.
Why should it be assumed that "we live under water" is the only interesting thing that a race should be able to bring to the table. Indeed, if that's the only interesting thing about a race, then it's not a very good race.
I actually think that this sort of conversation is a bit ironic, because I'm usually the one getting (falsely) accused of being rigid and unwilling to experiment as far as racial design goes.
My bad – I glanced over Swift Current, and missed that it works over Ground as well as liquid terrain. That makes it a bit better for a terrestial environment.
I too, would love a winged-race, that gets paragon flight, but alas, so much resources go into that component of their lifestyle that it feels like "aerial x" or "aquatic x."
I'd be interested in the race, but I don't know if it can be tailored to fit into any campaign, and that should be a requirement of every race – to have a place in any campaign if desired so.
And we have 5 or 6 humans, with one more on the way. Yet no one ever says, "No more humans!"
The problem with this rationale is that every race in the game is 'human'. Elves are humans with pointy ears, dwarves are stocky humans, halfings are short humans, genasi are elemental humans, dragonborn are humans with dragon heads, etc... The races of DnD are derived from our anthrocentric world view and thus are pretty much special variations of human being. Putting a whole ton of elves in the game is annoying to some folks because it basically says that this one special niche variation of human is more special than all the other nich variations, for no meaningful reason.
And the problem with your little dismissal is that you're saying the races are just human traits with crap tacked on. I'm talking about actual humans in the game.
Humans are humans.
Half-Eleves and Half-Orcs and Muls are part human.
Shadar-Kai are humans, actual humans, tainted by the Shadowfell.
Genasi are humans altered by the Elemental Chaos.
Tieflings are humans altered by an ancient pact.
Half-Giants, if they get made, or Dark Sun Goliaths if not, are part human.
Those aren't just "humans with a slight appearance change." They are actual humans altered by various conditions.
People bitch and whine about the different types of elves and their supposedly few differences and supposed "niche favoritism." But there are more humans that follow that than elves. And any claim that every race is really just "human" not only misses the point entirely, it's a flat out refusal to accept reality.
Shadar-kai have also suggestion side-bars that give other origins, but that's different because the established "core" fluff is that they were once humans.
Yes, human's might get subspecies or half-children, but you have to say What Measure is a Non-Human? – At what point does that human race have evolved into something... other.
In past editions, Githyanki and Githzerai were humans from the end of time that were changed by evolution and by Mind Flayer breeding and slavery, and brought back with them. That's an example of races having evolved so much they look quite different. Same with the human-origin Genasi story (though evolution is probably the wrong word in this case, because it's a mutation from elemental contamination).
But I guess we could say that some of these races have changed enough they're "no longer human."
What Measure is a Non-Human
What measure is a non-elf?
Maybe these aquatic elves were once Elves, and now they are something else which means it would not be adding to the list of elves.
You have to work a lot harder to drop a bunch of "Furry" races into a campaign, especially when not every DM wants a bunch of Squirrel people being a common race in their campaign.
And the problem with your little dismissal is that you're saying the races are just human traits with crap tacked on.
Exactly. All the races in DnD are just humans with traits and crap tacked on.
People bitch and whine about the different types of elves and their supposedly few differences and supposed "niche favoritism." But there are more humans that follow that than elves. And any claim that every race is really just "human" not only misses the point entirely, it's a flat out refusal to accept reality.
Its a refusal to accept reality when you fail to recognize that DnD is a game made by human beings from the view point of human beings and that all the races are obviously human beings with little traits tacked on. People don't tend care that there are a ton of races that are human derived in the fluff because when you look at every race in the game its obvious that they all conceptially come out of some variation on the human mold. When one of those specific molds gets repeated over and over again people complain though, since there are a million other more original takes on human variation that haven't been explored.
I must admit, I have been converted to the cause of the Horseshoecrabfolk. :D
Awesome :D
Though I was thinking of giving them the more serious name 'Limulian'. Though your 'Cheliceran' name is nice too.
I'm just wonderin' if I should pitch it to Dragon or just put it up here >.>
I must admit, I have been converted to the cause of the Horseshoecrabfolk. :D
Awesome :D
Though I was thinking of giving them the more serious name 'Limulian'. Though your 'Cheliceran' name is nice too.
I'm just wonderin' if I should pitch it to Dragon or just put it up here >.>
I dunno if these forums could wait that long for Dragon to accept/refuse it. I know i have already hunted these forums twice to see if you have posted stats!
I must admit, I have been converted to the cause of the Horseshoecrabfolk. :D
Awesome :D
Though I was thinking of giving them the more serious name 'Limulian'. Though your 'Cheliceran' name is nice too.
I'm just wonderin' if I should pitch it to Dragon or just put it up here >.>
I dunno if these forums could wait that long for Dragon to accept/refuse it. I know i have already hunted these forums twice to see if you have posted stats!
That's a heck of a lot of pressure :p
(But give us an inside scope if you can)
I'm all for monstrous humanoids. I've wanted Horseshoecrabfolk for a while now.
See, when I hear horseshoecrapfolk, I just think of a actual horseshoe crap but with a tophat and a British accent...
Though I was thinking of giving them the more serious name 'Limulian'. Though your 'Cheliceran' name is nice too.
How's the fluff on them coming, by the by? What would be their cultural and psychological quirks and traits?
See, when I hear horseshoecrabfolk, I just think of a actual horseshoe crab but with a tophat and a British accent...
That doesn't make for very adventurous critters though :p
Mine claim to be born from a drop of Melora's blood that fell into the ocean...but there's no telling how true that explaination is. They do have blue blood and her fickle, somewhat bipolar, temperament.
And altough they're aquatic they're more of the 'walk along the seafloor' style, they're actually lousy swimmers.
They used to have an empire beneath the waves off the coastline but they lost it to inner turmoil and Sahuagin. The communities left are carved out of cliffs, with half the town underwater where they farm lobsters, pearls and other underwater goods. They also make mercenary deal with coastal cities to protect their fishermen from Sahuagin and other underwater threat.
(Name)
Racial Traits
though it would be medium the exact proportions would be up to debate
Ability Scores: +2 Charisma +2 Inteligence
Speed: 5 squares (they are use to being in the water so it makes since they would be slower on land),
6 squares while swimming
Vision: Low-light vision
Language: Common, some kind of aquatic language
Skill Bonuses: +2 Athletics, +2 Arcana
Aquatic: You can breathe underwater
Diluted Blood: You have resist poison 5+one-half your level.
Call of the Sea: You can use the Call of the Sea as an encounter power
Call of the Deep
Your character calls upon the magic inherint within all bodies of water causing your foes to become lethargic and more prone to your attacks.
Encounter
Minor Action Personal
Effect: When you attack a creature next to you, you have a +1 bonus until the end of your next turn.
- This race would favor the Bard, Psion, and Warlock classes.