Dragonborn in Eberron! - Downloaded from the Wizards Community, all coding removed by Solauren

Dragonborn in Eberron!

Post/Author/DateTime Post
#1
tyrielwow
Jun 04, 2008 5:03:27 I dont know if theres a answer to this, ive tried reading Keith Bakers Blog (http://gloomforge.livejournal.com/), but havent found answer to this.

Where did 4th Edtion Dragonborn comefrom in Eberron, were they allways there, are they servants of true dragons in Argonessa and how do other races (Elves for instance?) react/feel about them? Or are do they have a culture of their own?

:D
#2
johnnyarkham
Jun 04, 2008 5:39:44 IIRC, according to Keith, that's entirely in your hands. He makes a few suggestions (Argonesen, Xendrick, etc), but there's nothing 'official'. Much like most of the other non-traditional races, they have a place in Eberron, but that place is up to the DM to decide upon.
#3
vickrin
Jun 04, 2008 5:58:44 Im going to be allowing any player who wants dragonborn to just use Yuan-ti instead (with slightly modified stats). I want to carry the story over that half dragons and such are rare and i think a dragonborn would attract far too much attention.

Playing one of the yuan ti on khorvaire worshiping the silver flame isnt too much too of a stretch.
#4
tyrielwow
Jun 04, 2008 6:16:50 Nothing Official, okay. But maybe when we get closer to 2009 and Eberrons release, maybe they are gonna come up with something.

Thanks. :D
#5
Alas
Jun 04, 2008 7:32:14
Where did 4th Edtion Dragonborn comefrom in Eberron, were they allways there, are they servants of true dragons in Argonessa and how do other races (Elves for instance?) react/feel about them? Or are do they have a culture of their own?

As with tieflings, I prefer the option that allows all those explanations to be true (or false) at the same time. That is: in my campaign, there will be dragonborn in Q'barra, Argonessen, Seren, and the bigger cities of the Five Nations. Each little group has their own claims about who they are and how they got there. One Q'barran tribe claims to be a legacy of the couatl (ooh, can't wait for them to meet the Gaashkala orcs guarding the Demon Wastes), while a clan in Sharn claims to be exiled Argonessen nobility. The only way the players are ever going to know if one claim is more factual than another is to go adventuring. If the players don't care enough to pursue the myths, then the "real" answer is moot.
#6
ieattrollsforbreakfast
Jun 04, 2008 10:29:46 http://www.dragon-above.com/index.php?p=4e#dragonborn

I'll just say that I have a dragonborn PC in one of my Eberron playtest groups, and I love the backstory we've come up with for him. And this stage, I have no idea if it will turn out to be the final path the official setting material takes, but I think it's certainly possible to give the dragonborn a role that makes sense within the setting.

It's all how you define "relevant". As I've said before, what I want is a role that makes sense, and a role that provides players with a wide range of interesting hooks to use as the foundation for PCs. This doesn't require us to say "Oh, when we said 'orc' in the 3.5 Eberron, we actually meant 'dragonborn'."

Anything we do is going to require some shifting. If, for example, tieflings keep approximately the same role in Eberron that they have in the PHB (and I'm not saying they WILL, just saying IF), then they should be found in human cities, and you'd expect to have a tiefling community in Sharn... likely in Lower Dura or the Cogs. That's a change. However, it's not as much of a change as "House Thuranni? Don't you remember? They've always been tieflings."

Same thing with dragonborn. I want dragonborn to have a role that is both logical and supports a range of dragonborn PCs. This doesn't mean that we suddenly turn Karrnath into "The Kingdom of Dragonborn". But it may mean that when you encounter a dragonborn in Karrnath, people aren't all scratching their heads and saying "What is it? I've never seen anything like that before."

Dragonborn aren't half-dragons. They don't have dragon daddies. The relationship is far closer to Rhashaak and his blackscale lizardfolk... they are dragon-y, nothing more. The reason most of the dragons of Argonnessen dislike half-dragons is because they think they are disgusting - it's the way I'd expect most humans to feel if someone had sex with a dog and produced a creepy, stunted puppy with fingers on its front paws and a human nose and chin. It's an ugly, crippled little thing produced by perverse behavior, living proof that one of our own demeaned himself and his blood by breeding with one of these little rodents. Dragonborn, on the other hand, are more like a breed of dogs that are amusing because they act like humans - aww, look at his mouth, doesn't he look like he's smiling? And he can shake hands! But there's no creepy "When I look at you I am reminded that my uncle had sex with a maggot in order to produce you" that you get with half-dragons. (And not all dragons ARE against half-dragons - which is how you got Erandis d'Vol in the first place. Hey, some people LIKE having sex with dogs.)

