Post/Author/DateTime	Post
#1 aryth3 Sep 18, 2015 20:16:47	The players have entered a forest corrupted several years ago during the Orc Wars. That corruption has bled over to the guardian spirit and it doesn't want anyone in its forest that doesn't belong. The players are seeking out the birthplace of a local noble to complete a ritual -- she's is fighting a possession and they need holy water blessed at her birthplace.   Initially I was going to have a guide take them -- an elf cleric who grew up in the forest and was displaced during the Orc Wars. A side quest came up that they couldn't just leave (they had to go through a swamp to get to the forest and they discovered that a black dragon had enslaved a group of nomads). So, knowing how important it was that they get the holy water quickly, they sent the cleric (Rolan) ahead. He draws out a rough map of how to find him and, reluctantly, goes off on his own.   They will eventually find his corpse as the forest stopped him from proceding. Now, I want the forest to make reaching the center more and more difficult for the players (in the meantime the forest is sending out creatures to remove the characters), but my labrynth drawing skills are lousy. I've looked online (even tried to find one premade) but nothing really felt right.   I want something random, that with good roleplaying and skill checks they can slowly figure out but I'm not sure how to do that -- I am thinking of borrowing the random dungeon generator from the DMG (ignoring non-forest things like doors), I'm just not sure how they'd be able to make it less and less random.
#2 BRJN Sep 19, 2015 18:17:59	IME the best way to make a labyrinth is via a Skill Challenge, not a map.  Survival, Perception, Insight all can indicate "not get lost, tell you were here before".  Arcana if there is "get-lost" magic (as a Minotaur) on the area.  Athletics and/or Acrobatics to get out of a sticky situation.  Religion (once only?) tells you how to propitiate the god of nature (auto-succeed one later roll).  Sleight of Hand gets you untangled from the briar patch.  In your case, Nature to stay away from swamp / bog / poison ivy.   Have a few "cookies" if somebody rolls a 20 on his check.  They find a piece of Chalk (to mark the way) -or- a canteen of clean water -or- climb a hill for a good view -or- the fog thins so the group can see the way to go.  OTOH they might roll a 1 and have to endure an extra fight -or- lose a backpack full of stuff getting out of quicksand -or- hopelessly lost, burn an hour figuring it out -or- spooky fog closes in so you take a penalty to next roll.   The DC to succeed on the checks should go up as they get closer to the center of the maze, but be aware of the PC's max possible roll (modified).  Don't make it mathematically impossible to succeed. You can make up Encounter Tables so that their failures send them to a combat.  The table should be "how much the PCs missed by" so the higher DCs later on send them to tougher fights.  I recommend Blights to start and Treants later on.   Is there a way to interact with the guardian spirit, or will it just assume all intruders do not belong?  If the PCs do get a chance to talk, what will persuade the spirit to let them in?  to let them accomplish their mission?  I would have a noble family token or house insignia displayed prominently, and taken to the right place, grant the PCs opportunity to talk - then opposed CHR checks (plus Persuasion or Deception or Intimidate) to determine how the conversation goes.
#3 aryth3 Sep 20, 2015 7:06:40	They had an interaction with the spirit... it tried to kill them using a Dryad and two Galeb Duhrs. What I'm thinking is have each character who wishes to contribute roll an ability check at disadvantage (let them rationalize the ability they want to use). Compare the lowest roll to the following:   < 5 -- You got yourselves lost. Spend 1d6 hours trying to find your way back. Lose progress made towards finding a way out. 5 - 15 -- You failed to notice something or you lead your friends to an ambush. I roll on the random encounter table I created. 16 - 21 -- You spend 1d4 hours walking. Everything appears the same. 21 - 26 -- You spend 1d4 hours walking. Scenary begins to change. You feel that you are getting closer to your object. Progress made: Add 1 to next lowest roll. 27+  -- You spend 1d4 hours wandering and eventually come across a clearing. Buildings that once housed the elves of this forest lay in shambles. At the center of the clearing is a large oak tree, veins of darkness run along its side like vines. According to your information, this should be the spot. You can't shake an uneasy feeling as you work your way closer to the center of this deserted town.
#4 Chaosmancer Sep 20, 2015 20:48:49	I'm curious what you meant by the maze creators "not feeling right" and making the dmg table "less and less random" as they go? Shouldn't it be slightly more random?   I'm picturing a circular maze, with the goal in the center. A random maze generator can give you a base, then add and remove elements. Place difficult terrain to slow the party, maybe fog or thorny plants. The closer they get to the center, maybe the forest grows some sort of poisonous plant over entrances the players need, nothing about your description says they need a clear path, the forest is trying to stop them so at the center it will put things that aren't "just turn left then right" and are more "vines dripping sickly green fluid drape between the tress" also, I'm picturing a hedge maze type of situation, but perhaps take some inspiration from Tolkien's Mirkwood? I can't remember details but illusions and dissonant whispers are great ways of making the players feel confused and disoriented.   I don't like simplifying it to a skill check, becuase that seems like it would lead to a lot of "you're walking, the scenery doesn't change roll again. You got lost, lose progress roll again." Instead of making it feel like a living breathing entity they are traveling through. The forest can't stop them from going forward, but it can simply make that progress difficult and slow, perhaps with a few paths that if they decide to follow simply lead them back out of the forest.
#5 Dreamstryder Sep 20, 2015 23:22:42	One way to create the labyrinth is to have many nodes connected to other nodes by lines, in a web. Each meeting place of lines is a different area described, and each line off that intersection is a different way one could leave the area (ie "up the cliff"). The players could gradually make sense out of the DM's descriptions of the area, but there is no visual map for them to see, making it feel as if in a maze without even using dice.   I'd connect the areas in the web willy-nilly at first, perhaps putting the more twisted areas at the center, but you don't have to make a "pretty" map, as only the DM will see it. Depending on how lost you want the players to feel, don't mention cardinal directions in any path descriptions: "along the river to the East or West" could become "along the river going left or right". If you want skill rolls to matter, perhaps this is the difference a good navigational check makes. Hints in descriptions such as the oldness of the growth, the amount of sky visible above, or the ominousness of the surroundings, may help them judge if they are at the edge or center of the forest.   If you think they would get too lost or that they need more choices, try a trick from Mirkwood: there was a single path the company was told not to leave, but circumstances made it difficult: there was a cursed stream interrupting the path with no bridge. There was also no food near the path, but plenty of curious goings on glimpsed off it. Likewise, your party could have instructions that would lead them directly to the center but are impossible to carry out perfectly under the circumstances, and it becomes a game of not getting into too much trouble by the corners the party cuts. It gives them a hint and something to occupy their minds as they make path choices.
#6 BRJN Sep 21, 2015 8:01:52	Also if you have a PC who is Survival(max) and/or Perception(max)*, make it easier for him than for others.  Because "not get lost in the spooky woods" is part of his job description.  (Some high-DC checks will accomplish this without much DM effort.) If the party splits up - or can be made to split up - whoever doesn't go with him might come to regret it...   * Wood elf Rogue takes Expertise in the skills mentioned, plus built as dual-stat WIS/xyz.
#7 Malzerious Sep 25, 2015 15:22:48	So this might work for you, I did it in a "living dungeon" but it would work for a corrupted forest as well.  Once the party enters the maze they get into a "reverse" worm, a corridor that changes as the party moves.. The corridor turns up ahead, maybe 50ft or so. After the party (assuming they move together) turns the corner, the corridor behind them closes up. As a DM you just roll randomly left for right for the next turn (another 50ft down the corridor). So the party sees a corridor that turns in front of them and behind them. Each time they make a turn, you roll to see where it turns next (what they see at the extent of their light). If they are mapping they will get frustrated as they find their path turning back over where they went before. Here is where it gets tricky. If they turn around and go backward, you do the same thing. So whereas they may have made two right turns to get to a corridor, when they return instead of two lefts, they might find a left and right.  In effect they are in a 50ft corridor with two turns, and maybe 50ft of corridor beyond that in each direction. That 150ft section of corridor changes as you randomly roll each direction.  The trick is to for them to split the party, have some people stay put, and others continue to go around the second bend. When I ran it, they finally got to a door (and the people staying put got attacked, the danger of splitting the party). Not sure if that made sense.     One nice thing, is that you get a twisty labyrinth without any drawing.  The other is a definite sense that the party is not in control.
#8 CraggleRock Sep 29, 2015 13:28:34	I did come up with an idea of using a deck of cards to abstract a maze like structure, and wrote a blog piece on it at http://exploring-infinity.com/2011/12/28/building-a-better-labyrinth-a-maze-mechanic-idea/
#9 WorBlade Sep 29, 2015 20:47:49	A flow sheet of encounter connected to each other would work. Each encounter has two or three paths out (lines to other boxes which are other encounters). Some of the encounters should be calm areas for resting. If they need to find a certain path to the heart of the forest then you can have box/encounters that are the pointers. Maybe blue flowers or glowing rock formations. The party leaves one of these, gets a nasty fight with no similar clue, goes back and tries another option until they get the pointer objects as part of the encounter.
#10 WorBlade Sep 29, 2015 20:48:01	A flow sheet of encounter connected to each other would work. Each encounter has two or three paths out (lines to other boxes which are other encounters). Some of the encounters should be calm areas for resting. If they need to find a certain path to the heart of the forest then you can have box/encounters that are the pointers. Maybe blue flowers or glowing rock formations. The party leaves one of these, gets a nasty fight with no similar clue, goes back and tries another option until they get the pointer objects as part of the encounter.