Post/Author/DateTime	Post
#1 pukunui Aug 26, 2015 3:03:30	My players have always struggled to get their PCs to work together effectively. There's always one or two who just want to do their own thing or who are always getting the others into trouble. So with my new campaign, I'm trying to focus on getting the PCs to be a real team.   To that end, I'd like to put them through some sort of test. I had planned on using bawylie's tutorial dungeon, but unfortunately he hasn't finished it yet. I could run it as a purely "trial by combat" sort of test, but I think I'd also like to throw some challenges at my players that require teamwork to overcome.   An example that comes to mind is from Dragon Age: Origins. There's a bit where you're hunting an urn with some ashes, and to get to it, you have to go through this series of challenges. The first is a bunch of riddles. Next you and your henchmen have to fight shadowy versions of themselves. Then there's this room with magic platforms that requires you to place all your party members on specific blocks in a particular order so that you can create a pathway to the far side of a pit. Then your main character has to strip naked and walk through a wall of fire to prove their worthiness.   The riddles could work. The players can work together to figure them out.   Having the PCs fight copies of themselves could potentially work too.   The room with the magic platforms might not work, since in D&D you can do things to bypass the puzzle that a computer game prohibits you from doing - like jumping, climbing, using ropes, etc.   The wall of fire could work too.     But I don't necessarily need to just copy that series of tests from Dragon Age. I'm open to other ideas. Anything that requires teamwork in order for the PCs to succeed.   Anyone got anything?     Thanks in advance! - Jonathan
#2 akr71 Aug 26, 2015 7:15:43	The tutorial dungeon seem complete enough to me... maybe I missed something.   It would be easy enough to dress it up to fit the setting.  If you are still using the silver dragon and the inn, perhaps they could be rooms beneath the inn.  The opponents could be illusions and the PCs don't take lethal damage, but they don't know that.  When I read through bawylie's tutorial I saw it as a way to reinforce teamwork and getting the party members to stick to their rolls.  It would be a shame to scrap it.   Throw in an extra room here and there with puzzles and/or riddles.  A puzzle that different checks along the way to accomplish will hopefully bring them together.  Everyone won't excell at everything - hopefully they realize each other's strengths and let 'expert' step forward for each part. -climb up and retrieve a piece -lift another heavy object into place (strength check) -unlock a box to get another -Perception check to notice that the locked box is high up on a shelf -Investigation check to figure out the puzzle -some text or pictures as a hint - if the players don't get the hint, the PCs can with an Insight check   After the puzzle is put together, it has a purpose.  A Rube Goldberg-esque device to unlock to door perhaps.  Again, if the players don't clue in, a relevant check might mean the character knows what to do.
#3 Ralif_Redhammer Aug 26, 2015 7:49:14	One thing to be cautious about with riddles is what’s obvious to the riddler isn’t always obvious to the one solving it. I’d recommend having a back-up path if they can’t solve it – though it should definitely be more difficult than if they had solved it.   Requiring a variety of skills to solve a puzzle can work – maybe there’s a circle of standing stones that are out of order – arcana/religion is required to find out what the order is, and athletics is requires to put them in the right order. If there’s a thief, perhaps there’s a mechanical device at the center that requires some fine motor skills to calibrate.   A trick I like to use to get the party to work together is to throw a problem at them that cannot be solved by skill checks or brute force (magical or physical). For example, in a past adventure, they had to figure out how to activate a levitation platform - the answer was drinking the dubious liquid in the cupboard.
#4 OoftaMeg Aug 26, 2015 7:57:49	I like the idea, but what's the cost of failure? Is there a time limit? Is poison gas slowly filling the area? Are they under threat of attack, or do they just not get the whatzit? You want to avoid a "cutscene" that adds no value to the narrative. You may also want to set up a couple ways of solving some of the tasks. The wizard just rolled a 1 on the arcana check? The rogue can do an acrobatics check to save the day, but then the fighter has to smash down the door the thief was unlocking but sets off a trap, etc.
#5 sleypy Aug 26, 2015 8:54:52	I strongly advise against having the party fight copies of themselves as a team building exercise.   Having task that requires one person to figure it out, but another person to accomplish would work. Like several statues at the bottom of a pool need to be retrieved in order to complete a complex arcane ritual. A series of magic runes are required  X number of people to start the second part of the puzzle which then has to be completed by the remaining people.