Vulkoor
Vulkoor is the evil god of the hunt and master of the wild jungle.
Deadly tribes of feral drow serve him and hunt down worthy prey
in his name. His commandments are strict and his punishments
are deadly:
*Stalk and slay your prey without it ever sensing your presence.
*Survive through self sufficiency lest you become the prey. Only
the strong deserve to hunt.
*Become one with the wilds around you and shape the world to
your will. Those who fail to do so are unworthy of their life.
Deity / Alignment / Areas of Influence.
Vulkoor - Evil - Domination, Poison, Trickery, War, Wilderness. (scorpions as possible extra domain)
Help me fine tune this, thanks.
Oh yeah, your quotes rock! THAT'S what I'm talkin' about! Right there! I have to bring that up everytime I see someone insist that someone is playing the game wrong!
Oh, and thanks again, I get a lot of mixed comments on my quotes. Some love them, some really, really hate them.
I think for most Eberron campaigns you've got a winner here. My FR tweaks and the general set-up of my game have the drow cast in a different light that had me do some minor rewriting for all drow in all of the settings, so I'd have to make Vulkoor fit more of the savage-but-neutral law of the jungle type being. Definitely give him the scorpions, I'd say, and other arachnids to a lesser extent.
Thanks for the feedback. I gave him the evil alignment instead of unaligned because in 3e he shares the same domains as the mockery and some believe Vulkoor to be an aspect of the mockery. Plus the Scorrow are evil creatures with a link to Vulkoor. So I just thought it fit.;)
Percisely. Some believe it to be so. Probably scholars of the Host and the Six.
In other words, I'm with Shiftkitty, even concerning the Scarrow(not Driders though-in my campaign they are daelkyr creations-Belashyrra's specifically).
They are listed as CE. I have no problem making Vulkoor unaligned but I'd need a bit more than "he could or couldn't be because it could be someone elses view".IMG, Vulkoor is a fiend who was able to avoid being tapped and smart enough to know that trying to crush, smash and destroy the world would only lead to his capture by those mean and nasty heroes.;) So its not an aspect of the mockery IMG. Its also not worshipped by the Rakshasa as Vulkoor probably wasn't among the most powerful of overlords.
I always pictured Vulkoor to be the darker aspect of the wild.
Or maybe he is trapped in khyber, but his prison is weak enough in Xen'drik to allow him to manifest an avatar or if "avatar" is the wrong word, then "clone" or "aspect".
thanks for the feedback folks!
Take the Shadar-Kai. "Following the dark auguries of their witches, shadar-kai move secretly to accomplich ruinous ends, destroying any heroes or kingdoms that stand in their way."
Compare to the Githyanki. "...the githyanki fled to the Astral Sea and became xenophobic and militaristic. They built citadels and armies, and from their they set out to conquer everything in their path."
Both are apparently heartless in attaining their goals, caring not for the fates of those who are "in their path" or "in their way". Yet the Shadar-Kai are "Unaligned" while the Githyanki are "Evil".
I assign alignment, when needed, based on how I've played the race in general and individuals on a case-by-case basis. For me, the scorrow are generally Unaligned. I could take your layout of Vulkoor (which I am very happy to see, by the way!), switch it to Unaligned as is, and it would fit quite nicely.
The alignment system is problematic, and an individual race's alignment can be open to interpretation. I think some races got the CE alignment because the game needed bad guys. I don't get it myself. The scorrow hunt intelligent races and are evil, the PCs hunt intelligent races and steal their stuff and they're heroes? Remembering that the scorrow's prey willingly entered scorrow territory, knowing full well the risks involved, and to me, labelling them evil for hunting this person would be like blaming the hornets for attacking when you stick your hand into their nest.
Take the Shadar-Kai. "Following the dark auguries of their witches, shadar-kai move secretly to accomplich ruinous ends, destroying any heroes or kingdoms that stand in their way."
Compare to the Githyanki. "...the githyanki fled to the Astral Sea and became xenophobic and militaristic. They built citadels and armies, and from their they set out to conquer everything in their path."
