It is a balancing act that WotC is working on. They *are* improving. The communication is leaps and bounds ahead of what it was. It will get better, I just think that there is a clash of cultures at WotC that is also complicating things.
:P
<.<
>.>
Aaaanyways...
By clash of cultures I mean the following.
I believe that there are a group of people at WotC who would like to share information about the status of DDI with the users. Statements about what is in beta, what is in alpha, etc.
At the same time, I think that there are people at WotC who prefer to keep the information about the DDI tools secret. Not that they don't want to give the users the information, but because they have those thought processes ingrained upon them from working on the print side of D&D, where the tendancy is to release very little information until street date.
Hope this makes things clearer.
Aaaanyways...
By clash of cultures I mean the following.
I believe that there are a group of people at WotC who would like to share information about the status of DDI with the users. Statements about what is in beta, what is in alpha, etc.
At the same time, I think that there are people at WotC who prefer to keep the information about the DDI tools secret. Not that they don't want to give the users the information, but because they have those thought processes ingrained upon them from working on the print side of D&D, where the tendancy is to release very little information until street date.
Hope this makes things clearer.
It does make things clearer. Thank you. It helps me to avoid attributing things to you that you did not intend.
As for me, I do wish that the dialogue flowed more freely. I can appreciate that when fans gets rabid, it can be quite difficult to bring yourself to respomd to their posts.. but I do miss the back and forth communication that one enjoys with other RPG Publishers. Paizo being a good example.
My experience of the company is that they make their products in something of a vacuum. That is not to say it's bad, and I heartfeltly believe that a lot of love and passion goes into the products. But that they create the game with this notion of how they think it should be, and only hope that the consumer will agree.
And to extent, it has to be that way.
But only to an extent. Sometimes it comes at the expense of coming across as standoffish.
Look at your own role for example. I think you do a great job. However you're a filter for direct involvement with the fan base. "Mudbunny, tell us what the villagers are talking about. Are they happy, or are they rioting?" Believe me when I say, I'm glad you do what you do.. but I wish there was dialogue above and beyond occasional appearances at Conventions and the like.
I find that WotC is much more responsive to being open and communicative when complaints are done politely, well written, and in a tone that is not antagonistic. If people start flaming or attacking WotC for being (paraphrased from a number of posters) "TEH SUCK", the chance that WotC devs stick their nose in the forums drops rapidly.
There also needs to be an awareness that, sometimes, there simply is no information to pass along to users.
The communication, as I said in the post you forked this discussion off of, *is* getting better, much better. However, as you said, it can get even better. It just takes time. We have a number of WOtC staff members who are involved on the DDI boards, directly with the users. The Architect, mdonais and WotC_DM for example.
I find that WotC is much more responsive to being open and communicative when complaints are done politely, well written, and in a tone that is not antagonistic. If people start flaming or attacking WotC for being (paraphrased from a number of posters) "TEH SUCK", the chance that WotC devs stick their nose in the forums drops rapidly.
There also needs to be an awareness that, sometimes, there simply is no information to pass along to users.
It takes far less time than you'd think. I think it requires a philosophical shift as you already pointed out. No one cares if there is actually nothing to communicate, so long as when there is it actually is or if there is nothing new, we're told that. Which has not been the case.
People want a [i]dialogue[/i] not marketing. I think it is unfair to fault the "insiders" for feeling frustrated.
I keep seeing paizo brought up, I know I've brought them up. WOTC could learn a lot from their method of customer dialogue, I mean that as constructive criticism. There is nothing wrong with borrowing from what works.
There also needs to be an awareness that, sometimes, there simply is no information to pass along to users.
Well the problem is, that they pass information to their custumers by doing things without telling us.
The removal of all the "upcoming features" info of DDI without any notice on the web site is indeed the perfect example for totally screwed communication.
This communicates:
- We think you're so dumb, you wont notice that it is gone
- We decided that 80% of what we told you about DDI is wrong, and your assumptions about the additional apps being vaporware are true, but we don't need to tell you, since we don't care.
- Just forget about it.
or similar things to most people.
Maybe it was just a web dev you thought he could use the "Upcoming features" button for a better thing than teasing about stuff that wont be ready for the next 6 months or so, but unfortunately human minds work different ;)
I just wish that people would wait until they find out *why* something is done.
I have no problems with people getting angry at WotC for stuff that WotC has screwed up, dont get me wrong.
I just wish that people would wait until they find out *why* something is done.
I agree, however, people don't know until AFTER it is done. All I ask, and most other people ask, is that we get a "heads up" BEFORE it happens or at the very least SAME TIME it happens. Not days or weeks after and in some cases, never.
I have no problems with people getting angry at WotC for stuff that WotC has screwed up, dont get me wrong.
I just wish that people would wait until they find out *why* something is done.
But the biggest issue is that we never seem to get an explanation before the reaction is reaching the point of grabbing the pitchforks and torches.
But the biggest issue is that we never seem to get an explanation before the reaction is reaching the point of grabbing the pitchforks and torches.
Excatly. The 4th ed launch and WOTC saying all the DDI tools would be ready on time a year before 4th ed launched. Then the street date came and went and we did not hear anything from WOTC for 2 months after street date that it was delayed. This makes them look sneaky and underhanded. By the time they said anything, lots of people were very upset to say the least.
I know software develoment takes time and there are usally delays. But its the way WOTC mislead the customers that upset people, IMO. If they came out and said the stuff would not have been ready on time when they knew it instead of two months after the fact, people would not have been as upset.
I hope you start to see more of what you are asking for (the open dialogue and sincere conversation) from various staffers on these boards in the coming weeks and months.
Personally, I like to post on Enworld. I also try and "spread the chat" on these boards as well and I will be taking more time to post here first.
Thanks!
I also know that the way this dialog is set up it is the front line guys that take the brunt of the ire. It's unfortunate. I can just picture some faces when reading the forums with jaws on desk wondering if it's safe to walk to their cars. I just hope that the thought behind the rants is what is actually listened to rather than some of the actual words of a few tantrums.
We and your Insiders WANT you to succeed. We are committed, unfortunately we're scared because many of us don't feel that WOTC (as a company) is as committed as we are. I hope that makes sense.
Scott - I really want you guys to know that it not the individual staff that I'm frustrated with. I know that you guys are on a short leash, I really do understand that. It is the people holding your leashes so short that I'm frustrated with. It is the management of DDI that makes me head-butt walls
I also know that the way this dialog is set up it is the front line guys that take the brunt of the ire. It's unfortunate. I can just picture some faces when reading the forums with jaws on desk wondering if it's safe to walk to their cars. I just hope that the thought behind the rants is what is actually listened to rather than some of the actual words of a few tantrums.
We and your Insiders WANT you to succeed. We are committed, unfortunately we're scared because many of us don't feel that WOTC (as a company) is as committed as we are. I hope that makes sense.
Lex,
It makes sense. We've collectively over promised and under delivered, that's not creating good customer experiences and that's not what we need to be doing. We need to be creating great customer experiences. I believe we are on that path with Char Builder, Compendium etc and we'll continue to work on creating more great experiences.
You have to understand something. As a business that is part of a division of a publicly traded company we need to be careful of what we say, how we say it, and when we say it. Sometimes, I have to play 'management" and decide how things get said. Sometimes it's a department like legal or investor relations that manages the message. Sometimes we just can say stuff at all. But what we can do is strive to provide great products and great service and if we can't say stuff just say so (and sometimes even say why we can talk about it). The goal: surprise and delight you the customer! Deal? :D
You have to understand something. As a business that is part of a division of a publicly traded company we need to be careful of what we say, how we say it, and when we say it. Sometimes, I have to play 'management" and decide how things get said. Sometimes it's a department like legal or investor relations that manages the message. Sometimes we just can say stuff at all.