#7
usf22raptr_dup
Jul 02, 2008 2:30:33 Here is what my group has come up with...just our 2 cp's worth...
#8
Nived
Jul 02, 2008 2:58:45 According to 4e Core Lore (taken from the Dragonborn entries, the Dragon entry in the MM, and Worlds and Monsters) a primordial rent the dragon god Io in twain, and one half became Bahamut and the other half Tiamat and that from his blood spray the blood coming into contact with the pure elements gave rise to dragons, and blood sprayed elsewhere gave us Dragonborn... or some such nonsense.

This should sound awfully familiar to Eberron fans.

In the wake of the battle of the Progenitors, life emerged on the new world. Siberys had fallen in battle, but power remained within his blood. Filled with the purest essence of magic, that blood fell on Eberron, merging life and magic to produce new creatures with the strength of both Progenitors: dragons. Where the blood of Siberys struck the clouds, silver dragons were born. It fell on the cold peaks, and white dragons rose from the ice. It struck the swamps, and black dragons emerged from the dark depths. And so all the dragons were born, mighty and proud, possessing the mystical power of Siberys and the vibrant life force of Eberron.

And even earlier in the Dragonshard Kobolds of Khorvaire

The kobolds of Khorvaire trace their history to the dawn of Eberron. According to ancient legend, kobolds were formed from the drops of blood shed in the battle between Eberron, Siberys, and Khyber. A new generation of dragons descended from Siberys, Khyber brought forth fiends and horrors, and Eberron gave birth to the creatures of nature -- but the kobolds were already there, spawned from the first battle. True or not, this myth is the driving force behind kobold psychology and culture.

So to me at least, the origin of Dragonborn in Eberron is staring us right in the face... hell they lifted the idea from Eberron. So yeah I'm tying their origin very closely with the Kobolds, however while Kobolds have always been more naturalistic (prefering to live in caves rather than build empires) the Dragonborn did try to build an empire, one that competed with the Goblinoid empire of Dhakaan. One that ultimately lost and was crushed by Dhakaan long before the Daelkyr war, they never recovered, after humans came they assimilated into Khorvaire culture much as the Gnomes, Dwarves, and Halflings did but had no homeland of their own, and no real sense of racial unity.
#9
dread_lord
Jul 03, 2008 2:20:54 If I were switching to 4ed I'd put them in Argonessa and make them the "commoners" of that land. Very few, if any, people have been inland on that continent so it's easy to say they've always been on the planet but no ones seen them until now.

