Am I rewarding bad behavior? - Downloaded from the Wizards Community, all coding removed by Solauren

Am I rewarding bad behavior?

Post/Author/DateTime Post
#1
hooliganbflo
Oct 03, 2010 16:20:00 I recently cancelled my subscription to DDi due to not feeling like much of an "insider" for the amount of cash I've given to WotC, and have been fairly skeptical of their ability to deliver additional tools.

HOWEVER, I would be ecstatic to eat those words and would be the first person to restart my sub, and convince everyone in my gaming circle that also cancelled DDi to resubscribe if the hints we've received lately meant additional tools in the next few weeks. Heck, I could even see myself dusting off the pom-poms and #1 FANBOY hat from when I assured people 3e D&D wasn't the end of the world at my FLGS.

Should I do that though? My main gripe with DDi has been the lack of information. From the refusing to mention upcoming DDi tools that are being worked on, a coherent explanation as to why the tools that were advertised/promised/mentioned (pick the word you like best) weren't delivered, and two years later what the direction of the DDi service is going to be. If they release another tool and I bolt for the nearest computer that I can cram my credit card information into to subscribe again, am I not telling WotC with my wallet that their lack of communication is fine with me?

So? Am I rewarding bad behavior?
#2
limejello10512
Oct 03, 2010 17:03:13 yes you are.

thankyou for warning me not to join....I thought they got that stuff up and running by now.
#3
Nyarlathotep
Oct 03, 2010 19:35:02 Who cares about their behavior? It's a business transaction. If their service is worth the money to you, subscribe. If it isn't, don't.

There is no moral judgment call to be made.
#4
salla
Oct 03, 2010 20:05:07
Who cares about their behavior? It's a business transaction. If their service is worth the money to you, subscribe. If it isn't, don't.

There is no moral judgment call to be made.

What he said.
#5
hooliganbflo
Oct 03, 2010 23:21:39 Ok, let me take the behavior statement back. I'll rephrase my question: I'm curious if anyone else who is really unsatisfied with the level of communication, specifically their policies on releasing info pertaining to DDi, has paused for a moment to wonder if rushing back to subscribe gives WotC the impression that their silence is the best policy?
#6
SoulCatcher78
Oct 04, 2010 7:28:15 Unsatisfied? Yes. Do I think it will change? No.

Subscriptions being renewed after a release will show that we will subscribe for new tools/updates/etc. They know that this will be the case. For every person who doesn't renew (which was me last year) they make the (probably correct) assumption that someone will take their place due to the new tool/update/etc. As long as they can keep a certain level of subscription money coming in, the program continues.

Last year it was a pitch to renew early before the rate went back to it's originally planned price and the Monster Builder. Apparently that kept enough people on long term subs to keep the program viable to this point. Having taken a year off, I can't say how much the level of service has changed but I notice that none of the people who were in charge last year seem to be around any longer (or at least they're not vocal...Randy Buehler, Heinsoo, Andy Collins).

Example of information management:

My fellow employees and I have been bugging the upper level of management for months about whether or not we will be getting a certain product for Q4. All we hear is wait and see when we know that they have to know the answer by now (as it's Q4). In the end, keeping that information secret might hurt sales since we cannot prep our potential sales (a problem that WotC as the sole seller of the platfrom doesn't have) but their reasoning is that we might only have limited quantities available and it would be better to have no info than driving unrealistic expectations.
#7
Mock
Oct 04, 2010 8:27:35 I agree with SoulCatcher - I am unsatisfied (of course I wish there was more information forthcoming beyond "soon"), but I have no expectation that they'll change. Their policy is set, and if they do reverse it, I will be very surprised. The word would be "gobsmacked," I think.
#8
talok55
Oct 05, 2010 14:02:26 If you were to renew your subscription now, after two months of no updates, I think it would qualify as rewarding bad behavior, or just plain stupidity on your part since you are paying for something you are not getting. What we really need to do is start cancelling our subscriptions in droves so WotC gets the message "no updates = no money." I have seen some vague hints that a new adventure tool may be added, but I can't think of tool good enough to justify not getting regular updates of new material added to the character and monster builders.
#9
Medriev
Oct 05, 2010 15:14:42
I recently cancelled my subscription to DDi due to not feeling like much of an "insider" for the amount of cash I've given to WotC, and have been fairly skeptical of their ability to deliver additional tools. HOWEVER, I would be ecstatic to eat those words and would be the first person to restart my sub, and convince everyone in my gaming circle that also cancelled DDi to resubscribe if the hints we've received lately meant additional tools in the next few weeks. Heck, I could even see myself dusting off the pom-poms and #1 FANBOY hat from when I assured people 3e D&D wasn't the end of the world at my FLGS. Should I do that though? My main gripe with DDi has been the lack of information. From the refusing to mention upcoming DDi tools that are being worked on, a coherent explanation as to why the tools that were advertised/promised/mentioned (pick the word you like best) weren't delivered, and two years later what the direction of the DDi service is going to be. If they release another tool and I bolt for the nearest computer that I can cram my credit card information into to subscribe again, am I not telling WotC with my wallet that their lack of communication is fine with me? So? Am I rewarding bad behavior?

This is an interesting question and one that I'm glad I don't have to answer for myself at the moment. I renewed early this year for various reasons including a forlorn hope that something new would be announced at Gen Con and so I have a year to run on my subscription. If there is a new tool and it is something I can use then that would be great but I am now thoroughly fed up with the lack of communication on everything, including on updates.

For my part, regardless of what is put out in the next few weeks or months, if the communication issue does not change, I more than likely will not renew. I may come back for the odd month here and there to get the latest stuff but I'm not sure I will ever sign up for a full year again unless I am told in advance what I can reasonably expect to see during that year. My only doubt about my own plan is access to the Compendium as I use it at the moment to sort Monsters by level and type quite often. Since the C&D notice was served on Masterplan, I have nothing that can do that without a subscription. Whether that is worth the money I am paying is a question I'll have to answer in the next year or so.
#10
Myztek
Oct 05, 2010 17:32:32
Who cares about their behavior? It's a business transaction. If their service is worth the money to you, subscribe. If it isn't, don't.

There is no moral judgment call to be made.

This.

Companies only listen to your wallet. That is the only voice that you have that they will ever really make the decision makers take notice. However, a wallet is a blunt instrument. You can't use it to make WotC (or any other company) do what you want. All you can do is give them an incentive to change the status quo.

They may decide that spending more money will bring in more customers - so we'd see more spent on editing, data entry, programming, development, etc... They might decide that reduced revenues will force them to cut costs, further reducing quantity and quality. They might decide the product just isn't cost efficient and kill it. Regardless, spending money is a vote for more of the same, and not spending money is a vote for different.

Personally, I want change. I'm willing to keep my money in order to help spin the wheel to see what we get. Hopefully, if enough of us withold money to cause a change, it won't kill Insider (or D&D in general). However, even if it does, I have more than enough materials to play great games for the rest of my life without repeating characters or being forced to do the same campaign over again...
#11
drowbattlemind
Oct 05, 2010 17:36:13
There is no moral judgment call to be made.

But there is one of ethics. Which is something that used to be taught in business schools.
#12
waldo_pepper
Oct 06, 2010 6:02:15
What we really need to do is start cancelling our subscriptions in droves so WotC gets the message "no updates = no money."

That's exactly what I've done - my subscription will end in November and I have no intention on renewing again unless I see some ongoing advantage. As it stands:
the magazines are really poor quality (I would characterize Dragon as being largely unreadable now as it's largely become a dumping ground for new powers, feats, and paragon paths);

the existing tools are not regularly updated (there's no reason why the CB issues should have impacted the MB update) ;

the adventure tools consists of a single tool which is still in beta

the "tools" that have been released more recently consist of stupid web applets (the name generator?!? Really?); and

we're rapidly approaching the holiday season which traditionally has meant:
A) a skipped update;

B) a long list of layoffs, often including software developers.

