Hi, I’m DMing my own adventure that contain an expedition to cold distant great kingdom, that mysteriously vanished long ago, and players are part of this group.
The expedition is mostly funded and led by very important Lord of Amn with the blessing and support of The Lord’s Alliance. I already established couple of npces, and they already made more or less contacts with player’s.
The main lord – he’s house in jeopardy (secretively),and he goes there to make a glory for himself and his house, and to uncover a lot of treasures and myster of vanishing - also to help his house.
Gnome nobleman- also lord alliance, he is al about the money. (old friend of one of the players)
The lady McCromwel people – lord alliance, lady is also funding the expedition cause her predecessors came from this great kingdom (not really, but she want her most trusted people to fabricate evidence that they really did).
Guard boss half-orc – concrete and diligent, he want to keep everyone safe
geeky girl scientist – the expedition main expert on the lost kingdom
The dwarven cleric of Lathander – going there to look for people of his church that went there previously with very important persona (daughter of Lathander?) and didn’t return. But secretly want to make sure that they wont return (bad guy)
The fighter girl – looking for her brother who went with the previous Lathander group.
The suspicious guy – mysterious man, who is looking for a very powerful artifact for his boss (BBEG), but really he wants to destroy it so the boss won’t gain so much power.
They are the most important npces I made, and in preparation for the trip the player character interacted with them.
Short story;
What expedition know: In the frozen mountains region, long time ago, there lived a tribes of people, dwarfs, and giants, nothing special. Until one man came, and united them all under one banner, he created a powerful and rich kingdom, and became the king of it. The kingdom prospered immensely until spell plague came, and then it mysteriously vanished. Some tried to look for it but without luck, they either were never seen again, or came back having not found anything.
What the expedition dosen't know: The king was very smart and great spellcaster, he used his wits and magic to create great kingdom, but when the spell plague came his kingdom was really threatened. He used powerful, although very dangerous artifact to protect it from chaos. And it kind of did. The kingdom was preserved with ice and magic, and hidden from normal world, most people went to filthy underground and there they changed, and created their own filthy and poor society, and they themselves changed (ever been to Valley of defilement from Demon’s Souls ;) ?), and the top kingdom was preserved with ice golems, frozen retainers and guards that can’t die of old age, and even a tribe of mountain creatures, who lives there and worship the being living in there.
(maybe not so short story
of course there are more detailes to it, juts don't want to post everything :D)
Anyway now there is one more day of preparations so players may learn something new, and maybe uncover some secrets. They already have some connection to this expedition bot not very strong. One player wanted to find some meaning of life or nature in seclusion, and got vision of this lost kingdom (they kingdom is calling her, and if she will be there they will find it), other one, is from a destroyed tribe and want to make a name for himself and bring honor and glory to his lost tribe, and third one has connection to the “lost artifact” there and also wants to make a lot o money. , So here are my questions:
1. What can I do to get player more invested in the expedition or people going there?
2. Do you think I should do something more in the preparation for the trip, or should I just fast foreword it
3. What kind of challenge I can make through the hard expedition in cold mountains? And in the kingdom itself?
4. What kind of great and sometimes hard choices I can bestow upon players?
Sory for the long post :P
Great backstory for a campaign TrueManiek, I'd play that in a heartbeat. My advice to you would be to make sure your players are on board for something of this scale. If their bellying up to your table to kill orcs and talk about movies, I’d shelve the campaign for now and do something simpler. It’s a horrible feeling to have a labor of live get cut apart because your players aren’t interested.
That said, if the players are game, I’d start by dropping plot hooks left and right and see what sticks. My guess is that they feel like their playing second fiddle to your NPC’s and have no control over their adventure. Give them concrete missions and short term goal, my guess is that something will capture their imagination before too long. Once it does, jump on it and make it a major part of your story.
I like what you've done here and id like to warn you away from some all too common pitfalls.
Please understand this advice is made without regard to your skill or brains - I don't know you and I'm not here to judge you.
The trip itself, and any exposition, should happen in very tight vignettes and take no more than an hour of your session in total. I play under some DMs who work too much on setup and it undermines the actual adventure part of the adventure.
Therefore, orchestrate 1 meaningful interaction between each PC and One of your NPCs. Do all the exposition you can/need as quickly as you can. Be direct. Do not role play your NPCs as cagey or secretive, but make them honest and relatable. "I'm looking for my brother, you remind me of him [wistful look]" etc.
As an expedition, your players' pay depends on the success of the venture overall. That's what ventures are. Explain this to them and ask them what their adventurers are prepared to do to make this as successful as possible - after all they were hired for a reason. Make them tell you why they were hired and what they expect out of it. (You'll be able to make good use out of it later). If possible, do this during the RP, so that the adventurers are explaining their presence and goals to the NPCs.
Arrive, make camp, establish a home base and have the wxpedition's leader point to a map and say "We're starting here!" Then get on with your adventure.
