Post/Author/DateTime	Post
#1 chimeradactyl Feb 13, 2015 21:38:23	I've just started running Lost Mine of Phandelver. It's a great adventure as is, but I've been looking for ways to add some additional detail and realism. My Realms has been a fantastic resource toward this end (a huge thanks to Scrivener of Doom!)   Phandelver spoilers begin here...   My party has just begun and they should be rescuing Sildar Hallwinter next session. As I was rereading the adventure in preparation, I noticed that he's a representative of Waterdeep. That led me to my idea: as the adventure is set nearer to Neverwinter than Waterdeep, it could be that the Waterdeep nobility wants to stake a claim on such a potentially valuable resource (magic items hot off the forge anyone?) That means Sildar's mission could be two-fold: yes, he's with the Lord's Alliance and he's all in favor of killing pesky goblins and keeping artifacts out of evil hands, but what he and his superiors really want is control of the mine (and its wealth).   On the flip side, I was thinking maybe Iarno Albrek could be the representative of Neverwinter. He's made some choices of questionable moral standing, yes, but maybe he has an agenda beyond the scope of his allegiance with the Spider and his primary goal is to protect Neverwinter's interests through whatever means necessary. This, for me, makes the characters and the conflict much more interesting: will the PCs decide to help the Waterdhavian who appears upstanding or the local Neverwinterite who has stooped to using illicit means to achieve his ends? Or, better yet, will they oust both of them and do something of their own design?   What did you guys think about Sildar Hallwinter? Is he really just a do-gooder paladin sent from Waterdeep to protect civilization? Or should he have an agenda? I can do anything I want in my version of the Realms, obviously, but does anyone know if this is the sort of thing the Lord's Alliance would be doing in FR? Common sense dictates that lords should be manipulating and backstabbing to get ahead day in and day out (playing the "game," as it were), but the description of the Alliance leads one to believe that their only goal is the preservation of civilization (yeah, right).   Please respond with your thoughts on the matter if this idea is of interest to you. Thanks!
#2 Archon007 Feb 14, 2015 1:06:02	He's not really a representative of waterdeep, he's from the faction Lords Alliance. Anyway Google neverwinter wiki and you'll see that the leader of Neverwinter was killed in the spell plague and the lord of waterdeep is the presiding ruler of Neverwinter as "the protector" there are also several other factions trying to stake their claim of Neverwinter.    Lords Alliance wrote:
#3 iserith Feb 14, 2015 4:55:01	In my campaign, Sildar was Snowball Hellwinter, a tiefling agent of Hell's Cargo, a tiefling banking and transportation concern trying to establish a network in the West. Iarno was an agent of that organization that went rogue, renamed Hex Arcana. (He had a big belt buckle that said "Don't Mess With Hexes.")    Snowball was a decent guy but had his own agenda, that of his company's. It's just his company wants what the PCs want - stability and justice so that it's easier to operate.
#4 Azylynne Feb 14, 2015 13:03:02	Personally, I like your idea of having Sildar with his own agenda.  That's pretty awesome.  For me, the Lord's Alliance appears Lawful Neutral on the surface, but under the surfance, depending which Lord, and of which city, they are willing to do what it takes to protect their cities and settlements, including taking over or buying out a certain super forge.  If I had about giving Sildar an angeda, I might of had him try convince Gundren to either, sell the mines to Waterdeep (or Lord Neverember, the First Protectorate of Neverwinter and also one of the "open" Lords of Waterdeep), or if not sell, greatly align the Rockseekers with the Lord's Alliance.  As such, any characters that "join" or swear loyalty to the Lord's Alliance, would also be asked to help convince Gundren to support the Lord's Alliance's agenda. On another note, perhaps Iarno is under the influence of a different Lord of Waterdeep.  So perhaps, Sildar is working for Lord Neverember's faction of the Lord's Alliance (Neverember is solidifying his control of Neverwinter in addition to his influence as a Lord of Waterdeep), but Iarno is ultimately working for another Lord of Waterdeep who is trying to undermind Neverember's influence.  Sounds like a lot of fun!
#5 chimeradactyl Feb 14, 2015 18:24:12	It does say that Hallwinter is an agent of the Lords' Alliance, but it also says he's from Waterdeep (specifically, he was a griffon rider there, so basically a high officer in the miliary). I just don't buy the Lords' Alliance faction as written. It seems like a Faerunian "United Nations" and I'm to believe there aren't members looking to advance one city's ends over another's?   Anyway, thanks for the responses. iserith, I love the belt buckle that reads "Don't mess with Hexes." Different tone than what I'm going for, but awesome nonetheless.   Azylynne, I really like your idea of having them serve different lords. The fate of Neverwinter is largely in the air right now. Some lords probably don't care much about it since it's still recovering from Mt. Hotenow's eruption. But others likely see it as a good investment. And what better way to ensure stability for an investment than to grab a mine fabled to include a magic item forge?   I used to follow Realmslore pretty closely, but I've been out of the loop throughout all of the 4th edition Spellplague changes, so I'm not sure what the current state of affairs is. I did some light research on FR Wikia, but I didn't find much there. All the known lords of Waterdeep are goody two-shoes and that's just not the vibe I go for in RPGs. No one is just a kindly old lord with the world's best interests at heart. Everyone has an agenda. I don't want the only conflict my players have to be with monsters.   So I'm planning on having Sildar Hallwinter's loyalties lie with Waterdeep. I think he knows more about Iarno Albrek than he lets on: Albrek is bitter about Waterdeep's domination in world affairs. He's used his contacts with the LA to find a good outpost to establish himself as an opposition to Waterdeep's influence, but things haven't gone as planned. Nezznar has been less than forthcoming with information, townspeople have scoffed at the establishment of a formal constabulary, and he's received no aid from Neverwinter, who he's been trying to align himself with. Him being under control of the Redbrands was mostly Nezznar's doing as a sort of test of his loyalty/willingness to misbehave. He isn't so much a "leader" as a "baby-sitter" for them. He's growing more and more frustrated with the situation as the days go by, and he'd love the adventurer's help to oust them (though he's not really sure what to do next in regards to Nezznar). Sildar will, of course, insist on Iarno Albrek being punished for his crimes. The PCs will have to decide which "authority" to obey.
#6 Azylynne Feb 15, 2015 3:02:43	Sounds like a plan Chimeradactyl!  I think you should shape the Lord's Alliance to what you want it to be.  This is, after all, your campaign.  To me the Alliance is flimsy at best, as the various cities work towards securing their own safety, but again, different factions with the alliance, and different lords and what not all operating in a way towards their own goals.  How much political intrigue goes on in our modern UN?  Probably quite a bit.  How often do countries kind of act outside of the UN's goals?  What about American, world police?  I think the same can hold true to the Lord's Alliance in the game. As with Waterdeep, for my campaign, I used the 4th Ed FR book... the griffon riders are no more.  That said, I had introduced some NPCs from Waterdeep that were formerly with the Griffon Calvary.  He showed interested in wanting to rebuild it but lacked griffons.  A few sessions later, the players found a den of griffens, trapped and prisoners of Mandi the Manticore and her Manticore club.  I'm playing the realms as if they were recovering from the Sundering, whatever that is.  Less heroes, less magic items all over the place, thus giving highlight to our group of characters as they make a name for themselves.   =)
#7 BRJN Feb 15, 2015 19:21:22	Neverember, Open Lord of Waterdeep and self-proclaimed Lord Protecter of Neverwinter, is trying to colonize Neverwinter as part of creating a commerical empire for Waterdeep.  It would not be unheard-of for various Waterdeep nobles to send agents to spy out the land and seek out opportunities.  The NPCs you mention could be working on their own and/or with support from a merchant family or noble house.   My 4e Warlock was about to move to Neverwinter - courtesy the Neverwinter Campaign Setting - and set up a new business there (Waterdeep background, plus Story Award: factor for a merchant coster), but the Sundering interrupted his plans.  (Got involved in "The End and The Beginning", LFR's 2014 Battle Interactive.)  Under different circumstances, that could have been ME that the PCs meet...   Edit: In addition to the 4e Neverwinter material and lore that is on the MyRealms site linked in OP, the 3.5 FRCG mentioned a minor god/dess that has a portfolio specifically for Neverwinter Wood.  Re-awakening him/her could be an interesting plot arc - especially for low-level PCs who may not have known exactly what they were doing at the time.  It would also explain why nobody and nothing historically wants to mess with the Woods.
#8 chimeradactyl Feb 16, 2015 12:23:59	Azylynne, that's exactly the vibe I was thinking. I'm seeing the LA as a Faerunian equivalent to Western influencers like USA. They want the best for everyone, so long as they get to set the standards on what's "best." In short, control.   Albrek knows by himself there's nothing he can do to oppose Waterdeep, so he did what any good tragic character would do: he sought help from an unsavory source and got in over his head.   BRJN, that further cements things for me. He's a salesman of sorts, sent to solidify the Rockseeker's relationship with a specific faction of Waterdeep over Neverwinter. I just need to determine how Neverember fits in... Something to think about. I also like the idea of wakening the god/goddess of Neverwinter Wood. That could definitely be tied in somewhere in the future. Thanks!   This is all particularly relevant to me, because I'm hoping to extend the Phandelver campaign into a political intrigue campaign afterward. This is a great start, I think. Thanks everyone for the help!