In other words, the future isn't looking much rosier and I'm quite skeptical about what the ability for a team that is clearly overwhelmed by maintaining the current tools updates to create and update additional tools.

Post/Author/DateTime	Post
#1 hooliganbflo Oct 03, 2010 16:20:00	I recently cancelled my subscription to DDi due to not feeling like much of an "insider" for the amount of cash I've given to WotC, and have been fairly skeptical of their ability to deliver additional tools. HOWEVER, I would be ecstatic to eat those words and would be the first person to restart my sub, and convince everyone in my gaming circle that also cancelled DDi to resubscribe if the hints we've received lately meant additional tools in the next few weeks. Heck, I could even see myself dusting off the pom-poms and #1 FANBOY hat from when I assured people 3e D&D wasn't the end of the world at my FLGS. Should I do that though? My main gripe with DDi has been the lack of information. From the refusing to mention upcoming DDi tools that are being worked on, a coherent explanation as to why the tools that were advertised/promised/mentioned (pick the word you like best) weren't delivered, and two years later what the direction of the DDi service is going to be. If they release another tool and I bolt for the nearest computer that I can cram my credit card information into to subscribe again, am I not telling WotC with my wallet that their lack of communication is fine with me? So? Am I rewarding bad behavior?
#2 limejello10512 Oct 03, 2010 17:03:13	yes you are. thankyou for warning me not to join....I thought they got that stuff up and running by now.
#3 Nyarlathotep Oct 03, 2010 19:35:02	Who cares about their behavior? It's a business transaction. If their service is worth the money to you, subscribe. If it isn't, don't. There is no moral judgment call to be made.
#4 salla Oct 03, 2010 20:05:07	Who cares about their behavior? It's a business transaction. If their service is worth the money to you, subscribe. If it isn't, don't. There is no moral judgment call to be made. What he said.
#5 hooliganbflo Oct 03, 2010 23:21:39	Ok, let me take the behavior statement back. I'll rephrase my question: I'm curious if anyone else who is really unsatisfied with the level of communication, specifically their policies on releasing info pertaining to DDi, has paused for a moment to wonder if rushing back to subscribe gives WotC the impression that their silence is the best policy?
#6 SoulCatcher78 Oct 04, 2010 7:28:15	Unsatisfied? Yes. Do I think it will change? No. Subscriptions being renewed after a release will show that we will subscribe for new tools/updates/etc. They know that this will be the case. For every person who doesn't renew (which was me last year) they make the (probably correct) assumption that someone will take their place due to the new tool/update/etc. As long as they can keep a certain level of subscription money coming in, the program continues. Last year it was a pitch to renew early before the rate went back to it's originally planned price and the Monster Builder. Apparently that kept enough people on long term subs to keep the program viable to this point. Having taken a year off, I can't say how much the level of service has changed but I notice that none of the people who were in charge last year seem to be around any longer (or at least they're not vocal...Randy Buehler, Heinsoo, Andy Collins). Example of information management: My fellow employees and I have been bugging the upper level of management for months about whether or not we will be getting a certain product for Q4. All we hear is wait and see when we know that they have to know the answer by now (as it's Q4). In the end, keeping that information secret might hurt sales since we cannot prep our potential sales (a problem that WotC as the sole seller of the platfrom doesn't have) but their reasoning is that we might only have limited quantities available and it would be better to have no info than driving unrealistic expectations.
#7 Mock Oct 04, 2010 8:27:35	I agree with SoulCatcher - I am unsatisfied (of course I wish there was more information forthcoming beyond "soon"), but I have no expectation that they'll change. Their policy is set, and if they do reverse it, I will be very surprised. The word would be "gobsmacked," I think.
#8 talok55 Oct 05, 2010 14:02:26	If you were to renew your subscription now, after two months of no updates, I think it would qualify as rewarding bad behavior, or just plain stupidity on your part since you are paying for something you are not getting. What we really need to do is start cancelling our subscriptions in droves so WotC gets the message "no updates = no money." I have seen some vague hints that a new adventure tool may be added, but I can't think of tool good enough to justify not getting regular updates of new material added to the character and monster builders.
