Post/Author/DateTime	Post
#1 madeguy Jul 30, 2014 6:24:10	After much arm twisting by my GF, she has convinced me to teach her kids d&d and DM a little group with her, her kids, and her brother.  The youngest girl is 12, her older brother is 14.   They are interested in playing, and even seem to be having fun with it. We've had three sessions now, the first was good, the second one kinda meh, and the last one--well, they have this sibling rivalry thing going on, always fighting with each other, and the last game it got so bad I called it off early.   They are difficult children. The boy has aspergers, and has difficulty knowing what is appropriate and inappropriate in a social situation. The girl...*sighs*. Is very spoiled and selfish. I dont know if all teenage girls are this way as I have never had kids myself.   Now I'm a bit of an ambitious DM. I like story, and I like my games to have a bit of weight to them. I like to make players *think* and learn. I like things to be fantastic but have realism as well, to make the fantastic plausible. I would dearly love my game to help these kids blossom a bit, become better people. Learn to work together.  I've tried subtly and overtly to suggest how much more effective they would be if they learned to work together as a group but it isnt sinking in.   So..any suggestions?  Puzzles, traps, situations?  Anything that would help get that lesson across.   It shouldnt make a difference but we're playing old school 2nd edition D&D. The boy is a 2nd lvl rogue and the girl is a 2nd lvl ranger. Anything that would help.
#2 iserith Jul 30, 2014 7:04:02	First, know your audience. Your realistic story may not resonate. Maybe try starting with simple fare - a fantastic location to explore full of deadly monsters and riches before reaching for more weighty drama.   You might be able to impart some of the advice in this article here: 11 Ways to Be a Better Roleplayer.
#3 bawylie Jul 30, 2014 11:42:23	Working with Aspergers isn't easy. I have one player with Aspergers whom I ask to help out another player who has no arms. He takes this very seriously, and his interactions and involvement increase - he connects with the game and the other player.    You might try engaging that way. Put him "in charge" of certain details like mapping or initiative. See if that sticks. And be very, very patient.    Last, Nothing - NOTHING - can halt a sibling rivalry.  I've got twins in one of my groups. Lawful Angry and Robot Rules Lawyer. Great guys. The best. But together, whew, they're a thorn in each others' sides, despite how much they love each other. The best I can do is ask LA & RRL what their Characters are doing and try to redirect their attention from each other to the game.
#4 ivstin Jul 30, 2014 13:13:51	To play off of what Brad said:   I have a friend who actually used D&D as a tool to manage his Aspergers. He learned about different personalities, what plans he could implement in how to interact with those personalities, and even how to practice interacting with personalities in a safe (imaginary) environment. As a public educator, I would also have to suggest using plenty of positive reinforcement when your aspy gamer succeeds in a social experiment in the game. Not just "Hey, great job, timmy," but actual in-game rewards. Thereby allowing the student/gamer to perceive that positive social behaviors create positive social effects. This can give the student/gamer a sense of ownership over their own behavior as well as ownership over the outcome of a social interaction.   But, that's the Teacher in me talking.   The gamer in me says to throw dragons at them and let them find out the hard way that if they do not work together they will never succeed. If they do not work together to create allies in the invisible imaginary world, they will never succeed against the dragons. RANDOM INFORMATION: Did you know, I have no idea what proper protocol is on using names on a forum? Bawylie has his name in his Signature (Brad), but if I refer to Iserith... would I type it iserith or Iserith? or... Izzy? I mean... What's up?! I'm so behind on the times with forums. Silly me, only using forums with people I know for the last six years and using their character names or real names.
#5 Sling617 Jul 30, 2014 15:17:01	I would suggest providing them situations where they have to combine their efforts to succeed. Have a trap where they both need to pull a different lever at the same time from different sides of the room, or have them combine their efforts to lift one of them up high enough to reach an item or mechanism that opens a door to let them out of a trapped room. Be sure to provide them with opportunities to combine their efforts and then when they do make sure you reward them with something for positive reinforcement.
#6 Noon Jul 30, 2014 18:16:00	They start fighting each other outside of combat, right?   Have continual combat.   But I know, you've got this thing for them to investigate, and then they discover this thing that is fairly obviously bad, and then either they are to figure out the next thing to stop that or some wise old NPC comes and tells them the next step, which involves investigation in figuring out how to do that thing, then doing that thing and maybe at that point a battle.   It's a double whammy - they aren't interested in your pre written story. More to the point, they aren't interested in pre written story perse. Any story that was written before the game began.   Do their characters have goals in life?
