Ability Scores Adjust with Level. Feature? Bug? - Downloaded from the Wizards Community, all coding removed by Solauren

Ability Scores Adjust with Level. Feature? Bug?

Post/Author/DateTime Post
#1
jon_m
Aug 02, 2009 8:21:49 This one has me a bit perplexed...

When I increase or decrease a monster in level, all ability scores increase by 1 when the monster is increased to an even-numbered level, and decrease by 1 when decreased to an odd-numbered level.

I'm not saying this is wrong. However it's not in the DMG that way and it leads to some very strange things. You can try this at home:

Load up your standard Zombie Level 2 Brute into the editor, decrease it to level 1. It will now have INT 0. (And all of it's other stats have decreased by 1). If you raise it to Level 4, it now has INT 2. Is it supposed to get smarter?

It is also very noticeable when trying to decrease higher level animals to low levels. Load up a Tiger Level 6 Skirmisher. Make it Level 1. Now it has INT -1.

It is supposed to work like this? Should there be some kind of sanity filter so that you can't get into negative numbers? Is anyone else seeing this or is it a problem that is only showing up on my system with Windows XP running under Parallels Desktop in Mac OS X?

Jon
#2
charliebananas
Aug 02, 2009 8:29:44 I just tried on the Zombie and you are right, I had noticed the to hit numbers changing but not the stats...odd
#3
dalzig
Aug 02, 2009 10:11:43 Could be part of the new DMG2 Monster rules...
#4
jon_m
Aug 02, 2009 10:22:18 Yes. The increasing or decreasing of ability scores could easily be a new DMG2 rule. That's fine. I have no issues. There have been requests for tool tips or little help screens that tell you what to do and how things work. That would be a nice little addition.

It's allowing ability scores to hit 0 or even go into negative numbers that's the big problem. I'd call that a bug.

The trickier issue is increasing ability scores. If you're increasing the level on an animal or mindless undead, should it's ability score increase beyond what it started with? Should a tiger ever go beyond INT 2? Or a regular zombie beyond INT 1? It certainly would be a bit harder to add into the program. It probably doesn't really matter. As a DM you'll play the monster how you want to play the monster. It's just something I noticed as I was entering my monsters from my campaigns.
#5
zgrose
Aug 03, 2009 10:52:02 The DM is the sanity filter. =)

I'm not sure its a bug that your stats can go to zero while you're in process of customizing a creature since the creature is, by definition, in-between states. While the generic monster rules may or may not say to apply -1 every 2 levels, the actual score of the creature is to be determined by you, the creator anyway.
#6
superdeadsmurf
Aug 03, 2009 12:29:19 I think the builder is trying to apply the suggested ability scores for level X monsters in a haphazard way. Most of the time it should work fine - you should always check on those scores anyway, fiddle with them to change the monster's defenses, and make them make sense for the monster.
#7
mudbunny
Aug 03, 2009 18:48:33 I have added this to the list I will be passing up to WotC by email, and posting in the main Monster Builder Beta feature requests and bugs/technical issues thread.

Post/Author/DateTime	Post
#1 jon_m Aug 02, 2009 8:21:49	This one has me a bit perplexed... When I increase or decrease a monster in level, all ability scores increase by 1 when the monster is increased to an even-numbered level, and decrease by 1 when decreased to an odd-numbered level. I'm not saying this is wrong. However it's not in the DMG that way and it leads to some very strange things. You can try this at home: Load up your standard Zombie Level 2 Brute into the editor, decrease it to level 1. It will now have INT 0. (And all of it's other stats have decreased by 1). If you raise it to Level 4, it now has INT 2. Is it supposed to get smarter? It is also very noticeable when trying to decrease higher level animals to low levels. Load up a Tiger Level 6 Skirmisher. Make it Level 1. Now it has INT -1. It is supposed to work like this? Should there be some kind of sanity filter so that you can't get into negative numbers? Is anyone else seeing this or is it a problem that is only showing up on my system with Windows XP running under Parallels Desktop in Mac OS X? Jon
#2 charliebananas Aug 02, 2009 8:29:44	I just tried on the Zombie and you are right, I had noticed the to hit numbers changing but not the stats...odd
#3 dalzig Aug 02, 2009 10:11:43	Could be part of the new DMG2 Monster rules...
#4 jon_m Aug 02, 2009 10:22:18	Yes. The increasing or decreasing of ability scores could easily be a new DMG2 rule. That's fine. I have no issues. There have been requests for tool tips or little help screens that tell you what to do and how things work. That would be a nice little addition. It's allowing ability scores to hit 0 or even go into negative numbers that's the big problem. I'd call that a bug. The trickier issue is increasing ability scores. If you're increasing the level on an animal or mindless undead, should it's ability score increase beyond what it started with? Should a tiger ever go beyond INT 2? Or a regular zombie beyond INT 1? It certainly would be a bit harder to add into the program. It probably doesn't really matter. As a DM you'll play the monster how you want to play the monster. It's just something I noticed as I was entering my monsters from my campaigns.
#5 zgrose Aug 03, 2009 10:52:02	The DM is the sanity filter. =) I'm not sure its a bug that your stats can go to zero while you're in process of customizing a creature since the creature is, by definition, in-between states. While the generic monster rules may or may not say to apply -1 every 2 levels, the actual score of the creature is to be determined by you, the creator anyway.
#6 superdeadsmurf Aug 03, 2009 12:29:19	I think the builder is trying to apply the suggested ability scores for level X monsters in a haphazard way. Most of the time it should work fine - you should always check on those scores anyway, fiddle with them to change the monster's defenses, and make them make sense for the monster.
#7 mudbunny Aug 03, 2009 18:48:33	I have added this to the list I will be passing up to WotC by email, and posting in the main Monster Builder Beta feature requests and bugs/technical issues thread.