Has anyone devised a system for zombie "infection", like traditional Romero style zombies (or any zombie/bite infection mythos)?
Was thinking of a low level zombie adventure, but wanting to add that "bite" threat of infection not only for suspense, but for story line purposes. How would you do it?
I looked at the Cockatrice, which has a bite DC of 11 (vs paralyze), and the challenge rating between the two are almost identical, so that could be a good starting point. Now, how would you go about the "transformation" part?
I was thinking an initial save that, if failed, would yield no immediate effects, but 2d6 hours later the victim would make a second save. Failure on the second save would place the victim at deaths door at 0 hit points (no healing can recover these hit points). He would remain comatose for an additional 2d6 hours, after which he makes another save. Failure and he becomes a zombie, success and he fights off the disease/curse, etc.
A remove disease/curse would remove the effects, as would a wish or limited wish. Would this be a disease or a curse?
That's just my initial thoughts. Anyone have an other suggestions to toss out on this?
Personally, I don't recommend something like that, since Cure Disease is a level 1 or 2 spell, and Palladins can just look at a sick guy and cure him before he even has to make a second saving throw. After about level 4, the disease stops being a hurdle to the party. Then, they just have to deal with hoards of zombies, something that's actually rather easy, since they move really freaking slow.
Even with cure disease it becomes an interesting challenge. When you know that you can spend spell slots to remove 'bites' you have to make a choice between attack power and immunity to infection.
A session spanning a single day, in which the party has to navigate an infected city, with their resources (uses of Cure Disease) dwindling, would be pretty interesting.
It also creates the desired separation between the endangered masses and the heroic party. The adventurers are perfectly set up as the only ones who could possibly end the plague by venturing into the infected areas.
As for the infecftion mechanics, I would do something like:
Zombie's have a bonus action called Bite, that they can use after a successful Slam attack. If it hits it does 1 damage and the target is infected with Zombie virus.
In a number of hours equal to 2d6 + Constitution modifier the infected creature will irreversibly turn into a zombie, even if they died in the meantime. This process can be interrupted and stopped by casting Cure Disease (or similar spell) on the infected creature.
A creature turned into a zombie uses the zombie statistics from the MM, but retain their Strength and Constitution and any armour they were wearing when they turned.
I'm not sure I'd have it be an absolute effect with no save. Especially if the character can't be cured after turning into a zombie. If they can, then it's just a simple case of restraining them until the Paladin gets his healing back and blasts the zombie PC with it a few hours later.
Varden_Khol wrote:
I guess I'm just not a fan of requiring a series of checks to essentially determine a single outcome. But that's just a personal preference, I can see that you're wanting the tension to build up from the initial bite.
My approach ends up being, "Don't get bit." followed by, "Dang, I'm bit! We better find me a healer fast or I'm dead."
The series of checks will be a bit more, "I'm bit, but I'll probably be fine, guys." then "Okay, it's looking bad, let's find me a healer." and then, "GUYS! I NEED THE HEALING NOW!"
It also comes down to how lethal you want it to be to PCs. NPCs can still turn quickly as story requires.
Zombie scenarios are pretty fun to run, since everyone gets the genre. Let us know how your session goes. 
Well, one way or another, it should make for an interesting story.
Thanks for the feedback guys. I'm still kicking it around, but both your feed back has been great. I really like the bonus action for the bite. Really adds some additional tension to the scene when a successful hit is followed by a "chomping" sound of gnashing teeth, lol! Really love that effect.
OK, went ahead and worked on this a bit more. Here's what I have so far. Note, the time from bite in infection can vary greatly depending up on the theme/mood of the game...
Variant: Zombie Infection
Zombie's have a bonus action called Bite, that they can use after a successful Slam attack. If it hits it does 1 damage and the target must make a Con saving throw (DC 11) or be infected with a Zombie virus. Failing the save a victim suffers no immediate ill effects, however in a number of hours equal to 1d4 + the victims CON bonus later, the victim falls to 0 hit points (no healing can recover these hit points). The victim remains comatose for an additional 1d4 hours, then "dies" and immediately rises as a zombie. A creature turned into a zombie uses the zombie statistics from the MM, but retain their Strength and Constitution and any armour they were wearing when they turned.
A remove disease (or similar spell) would remove the effects of the infection before the victim turns. After becoming a zombie, only a wish or limited wish will restore the victim to life.
Special: if a victim rolls a 1 on thier saving throw, they will become a zombie immediately.
