is that the same Table Top that was Touted so heavily pre Release of DnD 4.0?
The one that on page 11 of the Players Manual (that was printed and released in 2008) said we could use?
... let that sink in... 2008... !!!??!!!
it's now 20011 and your talking about a BETA TEST?
so, ---- Edited by OP ---
blah blah blah - Rant Rant Rage Rant ...
concluding statement:
Sorry but the burn is still there even after YEARS have passed.
--- Edited out Final Jab ---
Sig.
zWolf -out.
Nick -out
*drops the microphone*
~`~
I'm actually a big Fan of DnD, and my rant sounds petty... but... honestly... the burn from 2008 still festers and every once and a while it all just 'bursts out' in the form of a rant... sigh... isn't that what the interenets are for anyway? Rantz and Pr0nz?
zWolf -out.
-(edit - thanks to the abbility to edit our posts, I have made the original Post a bit lest hostile... the sentiment comes accross, but I took out some of the 'filler crap' that was in it. )-
The Virtual Table Top you can read about these days isn't the one announced in 2008. It is an independant tool build by a different company as far as I know. At this point in time however, the tool is still in closed beta testing. The bright side about it is, that up until now it looks quite solid and allready works fine enought to actually play the game online.
If you want to know more about it in detail, I recommend to take a look at the forum, or ask some more questions here. I might not be able to answer them but I'll try to do so as far as I can after beta testing it for some time now.
ya... I should just delete it... man every time I see something about it I just get so wound up ... ya know?
I'm actually a big Fan of DnD, and my rant sounds petty... but... honestly... the burn from 2008 still festers and every once and a while it all just 'bursts out' in the form of a rant... sigh... isn't that what the interenets are for anyway? Rantz and Pr0nz?
zWolf -out.
It's cool, man; I'm known to rant on occassion. I just don't like to get all wound up like that. It's not good for my blood pressure.
I typically use chiding posts like that to try and diffuse the poster and help them to chill out a bit, that's all.And, despite my best efforts at wholesale transformation, the internet does seem to be about nerd rage and porn.
My suggestion is to relax a bit. Sure they promised the moon and delivered something else. I just try not to take it personally. I mean, in the end we're talking about a game that we all love, you know?
Hey, so where is the best place to go for information on the VTT closed beta. I've been searching these forums for a couple of days now and haven't found a central location for information regarding the beta. Is there a master thread, or a page that someone can post a link to? I've checked out some people's blog posts and even stumbled on a youtube video of one guy using the thing.
Actually, there isn't a good place I've seen for people talking about their experiences with it. There is a private group with forums in it, but obviously that's for the VT testers. Wizards wants people to talk about it but I haven't seen much on it around here after a few threads with some initial "here's what I thought" posts.
I'm a tester, but I don't really have anything interesting to say about it. I can answer questions if you like.
In order to quickly answers the question you had:
The Virtual Table Top you can read about these days isn't the one announced in 2008. It is an independant tool build by a different company as far as I know.
Well this is good to know. that's right, I think they took the VTT off the list of things that they were working on for DDI for a little while, I guess that it's cool that they put it back on. heh. Thanks for the info on this.
At this point in time however, the tool is still in closed beta testing. The bright side about it is, that up until now it looks quite solid and allready works fine enought to actually play the game online.
Again, Excellent Info.
If you want to know more about it in detail, I recommend to take a look at the forum, or ask some more questions here. I might not be able to answer them but I'll try to do so as far as I can after beta testing it for some time now.
Thanks, I may, but... alas... I really don't want to get 'invested' in this again - I know I shouldn't have gotten so 'invested' in the last one, but I really bit hard into their hype, I had talked to lots of friends, and we were all ready to run a remote game when the books were released... even the printed Books directed users to the www.ddi.com web site, but when you got there it just auto forwarded you back to the main DnD site - it was a long time and manny requests for info. later before they finaly admited that there was NO tool available, with no ETA to completion (they finaly said a year, then finaly stopped talking about it... now they have a new tool.. but I fear being twice burned, so I think instead of 'digging into' finding out more about it, I'll be content with the other VTT's that I found (Fantasy Grounds II, Battle Grounds, iTableTop, and soon to be Epic Table)
Once WOTC actually has a product that I can use... then I'll wana check it out - and most likely, I'll become an avid user of the tool... till then, I'll try to get my nerd rage to cool down heh.
zWolf -out.