Trim any possible fat during this hour. Its meat-only. (Note Lovecraft's At the Mountains of Madness is super boring until they actually freaking arrive at the mountains - I mean, he's setting up a big payoff later, but that's a novella while your adventure is a game).
I understand
But some players like a lot of interactions between NPCes, and making relationships with them.
And do you suggest I need to also strip down the whole “getting there trip” to just the basics information? Because I thought that the dangerous trip in cold mountains and finding lost kingdom could be adventure in itself…
I agree with Bawylie. That said, as long as there's stuff to see and do on the trip there it should be ok. Just keep an eye on all your players, if they start getting restless wrap it up.
TrueManiek wrote:
TrueManiek wrote:
TrueManiek wrote:
Hey, plan short. If the players are really into it, you can always add. It's much easier to add than to remove.
Thanks for some great tips 
I tend to ramble a lot when role playing my npces, probably I fear that when they say very little and only important stuff it makes them less real and not really worth a while.
To relation
The druid player established relation with the girl who is looking for her brother, and the cleric dwarf of lathander
The halfling rogue player established relation with the gnome aristocat (who is a very old friend)
And the tiefling monk established relation with half-orc captain and the geek girl
So I think I’m set in this department. But of course there will be more interaction between them and whole expedition as times go buy, escalating when thing will go bad :D.
About 3
I was planning on having venture walk into a very bad blizzard, but I guess making it the way that player can actually avoid it could be interesting. And I wanted to make the actually kingdom hard to find, but I’m still wondering how to do it without stretching it too much and boring
Is there a compelling reason to withhold the adventure site?
Is the finding/searching aspect going to be fun and memorable?
If so, go wild! Make a base camp. Go exploring. Get maps. Visit a mysterious abandoned prior camp. Drop open questions that have no answers.
However, if we're just "gating" the adventure behind effort (maybe that's how we did it traditionally. Maybe we want the players to work for it. Maybe we just don't know better), then I'd say skip this part. It's the equivalent of waiting in line. If it isn't necessary and isn't fun, I don't want it in my game.
Of cours that's just my preference.
Ps- good work on establishing relationships w/NPCs!
TrueManiek wrote:
TrueManiek wrote:
I think I’m gonna start with challenge’s on the trip. But the steaks will be like iserith said, about how, when, and in what condition the expedition will find the kingdom. And if I see that my players are bored with that, I will jump straight to uncovering the lost kingdom secrets. How does that sound?
thehobb wrote:
Good plan.
Simply be very clear on stakes.
TrueManiek wrote:
OK so what are you saying is that if I present a challenge I need to be clear on goals and timelines of this challenge for my players, as in..
“After your examination you see that the boy has only 3 days to live” and “Each day you are looking for the kingdom you will lose a 20% of your resources, and gain one exhaustion + each day there is cumulative 20% chance that you will encounter a blizzard”
In contrast to
“After your examination you can’t be certain how much time the boy has, but it is a matter of days” and “If you can’t find the kingdom fast enough you probably will deplete your resources, be exhausted and you may encounter a blizzard”
Cause I only did the second one. Doesn’t the clear goals make it a little bit weird, more like a tactical game (don’t really know about it, just asking)? And maybe take away from mystery und uncertainty of the situations?
PS: Any idea how I can make the trip more compelling for druid hermit, who lived in seclusion to communicate with nature, is neutral, still seeking enlightment that eluded her in this seclusion, and enjoys delight of the world to much (hermit background J )
Clear goals seem weird, but they're "harder" vs the more natural language.
"A matter of days" feels like there's wiggle room. "You have 3 days" has no wiggle room at all.
TrueManiek wrote:
Thanks everyone, you have been a tremendous help
Btw: What do you think about avalanche during their trip?
TrueManiek wrote:
Like maybe using avalanche to Split the player from the rest of the group, and then player will try to rejoin the venture and survival alone in cold, harsh mountains?
An avalanche certainly seems appropriate for the region, but how are you using it? What's the scene? What are the stakes?
I can imagine using it like in the cartoons - make too much noise or cause too much of a disturbance and it starts the avalanche. So perhaps that is a threat hanging over another complication. Say, some yeti are attacking the caravan as it is traveling through a narrow pass. The leader of the yeti warband has this massive horn. When it's time for the yeti to retreat (reduced to 50% or fewer warriors), it blows the horn which inadvertantly starts an avalanche that chokes the pass and prevents forward progress toward the kingdom. The adventurers know this for some reason (maybe the caravan guide knows how yeti typically operate and also about the avalanche threat and tells them).
Can the PCs stop the yeti attack on the caravan without the warband leader blowing the horn? If they can, great. If they can't, then the yeti start the avalanche which adds days to the trek to the kingdom. (And remember, each setback moves the group closer to a failure condition for the overall travel.)
TrueManiek wrote:
Don't half-ass an avalanche. It isn't atmosphere or tone.
At minimum, it's a catastrophe. Plan and write accordingly.
I read your blog bawyile. I would really like to play your or iserith games, but that is another topic.