Adjustment: Increase a standard zombies challenge rating to 1/2
It looks alright, but having the player immediately turn into a zombie due to a stroke of bad luck seems a bit severe. The fact that a natural 1 is already an automatic failure on a saving throw or attack roll is good enough.
transcendantviewer wrote:
Also, there's no such thing as Limited Wish in 5e anymore. I think a Remove Curse should work for removing Zombism from an infected. Once they change, the disease becomes more like a curse, I guess?
transcendantviewer wrote:
Well, that's up to the DM, actually. If you cast Revivify in someone that's dead less than a minute, you return them to life with 1 hit point. If someone is inflicted with this virus, does it kill them first and then reanimate them as an undead? Or does it turn them into something like a zombie? That's the question. If it's a virus, it's not magical in nature, meaning it's just a disease. There are magical diseases, but they too are cured with spells. And if you cast Resurrection on an undead, does it return to life? These are questions you're going to have to figure out. I'd personally recommend letting some of them work, since they're interesting ways to combat the virus at each phase of infection.
Imagine the first time the cleric casts Revivify on a MM zombie. A zombie that has its entrails on the outside and half its face missing... That newly resurrected person wouldn't be happy, haha.
It's one way to get around those earlier Res spells. Say the corpse is too far decomposed. Higher level Res spelts that restore the body too would still work though. Could make for a cool scene where the players have to hold their subject down, while their getting turned back.
That is a fair point, I wasn't thinking of it in that context.
Here's how I ran my major Zombie encounter:
Zombies have max HP of 10 (but showed up in overwhelming numbers)
No slam attack.
Grab: melee attack to grapple target.
Bite: cannot be used unless the target is grappled. Deals 1d4 piercing and the player makes a DC10 CON save or takes 2d6 necrotic damage. If this save is failed they are infected.
Infected: A character with this affliction cannot regain hitpoints. Every hour the player must roll a DC11 CON save or take 2d6 necrotic damage (half on a successful save). If an infected character is reduced to 0hp but retins their brain they raise in 1d8 hours as a zombie. This condition can be cured as a disease.
Special Rule: You may make an athletics check at disadvantage to end multiple grapples against you at once (note that in my runnung of this zombies outnumbered players by an 8 to 1 ratio).
I called these ones 'plague zombies' to differentiate them from the MM zombies.
I like the idea that you have come up with so far. If i were running it though a player would have their consitution reduced by 1 or 2 on a successfull save. This would gradually weeken the characters (as this retroactivly reduces their hit point, and lowers their constitution save making them more succeptable to the virus). A long rest would restore the same amount of constitution points, though it they were bit multiple times in a day it would take several days to recover their full constitution. If you were to go this route I would increase the CR of the zombies by 1 instead on 1/2
To soften this effect you may limit it to one constituion drain per encounter (or per hour).
swrider, ability damage and drain was removed because it made things needlessly complicated. I think it's best to not try and incorporate it back into D&D. Older editions were one thing, since they were more complex, but this edition doesn't need complications.
in the NEXT playtest they had an additional encounter download for the keep on the borderlands, in it was a zombie infection disease carried by zombies.
DnD_Next_ReturnCavesChaos
Zombie Plague For a little more tension, you could make some or all the zombies carriers of the zombie plague. Replace the slam attack with a bite. The attack deals the same damage, but the type changes from bludgeoning to piercing. In addition, a living creature bitten by a zombie must immediately make a DC 12 Constitution saving throw. On a failed saving throw, the target is infected with the plague. While infected, a creature regains half the number of hit points through natural healing (magical healing is not affected). Each hour, the creature must succeed on another Constitution saving throw. If the creature succeeds on three saving throws, he or she recovers. If the creature fails three saving throws, he or she dies and rises 1d4 hours later as a zombie unless the corpse is decapitated or burned. A creature that dies while infected also rises as a zombie 1d4 hours after death, unless its corpse is decapitated or burned.
found it!
transcendantviewer wrote:
transcendantviewer wrote:
OGRE1984 wrote:
Lobo316 wrote:
I do like some of these ideas. May have to integrate in some mob rules as well. Individual zombies aren't much of a threat, it's when the solid wall of zombies that it's a significant threat even for higher level characters.
OK, check this version out. Basing this off the D&DNextcaves of Choas Ogre mentioned and combining several different idea that were presented, I present the Undead Infection. This could be used as a variant ability for zomibes to create two different types of zombies...carries and non-carriers (biters and smashers).
Let me know your thoughts...Enjoy!
Undead Infection
Replace the slam attack with a grab. The attack deals no damage, but allows the zombie to take a bonus action to use a bite attack against a grabbed target. The damage for the bite is the same as a slam, but the type changes from bludgeoning to piercing. In addition, a living creature bitten by a zombie must immediately make a DC 12 Constitution saving throw. On a failed saving throw, the target is infected with the plague.
While infected, a creatures maximum hit points is reduced by the damage of the bite attack and the victim regains half the number of hit points through natural healing. Magic healing will work normally, but will not negate the hit point maximum penalty from the effects from the bite.