As I said, I understand this completely.
But what we can do is strive to provide great products and great service and if we can't say stuff just say so (and sometimes even say why we can talk about it).
I think that this is what most of us are asking for. I know it number two on my list
The goal: surprise and delight you the customer! Deal? :D
Sure, just a little less on the negative surprises;)
Lex,
It makes sense. We've collectively over promised and under delivered, that's not creating good customer experiences and that's not what we need to be doing. We need to be creating great customer experiences. I believe we are on that path with Char Builder, Compendium etc and we'll continue to work on creating more great experiences.
You have to understand something. As a business that is part of a division of a publicly traded company we need to be careful of what we say, how we say it, and when we say it. Sometimes, I have to play 'management" and decide how things get said. Sometimes it's a department like legal or investor relations that manages the message. Sometimes we just can say stuff at all. But what we can do is strive to provide great products and great service and if we can't say stuff just say so (and sometimes even say why we can talk about it). The goal: surprise and delight you the customer! Deal? :D
Thanks for chiming in Scott, your response is appreciated.
And, just to add, it's a free country. You're just as entitled as anybody else to post over at EnWorld if you like. Its good Public Relations, and it gets your message to people who might not be consumers now, but could be in the future. I know that community appreciates when you do check in.
By posting over here, in addition to posting over there, you send a signal that you care about the folks who might already be consumers. That you're as comfortable here at "home" as when you're out being diplomat to the gaming community. The balance serves you well.
As for the sort of communication I'm really looking for, it doesn't necessarily have to be internal business decisions that effect shareholders. Its not my business why anybody got laid off. I think its ridiculous to keep harping on about the Digital Tools not being ready at the time of release.
But you know... There are a lot of things that could be talked about. Like game stuff.. The previews. Issues involving the articles in the magazines.
Not to throw them in your face, Paizo doesn't talk to their fans about proprietary business information either. They talk about their products. And ALL their staff talk about their products, writers and editors. And when there are mistakes (and there are some, certainly), they say their mea culpas.. BUT.. they also offer suggestions to fix them.
It is a dialogue. A relationship is built. Fans become less likely to attack, and consumer loyalty develops.
Of course, I realize your company has to be it's own entity and do things the way it needs to in order to be healthy.. but this is a behavior I appreciate in your competitor.
And there are trolls over there too. There will always be trolls. But if you talk to your community, they'll be pushed aside by people who have a genuine interest in your products and who want to talk to you about them.
I have no problems with people getting angry at WotC for stuff that WotC has screwed up, dont get me wrong.
I just wish that people would wait until they find out *why* something is done.
But the very fact that the customer *does* get angry with the company over issues that effect them should be the most direct indication to the company that they are doing a poor job along the line somewhere.
That said, there is no pleasing some people, and at some point you have to cut your losses, however since the 4e furor has died down, I don't see that as being much of an issue any longer. It's not the anti-4e people who are upset, it is the actual *customer* who is *buying* the product, and whom WOTC will depend on to buy more product in the future, that are voicing their displeasure.
That siutuation can turn toxic for a company in a short period of time and it is not easy to write off with a 'wait for our explanation' remark.
You have to understand something. As a business that is part of a division of a publicly traded company we need to be careful of what we say, how we say it, and when we say it.
Hrm.
I think this is a really important point, and something that some of us might not take much into account when we criticize.
On the other hand, :D the customers are not asking for the companies secrets.
I think it would go a long way to improving things if:
your staff blogs were updated occassionally. I think Paizo does a great job with their site blog, even though most information there is fluff and not all that informative. But, it builds a community with us.
you had someplace on this site that answered the paypal, print, and other questions people ahve asked here for months
your web site was easier to navigate, and broken links and other issues were fixed when pointed out (which they rarely are)
None of those are super hard, none of them likely increase your costs, but they'd all go a long way to improving your relationship with your customers, or not. My hypothesis could be wrong.
Thanks for chiming in Scott, your response is appreciated.
And, just to add, it's a free country. You're just as entitled as anybody else to post over at EnWorld if you like. Its good Public Relations, and it gets your message to people who might not be consumers now, but could be in the future. I know that community appreciates when you do check in.
By posting over here, in addition to posting over there, you send a signal that you care about the folks who might already be consumers. That you're as comfortable here at "home" as when you're out being diplomat to the gaming community. The balance serves you well.
As for the sort of communication I'm really looking for, it doesn't necessarily have to be internal business decisions that effect shareholders. Its not my business why anybody got laid off. I think its ridiculous to keep harping on about the Digital Tools not being ready at the time of release.
But you know... There are a lot of things that could be talked about. Like game stuff.. The previews. Issues involving the articles in the magazines.
Not to throw them in your face, Paizo doesn't talk to their fans about proprietary business information either. They talk about their products. And ALL their staff talk about their products, writers and editors. And when there are mistakes (and there are some, certainly), they say their mea culpas.. BUT.. they also offer suggestions to fix them.
It is a dialogue. A relationship is built. Fans become less likely to attack, and consumer loyalty develops.
Of course, I realize your company has to be it's own entity and do things the way it needs to in order to be healthy.. but this is a behavior I appreciate in your competitor.
And there are trolls over there too. There will always be trolls. But if you talk to your community, they'll be pushed aside by people who have a genuine interest in your products and who want to talk to you about them.
QFT
Scott, love your posts on ENWorld.
your staff blogs were updated occassionally. I think Paizo does a great job with their site blog, even though most information there is fluff and not all that informative. But, it builds a community with us.
Yes. The blog issue has been bugging me. It is a little quiet and needs more activity (including mine) and some just need to be killed since those people never use them.
your web site was easier to navigate, and broken links and other issues were fixed when pointed out (which they rarely are)
We are aware of the web site issues and are fixing them.
I'm curious about something which you should be able to answer:
What is happening with the up coming DDi applications?
By this I mean, what is happening with Dungeon Builder, Game Table, Character Visualizer? These apps appear to have totally disappeared from the web site and DDi pages.
Answers I'll be happy for you to give include:
- They are all being worked on as we speak.
- They are all temporarily suspended whilst we finish CB and Compedium.
- They have all been stopped till further notice.
- We're currently only working on the next one we are going to release (and we're not telling you which one that is yet)
- We don't know which one is next but they're all going to come out at some stage.
- We just don't know what is going to happen.
- We know the answer but we're choosing to keep you all in the dark for the moment.
- We know the answer but the "powers that be" don't want anything to be revealed about this just yet.
I suspect the answer is one of the last two, probably the very last. I'm happy to hear that, as it would at least be some information as to what is going on. At present we have nothing at all really, and I believe that is fueling disent in the ranks.
Thanks for all your feedback to date!
Blakey
Well the problem is, that they pass information to their custumers by doing things without telling us.
The removal of all the "upcoming features" info of DDI without any notice on the web site is indeed the perfect example for totally screwed communication.
This communicates:
- We think you're so dumb, you wont notice that it is gone
- We decided that 80% of what we told you about DDI is wrong, and your assumptions about the additional apps being vaporware are true, but we don't need to tell you, since we don't care.
- Just forget about it.
or similar things to most people.
Maybe it was just a web dev you thought he could use the "Upcoming features" button for a better thing than teasing about stuff that wont be ready for the next 6 months or so, but unfortunately human minds work different ;)
Yeah, this one is a bigger deal than seems to be generally recognised. Business requirements prevent you from making specific claims? Well, unfortunately, removing previous promises *is* a claim.. especially when people refuse to talk about it.
The better way to handle this would be to make a specific statement, very clearly and publically available: "We are re-evaluating which tools and features to produce next for DDI, and so we will temporarily remove the Upcoming Features section. Once we've finished the surveys and made our decisions, we'll let you know what the new direction will be."