#7 WintersKnight Jul 30, 2014 19:46:57	Sucker!    Just kidding. What do these kids like and relate to? Start there and build the campaign outward. From what I remember, aspergers or not, teenage years can suck.   Keep it going and don't second guess yourself. You'll plant an awesome seed.
#8 Nomral Aug 01, 2014 20:45:25	First of all, I want to let you know that it is doable. I have Autism and learned to play D&D at age 10...that being said, I have two caveats:   1) ALL kids (male, female, or whatever else) who are "middle school age" are inherently evil. Period. YOU were evil that age...I was evil that age...that's just how it is. Now, sometimes it is possible to wring some actual enjoyment out of them, but keep in mind that it's really difficult. Luckily, she'll probably grow out of that stage. Right now, she's dealing with weird hormones and may be having her first experiences with PMS, and may be coming off as spoiled and selfish, but that's more than likely just the puberty talking. But occasionally people that age can have brief moments of non-evil.   2) D&D can be incredibly engaging for people with Autism Spectrum Disorders and often helps us gain a foothold in the "real" social world, but this kid will need guidance. How accepting is he of advice about his social conduct? It's always helped me to ask others to tell me when I do things that bother them so I can fix it, but I know not all Autistic people are used to this kind of thing and may find it offputting. Ask your girlfriend for tips on interacting with him and if you're authorized to help correct his behavior. Also, I'm sure you've heard this many times by now, but clear, straightforward social rules are absolutely necessary for the vast majority of Autistic people. I can't just "use common sense" because to me, the unwritten, ambiguous, generalized social rules are not common sense. You may find yourself having to give specific instructions for each specific situation, or he may follow a rule to the letter and end up breaking a rule that's an exception to a more general rule if you fail to warn him about it. (Also, bawylie, I really like how you helped your Autistic person connect with other people and the game that way! Good job!)   Overall, I have more hope for the 14-year-old because he is no longer inherently evil and a lot of my friends began playing D&D around that age.   That being said, it's great that you're teaching them to play D&D and I think there is hope for both of them. I wonder if stressing to them that they are not their characters, and therefore out of game conflicts should not be transferred in character would help them any...probably not, but maybe it's worth a try! I agree with that article on becoming a better roleplayer.   Another thing you can try to keep their interest in the story is to focus heavily on their characters, and make them feel important. This is just part of my DM style (everyone gets to be "the most important person in the world" at least once) but I think it would work especially well for younger players who want to experience the thrill of having awesome characters who can do achieve anything with enough hard work and creativity. Have you noticed how often novels geared towards young adults feature Mary Sue-like main characters, yet are still enjoyable rather than infuriating to their readers?   Now, of course, we don't want to encourage them to play Mary Sues, but the principle is the same--let them feel like their characters are powerful and matter and are shaping the story rather than following it, and I think they'll end up enjoying the magic that is D&D. Let them save the princess and defeat the evil warlord that no one else could touch...if nothing else, they'll have something to remember, and even if they don't end up having the Best Time Ever with that particular game because of their squabbling, they'll see what D&D COULD be and probably return to it eventually.   Wow, I really do tend to ramble...I also second Sling617's suggestion on writing in encounters where they both have to work together to save the day.
#9 pauldanielj2 Aug 03, 2014 14:57:43	I find that with younger players you need to throw subtlety out the window. I would contrive an adventure where intra-party conflict is immediately and obviously going to cause the PCs to fail. For instance (and this is just off the top of my head so forgive if it sounds stupid), the party might be asked to escort a priest carrying a holy artifact across a dangerous area to a remote monestary. The catch is that this is an artifact of peaceful meditation, and the presence of violence or conflict can destroy it. So every time the party encounters an obstacle, be it monsters or dangerous terrain or whatever, they need to find a peaceful solution or risk the artifact blowing up. Similarly, if there is conflict between PCs, you can warn them ("as the artifact senses conflict within the party, it begins to glow and faint cracks appear across it..."), giving them a chance to cool off before they cause the adventure to fail.   Of course, that could make things worse if they can't work together and then end up blaming each other for the adventure's failure. But really, at that point I think you just throw your hands in the air and conclude that they lack the ability to play a cooperative game.