Anyway about avalanche. Maybe I make it as a impending thread that will engage player. If they won’t be careful (and I make it hard for them to be careful as a whole expedition), they can bring the disaster of avalanche on them. So I think it will play nicely that way
If they won’t hurry the cruel blizzard will catch up to them, and if they won’t be careful the catastrophe in the form of avalanche will hit them.
None of this will of course directly kill the players (well, if the do something stupid it will), but other members of venture are not so safe, and if they loose someone it can bring tension. + they can get exhausted, loose resources or other important items, and be in generally bad condition when they reach the kingdom.
Both the blizzard and theacalanche should come with warnings. This is a great opportunity for your expository character to talk about the potential hazards. Not merely list them, but give an understanding. Describe the rumored yeti tribes, the blizzards blowing away anything on a flat plane, and the cracking snowpacks that foretell an avalanche. Then during play, give false starts on all 3. Yetis in the distance (maybe blowing horns). A sudden single gust that blows everyone over. Thunderous crack!s in the slopes above. After that, you're free to hit them as hard as you like. (Maybe have your players roll the NPCs' saving throws - that way it's not simply DM fiat if one or more die).
TrueManiek wrote:
What of players DON'T buy into stakes?
Change 'em to something they will buy into.
TrueManiek wrote:
I remember that one of the player was really interested in one halfling character and her half-ling troop that I described before, and he made contact with this character (even wrote Her name on his character sheet). I never planed anything special for those Halflings, they were more as a background – but since the player took interest in them, my instincts tell me to do something with this…
But this will give another pool of npces to already big one :P
Flesh out the NPC he wrote down. The group can be simply a charicature. Put down a name and a single personality trait.
Winnie the Pooh is a good source for this. Eeyore is gloomy. Piglet is scared. Rabbit is fastidious. Pooh is hungry. Etc. Just don't have your NPCs saying "thanks for noticing me" or "think think, think think!"
Now that you have a functional group, you can simply toss them into background descriptions. When you're describing the environment or a dungeon, don't just give dimensions ("15 ft hewn stone walls"), instead say "on the 15 ft hewn stone walls, pooh leans back and stuffs rations into his mouth," or "Piglet approaches the long dark hallway with quaking knees before his torch gutters out - he runs."
They become color until you need to move them up for something else.
After session log:
I think the trip went nicely
First of I wrapped the whole preparation quickly, and made the player very important for the expedition, and gave them some plot hooks that they wanted.
Besides first couple of days of expedition was nothing special, so I described it making the player character even more reliable and an integral part of the venture , so their words and choices would truly matter for the rest.
And the choices were next, the player were faced with resources depletion at a little to fast rate, yeti patrol, and even yeti village along the way, an avalanche in the waiting, and oncoming blizzard. And there were 3 paths to the goal each with different danger level from one or the other + I was very clear on stakes (cumulative 5% chance every day for blizzard, avalanche starting point on “OH ****” matter different for every path and so on) They even found and dispatched yeti scouts, so the next patrol on the way was not alerted when they encountered it (and they make a pretty sweat hiding and grab the horn move )
They whole trip was a huge win in my opinion, but I wonder if my players fell the same way. Nobody from the expedition died, resources are still in good numbers, blizzard and avalanche were avoided, and they arrived to the lost kingdom in very good spirit. I wonder if I didn’t make it challenging enough :P
Next I need to make the whole frozen lost kingdom challenging and fun.
Sounds cool. Ask your players if they enjoyed it.
My suggestion for their next challenge should be finding a base camp. Maybe an old watch tower or something where they can seek refuge from the elements and build defenses against wandering monsters. You could run a while session of them clearing it out.
Having a warm place in the middle of this frozen wasteland will help create a sense of attachment for the characters and give them an emotional stake in the game.
It has the added advantage of having a safe place to put your NPC’s when not in use while still keeping them accessible when the PC’s want to consult with them.
Theros that is a very good idea. To bad I already fast-forwarded finding the good spot and setting the camp :P.
For time global pressure I got an idea.
See the kingdom, at least it surface area, is in a state of constant stasis, frozen in time (that is how it kind of protected itself from spell plague), and being there for a long period of time pulls you in this state, starting from the weak ones.
And I also got plans that a lot of npces will venture alone for their own personal objectives completely disregarding the whole group concept, and the player will met them in different locations, in different situations.
For clues about what happens:
I scattered the area with visions from the past (the most important point in history of kingdom), and with written clues, and even some knowledge (from one “survivor” giant, and ice weird there). So it will be fun seeing how they uncover it and draw conclusions.
Now, one player said, that he invested his expertise in proficiency in thieves tools, so he would really appreciate some traps, but I think that he really just want his skill to be usefull, and that can be done not only with traps.
Beside, I really like more of a puzzle-traps (like in “Adjusting traps” topic), and they are not gotcha that really on good roll on thieve tools proficiency. So how can I make rogue player happy?
TrueManiek wrote: