I'd like to ask MB and other members for their help in doing this.
The report (and therefore posts) should be constructive. No matter how upset some people are, mocking or belittling the WotC staff isn't going to help us deliver any viable information.
We should take into consideration what suggestions were made in reference to GZ's report--reporting the good, bad, ugly, and an ongoing issues section.
Thoughts?
I will help and do what I can for this, but I don't want to do it on my own.
I also strongly agree that the tone of the report is important. If we want the DDi staff to take it seriously and not see it as just another rant, we need to keep the accusations and aggressiveness out of the post.
No matter how upset some people are, mocking or belittling the WotC staff isn't going to help us deliver any viable information.
This is key. Hurling insults and slandering good intentions should not be tolerated from or by anyone. (*insert inference to recent event here*)
Well Epoch, since you have the first post, I suggest you edit your post weekly to include suggestions made by people as the thread gets longer. Something in this format, perhaps...?
7/22/08
Major Issues: (issues that need attention)
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-
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Minor Issues: (issues that don't need immediate attention)
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-
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Ongoing Issues (issues that need more attention)
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-
As for the thoughts, I'll be posting my issues shortly. :D
I have to say that with this recent action taken by GZ I'm a little skeptical of anything on these forums anymore as my faith in him (as the person who I thought was the only "good guy" with us) has really diminished. I hope that in time WotC as a whole will be able to renew the trust we all once placed in this company.
With that said, I'm going to humor everyone else and play as nice as I can in this thread. If this thread is going to go anywhere involving getting us heard and making a difference -at all- with the way things are going, then count me in. I really want this to be a successful product and I'm sure everyone else who posts about the failure/flaws want it to be too. So, I'm going to take off my armor and put down my maul and get ready to help out.
You guys have to answer me this though. "Is this really going to help? Or is this going to be another in vain sort of thing?"
Wulfe
It's always been the suggestion of GZ and other moderators that a different thread/community post/way of asking will actually, THIS TIME, maybe get you answers... and it never has. It's been a dodge. We deserve better.
Agreed, which is why I asked this...
"Is this really going to help? Or is this going to be another in vain sort of thing?"
No matter how upset some people are, mocking or belittling the WotC staff isn't going to help us deliver any viable information.
It makes us feel better? Anyways, having been 'under the gun' before on projects and the like, I do sympathize with them. Unluckily, at this point, the customer wants communication... thats really it.
Major Issue: As a semi-returning player, trying to get back into D&D with old gaming buddies, DDi is kind of a must. We are scattered around a couple of states. It is the only reason that we chose to purchase 4E (that and the new edition is cool), but we have discovered Fantasy Grounds, and its very compatible nature with the OGL products. There are 5 of us who are a bit put off, but wanting to know if we wasted $20-100 by thinking we could play online through the virtual tabletop.
Ongoing Issue: Considering the previous 'mishaps' with the release dates of DM Tools-->E-Tools-->Sold it too CMP and the lack of communication, this appears to be just a repition of past events. If DDi isn't up soon (loosely defined as before 5E), we will scrap the idea of it and just purchase FG and go play 3.5, since we can get all the OGL stuff on it.
Props!!!:The Dungeon and Dragon content is nice and we will all continue to pick it up. No worries there, even not being able to game, I still like the overall feel of the magazines.
Major Issue: Get Together. Roll Some Dice. Have Fun. For those of who were depending on WotC to be able to get together, well... as of right now, rolling dice and having fun is reduced to phone calls.
And yes, I realize the purpose of the thread is to cover major issues, but these are the current largest issues to myself and my group (hate to be selfish, but I know there are other people in that same boat).
Major Issues
- Indirectness: This is about recent events. GZ, I understand that you are forced by the rules of the company to not say anything with negative connotations to or about any customer. But, as a setback, often your post involves a reader to infer what you're actually saying. This is somewhat detrimental to your goal of effective communication, you see.
Minor Issues
- GZ didn't answer my PM about D&Di. Waaaah.
Ongoing Issues
- Forum stability: It's just poor. I can't even get onto RPG Live today. Darn Gleemax; why is it really needed?
- People wanna know exactly why D&Di failed. They don't like to infer what Ken said.
- Trust: Why should we have to make a community report for you? I purposefully exaggerated the first sentence, but I know some people are thinking that. From this viewpoint, it doesn't make sense that the customers should have to be the ones working, you know?
- Forum stability Though the lack of DDI tools is depressing the lack of a stable environment of any kind to communicate is even worse. Forum down time is depressing the communities moral and it reflects in every other post they give.
- Game Table The most pressing issue of DDI that is effecting me is the lack of a game table. I don't care if it is small not very pretty or just is a PHP grid system with some coins on it. Without it I can't game. Trying to make the Table the be all and end all is not what is needed just making it work and getting it up and running is more important worry about the rest as it comes along. build a foundation and then give updates to continue it's growth.
Major Props
- Community Report This small bit of information has increased moral of some members and given them hope and has went a small way into restoring faith between WoTC and some of the community.
