Winning Races
By. Robert J. Schwalb
Where common elves are free-spirited and mercurial, dusk elves are furtive, haunted, and suspicious. Dusk elves restrict their emotions to a narrow range, showing little joy and less grief. Dusk elves value their privacy and guard their lands from trespassers. During private moments, they reflect on their nature, their people’s history, and the plans Sehanine has for them. They see the natural world as a prison, albeit a beautiful one, and pine for the fabulous cities and verdant fey lands they abandoned long ago.
At the dawn of creation, no difference between the eladrin and elves existed, and no wickedness sundered the drow from their light-dwelling kin. They were one people, bound through common love and life, and united by the eagerness and curiosity for the natural world’s many wonders. All this ended during the dread wars between the Houses, because Lolth’s poison sundered family, shattered bonds, and altered the eladrin’s course for all time.
I think the idea of bloodline feats is that they cross multiple races, while this one is spefically elf.
Also, in this case, its like the Faerun elf sub race feats, though largely expanded upon.
I think the idea of bloodline feats is that they cross multiple races, while this one is spefically elf.
Also, in this case, its like the Faerun elf sub race feats, though largely expanded upon.
On that note, I think Dusk Elf Stealth should have a notation that it can't be taken alongside the Wood Elf and Wild Elf-specific feats in the FRPG.
Another point that seems off to me -- these elves give others a bonus to Stealth but gain no bonus themselves?
The feat probably should include a stealth bonus, true.
It's almost like they made some feats and tried to tweak them until they made sure no one would pick them up. Original versions of these feats were probably something like:
Duskelf Stealth - you gain training in Stealth and a +2 feat bonus to stealth checks.
Duskelf Weapon Training - you gain training in all simple and military light blades as well as the rapier and parrying dagger. You gain +2/3/4 feat bonus to damage with these weapons.
Gathering Night - whenever you use total defense, you become invisible till end of next turn.
Gloaming Ward - when you are bloodied by an enemy the first time in an encounter, you gain concealment until the end of the enemy's next turn.
Sehanine's Boon - whenever you spend a healing surge while you have concealment or total concealment, you regain additional hit points equal to your wisdom modifier.
Umbrel Wind - when you use your second wind, you gain concealment till end of your next turn. If you already have concealment, you instead gain total concealment.
And then, somebody decided, no, we don't want people to actually use these feats, and they started chopping off the useful bits.
Dusk Elf Weapon Training seems weak. Who uses light blades? Rogues, Sorcerers, and Tempests pretty much. And they have proficiency in pretty much all of the simple and military light blades that they'd be using. Shouldn't there be some superior options? Then people might actually use kukris!
On some of the feats, if you have Concealment and took a specific action, you would then gain either Invisibility or Total Concealment.
What if you only have Concealment against a few creatures on the field, rather then everyone? Would you still have Invisibility or Total Concealment from everyone, despite not having Concealment against some of the creatures? Or would it be the thought of only having the Invisibility or Total Concealment against the creatures you had Concealment from to begin with?
I am assuming the later at the moment.
Awesome concept. Sub-races as feats... sigh.
It's not easy being a dusk elf.
Awesome concept. Sub-races as feats... sigh.
It's not easy being a dusk elf.
I like that you can get it after being "just" a (half-)elf for a long time.
"Why do I now feel so dusky? Perhaps I should stand in plain sight and assist my friends in hiding."
Anyone else think Gathering Night is an OK feat for (half-)elf Warlocks who bother to go this route?
Some of the others may be alright, though they should have consolidated Sehanine's Boon and Umbral Wind. Maybe Gloaming Ward could be rolled in there, too. There needs to be a (situational?) (Paragon?) feat which turns concealment into total concealment.
DE Weapon Training is laughably weak and should give superior weapons. Or a racial to-hit bonus to light blades instead. Or a racial damange bonus to light blades. Or SOMETHING.
Darkening Blade isn't bad for Dex folks, but I suspect most class PPs will crowd it out.
Do we get all these kind of subraces for Dragonborn? No... Do we get this for Halflings? No... Do we get this for Deva? No... We only get this with Elves and freaking Dwarves! Stop it! Stop this madness right now. We do not want to go down this road again. We were tired of it under 2E, we were tired of it under 3E, and we're beyond tired of it now.
Stop with the freaking Elf Love. Let's spread this love around.
Stop with the freaking Elf Love. Let's spread this love around.
Cheers to this.
This is restarting the whole '200 types of elves' thing, though. the Elf issue. Now we have... Moon Elf, Sun Elf, Drow, Eladrin, (Some even consider Shadar-Kai as Shadow Elves), Wild Elf, Anareal Elf, and now DUSK elves.