Post/Author/DateTime	Post
#1 tyrielwow Jun 04, 2008 5:03:27	I dont know if theres a answer to this, ive tried reading Keith Bakers Blog (http://gloomforge.livejournal.com/), but havent found answer to this. Where did 4th Edtion Dragonborn comefrom in Eberron, were they allways there, are they servants of true dragons in Argonessa and how do other races (Elves for instance?) react/feel about them? Or are do they have a culture of their own? :D
#2 johnnyarkham Jun 04, 2008 5:39:44	IIRC, according to Keith, that's entirely in your hands. He makes a few suggestions (Argonesen, Xendrick, etc), but there's nothing 'official'. Much like most of the other non-traditional races, they have a place in Eberron, but that place is up to the DM to decide upon.
#3 vickrin Jun 04, 2008 5:58:44	Im going to be allowing any player who wants dragonborn to just use Yuan-ti instead (with slightly modified stats). I want to carry the story over that half dragons and such are rare and i think a dragonborn would attract far too much attention. Playing one of the yuan ti on khorvaire worshiping the silver flame isnt too much too of a stretch.
#4 tyrielwow Jun 04, 2008 6:16:50	Nothing Official, okay. But maybe when we get closer to 2009 and Eberrons release, maybe they are gonna come up with something. Thanks. :D
#5 Alas Jun 04, 2008 7:32:14	Where did 4th Edtion Dragonborn comefrom in Eberron, were they allways there, are they servants of true dragons in Argonessa and how do other races (Elves for instance?) react/feel about them? Or are do they have a culture of their own? As with tieflings, I prefer the option that allows all those explanations to be true (or false) at the same time. That is: in my campaign, there will be dragonborn in Q'barra, Argonessen, Seren, and the bigger cities of the Five Nations. Each little group has their own claims about who they are and how they got there. One Q'barran tribe claims to be a legacy of the couatl (ooh, can't wait for them to meet the Gaashkala orcs guarding the Demon Wastes), while a clan in Sharn claims to be exiled Argonessen nobility. The only way the players are ever going to know if one claim is more factual than another is to go adventuring. If the players don't care enough to pursue the myths, then the "real" answer is moot.
#6 ieattrollsforbreakfast Jun 04, 2008 10:29:46	http://www.dragon-above.com/index.php?p=4e#dragonborn I'll just say that I have a dragonborn PC in one of my Eberron playtest groups, and I love the backstory we've come up with for him. And this stage, I have no idea if it will turn out to be the final path the official setting material takes, but I think it's certainly possible to give the dragonborn a role that makes sense within the setting. It's all how you define "relevant". As I've said before, what I want is a role that makes sense, and a role that provides players with a wide range of interesting hooks to use as the foundation for PCs. This doesn't require us to say "Oh, when we said 'orc' in the 3.5 Eberron, we actually meant 'dragonborn'." Anything we do is going to require some shifting. If, for example, tieflings keep approximately the same role in Eberron that they have in the PHB (and I'm not saying they WILL, just saying IF), then they should be found in human cities, and you'd expect to have a tiefling community in Sharn... likely in Lower Dura or the Cogs. That's a change. However, it's not as much of a change as "House Thuranni? Don't you remember? They've always been tieflings." Same thing with dragonborn. I want dragonborn to have a role that is both logical and supports a range of dragonborn PCs. This doesn't mean that we suddenly turn Karrnath into "The Kingdom of Dragonborn". But it may mean that when you encounter a dragonborn in Karrnath, people aren't all scratching their heads and saying "What is it? I've never seen anything like that before." Dragonborn aren't half-dragons. They don't have dragon daddies. The relationship is far closer to Rhashaak and his blackscale lizardfolk... they are dragon-y, nothing more. The reason most of the dragons of Argonnessen dislike half-dragons is because they think they are disgusting - it's the way I'd expect most humans to feel if someone had sex with a dog and produced a creepy, stunted puppy with fingers on its front paws and a human nose and chin. It's an ugly, crippled little thing produced by perverse behavior, living proof that one of our own demeaned himself and his blood by breeding with one of these little rodents. Dragonborn, on the other hand, are more like a breed of dogs that are amusing because they act like humans - aww, look at his mouth, doesn't he look like he's smiling? And he can shake hands! But there's no creepy "When I look at you I am reminded that my uncle had sex with a maggot in order to produce you" that you get with half-dragons. (And not all dragons ARE against half-dragons - which is how you got Erandis d'Vol in the first place. Hey, some people LIKE having sex with dogs.)
#7 usf22raptr_dup Jul 02, 2008 2:30:33	Here is what my group has come up with...just our 2 cp's worth...
#8 Nived Jul 02, 2008 2:58:45	According to 4e Core Lore (taken from the Dragonborn entries, the Dragon entry in the MM, and Worlds and Monsters) a primordial rent the dragon god Io in twain, and one half became Bahamut and the other half Tiamat and that from his blood spray the blood coming into contact with the pure elements gave rise to dragons, and blood sprayed elsewhere gave us Dragonborn... or some such nonsense. This should sound awfully familiar to Eberron fans. In the wake of the battle of the Progenitors, life emerged on the new world. Siberys had fallen in battle, but power remained within his blood. Filled with the purest essence of magic, that blood fell on Eberron, merging life and magic to produce new creatures with the strength of both Progenitors: dragons. Where the blood of Siberys struck the clouds, silver dragons were born. It fell on the cold peaks, and white dragons rose from the ice. It struck the swamps, and black dragons emerged from the dark depths. And so all the dragons were born, mighty and proud, possessing the mystical power of Siberys and the vibrant life force of Eberron. And even earlier in the Dragonshard Kobolds of Khorvaire The kobolds of Khorvaire trace their history to the dawn of Eberron. According to ancient legend, kobolds were formed from the drops of blood shed in the battle between Eberron, Siberys, and Khyber. A new generation of dragons descended from Siberys, Khyber brought forth fiends and horrors, and Eberron gave birth to the creatures of nature -- but the kobolds were already there, spawned from the first battle. True or not, this myth is the driving force behind kobold psychology and culture. So to me at least, the origin of Dragonborn in Eberron is staring us right in the face... hell they lifted the idea from Eberron. So yeah I'm tying their origin very closely with the Kobolds, however while Kobolds have always been more naturalistic (prefering to live in caves rather than build empires) the Dragonborn did try to build an empire, one that competed with the Goblinoid empire of Dhakaan. One that ultimately lost and was crushed by Dhakaan long before the Daelkyr war, they never recovered, after humans came they assimilated into Khorvaire culture much as the Gnomes, Dwarves, and Halflings did but had no homeland of their own, and no real sense of racial unity.
#9 dread_lord Jul 03, 2008 2:20:54	If I were switching to 4ed I'd put them in Argonessa and make them the "commoners" of that land. Very few, if any, people have been inland on that continent so it's easy to say they've always been on the planet but no ones seen them until now.