4e Skill Challenges - Downloaded from the Wizards Community, all coding removed by Solauren

4e Skill Challenges

Post/Author/DateTime Post
#1
Talae
Jul 07, 2011 18:40:43 Can anyone suggest some places that they have seen them done right? I find this to be a weak point of mine and have never really successfully prepared a skill challenge in the formal sense. I know that they have evolved over time and would love to hear what you guys (those that know 4e) have to say.

For instance, are the articles by Wizard''s a good place to start? A specific rulebook(s)? A website? An adventure (series)?

I am about readyto start a campaign (this weekend) and would like to do my best to integrate skill challenges if they add something to the game.
#2
Madfox11
Jul 08, 2011 3:33:21 A good spot to take a look at skill challenge into action are in various Living Forgotten Realms adventures at www.livingforgottenrealms.com. You should limit yourself to the recent adventures, those with a 3 after the four letter code. EPIC3-2 (an adventure for level 22 characters) for example contains a couple of skill challenges that worked really well for my group of gamers. The NETH3-1 to NETH3-3 also contain some skill challenges. Mind you, the encounters in LFR are designed for convention play and random groups, so you likely need to adapt them to your own group and play style. Furthermore, no skill challenge is designed to be run litterally as written. They are guidelines that help the DM define what is going on, and provide potential ways the story can go, but no designer can predict all actions of players or how the dice will roll. All too often I have seen DMs and players stick too strictly to the number of successes/failures required, not dealing logically with failed checks or letting one PC carry the whole challenge.
#3
jhanzur
Jul 08, 2011 4:30:45 My advice is to not be as rigid as the mechanic implies. Don't tell the PCs they're in a skill challenge. Present the goal the PCs are working towards and ask them what they plan to do. If a player comes p with a good reason to use a skill you didn't plan on, do your best to accomodate that.
#4
Gilo
Jul 08, 2011 12:14:02

For instance, are the articles by Wizard''s a good place to start? A specific rulebook(s)? A website? An adventure (series)?

Keith's blog post on Skill Challenges is very helpful: gloomforge.livejournal.com/12135.html

#5
Ashlock
Jul 08, 2011 16:38:30

For instance, are the articles by Wizard''s a good place to start? A specific rulebook(s)? A website? An adventure (series)?

Keith's blog post on Skill Challenges is very helpful: gloomforge.livejournal.com/12135.html

I second that!
#6
Madfox11
Jul 12, 2011 3:33:13
My advice is to not be as rigid as the mechanic implies. Don't tell the PCs they're in a skill challenge. Present the goal the PCs are working towards and ask them what they plan to do. If a player comes p with a good reason to use a skill you didn't plan on, do your best to accomodate that.

Good advice when in most skill challenges, but when the skill challenge is all about a tactical approach it is IME best to carefully explain the mechanics. For example, when the PCs are performing an hour long ritual to close a manifestion zone with creatures emerging from the other end in an attempt to stop the PCs, explaining what needs to be done helps the players plan their actions. The same is almost always true for skill challenges during a fight. If you don't tell them what to do, they are more likely to just spend actions on the fight and ignore the challenge since nobody likes to waste actions under those circumstances (and better make sure the skill checks for the challenge are on par with the fight most of the time).

#7
jhanzur
Jul 12, 2011 5:24:59
My advice is to not be as rigid as the mechanic implies. Don't tell the PCs they're in a skill challenge. Present the goal the PCs are working towards and ask them what they plan to do. If a player comes p with a good reason to use a skill you didn't plan on, do your best to accomodate that.

Good advice when in most skill challenges, but when the skill challenge is all about a tactical approach it is IME best to carefully explain the mechanics. For example, when the PCs are performing an hour long ritual to close a manifestion zone with creatures emerging from the other end in an attempt to stop the PCs, explaining what needs to be done helps the players plan their actions. The same is almost always true for skill challenges during a fight. If you don't tell them what to do, they are more likely to just spend actions on the fight and ignore the challenge since nobody likes to waste actions under those circumstances (and better make sure the skill checks for the challenge are on par with the fight most of the time).

I agree, and I think that is what I was trying to convey. Give the PCs the goal, and the means to get there, but not the blueprint of how to get there.

#8
ciaran
Sep 19, 2011 9:07:48 Keep experimenting and be flexible. The players aren't visualizing everything the same way as you and you must not punish them. Encourage them to describe what they are doing instead of naming which skill they are using.

