Character Visualiser - Downloaded from the Wizards Community, all coding removed by Solauren

Character Visualiser

Post/Author/DateTime Post
#1
pauln6
Jan 08, 2009 5:16:35 In spite of comments that the visualiser was ready to release long before the character generator, we've seen no sign of it nor any fresh updates on when it might be coming online. Further, to avoid censure, WotC has said that they are going to stop speculating on release schedules which turn out to be over-optimistic for now i.e. no more news on when we can expect release dates, probably because a lot of people were holding off on subscribing until the full package goes live.

Is the visualiser going to be part of the full character generator when it goes live this month or has it been downgraded to the bottom of the priority pile? Has anybody heard any scuttlebut?
#2
MattDroz
Jan 08, 2009 7:43:26 The only thing I know for certain is that it is not part of the Character Builder.
#3
mudbunny
Jan 08, 2009 7:57:49 The character vuisualizer was never part of the character builder.

The most recent info I have seen is by WotC_DM on the state of the various tools:

I can say that the dungeon Builder is fairly close to beta, but still requires the capability to be updated, and we have been working on the character builder updater with the intent to use it for the other applications. So we have some integration steps to do for the Dungeon Builder to be shippable.

The Game Table and the Character Visualizer are in Alpha stage.

#4
mudbunny
Jan 08, 2009 8:20:52 Also keep in mind the high bar that has been set for the character visualizer. If any of you have seen the Character creator put out by Cryptic Studios for City of Heroes/City of Villains, it is, 5 years later, still by far the best character creator out there. No other game I have seen comes close, and if you limit it to MMOs only, there is nothing that is even in the same league.
#5
anaro
Jan 08, 2009 15:01:26 In my opinion, the significant PR hit for the likely delay (I hope) of the visualiser is due to the prominence it was given in '07 and early '08. It's amazing when you think back to the old promotional videos that this piece could be so not ready. I'm not saying I'm surprised, just that considering how much this was used to generate marketing excitement it's no wonder it annoys people.
#6
Takeyabue
Jan 08, 2009 22:51:35 IMHO, the Character Visualizer "demos" were most likely the eye candy to get the money flowing during the intial development startup. The "suits" would not have time to actually "learn" how to use and understand a character builder, but show them a "bright shiny object" and the money begins to flow.

Takeyabue
#7
WolfStar76
Jan 09, 2009 6:32:15 I'd venture that part of why the Visualizer was pushed back is due to simple community feedback.

When DDI missed its original deadline, there were a couple discussions (I believe they may have even been Mudbunny's patent "Directed Discussions" on what the next project should be.

At that time, all indicators pointed to the visualizer being the "focus" project that was due to be the first one released.

However many arguments were made that, while the visualizer is nice - it's of very limited utility. Sure, I can make a cool figure with it, but without a character builder, there's no sheet to attach his image to - without the game table, I can't "use" the figure.

I think it was shortly after that that WotC_DM first let us know that the focus was being shifted to the Character Builder instead - and that's been the plan ever since.

This still raises the question of "what's next" now that the builder is ready to drop. I was personally expecting the next project to be the Visualizer, however others keep saying that the Dungeon Builder is drawing close.

I suppose only time will tell.
#8
duum982
Jan 09, 2009 8:24:46 I could really use a decent dungeon builder. Of the 3 tools left to develop (Dungeon Builder, Character Visualizer, and VTT) that one has the most utility for me. I would happily embrace that as the next project. Hopefully the WoTC development team will "find its way" in the next few weeks and share its direction with us.
#9
mudbunny
Jan 09, 2009 8:40:21 According to WotC_DM in a recent post, here are the states of the various tools:

I can say that the dungeon Builder is fairly close to beta, but still requires the capability to be updated, and we have been working on the character builder updater with the intent to use it for the other applications. So we have some integration steps to do for the Dungeon Builder to be shippable.

The Game Table and the Character Visualizer are in Alpha stage.

#10
whitebaron
Jan 09, 2009 8:54:11 well, if alpha is the state of software they presented of the character generator at DDXP'08, it will take even longer till everything is finished. just focussing on the character builder (arguably the second easiest tool behind the visualizer) took them more than 1 year, still not finished, so 3+ years to finish the entire suite. which brings us to 2012 for full DDI.
#11
derren_s.
Jan 11, 2009 8:00:08 I think the Character Visualizer is vaporware.
Why? Because it would be a big effort to keep it up to date and I don't think WotC will invest that money.