#9 Medriev Oct 05, 2010 15:14:42	I recently cancelled my subscription to DDi due to not feeling like much of an "insider" for the amount of cash I've given to WotC, and have been fairly skeptical of their ability to deliver additional tools. HOWEVER, I would be ecstatic to eat those words and would be the first person to restart my sub, and convince everyone in my gaming circle that also cancelled DDi to resubscribe if the hints we've received lately meant additional tools in the next few weeks. Heck, I could even see myself dusting off the pom-poms and #1 FANBOY hat from when I assured people 3e D&D wasn't the end of the world at my FLGS. Should I do that though? My main gripe with DDi has been the lack of information. From the refusing to mention upcoming DDi tools that are being worked on, a coherent explanation as to why the tools that were advertised/promised/mentioned (pick the word you like best) weren't delivered, and two years later what the direction of the DDi service is going to be. If they release another tool and I bolt for the nearest computer that I can cram my credit card information into to subscribe again, am I not telling WotC with my wallet that their lack of communication is fine with me? So? Am I rewarding bad behavior? This is an interesting question and one that I'm glad I don't have to answer for myself at the moment. I renewed early this year for various reasons including a forlorn hope that something new would be announced at Gen Con and so I have a year to run on my subscription. If there is a new tool and it is something I can use then that would be great but I am now thoroughly fed up with the lack of communication on everything, including on updates. For my part, regardless of what is put out in the next few weeks or months, if the communication issue does not change, I more than likely will not renew. I may come back for the odd month here and there to get the latest stuff but I'm not sure I will ever sign up for a full year again unless I am told in advance what I can reasonably expect to see during that year. My only doubt about my own plan is access to the Compendium as I use it at the moment to sort Monsters by level and type quite often. Since the C&D notice was served on Masterplan, I have nothing that can do that without a subscription. Whether that is worth the money I am paying is a question I'll have to answer in the next year or so.
#10 Myztek Oct 05, 2010 17:32:32	Who cares about their behavior? It's a business transaction. If their service is worth the money to you, subscribe. If it isn't, don't. There is no moral judgment call to be made. This. Companies only listen to your wallet. That is the only voice that you have that they will ever really make the decision makers take notice. However, a wallet is a blunt instrument. You can't use it to make WotC (or any other company) do what you want. All you can do is give them an incentive to change the status quo. They may decide that spending more money will bring in more customers - so we'd see more spent on editing, data entry, programming, development, etc... They might decide that reduced revenues will force them to cut costs, further reducing quantity and quality. They might decide the product just isn't cost efficient and kill it. Regardless, spending money is a vote for more of the same, and not spending money is a vote for different. Personally, I want change. I'm willing to keep my money in order to help spin the wheel to see what we get. Hopefully, if enough of us withold money to cause a change, it won't kill Insider (or D&D in general). However, even if it does, I have more than enough materials to play great games for the rest of my life without repeating characters or being forced to do the same campaign over again...
#11 drowbattlemind Oct 05, 2010 17:36:13	There is no moral judgment call to be made. *But there is one of ethics. Which is something that used* to be taught in business schools.**
#12 waldo_pepper Oct 06, 2010 6:02:15	What we really need to do is start cancelling our subscriptions in droves so WotC gets the message "no updates = no money." That's exactly what I've done - my subscription will end in November and I have no intention on renewing again unless I see some ongoing advantage. As it stands: the magazines are really poor quality (I would characterize Dragon as being largely unreadable now as it's largely become a dumping ground for new powers, feats, and paragon paths); the existing tools are not regularly updated (there's no reason why the CB issues should have impacted the MB update) ; the adventure tools consists of a single tool which is still in beta the "tools" that have been released more recently consist of stupid web applets (the name generator?!? Really?); and we're rapidly approaching the holiday season which traditionally has meant: A) a skipped update; B) a long list of layoffs, often including software developers. In other words, the future isn't looking much rosier and I'm quite skeptical about what the ability for a team that is clearly overwhelmed by maintaining the current tools updates to create and update additional tools.