Do we get all these kind of subraces for Dragonborn? No... Do we get this for Halflings? No... Do we get this for Deva? No... We only get this with Elves and freaking Dwarves! Stop it! Stop this madness right now. We do not want to go down this road again. We were tired of it under 2E, we were tired of it under 3E, and we're beyond tired of it now.
Stop with the freaking Elf Love. Let's spread this love around.
No one considers Shadar-Kai elves. Why? Because they're humans. And if you're going to whine about too much Elf/Dwarf love, then here:
Humans: Human, Shadar-Kai, Half-Elf, Half-Orc, Genasi, Tiefling
Those are all actual races, versus a single race with a few feats to create sub-races. So why don't you complain about too many humans, huh?
Do we get all these kind of subraces for Dragonborn? No...
Actually, there is a whole Dragonborn book coming out (for which we should be getting previews soon), so, possibly yes. Tieflings are next.
Stop with the freaking Elf Love. Let's spread this love around.
I agree that we need more Dwarf Woman love. I'm pleased to see one in today's article art, and I suspect I know what she's questing for in the next parcel: the missing Armor of Legendary Decolletage which is her birthright.
Blonde Dusk Elf man is saying: "Shhh! Let me help you hide over there my sweet. Thank goodness I know how to use this light blade, which is _my_ birthright."
I don't like how Wayne Reynolds does eyes. Dunno why. Too beady or something.
No one considers Shadar-Kai elves. Why? Because they're humans. And if you're going to whine about too much Elf/Dwarf love, then here:
Humans: Human, Shadar-Kai, Half-Elf, Half-Orc, Genasi, Tiefling
Those are all actual races, versus a single race with a few feats to create sub-races. So why don't you complain about too many humans, huh?
Really, can someone tell me what is supposed to make Humans, Goliaths, and Devas look different? Besides the direction of the stripes? :p
This is restarting the whole '200 types of elves' thing, though. the Elf issue. Now we have... Moon Elf, Sun Elf, Drow, Eladrin, (Some even consider Shadar-Kai as Shadow Elves), Wild Elf, Anareal Elf, and now DUSK elves.
Do we get all these kind of subraces for Dragonborn? No... Do we get this for Halflings? No... Do we get this for Deva? No... We only get this with Elves and freaking Dwarves! Stop it! Stop this madness right now. We do not want to go down this road again. We were tired of it under 2E, we were tired of it under 3E, and we're beyond tired of it now.
Stop with the freaking Elf Love. Let's spread this love around.
You are mixing up some things here.
Moon Elf, Sun Elf = Eladrin in Forgotten Realms
Wild Elf = FR normal Elf
Anareal is Eberron if I am not mistaken.
So the Dusk are the only one really new.
That said, I also think that the feats could use a little bit boosting.
Really, can someone tell me what is supposed to make Humans, Goliaths, and Devas look different? Besides the direction of the stripes? :p
That's the trouble with still images. Apart from goliaths being 1/2 to and 2 feet taller than even a deva, and deva having a much wider variety of skin tones, most of their differences are in how they hold themselves. If you could see them in motion, the deva's almost utter stillness would be very distinctive.
The way the artwork distinguishes them is through clothing. Deva are, with few to no exceptions, depicted with artificial wings.
Stop with the freaking Elf Love. Let's spread this love around.
Cheers to this.
and cheers again. i don't mind the sub-races through feats so long as the feat states that other sub-race feats cannot be chosen.
we have tribal feats, guild feats, dragonmarked feats, so some sub-race of x would be a nice addition. however, i heartily agree that we can be done with elf love for a while.
in response to other posters about variations on humans, so those are quite humanoid, but what if i want that extra feat and at-will? i'd like to remain human but have some interesting benies from the culture i grew up in that goes beyond background, tribe, dragonmark, or guild.
also, why couldn't we make sub-races of shifters [ie panther razorclaw, tiger razorclaw, siamese razorclaw, bobcat razorclaw, wolf longtooth, pug longtooth, beagle longtooth]? there's a race that has room for sub-races.
how about sub-races for changeling that relate to the parentage opposing the doppleganger parentage?
i like the concept, but why is it that only elves seem to have so much diversity in these fantasy genres? it seems there ought to be just as much room for diversity in every other race.
Dara
also, why couldn't we make sub-races of shifters [ie panther razorclaw, tiger razorclaw, siamese razorclaw, bobcat razorclaw[...]
Persian razorclaw shifters? I'm game. "Sneeze Barrage", "Drenched Chin Shake", "Eye Crud Rub". Totally imba.
i like the concept, but why is it that only elves seem to have so much diversity in these fantasy genres? it seems there ought to be just as much room for diversity in every other race.
Like much in generic fantasy, blame Tolkein, who cared more about elves than people humans.
This is restarting the whole '200 types of elves' thing, though. the Elf issue. Now we have... Moon Elf, Sun Elf, Drow, Eladrin, (Some even consider Shadar-Kai as Shadow Elves), Wild Elf, Anareal Elf, and now DUSK elves.
Do we get all these kind of subraces for Dragonborn? No... Do we get this for Halflings? No... Do we get this for Deva? No... We only get this with Elves and freaking Dwarves! Stop it! Stop this madness right now. We do not want to go down this road again. We were tired of it under 2E, we were tired of it under 3E, and we're beyond tired of it now.
Stop with the freaking Elf Love. Let's spread this love around.
amen.
lets see metallic and chromatic dragonborn.......... rabbit shifters....snake shifters......bear shifters....
mice shifters....
Volcano dwarves.....
.....dark angel Deva, nature deva.....
underdark goliath.....pirate goliath.......desert goliath...... jungle goliath......
urban half-orc....... pirate half-orc.......plains half-orc..... sky half-orc......
metal gnomes........ rock gnomes.....tattoo gnomes...... wind gnomes....
amen.
lets see metallic and chromatic dragonborn.......... rabbit shifters....snake shifters......bear shifters....
mice shifters....
Volcano dwarves.....
.....dark angel Deva, nature deva.....
underdark goliath.....pirate goliath.......desert goliath...... jungle goliath......
urban half-orc....... pirate half-orc.......plains half-orc..... sky half-orc......
metal gnomes........ rock gnomes.....tattoo gnomes...... wind gnomes....
Rock Warforged, Hard Rock Warforged, Heavy Metal Warforged...
4e has elf love?
To be fair, Eladrin take it worse by far than elves, but elves still don't have that much. So... Yeah, huh?
I just double checked the Gnome feat Group Stealth, because I remembered it being pretty good. It is the same feat as Dusk Elf Stealth, except it's better in every way- +2 instead of +1, and out to 10 squares instead of 6. I haven't heard anyone say that Group Stealth is broken, so why is this one so much worse?
I think Dusk Elf Stealth may be broken in the sense of being too weak, not too strong. Gnomes get a +2 bonus to Stealth -- dusk elves do not. That feat would be the first of the "Group" feats or racial abiliities to enable a character to grant a skill bonus that the character in question does not have.
Unless they actually thought Dusk Elf Stealth was good...
"Tiger in disguise... More than meet the eye!" XD
The extremely niche feat being a prerequisite for every other mediocre feat in the article makes the crunch in this article rather disappointing. I like that there is a prerequisite for the feats, but wish it had been something more significant.
It's almost like they made some feats and tried to tweak them until they made sure no one would pick them up. Original versions of these feats were probably something like:
Duskelf Stealth - you gain training in Stealth and a +2 feat bonus to stealth checks.
Duskelf Weapon Training - you gain training in all simple and military light blades as well as the rapier and parrying dagger. You gain +2/3/4 feat bonus to damage with these weapons.
Gathering Night - whenever you use total defense, you become invisible till end of next turn.
Gloaming Ward - when you are bloodied by an enemy the first time in an encounter, you gain concealment until the end of the enemy's next turn.
Sehanine's Boon - whenever you spend a healing surge while you have concealment or total concealment, you regain additional hit points equal to your wisdom modifier.
Umbrel Wind - when you use your second wind, you gain concealment till end of your next turn. If you already have concealment, you instead gain total concealment.
And then, somebody decided, no, we don't want people to actually use these feats, and they started chopping off the useful bits.
Complete agree with this. All the feats in this article are just plain bad, to the point nobody will ever take. And about the elf love: come on, this is the FIRST elf article with crunch since the beginning of forth edition, almost two years ago! And they do such a crappy job? I was really looking forward to this article, but it does no good whatsoever to my elf! I'm completely disapointed. Worst part is having to wait months for the NEXT elf article to finally get some useful feats... Where is ''Elven Bow Weapon Mastery''?
Complete agree with this. All the feats in this article are just plain bad, to the point nobody will ever take. And about the elf love: come on, this is the FIRST elf article with crunch since the beginning of forth edition, almost two years ago! And they do such a crappy job? I was really looking forward to this article, but it does no good whatsoever to my elf! I'm completely disapointed. Worst part is having to wait months for the NEXT elf article to finally get some useful feats... Where is ''Elven Bow Weapon Mastery''?
What would Elven Bow Weapon Mastery do? Bow Mastery is already the easiest of the epic 19-20 critical feats to qualify for.
I think he means a feat equiavlent to Eladrin Soldier, or Dwarven Weapon Training, but for bows. It seems most other races with a signature weapon are getting them these days.
Yeah, that's what I was saying. Keep in mind, the Githzerai's feat is called Githzerai Blade Mastery.
I think he means a feat equiavlent to Eladrin Soldier, or Dwarven Weapon Training, but for bows. It seems most other races with a signature weapon are getting them these days.
Yeah, that's what I was saying. Keep in mind, the Githzerai's feat is called Githzerai Blade Mastery.
For all of those races, they're getting a benefit to using a melee weapon type associated with their race, and none of them favor Strength. Goliaths favor Strength and have a similar feat, but their feat doesn't give proficiency with any superior weapons. I think it's unlikely that you'd have a race that favored Dexterity getting a feat which gave them greatbow training and a damage boost, no matter how closely associated with their race that bows are.
I think the role of those feats is to encourage people to play weapon-based classes when they otherwise aren't suited for them. Elves are already very well-suited for bow users and don't need another feat to help with it. (And yes, I know that there are now some Wisdom-based weapon using classes which make Dwarven Weapon Training and Githzerai Blade Mastery better than originally intended. I think that was a consequence that was not foreseen).
Swordmages and Artificers use Int.
Rogue, Assasin, and Monks (although they mostly use them for enchantments) are Dex.
Avengers use Wisdom.
Bards use charisma.
And thats before the other 3 psionic classes, and the divine one in PHBIII, who could very well be melee users without strength primary.
However, classes that wield weapons are no longer all strength except the rogue.
Swordmages and Artificers use Int.
Rogue, Assasin, and Monks (although they mostly use them for enchantments) are Dex.
Avengers use Wisdom.
Bards use charisma.
And thats before the other 3 psionic classes, and the divine one in PHBIII, who could very well be melee users without strength primary.
That said, swordmages only use light and heavy blades (and while the eladrin feat helps with longswords, it's no better than Weapon Focus through paragon and epic). Rogues only use light blades and a couple of other weapons which don't come into play with the existing weapon feats.
Artificers, assassins, and bards are not limited by their powers like swordmages and rogues are, but artificers and bards don't have high [W] damage powers, so they're slightly less affected by feats which help out with weapon choice and damage. It does help eladrin artificers (who take a greatspear, probably), but there aren't any races who have a Charisma bonus and one of the racial weapon feats.
At this point, assassins and avengers have races which get a racial weapon feat and a bonus to their primary statistic. I don't disagree that the problem I see is already present in some cases. I think the racial weapon feats were made to bring races up to snuff when playing classes that were associated with them when they otherwise would not have been (e.g. dwarven fighter). That those feats make some class/race combinations more powerful than the baseline is an unintended consequence. A feat which gives elves a superior weapon proficiency (greatbow) and a damage boost would strongly advantage elven rangers and seekers over other races for those classes. It's not a good thing when some choices are clearly better than others, and an elven ranger with a racial feat to boost the use of bows (like the ones we've already seen) would be clearly better than a ranger from another race with the same attribute bonuses.
Basically, every new article inflationate the feat pool, and end up killing those feats that are interesting but no more so useful. It's a lot since the last apparition of back to the wall in the Char Op, while many new more reliable feats are appearing in those uber-chars.
Now, while many player od not give a cent about min/maxing, it remain that those new options are more attractive than others. Ever an actor player do not care about certain feats and end up commenting "nice, but not useful as... XXX" when looking at many feats.
This is an effect of inflating of certain feat type (like plain damage boosts) over more specific, situational ones (like back to the wall).
So, nice things, many avengers will be happy for this. But... It seem to me that aumenting the options reduce the things you take.
Should feats (and powers, and equip) really need this sort of no-brain things? Shouldn't be more interesting to have more situational but more spectacular effects from feats?
How many damage boosting feats, effect and items one can cumulate? The number is limited.
To sum up, I would much rather spend my feats on traits like the dusk elf feat instead of Weapon Expertise, or Epic Will, Robust Defenses and the like. Maybe the players handbook 3 will fix these things.
Well, we have wandered away from article discussion back to feature creep, the feat tax, and how the designers had to use feats to make a math fix. The fact so many discussions wander in that direction should be good evidence that a few basic changes to the game are needed.
To sum up, I would much rather spend my feats on traits like the dusk elf feat instead of Weapon Expertise, or Epic Will, Robust Defenses and the like. Maybe the players handbook 3 will fix these things.
Seconded. And the feats are all good IMO, apart from the first. The first should grant ssomething different too. As it is, it reeks of "take this uninteresting feat to justify how interesting you'll become later".
Gather The Night is the most awesome feat I know. I'm totally doing an invisible ever-defending warden with that.
I will consider the Dusk Elf if I ever get to play the game instead of mastering it.