Whenever a new race or new equipment comes out it has to be included into the Character Visualizer with all its customization options. That would require a permanent artist just to keep the CV up to date.
#12
whitebaron
Jan 11, 2009 8:16:27 well, if keeping an artist is the only thing they need to do for updating the character visualizer, this is far cheaper than e.g. the character builder or gametable and about as expensive as the dungeon builder.

keeping an artist for twice a year update is pretty cheap compared to the lots many other things cost. races are not as often released as new classes, items or maps in adventures. and i still have not given up the hope that you'll be able to buy or select every adventure-map in the gametable or dungeon builder as well.
#13
WolfStar76
Jan 11, 2009 8:58:12
I think the Character Visualizer is vaporware.
Why? Because it would be a big effort to keep it up to date and I don't think WotC will invest that money.

Whenever a new race or new equipment comes out it has to be included into the Character Visualizer with all its customization options. That would require a permanent artist just to keep the CV up to date.

I'd agree that they'll have to keep updating as new races come out, but the equpiment section, from what I saw at GenCon is very user-flexible. Really 2-3 styles of each armor type would generally suffice, as users can (theorticaly) add color, logos/tattoos, and even control "glow" effects on their equipment.

That gives the user a lot of power to decide how their gear looks in the visualizer, without having to abide by a "fixed" description.

Then, as time allows between the release of new races, the artist(s) could work on a few of the more unique bits of equipment.
#14
derren_s.
Jan 11, 2009 8:59:28
keeping an artist for twice a year update is pretty cheap compared to the lots many other things cost. races are not as often released as new classes, items or maps in adventures. and i still have not given up the hope that you'll be able to buy or select every adventure-map in the gametable or dungeon builder as well.

Not? How many new Races have been released in the last 6 months? 1 race per 2 months, not counting monsters as PCs?

And for every race you need to make 2 3D models (male and female) with all the customization options which are available. This doesn't sound like a new texture is enough for that.
Also you need to include all new weapons and other "holdable" items. Whenever a new weapon comes out it must be added to the visualizer with all customization options.
It gets especially complicated when they add stuff like the Warforged which can graft equipment into his body. Generally grafts (Open Grave, etc.) will also require a bit more work.

Compared to that, the character builder etc. is just text. You simply include the new information in an xml file and it works.