Post/Author/DateTime	Post
#1 Talae Jul 07, 2011 18:40:43	Can anyone suggest some places that they have seen them done right? I find this to be a weak point of mine and have never really successfully prepared a skill challenge in the formal sense. I know that they have evolved over time and would love to hear what you guys (those that know 4e) have to say. For instance, are the articles by Wizard''s a good place to start? A specific rulebook(s)? A website? An adventure (series)? I am about readyto start a campaign (this weekend) and would like to do my best to integrate skill challenges if they add something to the game.
#2 Madfox11 Jul 08, 2011 3:33:21	A good spot to take a look at skill challenge into action are in various Living Forgotten Realms adventures at www.livingforgottenrealms.com. You should limit yourself to the recent adventures, those with a 3 after the four letter code. EPIC3-2 (an adventure for level 22 characters) for example contains a couple of skill challenges that worked really well for my group of gamers. The NETH3-1 to NETH3-3 also contain some skill challenges. Mind you, the encounters in LFR are designed for convention play and random groups, so you likely need to adapt them to your own group and play style. Furthermore, no skill challenge is designed to be run litterally as written. They are guidelines that help the DM define what is going on, and provide potential ways the story can go, but no designer can predict all actions of players or how the dice will roll. All too often I have seen DMs and players stick too strictly to the number of successes/failures required, not dealing logically with failed checks or letting one PC carry the whole challenge.
#3 jhanzur Jul 08, 2011 4:30:45	My advice is to not be as rigid as the mechanic implies. Don't tell the PCs they're in a skill challenge. Present the goal the PCs are working towards and ask them what they plan to do. If a player comes p with a good reason to use a skill you didn't plan on, do your best to accomodate that.
#4 Gilo Jul 08, 2011 12:14:02	For instance, are the articles by Wizard''s a good place to start? A specific rulebook(s)? A website? An adventure (series)? Keith's blog post on Skill Challenges is very helpful: gloomforge.livejournal.com/12135.html
#5 Ashlock Jul 08, 2011 16:38:30	For instance, are the articles by Wizard''s a good place to start? A specific rulebook(s)? A website? An adventure (series)? Keith's blog post on Skill Challenges is very helpful: gloomforge.livejournal.com/12135.html I second that!
#6 Madfox11 Jul 12, 2011 3:33:13	My advice is to not be as rigid as the mechanic implies. Don't tell the PCs they're in a skill challenge. Present the goal the PCs are working towards and ask them what they plan to do. If a player comes p with a good reason to use a skill you didn't plan on, do your best to accomodate that. Good advice when in most skill challenges, but when the skill challenge is all about a tactical approach it is IME best to carefully explain the mechanics. For example, when the PCs are performing an hour long ritual to close a manifestion zone with creatures emerging from the other end in an attempt to stop the PCs, explaining what needs to be done helps the players plan their actions. The same is almost always true for skill challenges during a fight. If you don't tell them what to do, they are more likely to just spend actions on the fight and ignore the challenge since nobody likes to waste actions under those circumstances (and better make sure the skill checks for the challenge are on par with the fight most of the time).
#7 jhanzur Jul 12, 2011 5:24:59	My advice is to not be as rigid as the mechanic implies. Don't tell the PCs they're in a skill challenge. Present the goal the PCs are working towards and ask them what they plan to do. If a player comes p with a good reason to use a skill you didn't plan on, do your best to accomodate that. Good advice when in most skill challenges, but when the skill challenge is all about a tactical approach it is IME best to carefully explain the mechanics. For example, when the PCs are performing an hour long ritual to close a manifestion zone with creatures emerging from the other end in an attempt to stop the PCs, explaining what needs to be done helps the players plan their actions. The same is almost always true for skill challenges during a fight. If you don't tell them what to do, they are more likely to just spend actions on the fight and ignore the challenge since nobody likes to waste actions under those circumstances (and better make sure the skill checks for the challenge are on par with the fight most of the time). I agree, and I think that is what I was trying to convey. Give the PCs the goal, and the means to get there, but not the blueprint of how to get there.
#8 ciaran Sep 19, 2011 9:07:48	Keep experimenting and be flexible. The players aren't visualizing everything the same way as you and you must not punish them. Encourage them to describe what they are doing instead of naming which skill they are using.