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| #1AvonRekaesMay 03, 2009 4:15:01 | RACIAL TRAITS Average Height: 5' - 6' Average Weight: 100-170 Average Lifespan: 50 years Ability Scores: +2 Charisma, +2 Constitution Size: Medium Speed: Six squares Vision: Darkvision Languages: Common, Daelkyr (Developer's Note: Or Deep Speech if Daelkyr is no longer a language in 4e Eberron) Skill Bonuses: +2 Arcana, +2 Dungeoneering Aberrant Origin: Your gestation in your mother's womb was tainted by a twisted influence, so you are considered an aberrant creature for the purposes of effects that relate to creature origin. Personal Symbiont: When you were born, you had a twin sibling, though an utterly inhuman one. This aberrant creature developed a symbiotic relationship with you that persisted into adulthood. Choose one of three types of symbionts: breed leech, crawling gauntlet, or throwing scarab. Each symbiont grants you a different racial encounter power. If you choose to retrain your choice of symbiont, your aberrant sibling mutates into the new form you choose. Terrible Visions: You need not be trained in the Arcana skill to remember information about Xoriat. (Developer's Note: assuming this rule is translated from core, and applies to Xoriat instead of the Far Realm) Unbalanced Mind: Enemies that target you with an attack versus your Will defense and hit take a -2 penalty to their own Will defense until the end of your next turn. In addition, you have resistance to psychic damage equal to 5 + one-half your level. |
| #2tethryn_lahralein_dupMay 03, 2009 13:44:04 | Overall it looks like a good translation of the original material. I'm curious, what's your reasoning for the bonuses to Con and Cha, fluff-wise? The Unbalanced Mind trait -might- be a little too powerful, since it gives both resistance and a penalty to the attacker (but then again they have to HIT, which implies doing damage...) As for the racial traits, I like the representation of the symbiotes... have you considered a smaller bonus for the Breed Leech temporary HP, that scales up through Heroic/Paragon/Epic, to keep it in line with the other traits? |
| #3AvonRekaesMay 03, 2009 16:48:58 | My justification for Constitution is mainly through the Star Pact Warlock build. The tie-in between Stars and the Far Realm isn't clear, but it's there. Also, to quote the PHB: "Star pact spells require you to be physically inured to the rigors of otherworldly energy (Constitution),..." So I figured being infused with otherworldly energy from before birth would boost your Con, even if you end up looking thin and sickly (because hey, you're not human anymore) For Charisma, I thought Daelkyr Half-Bloods would have force-of-personality in abundance. In fact, possibly too many forces of personality screaming at once. Charisma seemed like the best mental stat to approximate this state of mind. (It gives them a bonus to lying, being diplomatic, being scary, and knowing how to get information. Seems pretty schizophrenic/sociopathic to me.) As for unbalanced mind, I'm fairly certain its in the "sweet, but not broken" territory. It only works if you've been hit, as you noted. Also, the Daelkyr Half-Blood only has two mechancally significant abilities, Unbalanced Mind and Personal Symbiont. Psychic resistance isn't as powerful as fire or cold resistance. I'm fairly certain there's enough wiggle room that Unabalanced Mind is just good and not too good. As for Breed Leech, having it just be half your healing automatically scales with level. I don't think the bonus is too high either, for a once per encounter thing. Plus you need to have actually been damaged enough in a fight to warrant spending a surge. Forcing you to wait that long means its benefit can be greater (Look at Shifters). |
| #4tethryn_lahralein_dupMay 03, 2009 18:17:20 | Sounds like a fair enough explanation/justification to me; I liked the idea from the start as-is. I think I'll keep this thread saved in case I want to play one or have an NPC in the future ![]() |
| #5RhovanionMay 04, 2009 23:04:23 | I've been thinking about the half-blood recently too. One thing that jumped out at me was the spellscar rules from FR. Just reflavor the powers, and you can end up with some really nasty sounding Daelkyr abilities. Plague Lash: "A whip of flickering blue flame passes through your victims chest ..." changed to "A tentacle of quivering red flesh lashes out from a hole in the palm of your hand to wrap about your victim ..." Something like that ... |
| #6nthdegree256May 05, 2009 0:06:53 | I've been thinking about the half-blood recently too. One thing that jumped out at me was the spellscar rules from FR. Just reflavor the powers, and you can end up with some really nasty sounding Daelkyr abilities. Sounds sensible. I've been reflavoring the spellscar rules as psionic powers granted by an ancient Xen'drik docent that the warforged wizard in my party picked up (the player wanted to pick up some spellscarred powers because they're amazing, and this was the best flavor approximation I came up with.) |
| #7angelus_obscuraMay 05, 2009 1:17:48 | For Charisma, I thought Daelkyr Half-Bloods would have force-of-personality in abundance. In fact, possibly too many forces of personality screaming at once. Charisma seemed like the best mental stat to approximate this state of mind. (It gives them a bonus to lying, being diplomatic, being scary, and knowing how to get information. Seems pretty schizophrenic/sociopathic to me.)(Look at Shifters). I'd like to point out that in 3rd edition, almost all of the aberrant races had penalties to Charisma, due to their alien minds and inscrutable or volatile emotions (not sociable or charismatic). Edit: On second thought. I'd say the half-bloods should have a +2 to Dex. I just pored through my Magic of Eberron book, and read that they are either insane (born in Daelkyr controlled area) or secretive (melancholy, anguished, etc) in normal societies. They prefer to remain quiet and out of sight, staying in shadows and etc. Dex would be ideal, considering most daelkyr half-bloods have a propensity to follow roguish paths. This way, a daelkyr half-blood can have the option of being a Rogue (Dex) or Starlock (Con), or both. Just my twopence. :coolcthul |
| #8sallaMay 05, 2009 6:09:55 | I've been thinking about the half-blood recently too. One thing that jumped out at me was the spellscar rules from FR. Just reflavor the powers, and you can end up with some really nasty sounding Daelkyr abilities. Perhaps the halfblood should be something like the dhampire stuff in dragon, then; a bloodline feat followed by power-swap feats. |
| #9RhovanionMay 05, 2009 7:38:53 | What about possibly creating a few at-wills and allowing a choice of one as an additional, similar to the extra given to humans? This would add to the aberration feel and show a reliance on the symbiote. Maybe I'm stuck on the idea, but then like spellscar you can take power swap feats to add more to them. Though it does seem like alot of work just for a single race. The bloodline would work well since then you're no longer locked into having human origins. |
| #10AvonRekaesMay 05, 2009 9:43:49 | Actually, I like the idea that these guys only come from humans. Because, you know, the universal incarnations of perfect insanity look like humans. Also, as far as 3e goes, there were a few creatures that had this special ability called "Insanity" or something, that let them use their charisma modifiers for Will saves instead of their Wisdom modifiers. If Charisma measures the force of your personality, having a really strong psychotic one means a high Charisma. I'm sticking to it. Also, Con is an ubiquitous boost. Everyone could use a good Con. And an 18 in dex doesn't make them unplayable rogues, just cause they don't have that 20. They'd also get a boost to charisma which would help some rogue builds. |
| #11RhovanionMay 05, 2009 10:39:55 | This way, a daelkyr half-blood can have the option of being a Rogue (Dex) or Starlock (Con), or both. I've never looked at a race's stats and pigeon-holed it into this class or that based off of the bonuses. I don't find the fun in that. If I want to play a rogue, and I really like the dwarf race, I'm not going to sacrifice one of the things I really like just because the stat bonuses don't mesh. Optimization is great to a point, but once it starts messing with a character concept I have, I'm more than willing to throw it out the window. Your write-up looks pretty good, and quite similar to another thought I had. Using the half-elf as a basis (keeping the stats, speed, vision), changing the Dilettante out for the symbiote (which you pretty much did ... I took Lightning Lash from the Swordmage to stick with my tentacle theme, though I figured there were other at-wills that could act like symbiotes), changing the skill bonuses (which you did), and then a few other adjustments. To me, dark vision seems a little strong, since remember it is a halfbreed, and wouldn't have the full strengths of its "parent". I like the psychic resistance, but not sure about the - to opponents' wills. I'll have to roll it around in my head a bit more. |
| #12angelus_obscuraMay 05, 2009 11:33:33 | I've never looked at a race's stats and pigeon-holed it into this class or that based off of the bonuses. I don't find the fun in that. If I want to play a rogue, and I really like the dwarf race, I'm not going to sacrifice one of the things I really like just because the stat bonuses don't mesh. I wasn't writing that from an optimization POV, but naturally drawing from my own write-up for the reasons. I myself never look at the stat bonuses to make a character, but work off a theme or story first. Otherwise, I would not be playing a drow swordmage, who has no mechanical connection to the class what-so-ever. HOWEVER, you can't deny that the 4e races all have an inclination to certain classes, which "coincidentally" match with their stats. What classes will a half-blood "coincidentally" match with? Just starlocks and sorcerers and bards? Only spellcasters? At least the tiefling had stat bonuses to the secondary stat for rogues, warlords, and paladins. I just don't see the half-daelkyr as being that charismatic, no matter their force of personality. You could say every race has a force of personality, as it is actually the player roleplaying their PCs in a certain emotional spectrum. Even the psionic Elan race (also mostly drawn from human stock) had penalties to Cha, not just in their personality but also mechanically. The daelkyr half-bloods won't be winning people over with personality when their symbionts are visible as well as their other mutations and quirks. Hence why they usually sneak, hide, and prefer the night. You can't just depend on emotion and parentage to give them a +2 to a mental stat, it's also dependent on the social circumstance (generally speaking). Half-elves always had a tendency as a whole to drive themselves forward despite the hardships endured growing up, and their fey charms help. But people generally accept half-elves cause they can relate and understand. Half-orcs are a volatile, emotional race, but they don't got Cha bonus. But still, half-orcs are more human than anything half human-half aberrant. How do you relate to someone with tentacles and body bugs (esp. in a climate where aberrations are loathed and hunted in Eberron). In 3e, were there any monsters that used Int/Wis for their supernatural or spell-like abilities? Charisma has always been one of the staple stat used for these abilities because like sorcery, they depended on inner force of personality, even for non Cha creatures. Just sayin'. Edit: On closer examination of the other PHB/2 races, a Cha race can still go for a martial character like paladins and such. But do half-bloods favor paladin class? I see them favoring rogues and warlocks. I think I'm gonna have to go ahead and agree with Salla. Half-bloods should be like the Dhampyr and be a heritage feat with a symbiont power. I did not mean to come off as a ranting lunatic. |
| #13AvonRekaesMay 05, 2009 12:41:14 | I don't think you came off as a ranting lunatic, angelus, I'm just defending my points. It's a friendly discussion ![]() As for the whole charisma thing, I honestly don't think it just means how well-liked you are. I think it's more of a representation of your personal mental power. It's not how much you know or are able to learn, like Intelligence, or how well you can percieve and intuit something, like Wisdom, it's just raw personal force. At least, that's how I see it and I'm sticking to it. (Also, Charisma is a secondary stat for some rogue builds, so my version of Daelkyr Half-bloods is just as good of a rogue as the tiefling.) As for doing them up like a Bloodline feat, I'm probably going to go the way that Deva went. Have a base-race of the "truest" Daelkyr Half-Bloods, those made from human stock (I still like the connection between humans and daelkyr), and then have a Bloodline feat set that mimics them. Something like: Womb-Warped [Bloodline] Prerequisites: Any living humanoid, must not be a Daelkyr Half-blood Benefit: You were born with a vestigial personal symbiont (see the Personal Symbiont racial feature for Daelkyr Half-Bloods for more information). Pick a personal symbiont from the list available to Daelkyr Half-Bloods. You may use the associated Daelkyr Half-Blood racial power once per day. In addition, you need not be trained in Arcana to remember information about Xoriat. Special: You qualify for racial feats as if you were a Daelkyr Half-blood. If you take a feat that adds to the list of personal symbionts you may choose, the associated power granted by that feat can only be used once per day. And again, for Unbalanced Mind, I feel it's balanced because it doesn't actually make you any less likely to be hit. You must still suffer all the consequences for being attacked (excepting, of course, resisted psychic damage if any). EDIT: Actually that opening for the half-blood bloodline feats is pretty lazy. I'd look to do something more unique, like how the Deva bloodline opening feat doesn't give you something that Devas already have. EDIT 2: Son of Edit I've been thinking about the Dex/Cha issue some more, and I realized my resistance to agreeing with Dex. Your point for Dex is that "because of their background, Daelkyr Half-Bloods would need to be sneaky and skulk around, like rogues". However, that seems more appropriate as an actual Background, with associated skills in Stealth and Thievery. When I was considering what stats to give them bonuses to, I based my decision on what the Daelkyr Half-Blood is from the very core, from birth. Being inurred to otherworldly energies would give them a higher Constitution because they've been tempered, just like how Con is important to the survival of Starlocks in a fluff-sense. I gave them a high Charisma because I felt that the very nature of their mind would bear a mechanical increase, since half of what makes Daelkyr Half-Bloods unique from other humanoids is their link to Madness incarnate (the other half being their aberrant physiology, specifically their link to symbionts). A bonus to Dex could only be justified by growing up in a certain environment, with a certain kind of background. What if your Daelkyr Half-Blood was raised in House Tharashk? The Cults of the Dragon Below are prevalent in the House of Finding, and you might've been born as a half-blood on purpose as a sort of manufactured messiah. Maybe you and your symbiont were pampered and spoiled as children. Maybe something in adulthood made you realize they were all crazy, or you ran away for some reason. But none of that suggests you should have a bonus to Dex, let alone be a rogue. But you'd still have a raging personality in your head, and still be exposed to otherworldly energy from birth. Perhaps you were born in captivity, your mother forcibly exposed to a Daelkyr's emanations against her will by Mind Flayers. You might have been trained to be a mighty thrall with a brood of other half-bloods, only to fall in love with one of your intended victims on your first forray. There's more chance of you being a fighter or some sort of warped barbarian, with more strength and con than dex. But you'd still have a raging personality in your head, and still be exposed to otherworldly energy from birth. You could have been abandoned in the woods by your frightened mother when you were just a child. A local druid might've found you and recognized you for what you were, but took pity on you and understood that you still had a choice to be who you wanted to be. He raised you to be nature's vanguard, taught that to redeem yourself you must eradicate as many creatures destructive to nature as you can. You could be a barbarian, or hell, even an Archer Ranger with high Dex. But you'd still have a raging personality in your head, and still be exposed to otherworldly energy from birth. These two things are the key features of Daelkyr Half-bloods. They are the core identity of this race, moreso than any specific kind of upbringing. I felt that these two key conceits were what the Ability bonii should be based on. That's my thinking. |