Post/Author/DateTime	Post
#1 pauln6 Jan 08, 2009 5:16:35	In spite of comments that the visualiser was ready to release long before the character generator, we've seen no sign of it nor any fresh updates on when it might be coming online. Further, to avoid censure, WotC has said that they are going to stop speculating on release schedules which turn out to be over-optimistic for now i.e. no more news on when we can expect release dates, probably because a lot of people were holding off on subscribing until the full package goes live. Is the visualiser going to be part of the full character generator when it goes live this month or has it been downgraded to the bottom of the priority pile? Has anybody heard any scuttlebut?
#2 MattDroz Jan 08, 2009 7:43:26	The only thing I know for certain is that it is not part of the Character Builder.
#3 mudbunny Jan 08, 2009 7:57:49	The character vuisualizer was never part of the character builder. The most recent info I have seen is by WotC_DM on the state of the various tools: I can say that the dungeon Builder is fairly close to beta, but still requires the capability to be updated, and we have been working on the character builder updater with the intent to use it for the other applications. So we have some integration steps to do for the Dungeon Builder to be shippable. The Game Table and the Character Visualizer are in Alpha stage.
#4 mudbunny Jan 08, 2009 8:20:52	Also keep in mind the high bar that has been set for the character visualizer. If any of you have seen the Character creator put out by Cryptic Studios for City of Heroes/City of Villains, it is, 5 years later, still by far the best character creator out there. No other game I have seen comes close, and if you limit it to MMOs only, there is nothing that is even in the same league.
#5 anaro Jan 08, 2009 15:01:26	In my opinion, the significant PR hit for the likely delay (I hope) of the visualiser is due to the prominence it was given in '07 and early '08. It's amazing when you think back to the old promotional videos that this piece could be so not ready. I'm not saying I'm surprised, just that considering how much this was used to generate marketing excitement it's no wonder it annoys people.
#6 Takeyabue Jan 08, 2009 22:51:35	IMHO, the Character Visualizer "demos" were most likely the eye candy to get the money flowing during the intial development startup. The "suits" would not have time to actually "learn" how to use and understand a character builder, but show them a "bright shiny object" and the money begins to flow. Takeyabue
#7 WolfStar76 Jan 09, 2009 6:32:15	I'd venture that part of why the Visualizer was pushed back is due to simple community feedback. When DDI missed its original deadline, there were a couple discussions (I believe they may have even been Mudbunny's patent "Directed Discussions" on what the next project should be. At that time, all indicators pointed to the visualizer being the "focus" project that was due to be the first one released. However many arguments were made that, while the visualizer is nice - it's of very limited utility. Sure, I can make a cool figure with it, but without a character builder, there's no sheet to attach his image to - without the game table, I can't "use" the figure. I think it was shortly after that that WotC_DM first let us know that the focus was being shifted to the Character Builder instead - and that's been the plan ever since. This still raises the question of "what's next" now that the builder is ready to drop. I was personally expecting the next project to be the Visualizer, however others keep saying that the Dungeon Builder is drawing close. I suppose only time will tell.
#8 duum982 Jan 09, 2009 8:24:46	I could really use a decent dungeon builder. Of the 3 tools left to develop (Dungeon Builder, Character Visualizer, and VTT) that one has the most utility for me. I would happily embrace that as the next project. Hopefully the WoTC development team will "find its way" in the next few weeks and share its direction with us.
#9 mudbunny Jan 09, 2009 8:40:21	According to WotC_DM in a recent post, here are the states of the various tools: I can say that the dungeon Builder is fairly close to beta, but still requires the capability to be updated, and we have been working on the character builder updater with the intent to use it for the other applications. So we have some integration steps to do for the Dungeon Builder to be shippable. The Game Table and the Character Visualizer are in Alpha stage.
#10 whitebaron Jan 09, 2009 8:54:11	well, if alpha is the state of software they presented of the character generator at DDXP'08, it will take even longer till everything is finished. just focussing on the character builder (arguably the second easiest tool behind the visualizer) took them more than 1 year, still not finished, so 3+ years to finish the entire suite. which brings us to 2012 for full DDI.
#11 derren_s. Jan 11, 2009 8:00:08	I think the Character Visualizer is vaporware. Why? Because it would be a big effort to keep it up to date and I don't think WotC will invest that money. Whenever a new race or new equipment comes out it has to be included into the Character Visualizer with all its customization options. That would require a permanent artist just to keep the CV up to date.
#12 whitebaron Jan 11, 2009 8:16:27	well, if keeping an artist is the only thing they need to do for updating the character visualizer, this is far cheaper than e.g. the character builder or gametable and about as expensive as the dungeon builder. keeping an artist for twice a year update is pretty cheap compared to the lots many other things cost. races are not as often released as new classes, items or maps in adventures. and i still have not given up the hope that you'll be able to buy or select every adventure-map in the gametable or dungeon builder as well.
#13 WolfStar76 Jan 11, 2009 8:58:12	I think the Character Visualizer is vaporware. Why? Because it would be a big effort to keep it up to date and I don't think WotC will invest that money. Whenever a new race or new equipment comes out it has to be included into the Character Visualizer with all its customization options. That would require a permanent artist just to keep the CV up to date. I'd agree that they'll have to keep updating as new races come out, but the equpiment section, from what I saw at GenCon is very user-flexible. Really 2-3 styles of each armor type would generally suffice, as users can (theorticaly) add color, logos/tattoos, and even control "glow" effects on their equipment. That gives the user a lot of power to decide how their gear looks in the visualizer, without having to abide by a "fixed" description. Then, as time allows between the release of new races, the artist(s) could work on a few of the more unique bits of equipment.
#14 derren_s. Jan 11, 2009 8:59:28	keeping an artist for twice a year update is pretty cheap compared to the lots many other things cost. races are not as often released as new classes, items or maps in adventures. and i still have not given up the hope that you'll be able to buy or select every adventure-map in the gametable or dungeon builder as well. Not? How many new Races have been released in the last 6 months? 1 race per 2 months, not counting monsters as PCs? And for every race you need to make 2 3D models (male and female) with all the customization options which are available. This doesn't sound like a new texture is enough for that. Also you need to include all new weapons and other "holdable" items. Whenever a new weapon comes out it must be added to the visualizer with all customization options. It gets especially complicated when they add stuff like the Warforged which can graft equipment into his body. Generally grafts (Open Grave, etc.) will also require a bit more work. Compared to that, the character builder etc. is just text. You simply include the new information in an xml file and it works.