Minor issues
- DDI Specs the specification for DDI seam to high for a portion of the communities computers. Given that an acceptable level of graphics would be the equivalent of Diablo, Neverwintner nights or WOW it seems that DDI is less of a game but has a higher requirement than top selling games of the past.
Minor Props
- Dungeons and Dragons The content of Dungeons and Dragon magazines continues to impress the community.
I will try to get some quotes and links added to this very soon. I will just edit this post to make it easier to find for the compilation of the end report or if any of the points should make it into the final community report. I thinks we should all just maintain one major post each report and that way we can discuss without disrupting the editors ability to compile a useful report to GZ.
As far as why I think we should compile this report, I think it is fun, it makes me feel like I am participating rather than just sitting there bi#$%ing about the state of things, and it is helpful. I don't mind doing it even if I shouldn't have to do it. I have a large investment of time, emotion, and money into D&D and I think that if I want to protect that investment I should not sit idly by. I also think that if you want to make your investment grow you sometimes have to roll your sleeves up and do a bit of work yourself.
Wulfe
Someone had a positive point about the community's reaction to the Dragon and Dungeon articles. I have seen several posts, however, where people feel these are sub-par. Right now, they're free, so web stats won't show whether people are 'buying' into the product or not. Perhaps to get to the bottom of this, Wiz needs to send someone out to find out what the people would need to see to be equivalent to or better than the articles they remember.
As it's also been pointed out here, communication is a big issue right now. We keep hearing promises, but not seen anything delivered. I've gone as far as to ask GZ what has been delivered thus far, and he hasn't been able to answer. That's a bit disheartening, as well as him never replying to the question in reference to "what has your team done well, that you'd like to show off." No, it's not his job to answer my questions, but when he can't, and they're rather broad and a chance to shine rather than defuse a situation
I see an issue, and I'm not alone here.
Obviously, the forum stability issues and lack of DDi are ongoing concerns, and there are hangers-on and rubber neckers.
The boards are also in a serious amount of disarray, and the community management team doesn't seem to be on the same page in a number of issues.
Communication from within wizards for many has been relatively non-existent. Fans and companies are waiting weeks upon weeks for a response and are lucky to get a "I've been busy" reply. Get these people some help or better time management, whichever they need (Personally, I think it's help and letting them cut through some red tape).
The entire process of anything from Wizards has come to such a crawl that it is alienating its customer base. As I have pointed out before, any honest statistical analysis can tell you that your boards provide you more than enough of a base to complete marketing analysis, so I don't know why people keep saying that they don't. Right now, it seems from the outside that WotC is interested in making what they can now, without any forethought as to the damage they are causing to their fiscal future.
Major Issues
[*]Game Table The most pressing issue of DDI that is effecting me is the lack of a game table. I don't care if it is small not very pretty or just is a PHP grid system with some coins on it. Without it I can't game. Trying to make the Table the be all and end all is not what is needed just making it work and getting it up and running is more important worry about the rest as it comes along. build a foundation and then give updates to continue it's growth.
The Game Table is the most complex application to develop and get right. It is also the application that requires the most resources, besides development: Q/A, servers, builds.... As such it is the least likely to come first, because on top of that we want to have some integration with the other applications.
We are *not* trying to make the Game Table to be all and end all, we do plan to do exactly what you describe: build a foundation and then give updates to continue it's growth. At the moment, we have some usability testing feedback to take care of, but in term of functionalities, we are not adding new features, and this is not what is holding us up on this application. We are focusing on making what we have work, and make it work right from the user perspective too.
Minor issues
[*]DDI Specs the specification for DDI seam to high for a portion of the communities computers. Given that an acceptable level of graphics would be the equivalent of Diablo, Neverwintner nights or WOW it seems that DDI is less of a game but has a higher requirement than top selling games of the past.
The specification posted are not minimum specifications, but recommended specifications. We are still working on the exact details of the minimum specifications. We'd like to allow graphic cards using shader 1.1 to be able to run the D&D Game Table, but all the details about minimum specs will be communicated when they have been confirmed through our Q/A processes.
Game Table. it is going to be a bear for the company because of the integration and server load alone. I see this. I hope that everything goes smoothly on launch. Take the time you need to get it right, I just wish it was the first to come out.
Specs. Because of the graphic requirements of shader 1.1 I don't think I can run your application on my computer. I scraped together a computer. I scraped together a computer just for this application and I still wont be able to run it. I am a mac guy and the graphic card on my laptop although good enough to run Diablo or Neverwiner or WOW, will not be able to run Game table. i put a second computer together out of spare parts to hopefully use to run game table but I don't have the money to continue to put into this machine to be able to run Game table, especially since I can just run Fantasy grounds and still be able to work just fine. I will still subscribe to DDI though because I love the Dungeons and Dragon Articles though. I'm just said that I will not be able to use the rest of it.
I hope that this is not taken as a post that is gripping or bi#$%y. I really think you guys are trying to do right by us. I just wish I could be a part of it as well.
I will have quotes and links relevant to my comments soon.
And BTW, thanks DM for coming on and letting us have some more info on the matter I really appreciate it.
Wulfe
Hey, I can chime on some of those issues highlighted
The Game Table is the most complex application to develop and get right. It is also the application that requires the most resources, besides development: Q/A, servers, builds.... As such it is the least likely to come first, because on top of that we want to have some integration with the other applications.
We are *not* trying to make the Game Table to be all and end all, we do plan to do exactly what you describe: build a foundation and then give updates to continue it's growth. At the moment, we have some usability testing feedback to take care of, but in term of functionalities, we are not adding new features, and this is not what is holding us up on this application. We are focusing on making what we have work, and make it work right from the user perspective too.
The specification posted are not minimum specifications, but recommended specifications. We are still working on the exact details of the minimum specifications. We'd like to allow graphic cards using shader 1.1 to be able to run the D&D Game Table, but all the details about minimum specs will be communicated when they have been confirmed through our Q/A processes.
Thanks.
Edit: I fell ill this weekend and still am, but I'm not finding anything out of character or upsetting here. I suppose below is the report as it stands, GZ.
Report Items:
In an effort to increase communication between WotC and the customers, GZ indicated he would be willing to put together a progress report for DDi. It’s still unclear as to why, this suggestion has been made repeatedly in numerous threads over the past several weeks and is only now coming around to being noticed, and when asked why, we received the common ineffective communication we are striving to correct.
http://forums.gleemax.com/showthread.php?t=1065108
We started the week with a relatively simple issue. One of the fans showed their dissatisfaction in what could easily be considered an ineffective manner. The thread was closed and directed to be added to a more constructive thread. There were other ways this could have been handled and, based on just the initial handling it works in the negative way of positive PR for WotC. The offending post can be found here http://forums.gleemax.com/showthread.php?t=1064397 .
Again, on the failure of communication by WotC, we have this post: http://forums.gleemax.com/showthread.php?t=1065691 “Is DDi going to happen or is it Vaporware?” Quite possibly inflammatory, but it was put succinctly without any malice or mockery. Still, no one has been able to step forward and answer the question. This is the sort of thing that really lowers the opinion of WotC.
http://forums.gleemax.com/showthread.php?t=1065003
It’s a simple question, but I think one poster says it best, and this is true of so many things we see answered on the forums.
http://forums.gleemax.com/showpost.php?p=16417740&postcount=3
By: Paulon
“I understand your position here Gamer_Zero, but I'm disgusted that you have to check with the legal people to find out the answer. That's a question that they should have considered, decided on the answer, and publicized that answer before any digital articles were even posted.”
Positives:
It’s unfortunate to say, but trying to find something positive is like finding a rare gem among the boards nowadays.
We do have the UnCon notices and discussions, which is a good thing.
http://forums.gleemax.com/showthread.php?t=1028521 and http://forums.gleemax.com/showthread.php?t=1062892
We also have GamerZero making more appearances and discussing things more. WotCDM has also been chiming in on a number of the technical aspect questions.
Ongoing Issues
The argument over pricing continues well into today, as evidenced here http://forums.gleemax.com/showthread.php?t=1040013&page=8.
A sub-set of the argument, associated with PDF pricing can be found here. http://forums.gleemax.com/showthread.php?t=1059546
We’re still seeing issues with the forums. Database errors are popping off and on even from the main site. It doesn’t help when announcements are a week or more old when discussing projected downtime, as this was still live on 7/26: http://forums.gleemax.com/announcement.php?f=46 with no update since the maintenance almost a week ago.
I'd really like some more positive stuff to go in here (sans spin), so any help with that would be appreciated for sure.
Only positive things I can see is WotC_DM is answering what questions that he can and GZ is more involved in discussion the last week or two then in the past.
Only positive things I can see is WotC_DM is answering what questions that he can and GZ is more involved in discussion the last week or two then in the past.
Yup, I added that. The report is done, I suppose, and ready to be sent off.
Yup, I added that. The report is done, I suppose, and ready to be sent off.
Oh-ho, that is only the first week's report, m'dear.. (..m'sir?)
Time for the next week's list of complaints! :D
Major Problems
-Nothing I can think of at the moment.
Minor Problems
-"If you do not have cookies enabled you will not be able to fully experience the D&D website and D&D Insider". The cookies presented do not have a third-party compact policy (and I know this because my "Low" setting for internet options doesn't even give me a prompt for the cookies). The only way D&Di cookies would be allowed is if players pretty much ignored their security system, and while many people may hate Norton or other protections, few would completely shut them off while surfing the internet.
Ongoing Problems
-GZ's WPM: It's fast, no, really fast. You would think that GZ being a fast typer would be a positive, but in truth it only leaves more questions. He's able to type up a gigantic post in a matter of minutes, and yet the time it takes for everything to move is rediculously slow. Further words cannot describe the blindingly apparent oxymoron.
....just a thought....
I'm still really disturbed that when given the chance to be their own pep squad, let along damage control, no one over there seems to take up the call....does this make anyone else uncomfortable?