There has not been really one thing i have hated about 4th Edition until i saw this picture... Its ok as far as drawings go but for the images of warforged in 3.5 that we have seen this just looks like a step back...
[Edit] why is the Docent location in the belly? and what is with the Eyes? this just furthers the "terminator" cliché that warforged are subject to by non-Eberron players
this is SOO much better...
And Finally to the Artist, Eva Widermann, have seen the other work you have done... this looks like it was last minute...
Sorry if i am harsh but all the other art has just been BEAUTIFUL but the warforged is just... just not so....
So, I am voting that it is Dr. Doom. Or, you know, the warforged.
edit: yes first picture is awesome, albeit a step back.
And How do you even know if that's a docent?! Even if it is, it doesn't really matter to me where the docent is located? In fact, I like the idea that different models might have minor design differences. It shows the evolution of the "product" by House Cannith. Sort of like how the designs of keyboards have changed over the years. Still the same functionality overall.
The head looks awkward on that body, and with the sunken and joined eyes it seems too robotic.
EDIT: I think I figured out what was bothering me the most: that nose ridge. I tried removing it an dimming the eyes, and much prefer the result:
It's a shame we don't have one of Prescott's warforged representing the race in the MM, but in the end this is just one artist's interpretation. I'm sure we'll see lots more warforged in the coming years, some you'll like and others you won't.
Err, what is wrong with that first picture? It seems fine to me.
I agree.
I like the first picture too, it's pretty;)
As a side note, as this is a 4E preview, I guess we can assume they are in the MM, which likely means the race left out is Kalasthar (sp?) which makes sense with no Psionics integrated into 4E core 3.
Warforged have long been confirmed to be in the MM, along with Shifters and Changelings. Warforged are even getting a full PC write up in the first 4E issue of Dragon.
Since psionics aren't going to work with different mechanics in 4E (just as another power source), we might even see Kalashtar. At least, it's possible they make an appearance before the psionic classes.
I much prefer this Warforged to any other:
EK
Warforged have long been confirmed to be in the MM, along with Shifters and Changelings. Warforged are even getting a full PC write up in the first 4E issue of Dragon.
Since psionics aren't going to work with different mechanics in 4E (just as another power source), we might even see Kalashtar. At least, it's possible they make an appearance before the psionic classes.
Yes, I discovered this about a half hour after posting that when digging around the net more.
This makes me happy, as I might be able to run a 4E Eberron game as soon as I get my hands on the set (and have the time to read it).
Hope they don't have a nude gnome's and orcs in the MM.
It looks too much like a robot - the rougher, stonier, less polished warforged that Steve Prescott or Wayne Reynolds have painted for Third Edition Eberron books look a lot better.
I know what's with people drawing warforged... you know... naked?
Hope they don't have a nude gnome's and orcs in the MM.
Clothing is worn for any combination of three reasons: Protection, Vanity, and Modesty. When you have armor plating, you don't need protection from the elements. Vanity is variable (this one, apparently, is not). Modesty is unnecessary when you have no genitalia.
That said, I see both sides of the argument. This Warforged does look a lot sleeker than a lot of the ones we've seen; I suspect he may be a Mithral-bodied one instead of a 'standard'. On the other hand, the standard warforged look never really gave me the creeps ... THIS DOES.
Then again, Warforged can (or could ... can't predict the future after all) alter their body shapes to a degree through the Warforged Feats; it may simply be a matter of this particular WF's choice that he chooses to look as he does.
Or, artist's interpretation.
Then again.. it doesn't really matter what it looks like. Changing the appearance of a warforged is about as difficult as changing the colour of a dragonborn's scales (although its funny how many people adamantly state that they will "house rule" that dragonborn can be of any color... Seriously - do you require a written rule to play as a human with light/dark skin?)
hahah I totally agree with the wizard warforged picture being the best. My favourite pictures of warforged are when they're doing things other than fighting (like the one staying away sharpening his sword, or the one stitting on a stool at a table, etching schema). Its somehow cute, to see warforged engaged in peaceful activities. I would totally love to see some artwork of a Warforged Druid, with moss growing on him, or something like a warforged architect, drawing up bridge plans with mechanical precision. :D
Carrion, a warforged necromancer
Scrap, a warforged sorcerer
Warforged paladin
Warforged druid
Warforged monk
You know it's not going to be Wayne Reynolds level but... ugh. Bottom of the barrel. The artist obviously never looked at any prior pictures of warforged (or else s/he really felt like they had to "leave their mark" by taking the warforged in a "new direction").
Anyway, i'd be nice if they stopped trying to refernce the terminator.
Warforged ~= Robot.
It's too clean, too technological - the pieces of metal on its body look machined, not forged.
Hmm. You know, I think the "forged" part of their name might just be figurative. From the flashback creation forge scenes in Keith's novels, I've always had the impression that they're sort of "grown," birthed from the pods of a creation forge. As if all the core materials are placed into some sort of processor, and then the creation forge uses it's [url=http://www.d20srd.org/srd/spells/majorCreation.htm]major creation-like power to reproduce those materials—be it steel, mithral, adamantine, darkwood, livewood, or whatever—and then births the final product.
Without really going into it, that's how I sort of imagined it in my own book.
I agree that Steve Prescott's warforged are the best. I'm not wild about this MM entry picture, but it's not terrible. I think it's just proportioned kinda funny.
Hmm. You know, I think the "forged" part of their name might just be figurative.
Yes, I think it's clear that it is, but the fact remains that the metal on Eva Widermann's version of the warforged, especially the face and the thigh plates, looks like something a modern metal shop would produce - like he was built at Orange County Choppers or something. :P
The warforged wizard upthread looks a lot less modern, despite the fact that Widermann's warforged's armour is clearly inspired by late medieval or Renaissance plate.
In my head I've always pictured standard warforged as "stony" rather than metallic, which helps to differentiate the Adamantine Body and Mithral Body types in appearance. So I suggest that maybe we could just assume that the offending picture is of a Mithral Body or perhaps even Adamantine Body 'forged instead of being standard (if no where else but at least in our own heads to make us feel better.)
I don't mind the metal. The glowing red eyes and skull-like hinged jaw are what make it too much like Terminator for me. The one in the wizard picture has subtler green eyes that look more like gems than infrared targeting cameras. It also has a more abstract head that looks a little more "construct" and a little less "metal human skull" if that makes any sense.
#2 - Why are we ganging up on this one picture, when there's been more than a few...odd... warforged pics in 3e?
#3 - From what I've heard recently, warforged actually "wear" armor, which explains this one's body.
On point #3...really? Where've you heard that? I wouldn't mind armor enhancements, like maybe some sort of adamantine mantle placed on a non-adamantine warforged or some such, but wearing actual suits of armor? Hard to believe that.
#1 - This is a MM picture. The warforged picture better look threatening if it's to see use.
#2 - Why are we ganging up on this one picture, when there's been more than a few...odd... warforged pics in 3e?
#3 - From what I've heard recently, warforged actually "wear" armor, which explains this one's body.
The thing is, non-Eberron players tend to go "Warforged = Robot", the whole no emotions, synthesized voice, etc. If you base warforged on the terminator, and this is the one going in the 4e MM, this is the only one non-Eberron players will see and play as.
Also, each of the "odd" Warforged pics you mentioned, look that way for a reason, such as a special prestige class, or sub-race, the psi-forged. This is supposed to be what every warforged looks like in 4e.
On point #3...really? Where've you heard that?
It's from the latest leak, from some store owners who got a chance to look at the 4e books. There's a whole mess of details in Enworld, but this was one of the more surprising (other than how much ass gnomes are gonna kick in 4e). As you might expect, 'forged won't be "wearing" armor so much as incorporating it into their bodies.
The thing is, non-Eberron players tend to go "Warforged = Robot", the whole no emotions, synthesized voice, etc.
And we care what non-Eberron players think because...?
This is supposed to be what every warforged looks like in 4e.
I thought all warforged looked at least slightly different, especially the ones with mithral or adamantine bodies. Unless the same holds true for other races found in the MM - "Every goblin looks just like this" - something I doubt very much.
Basically...this is artwork, folks, not even Eberron-specific artwork.
And we care what non-Eberron players think because...?
Because we want them to become Eberron players too
I'm on your side, though. I prefer a lot of the 3E art to this one in the 4E MM, but it's just one of many interpretations we're likely to see. Some will be good, some will be bad, just like in 3E.
As a side note, as this is a 4E preview, I guess we can assume they are in the MM, which likely means the race left out is Kalasthar (sp?) which makes sense with no Psionics integrated into 4E core 3.
From the play test games, the description of a lot of the warlock powers are psychich this and mental that. Maybe that can be the psionic placeholder for a while?
I don't mind the metal. The glowing red eyes and skull-like hinged jaw are what make it too much like Terminator for me. The one in the wizard picture has subtler green eyes that look more like gems than infrared targeting cameras. It also has a more abstract head that looks a little more "construct" and a little less "metal human skull" if that makes any sense.
If the "skin" and "skull" were stone, no one would be thinking Terminator, even with glowing red eyes (Also, no one thinks "Terminator" when they see pics of skeletons with glowing red eyes). Bill Cowher maybe, but not Terminator. ;) But if they're going with warforged "wearing" armor, then I suppose they're stuck with the metal and therefore would be better off downplaying the eyes and skull thing.
I can't do that with this artwork however. The truth is, its a thousand times better than I could draw. But it isn't Eberron. The warforged are the soul of the Eberron setting. They embody the magic and mystery and conflict and hope and tragedy that sets Eberron apart and make it worth playing. This drawing has no soul.
Maybe its not supposed to. After all, its not in the ESC or the EPG. Maybe in the standard monster manual, Warforged are supposed to be soul-less killer robots. Maybe they aren't supposed to look like this in Eberron at all.
We can pray.
-Joni
I think we might be reading too much into this one picture. It might be a new model, a PRC, a giant's WF, or just one artists take on the forged. When the new books come out we'll have more of an idea if this is the new look or a singular oddity.
This isn't from Eberron, it's from the MM for core 4th edition. No PRC, not made by Giants, and what every forged looks like. And I think it's probably going to be a model for the rest. Have you ever seen a bright pink 20 legged 2 inch high displacer beast? And altering the design a drastic amount is just going to confuse/anger people (look at this thread for an example, but opposite. When they see a Warforged that looks like the ones we have now, people are going to say "This artists sucks/took too much artistic license/had no idea what they were drawing, Warforged are metal robotic killing machines sent from the future to kill Sarah Conner, not stone constructs made by Ancient Giant civilizations with magic who were recreated later in magic forges."
This isn't from Eberron, it's from the MM for core 4th edition. No PRC, not made by Giants, and what every forged looks like. And I think it's probably going to be a model for the rest. Have you ever seen a bright pink 20 legged 2 inch high displacer beast? And altering the design a drastic amount is just going to confuse/anger people (look at this thread for an example, but opposite. When they see a Warforged that looks like the ones we have now, people are going to say "This artists sucks/took too much artistic license/had no idea what they were drawing, Warforged are metal robotic killing machines sent from the future to kill Sarah Conner, not stone constructs made by Ancient Giant civilizations with magic who were recreated later in magic forges."
I heard a rumor that in 5e Eberron, they're making the Warforged into Mithril Oozes and merging them with the Changelings.
Tear it apart, guys.
- Handle on the weapon too short. Common mistake even in official art. No biggie.
- Fingers look a bit short and stubby. *Shrug*
- This may be caused by the pose, but symetry and proportions look a bit off. IMO.
- Maybe less spikes next time?
Other than that it's a good piece IMO.
-Joni
I'm no expert, but here's what I have to think:
- Handle on the weapon too short. Common mistake even in official art. No biggie.
- Fingers look a bit short and stubby. *Shrug*
- This may be caused by the pose, but symetry and proportions look a bit off. IMO.
- Maybe less spikes next time?
Other than that it's a good piece IMO.
-Joni
1) I've had this comment before. My answer usually resolves around ''There's less handle because he won't cut his hands off by picking the blade directly''.
2) A warforged with longuer fingers always looked weird to me, but YMMV.
3) It's the pose, lad.
4) In his long, long character creation, Guyr Adamantine (That's his name. My nickname was a rough draft of it, really.) got through the Warforged Juggernaut phase, so the spiky look forever stuck in my mind. His latest character sheet says he's a pure Warblade at the time.
I think I got through every single book I have to pin every possible character concept for this one character. I enjoyed every minute.
Other than the legs though, I think it looks nice.
I think it looks pretty good actually. The legs look way to slim (especially the tops), though, given he looks like he's taken a few levels in Juggenaut and his body is on the large side. The fingers on all warforged seem stubby to me, so I think they're ok.
Other than the legs though, I think it looks nice.
Look again. You probably mistook the cloth covering the upper legs for a gap between them.