Both are apparently heartless in attaining their goals, caring not for the fates of those who are "in their path" or "in their way". Yet the Shadar-Kai are "Unaligned" while the Githyanki are "Evil".
I assign alignment, when needed, based on how I've played the race in general and individuals on a case-by-case basis. For me, the scorrow are generally Unaligned. I could take your layout of Vulkoor (which I am very happy to see, by the way!), switch it to Unaligned as is, and it would fit quite nicely.
I'll consider what you've said cause it does make sense, but since vulkoor does share the same domains in 3e as the mockery, it does smack of evil.
Destruction, which is generally assigned to evil gods.
Domination, its bad but it could be use for non evil easily enough.
Evil. (lol!):P
Illusion (nothing to do with alignment)
Trickery (means he can't be lawful, but 4e doesn't provide that option anyways)
War (nothing to do with alignment)
So I mean there are things that are hard to overcome, but I initially left out the evil domain in his areas of influence as I didn't see a need to include it. He's the god of scorpions after all and hes worshipped by drow. Not that the stereotype works in eberron, but its still weight towards evil on the scales.
But I'll consider it, I need to read up more on the drow and the Scarrow-Scorrow.:D THanks for the feedback and positive comments. (Vulkoor is my favorite drow god, I always wanted a scorpion god of the drow since 2e forgotten realms.)
Secrets of Xen'drik states that clerics of Vulkoor have access to the same domains of the Mockery. However, I'd like to add the Protection domain to the list. Vulkoor is depicted is a warrior, a hunter, and a giant scorpion carrying a drow village on his back (much like a mother scorpion carrying her young). Unlike spiders, scorpions actually protect and nurture their young after birth, and this aspect of Vulkoor is very intriguing.
One of the things that has me putting the drow/scorrow folks in "Unaligned" is that I compare them to the native American tribes. Xen'drik is their land, the land of their ancestors, and the land of their children and their children's children. and now all these treasure hunters come traipsing in to steal their heritage and convert it into something so vulgar as money. It's tantamount to someone digging up your beloved grandmother and making off with her jewelry so he can pawn it. I have a drow campaign running, and this is our take on it. At least three of us, myself included, have strong native ties, so we totally relate to this particular viewpoint.
I really wish they hadn't left the Mockery/Vulkoor thing murky. IMG, I made Vulkoor a separate deity of unknown motives.
Secrets of Xen'drik states that clerics of Vulkoor have access to the same domains of the Mockery. However, I'd like to add the Protection domain to the list. Vulkoor is depicted is a warrior, a hunter, and a giant scorpion carrying a drow village on his back (much like a mother scorpion carrying her young). Unlike spiders, scorpions actually protect and nurture their young after birth, and this aspect of Vulkoor is very intriguing.
This may cover the "Vulkoor as god" aspect but we still have "Vulkoor as a (or THE-depends on the tribe) primal spirit" to play with.
Besides, religion alignments in Eberron have changed since 3e in more than one cse so I don't think that the SoX entry should be considered as the final word even on the former case.
In any case, Vulkoor's worship differs so greatly between tribes that I'm sure that we can have all interpretations simultaneously.
SHiftKitty: A very nice post.
As for the protection domain, I missed that and will have to read up on it.
The idea of Vulkoor being a primal spirit is very, very interesting.
The evil thing is hard to ignore though considering the scorrow and the drow who worship vulkoor are all evil in the 3e xendrik book.
Plus the evil domain is a big bright marker seeable from space.:DNote that in the 4e ECS, only the Umbragen example is evil-blame the Umbra- whereas all other drow are unaligned.
Is a lioness being evil when she brings down a water buffalo calf? No mercy is shown to the young or to its bawing mother as her child gets ripped to shreds (although there is a funny video about a water buffalo calf, some smug lionesses, an opportunistic crocodile, and a herd of water buffalo that has decided that enough is enough).