Each hour, the creature must succeed on another Constitution saving throw. If the creature succeeds on three saving throws, he or she recovers. If the creature fails three saving throws, he or she dies and rises 1d4 hours later as a zombie unless the corpse is decapitated or burned. A creature that dies while infected also rises as a zombie 1d4 hours after death, unless its corpse is decapitated or burned.
Making it a grab means that the zombie has to actually first succeed an opposed grapple check. Which is a Strength (Athletics) check, a skill zombies aren't proficient in. Either that, or the effect of the grab attack is:
If the Zombie's Grab Attack hits, the target is grappled. A zombie can use its action to grab or bite, but it has Advantage on its bite attack if it attempts to bite a creature that is grappled. Don't give them a bonus action to attempt to bite in the same turn that they grab, that makes things much too fast.
transcendantviewer wrote:
The Zombie genre works because there is no cure for it. Nothing can save you once you've been infected. That's why it's scary. There's no escape and it's all consuming. Take that away and you get... meh.
Which is why fantasy Zombies are what they are.
You could modify their stats to resemble plague rats or Dire Rats, but make the disease more dibilitating and if it results in the host's death, they'll rise as a Zombie in a little while after death.
Danny_Montanny wrote:
Lots of great ideas here, and timely for me as I am 3-4 sessions away from needing to unleash a zombie infection. After picking through the ideas here, this is what I am thinking about
Infected Zombie
HP 10, AC 11, Speed 40
Character must be grabbed (+4 attack action) prior to being bitten by a number of Zombies equal to their strength modifier (Min 1). Grabbed results in character imobilized DC 11 Str or Dex check to escape (+2 for each additional zombie grabbing the character).
If a zombie is within 40' of a grabbed character and not already grabbing a character, zombie must use it's movement to go towards the grabbed character
When grabbed by sufficent Zombies, Zombie can make a bite attack (+2, 1 point damage)
Bitten character makes a DC 12 Con check or is Infected and takes 3d6 necrotic damage, reducing max HP.
Once Infected Make an additional save every 1+Con minutes. Can be cured by lesser or greater restoration, cure disease, or by a DC 20 Con save
If target is reduced to 0 HP while infected, they immediatly rise as a zombie. Only Greater Restoration or Wish can then restore the character to life.
Note that my party will be around level 11-12 when this breaks out, so I wanted a bit faster spreading disease for the masses that the party would still have a chance against, however, I plan on starting the session by handing the players 4 1st level character sheets, and have them sitting in a bar in the town when all hell breaks loose. Their goal will be to get to the temple in the center of town. Once there, I will have them switch to the main party, who arrive at the temple after going through the portal I ended the previous session on. The game then switches to the PCs trying to stop the spread of the hoard before it goes beyond the town of 700 or so they are in.
Thanks again for the inspiration! Welcome any thoughts on the above.
OB1 wrote:
transcendantviewer wrote:
Related question, if your are grappled or whatever, what kind of restrictions apply to attack rolls made by the grappled parties? Do you restrict weapon size to only small weapons can be used while grappled? Do you impose disadvantage on attacks made while grappled.
If you're grappled, the only restrictions that apply are that you can't move until the Grappled Condition ends. Certain creatures gain bonuses while grappling a target, like some have the ability to restrain any target that they grapple (As the Restrained Condition), however, very few creatures actually have the ability to get out of a grapple themselves. They depend upon special attacks to grapple, rather than skill checks. So if somebody can grapple the zombies at a range, the zombie will have a hell of a time actually getting free. *Cough* Tavern Brawler *Cough*
Lobo316 wrote:
swrider wrote:
Danny_Montanny wrote:
i would use Mob rules from the DMG. tie it in with Orcus and make it a Curse rather than a mundane disease. also consider other undead that have it, such as Ghouls and Ghasts.
One thing that fascinates me about this was a bit mentioned earlier about Raise Dead not working on an undead. My question is "Why?".
Going off what I remember, there are generally two reasons Raise Dead would normally not work, one is time elapsed the other is that the soul is unwilling or unable to return.
This raises a cool thematic point, what if the plague doesn't just kill you and takes control of your body, what if it attacks the soul somehow? Makes no difference to the players (unless you have people who are really into RPing their faith) but it adds an extra twist for your NPC's. This is a disease that won't only kill you, but may deny you an afterlife as well. Of course, that brngs Churches, Gods and Clerics way more into the whole mess, because messing with souls is a big no-no, but it defintely can add some new terror into the unending hordes of the diseased to know that somehow the necromancy is affecting things on a spiritual level.
Hmm... That would work better in a more divine campaign, this is almost exclusively a horror game where the disease and the hoards are the issue.
Danny_Montanny wrote: