4E Race Disputes - Downloaded from the Wizards Community, all coding removed by Solauren

Post/Author/DateTime	Post
#1 Keyboard-Scribe Oct 10, 2008 7:55:05	I have some questions about Eberron races in 4E. I know i could incorporate the dragonborn and tiefling quite easy into the campaign, but what about the Eladrin and what can be done about the kalashtar? Is there any info on this? Should I use the Eladrin as the Kalashtar with some flavor changes to fit the story or should they be separate? I was thinking the Dragonborn could be the offspring of dragons and argonessan barbarians that fled to Khorvaire and the tiefling could hold within them the bloodlines of the ancient demon empire. I don't knowwhat to do with the eladrin. Maybe a big story arc could be in place where the Faerie Court plane is now so close to eberron it is popping into their Eberronian reality.
#2 Elton74 Oct 10, 2008 8:15:56	Just wait until the Eberron book comes out. And play Eberron 3.5 while you're waiting.
#3 azazyll Oct 10, 2008 12:34:45	If you read Dragonforge, you see where all three new races are incorporated. Dragonborn are minions of Dragons living in cities of their own that war with one another in the Vast portion of Argonessen. Eladrin are fey beings living between Thelanis and the Eldeen Reaches. And tieflings come from the Demon Wastes, as one would expect.
#4 eehamburg Oct 10, 2008 13:42:18	Keep in mind that novels are not canon. Also keep in mind that this is merely 1 interpretation. Therefore, the only official answer will come once the ECG & EPG are released. Until then, 1 opinion is as good as another.
#5 mystrich Oct 10, 2008 13:51:37	I believe the general consensus falls along the lines of: Like 3.5, Eladrin are in Thelanis and occasionally decide to come to the Material Plane. I would say they work fine as Kalashtar if someone wants to play one though. Tieflings blend in with Society, as do Dragonborn. Dragonborn are usually considered similar to medium sized kobolds. A dragonic race that has no connection to real dragons. The other common theory I've seen is that they live with or make up the entirety of the Seren Barbarians.
#6 paideia Oct 10, 2008 16:57:29	I'm starting to write an Eberron campaign as well and thought I might as well present my interim solutions to the race problems here: Kalashtar: I have decided not to allow this race. Psionics haven't been adressed at all in 4th edition yet and I really don't feel like having to make it up from scratch (not setting my campaign near Sarlona also helps). I might throw a few noncombatant NPCs in if I feel like it. Warforged: With the great Dragon article this is not a problem at all. Tieflings: Basically Tieflings can be found anywhere as a result of dealings with fiends, with a large concentration in the Demon Wastes. I believe, that Keith Baker has hinted at Ohr Kaluun (from Secrets of Sarlona) might correspond to Bael Thurath as the origin of the Tiefling race. That makes sense if they, following the Sundering and invasion of their homeland fled to the Demon Wastes (on the west coast of Khorvaire across from Sarlona) and spread out from there. I might go with that, but it won't have a major effect on anything but character backstories and reactions towards Kalashtar and Inspired. Shifters: The Monster Manual presents a fairly decent race outline. I could use a few more traits though and am considering creating Beasthide and Wildhunt myself. I might also need to boost their racial bonuses a bit. Dragonborn: I'm gonna steal from the Kobold mythology and give the Dragonborn the same claim (the third race descended from the Three apart from dragons and couatl). Whatever is true doesn't matter, my players will never have to find out. Dragonborn can be found in most civilized places, always revering the Three and dragons above the Host. I'm not going to replace the Seren with Dragonborn because I don't see it fitting with their attitude of pride and honor. Others are free too though. Eladrin: My "fix" for the eladrin require a slight shift in the Eberron cosmology. As the Plane of Shadow with its close connection to Mabar and Dolurrh has become the Shadowfell, in my campaign the Ethereal Plane and Lamannia and Thelanis are connected and make up the Feywild. I have not yet decided on whether or not the Eladrin were the progenitors of the other elf races, enslaved and changed by the giants or rather elves on Xen'drik who escaped from the Giants into the Feywild (possible the Gyrderi mentioned in Secrets of Xen'drik). I hope this helps anyone. If you have any suggestions please share them.
#7 Nived Oct 10, 2008 19:15:26	At GenCon it was confirmed that James' Dragonforge was written while the two year jump was still the way they thought they were going to go with the setting, and can be take as 'one way to go' with the Dragonborn. They said that its not really the way they are going to go. Because Dragonborn are PCs that are intended to be played, while Argonessen was always supposed to be a big mysterious dangerous place, that becomes considerably less dangerous when (I'm paraphrasing Kieth here I think... though it could have been James) the fighter in your party can go "Argonessen? No so bad, I know a great tavern there." It kinda kills the mystery and majesty. So now that they are not advancing the timeline, Dragonborn are not going to be 'just from Argonessen'. Also Kieth mentioned one of the two groups he's DMing has a Karrnathi Dragonborn Paladin of the Blood of Vol... Not saying that's the way they're going to go either... Just that don't count of Dragonforge being the last word on Dragonborn in Eberron.
#8 julescarv Oct 10, 2008 21:13:54	Personally, I like the idea of dragonborn being of orc lineage who, generations ago, transformed themselves into dragonborn with the help of Vharaak's guidance (using rituals, etc) to more effectively battle the Xoriat invasion. If half-orcs are basically gone from D&D, having the Shadow Marshes be full of dragonborn and orcs (with dragonborn having some orcish cultural aspects) could be a viable replacement for the 3.5 canon of the Shadow Marshes being full of half-orcs and orcs.
#9 rekko Oct 10, 2008 21:25:17	I think I will adapt your idea about Gatekeepers being Dragonborns. Dragonborns would be beings that were able, a long time ago, to tap into their draconic potential. It is with a deeply secret and tabooed ritual that the transformation to become a full dragonborn can be complete, thus dragonborns are rare across the world. Their concentration rises within the gatekeepers, which learned the ritual by the dragon Vharaak, and in the Vast where dragons raise armies for their pleasure, fame and fortune.
#10 That_Blasted_Somoflange Oct 11, 2008 0:16:00	Kalashtar Ability Scores: +2 Wis, +2 Cha Size: Medium Speed: 6 squares Vision: Normal Languages: Common, Quori Skill Bonuses: +2 Diplomacy, +2 Insight Psychic Resistance: You have resist psychic 5 + one half-your level. Naturally Psychic: Kalashtar get +1 to attack rolls when using powers with the Psychic Keyword Kalashtar Diplomacy: You can use Kalashtar Diplomacy as an encounter power Kalashtar Diplomacy With a commanding presence, and gentle psychic nudge, you can influence others. Encounter Free Action * Personal Effect: Reroll any bluff, intimidate, or diplomacy roll. Use the second roll, even if it is lower.
#11 Cyber-Dave Oct 11, 2008 0:29:50	Half orcs are not gone from Eberron, or D&D. They will be appearing as a race in the 4e Players Handbook II, which will also include Shifters and Goliaths. I'm not 100% sure, but I think it was stated that it will include Gnomes as well. Considering that 4e Eberron will be released around the same time as the players handbook 2, there is really no reason to do anything with half-orcs except to include them as written in the lore.
#12 Gilo Oct 11, 2008 1:49:02	Half orcs are not gone from Eberron abit off topic I played an half-orc fighter (used the Orc PC from the 4e MM) named Yaki Sova. He joined a house Ghallanda expatiation into the Q'Barra jungle lead by there top chef - a fat halfling named Alfredo and there shifty jungle guide (another halfling) named Mr. Nixe. The expatiation aim was to locate some new exciting herbs for Alfredo's kitchen (Yaki was the muscle). together they investigated a ruin that housed a "Kobold Hall" and Yaki following his Gatekeeper grandfather footsteps stooped another evil plot by the cult of the Dragon Below.

Post/Author/DateTime

Post

Keyboard-Scribe

Oct 10, 2008 7:55:05

I have some questions about Eberron races in 4E. I know i could incorporate the dragonborn and tiefling quite easy into the campaign, but what about the Eladrin and what can be done about the kalashtar? Is there any info on this?
Should I use the Eladrin as the Kalashtar with some flavor changes to fit the story or should they be separate?

I was thinking the Dragonborn could be the offspring of dragons and argonessan barbarians that fled to Khorvaire and the tiefling could hold within them the bloodlines of the ancient demon empire.

I don't knowwhat to do with the eladrin. Maybe a big story arc could be in place where the Faerie Court plane is now so close to eberron it is popping into their Eberronian reality.

Elton74

Oct 10, 2008 8:15:56

Just wait until the Eberron book comes out.

And play Eberron 3.5 while you're waiting.

azazyll

Oct 10, 2008 12:34:45

If you read Dragonforge, you see where all three new races are incorporated. Dragonborn are minions of Dragons living in cities of their own that war with one another in the Vast portion of Argonessen. Eladrin are fey beings living between Thelanis and the Eldeen Reaches. And tieflings come from the Demon Wastes, as one would expect.

eehamburg

Oct 10, 2008 13:42:18

Keep in mind that novels are not canon. Also keep in mind that this is merely 1 interpretation. Therefore, the only official answer will come once the ECG & EPG are released. Until then, 1 opinion is as good as another.

mystrich

Oct 10, 2008 13:51:37

I believe the general consensus falls along the lines of:
Like 3.5, Eladrin are in Thelanis and occasionally decide to come to the Material Plane. I would say they work fine as Kalashtar if someone wants to play one though.
Tieflings blend in with Society, as do Dragonborn. Dragonborn are usually considered similar to medium sized kobolds. A dragonic race that has no connection to real dragons. The other common theory I've seen is that they live with or make up the entirety of the Seren Barbarians.

paideia

Oct 10, 2008 16:57:29

I'm starting to write an Eberron campaign as well and thought I might as well present my interim solutions to the race problems here:

Kalashtar:
I have decided not to allow this race. Psionics haven't been adressed at all in 4th edition yet and I really don't feel like having to make it up from scratch (not setting my campaign near Sarlona also helps). I might throw a few noncombatant NPCs in if I feel like it.

Warforged:
With the great Dragon article this is not a problem at all.

Tieflings:
Basically Tieflings can be found anywhere as a result of dealings with fiends, with a large concentration in the Demon Wastes. I believe, that Keith Baker has hinted at Ohr Kaluun (from Secrets of Sarlona) might correspond to Bael Thurath as the origin of the Tiefling race. That makes sense if they, following the Sundering and invasion of their homeland fled to the Demon Wastes (on the west coast of Khorvaire across from Sarlona) and spread out from there. I might go with that, but it won't have a major effect on anything but character backstories and reactions towards Kalashtar and Inspired.

Shifters:
The Monster Manual presents a fairly decent race outline. I could use a few more traits though and am considering creating Beasthide and Wildhunt myself. I might also need to boost their racial bonuses a bit.

Dragonborn:
I'm gonna steal from the Kobold mythology and give the Dragonborn the same claim (the third race descended from the Three apart from dragons and couatl). Whatever is true doesn't matter, my players will never have to find out. Dragonborn can be found in most civilized places, always revering the Three and dragons above the Host. I'm not going to replace the Seren with Dragonborn because I don't see it fitting with their attitude of pride and honor. Others are free too though.

Eladrin:
My "fix" for the eladrin require a slight shift in the Eberron cosmology. As the Plane of Shadow with its close connection to Mabar and Dolurrh has become the Shadowfell, in my campaign the Ethereal Plane and Lamannia and Thelanis are connected and make up the Feywild. I have not yet decided on whether or not the Eladrin were the progenitors of the other elf races, enslaved and changed by the giants or rather elves on Xen'drik who escaped from the Giants into the Feywild (possible the Gyrderi mentioned in Secrets of Xen'drik).

I hope this helps anyone. If you have any suggestions please share them.

Nived

Oct 10, 2008 19:15:26

At GenCon it was confirmed that James' Dragonforge was written while the two year jump was still the way they thought they were going to go with the setting, and can be take as 'one way to go' with the Dragonborn.

They said that its not really the way they are going to go. Because Dragonborn are PCs that are intended to be played, while Argonessen was always supposed to be a big mysterious dangerous place, that becomes considerably less dangerous when (I'm paraphrasing Kieth here I think... though it could have been James) the fighter in your party can go "Argonessen? No so bad, I know a great tavern there." It kinda kills the mystery and majesty.

So now that they are not advancing the timeline, Dragonborn are not going to be 'just from Argonessen'. Also Kieth mentioned one of the two groups he's DMing has a Karrnathi Dragonborn Paladin of the Blood of Vol... Not saying that's the way they're going to go either...

Just that don't count of Dragonforge being the last word on Dragonborn in Eberron.

julescarv

Oct 10, 2008 21:13:54

Personally, I like the idea of dragonborn being of orc lineage who, generations ago, transformed themselves into dragonborn with the help of Vharaak's guidance (using rituals, etc) to more effectively battle the Xoriat invasion. If half-orcs are basically gone from D&D, having the Shadow Marshes be full of dragonborn and orcs (with dragonborn having some orcish cultural aspects) could be a viable replacement for the 3.5 canon of the Shadow Marshes being full of half-orcs and orcs.

rekko

Oct 10, 2008 21:25:17

I think I will adapt your idea about Gatekeepers being Dragonborns.

Dragonborns would be beings that were able, a long time ago, to tap into their draconic potential. It is with a deeply secret and tabooed ritual that the transformation to become a full dragonborn can be complete, thus dragonborns are rare across the world. Their concentration rises within the gatekeepers, which learned the ritual by the dragon Vharaak, and in the Vast where dragons raise armies for their pleasure, fame and fortune.

#10

That_Blasted_Somoflange

Oct 11, 2008 0:16:00

Kalashtar

Ability Scores: +2 Wis, +2 Cha
Size: Medium
Speed: 6 squares
Vision: Normal

Languages: Common, Quori
Skill Bonuses: +2 Diplomacy, +2 Insight
Psychic Resistance: You have resist psychic 5 + one half-your level.
Naturally Psychic: Kalashtar get +1 to attack rolls when using powers with the Psychic Keyword
Kalashtar Diplomacy: You can use Kalashtar Diplomacy as an encounter power

Kalashtar Diplomacy
With a commanding presence, and gentle psychic nudge, you can influence others.
Encounter
Free Action * Personal
Effect: Reroll any bluff, intimidate, or diplomacy roll. Use the second roll, even if it is lower.

#11

Cyber-Dave

Oct 11, 2008 0:29:50

Half orcs are not gone from Eberron, or D&D. They will be appearing as a race in the 4e Players Handbook II, which will also include Shifters and Goliaths. I'm not 100% sure, but I think it was stated that it will include Gnomes as well. Considering that 4e Eberron will be released around the same time as the players handbook 2, there is really no reason to do anything with half-orcs except to include them as written in the lore.

#12

Gilo

Oct 11, 2008 1:49:02

Half orcs are not gone from Eberron

abit off topic

I played an half-orc fighter (used the Orc PC from the 4e MM) named Yaki Sova. He joined a house Ghallanda expatiation into the Q'Barra jungle lead by there top chef - a fat halfling named Alfredo and there shifty jungle guide (another halfling) named Mr. Nixe. The expatiation aim was to locate some new exciting herbs for Alfredo's kitchen (Yaki was the muscle). together they investigated a ruin that housed a "Kobold Hall" and Yaki following his Gatekeeper grandfather footsteps stooped another evil plot by the cult of the Dragon Below.