Not vaporware. I am testing it as are several hundred other DDi members as Kartesh mentioned.
My nerd Rage asside, this is pretty cool news. heh - If I can step back from my hurt feelings a bit, I can even feel a slight 'tingle of anticipation' - an 'ember' or 'spark' of the old enthusiasm stirs withen.
I hope it is cool - even if it's just a shadow of what they presented back in the 'hype' days pre 4.0 release heh, I bet I'd still enjoy running games with my remote friends.
Answer me this: Would you truly have been happier had they never released it?
Well so far, they havn't 'released it' so, I suppose your question could be edited to read: 'would you truly be happier if they don't release it?'
but even with that question out there - it's not the fact that it wasn't released that was my issue to start with... I'm not sure if you were there for all the hype behind the tool pre release of the books.. there were lots of folks that bought the books, with the intentionof playing with remote friends with the tools that they assured us would be available upon the release of the books.
Even after the release, with people going to the web site (that was printed in the books, with instructions to go there to play on the virtual table top remotely,) there was no anouncment for several days that the tool wasn't even available...
So that means that people that had been following the developement, had been told it would release with the books, so the books come out, no tool - we as for clarification and get nothing (they still had books to sell to folks that were buying them so they could use the VTT you see - it's the only explination behind the lack of communication those first few days that I can come up with.)
Eventualy they did admit that it wasn't ready, but they assured us it was just a few weeks out...
after those weeks passed, they came up with a schedule that showed the tools that were closest to completion and listed the VTT as out a few months... we got the compendium, the Character Builder, the magazines Electronicly.. things like that... then came a list of things they were working on, with out even the VTT on the list!! grrr - seee my frustration growing... it had nothing about me not wanting it to come out, and every thing to do with the lack of communication and the use of hype to sell products... first the books, then the ddi subscription.
anyway - no your question is quite silly, I'd not be happier if they never release it, my unhappiness stems wholey from the lack of release, and the lack of or misuse of communication. (lies and ommisions mostly.)
anyway, all that said - I still like DnD, I'm still a fan, I just hope for better communication and less lying.
...lying... it's such a strong word... I retract it. sigh, as for me posting on the forums, honestly, it's theripudic... (how ever you spell it,) by sharing my feelings with the group - and seeing that there IS still work going on - I actually get closer to getting over my 'hurt feelings' and moving on to enjoying (and even paying for,) the e-tools.
So thanks for reading.
zWolf -out.
...And, despite my best efforts at wholesale transformation, the internet does seem to be about nerd rage and porn.
My suggestion is to relax a bit. Sure they promised the moon and delivered something else. I just try not to take it personally. I mean, in the end we're talking about a game that we all love, you know?
lol, and ya, good sugestions. :-)
Hi. Wouldn't this be better served as an email?
Nick -out
*drops the microphone*
~`~
Ya - you were right - so I took out the most 'ranty' of the rant... I left the general 'gist' there so that the folowing thread made sense.. but some of the sharp corners were sanded off in the editing heh.
I was sleep deprived - what can I say.
Zwolf,
A lot of folks have felt the way you do, and there are those who still feel deeply burned by the pre-4E hype for the tools. I also had high hopes and expectations based on the original hype, and was disappointed by their failure to deliver.
I didn't need the VTT, so the eventual release of a decent Character Builder left me content, if still disappointed they never realized the potential of digital tools to aid the DM.
They are still struggling with how to communicate, even in the past few months with the lead up to the "new DDI". But they seem to have made some significant improvements with their communication plans and have been a bit more forthcoming with plans including acknowledgement of not quite meeting some recent goals.
It is still too early to call it a successful turnaround, but it seems to me they are finally getting some forward traction. It is certain that they will not make everyone happy with the DDI Tools 2.0, but at least they seem to have a vision and the ability to program new tools.
Not vaporware. I am testing it as are several hundred other DDi members as Kartesh mentioned.
I am able to post here but I have not received my Beta invite, what do I need to do?
I'm still waiting for that beta invite. Also, if I get one, do each of my friends need to have the beta invite as well? Or could we all play with one invite?