One of the things that has me putting the drow/scorrow folks in "Unaligned" is that I compare them to the native American tribes. Xen'drik is their land, the land of their ancestors, and the land of their children and their children's children. and now all these treasure hunters come traipsing in to steal their heritage and convert it into something so vulgar as money. It's tantamount to someone digging up your beloved grandmother and making off with her jewelry so he can pawn it. I have a drow campaign running, and this is our take on it. At least three of us, myself included, have strong native ties, so we totally relate to this particular viewpoint.
I really wish they hadn't left the Mockery/Vulkoor thing murky. IMG, I made Vulkoor a separate deity of unknown motives.
You're comparing humanoids with animals. Animals have no concept for evil OR good, they just act on their biological drives. You can't apply that to drow (or other sentient humanoid for that matter) and their worship of an obscure entity. In Eberron, a deity's existence is not exactly proven and it is the power of faith of the believers that give them a resemblance of existence. The drow of Xen'drik are almost all evil not because their "god" mandates it, but because their very own perceptions shape what their god is like and applies their personal philosophies onto their deity.
Is a lioness evil for killing a water buffalo for food? No. But is a man evil for killing another sentient being with the awareness that he could spare life and let it go? Yes. Murder is evil, and animals do not murder. Beasts may know no concepts of mercy, but we certainly do. And that makes us culpable.
In 3.5, Keith Baker himself wrote or must have been aware of how the drow and Vulkoor were being shaped into. They are mostly evil, but in Eberron, that doesn't mean much. I don't know if I'm making sense or not, but I hope you get what I'm saying.
Other DMs may have different takes on it. I believe that, when in doubt or if you have no reason to do otherwise, go by the book.
I understand what your saying, and it may come to where we place "sentient" beings in the order of things. Any hunter could let his prey go. Killer whales will practice knocking seals off of ice and won't always eat them. Look how cats play with their prey, not always killing it, sometimes only maiming it. Chimpanzees kill each other over territory. Dolphins have been observed killing packs of some other marine animal (argh! can't remember what it was!) in some kind of apparently genocidal campaign. These animals can formulate murderous plans, sometimes working with an amazing amount of organization. Ants take slaves. Hornets engage in wholesale slaughter of bees for no apparent reason (that I can recall). The only thing we can't see is "why".
Killer whales practice knocking off seals? That's not a solid reason for mercy. That may be young whales practicing their hunting skills. Wild cats don't maim their prey and not eat them, unless they're killing for their prime/alpha. Dolphins attack porpoises for an as of yet unknown reason. But it might be biological drives or territorial in nature. As for the slave ants, that's not from a desire to own other ants and make them work. Those slavemaker ants are symbiotes that use different ant species to do the work they don't have the numbers to do.
For myself, I don't remove human beings from the animal kindgom. We are the only predators in the kingdom for whom we can answer why we kill in groups or as individuals. We're not privy to the inner workings of our hairier, furrier, scalier, slimier or more feathery brothers. It's for this reason that I look at the way the scorrow, drow and Vulkoor are written and have decided that they are only protecting their territory and doing what biology (or their creator) has programmed them to do.
Other DMs may have different takes on it. I believe that, when in doubt or if you have no reason to do otherwise, go by the book.
I'm not arguing that we aren't animals ourselves; but there is a HUGE evolutionary gap between us and beasts. Animals fight over territory because it is a hunting/breeding ground and they CAN'T afford to share without threatening their own survival. We fight over territory for immaterial things such as wealth, power, and just plain spite (besides material resources etc). Vulkoori drow kill/fight off intruders because they don't want people getting their hands on Giant lore. Who knows, maybe they just don't like outsiders. Xenophobia is rooted in fear and breeds hate. I'm not saying that unaligned non-evil drow and scorrow are impossible, just not that numerous. By your statements, you're making the Vulkoori and scorrows above reproach in their behavior and in terms of alignment. What about the yuanti who share drow lands? Are they evil? Yes. But they are part snake and shouldn't be held accountable, right? Since they're beastly. So w/e their god is must be unaligned too and not be evil? idk -_-. I think I confused myself there. Lol.
I just don't think it's fair to label the drow as Evil in general simply because they defend their territory. As for the scorrow, I must yield. I just found my 3e SoX and it does indeed cover why the scorrow would be considered evil. They kill and take the valuable goodies to trade. But for the drow, I see them as no more evil than the Apache, Sioux, etc., who also had no mercy for those captured, even those who were doing little more than ekeing out an existence. Savage? Yes. Beyond reproach? No, but certainly not worthy of being called evil, IMO. (Whether Baker intended it or not, I see too many comparisons between the Xen'drik drow and the native American tribes to not show a bit of sympathy.)
I just don't think it's fair to label the drow as Evil in general simply because they defend their territory. As for the scorrow, I must yield. I just found my 3e SoX and it does indeed cover why the scorrow would be considered evil. They kill and take the valuable goodies to trade. But for the drow, I see them as no more evil than the Apache, Sioux, etc., who also had no mercy for those captured, even those who were doing little more than ekeing out an existence. Savage? Yes. Beyond reproach? No, but certainly not worthy of being called evil, IMO. (Whether Baker intended it or not, I see too many comparisons between the Xen'drik drow and the native American tribes to not show a bit of sympathy.)
Don't get me wrong, I love drow. Especially Xen'drik drow. They aren't as malicious as the standard core drow. But honestly, I see them more akin to the ancestors of the American Indians. Pre-Apache, Algonquin, etc. The giants of Xen'drik had a very Aztec-like culture, and the art depicting them helped along in this regard. I've always envisioned the Vulkoori drow as much more savage and primal than the Native Americans. More in line with the Mayans maybe? I've played a Vulkoori drow duskblade (swordmage apprenticed to an Umbragen) in my current game (Ravenloft/Planescape) and I've always had him act like a Aztec/Mayan warrior. He had no concept of wealth; just took what he needed from those too weak to keep it. Whenever he encountered the spider-kissing drow of other worlds, he hunted them down with ruthless efficiency. His rituals (both arcane and religious) were often bloody and violent. I saw no evidence of softness in the Vulkoor drow and so modeled mine to that mold.
) I can see your take on it. The architectural style does indeed scream Central/South America, and for that I am grateful.Based on his presentation in the Dreaming Dark trilogy by Baker, I didn't get the vibe that Vulkoor was evil. Certainly many of his followers may be going down that path in their excessive (but all too often justified) xenophobia, but Vulkoor didn't seem so malicious, just very primal. Compared to say, Malar in the forgotten realms, he seems more reflective and protective, not driven by the sort of bestial frenzy and cruelty you'd expect from the Mockery.
but Vulkoor didn't seem so malicious, just very primal. Compared to say, Malar in the forgotten realms, he seems more reflective and protective, not driven by the sort of bestial frenzy and cruelty you'd expect from the Mockery.
Keep in mind that the scholars of Khorvaire are the ones associating Vulkoor with the Mockery, using the savagery and "evilness" of the xenophobic drow as a reference. I think Vulkoor and the Mockery are completely different entities, but try telling that to the -Sovereign Host/ Dark Six- assimilationists.
Thanks folks. I'm loaded with stuff to do right now but I am researching Vulkoor as much as possible and am leaning towards unaligned. I'll be posting a revision of my Vulkoor entry soon along with a 4e write up of Vulkoor as an epic monster encounter.
Thanks again for all the feedback!
I think Vulkoor and the Mockery are completely different entities, but try telling that to the -Sovereign Host/ Dark Six- assimilationists.
Good point, the Dark Six-assimiliationist point of view is an appealingly tidy and convenient way to characterize all evil deities as simply a local variation of the same basic themes. But I recall the scorpion avatar of Vulkoor encountered in the book 'The Gates of Night' seeming much more a lesser primal spirit-god of the Fey realm than the servant of an over-arching deity of malice. An by the way, very concrete and definitely 'real', where as the Sovereign Host and Dark Six pantheon are kind of ethereal and unproveable.