If you want to play with people, they have to have access to the table, which would be granted only if they signed up for the beta and if Wizards approved of it. Otherwise, you'll have to make friends with people in the beta already and play with them.
That's not that difficult either, there is a thread for people who are always starting up impromptu games that have no real continuing story line.
I tried to make a video about making tokens for the VT so once it's out people will understand a good way to do it, but I have been having trouble with my recorder... It may be the fact I'm running an older screencapture program on windows seven so I'll have to give it a try on my XP machine to see if it will work.
Right now, they are making a system that works, maps, number crunching... ext... I HOPE that they will work on making it better graphically once the basics are working perfectly. I'd like to see the 3d thing they said they'ed make too.
...Right now, they are making a system that works, maps, number crunching... ext... I HOPE that they will work on making it better graphically once the basics are working perfectly. I'd like to see the 3d thing they said they'ed make too.
Personally I haven't seen any statement about any sort of "3d thing" other than maybe the visualizer in the recent past and the ones I think to remember only said it was not canceled.
However I highly doubt they will integrate any sort of 3d element into the virtual table. The tool is allready in closed beta, which is definetly not the time to once again reconsider about making it a 3d platform. I am not a software designer, but even I can imagine, that switching to 3d at this point in time whould mean to allmost start from scratch again.
What I expect are more features and bugfixes. Mainly the first one, since the tool is quite simple right now, so there aren't many things that require a fix. In the end it very much depends on how customized and comfortable they want this tool to be. That said, I hope they will some day reach the point at which there is no doubt that this tool is the first choice if you want to play D&D online.
Have there been any updates to the VT while this Beta is going on? Have you seen bugs reported or fixed? Features added?
Oh yes there have. Especially major problems (of which there were rather few so far as I experienced for myself) normally get solved rather quick. Bugreports are also listed and will be worked on as time passes. For example there was an update last thursday that also introduced some new features to the virtual table. I hope you dont mind if I do a quick copy and paste here to give you a small impression on it:
Hello beta participants. Here is the information regarding Thursday's downtime, and the changes you will see:
- Damage, Healing, and Condition Dialogs: This is a revamp to applying damage, healing, and conditions that makes the process more intuitive by separating the dialogs, adding checkboxes for conditions, and allowing a user to spend healing surges to heal.
- Open Campaign Search Changes: These are changes to the campaign manager that make it easier to ensure a user can jump into pickup games. A DM is required to specify a start time and duration for a campaign in order to create open slots for it, and users can filter open campaigns by campaigns starting now (or in 15 minutes), in the future, or on specific days.
- Movement tracking of tokens in the application.
- Rest dialog simulating short and extended rests.
- Application waits 20 seconds and then shuts down if user enters 3 invalid pass-codes.
- In-table announcement and chat when a player is booted, banned, drops out or has timed out.
- Text on Campaign Manager is too light.
- Numerous minor bug fixes.
It all has a very personal feeling to it and Josh is doing a great job in order to answer our questions and make sure our suggestions and reports are heard.
I hope this answers some of your questions, feel free to ask if there is anything else on your mind.
Well this is good to know. that's right, I think they took the VTT off the list of things that they were working on for DDI for a little while, I guess that it's cool that they put it back on. heh. Thanks for the info on this.
Yeah, you probably haven't heard too many details about what happened with the original VTT, but it sounds like they had contracted it out to an independant team. And WotC's main problem was, perhaps, not have enough management review on that team, and simply taking them at their word that the product was coming along - so they likely truly believed that it would be out when they said it would be out. And eventually it turned out that the VTT was incomplete and non-functional, and so they had to scrap it entirely and were out a pretty huge investment, leaving DDI scrambling to put together products on their own.
And, right around this time, the senior manager of DDI was involved in a pretty horrific incident, which I imagine caused further difficulties for the team.
I think they always wanted to get back to having a VTT, but the original one was pretty much useless, and they didn't have the time or resources to develop a new one from the ground up - until now.
Hello all, I wonder is it too late to help with testing?
Hello all, I wonder is it too late to help with testing?
No, but you have to receive an invite from wizards.com
Hello all, I wonder is it too late to help with testing?
They're still doing invite's, I received mine a couple of days ago. Make sure your notifications are turned on & you've filled out the beta application form ok. Then keep your fingers crossed!
